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The Rise of Skywalker SPOILERS ALLOWED discussion thread


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13 hours ago, Manakin Skywalker said:

Wait so who was Palpatine's child? Rey's mother or her father? Also who would bang Palpatine?!

 

Palpatine child was a nobody who met another nobody and they abandoned Rey, geez, did you missed an episode?

 

ūü§£

 

You all focuses on the wrong parts!

 

Ben uses the force to resurrect Rey!!!

 

Hello???

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It was nice of J.J to pull a 'Last Action Hero' and go into the film to give all the characters the script.

 

Everyone just seemed to know what was happening at all times and how to get to the next Macguffin instantly. 

 

Just one small example of the wonderful coincidences this films had is that it was lucky for them to 'accidentally' get into a sand speeder chase and then 'accidentally' get shot down and fall into the only patch of quicksand around, and then 'accidentally' discover a hidden cavern that 'accidentally' has the exact thing they're looking for. 

 

...wonderful...erm, what's that word? Is it storytelling?

 

 

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I hate coincidence storytelling more than anything.  And JJ's Star Wars films are full of it

 

Like opening TFA by spending 40 minutes with nice new characters, only to have two of them coincidentally get picked up by Han and Chewie for... reasons

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But thank god that Zori Bliss' First Order command token coin turned out to be EXACTLY what Poe needed to get onboard the First Order ship. That was great storytelling, not lazy coincidence hack writing.

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1 hour ago, Stefancos said:

There's no sex either!

 

There isn't love of any kind. Not just romance. No relationship in this goes anywhere. Finn and Poe bicker all the time. The Rey Kylo kiss comes out of nowhere. Literally. Nowhere. 

Finn and Rose seemed to share romantic feelings. Not ever followed up on. Poe and Zaari or whatever she's called had a tiny spark. No. Nothing. 

Rey doesn't seem to care about anyone but her own feelings and Leia. 

There is no feeling of genuine friendship anywhere. At most, between Jannah and Finn for a sub sub sub sub plot. 

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Also thank god for that random short alien that gave Rey a beaded Carnival necklace on the burning man desert party planet so that Kylo could force-skype call her and grab it off her neck and then have the first order scientist find out which brand of necklace it was so the first order could figure out which planet Rey is on. 

 

Not contrived and coincidental storytelling at all. Just solid well-thoughtout writing.

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Doesn’t Snoke encourage Kylo to kill Rey? Or at least hint that that’s what he should do?

 

But if he’s being controlled my Palpatine and Palpatine wants Rey... ugh, they really should have planned this better.

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Just now, leeallen01 said:

Also thank god for that random short alien that gave Rey a beaded Carnival necklace on the burning man desert party planet so that Kylo could force-skype call her and grab it off her neck and then have the first order scientist find out which brand of necklace it was so the first order could figure out which planet Rey is on. 

 

Not contrived and coincidental storytelling at all. Just solid well-thoughtout writing.

 

Also, thank god they arrived on that planet on the exact day this celebration takes place every 32 years, so that Rey can be given a necklace to reveal to Kylo where she was. 

Not just on a specific day every year. A specific day every 32 years. 

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My favourite line was when Dominic Monaghan said "why not just use the Holdo Maneuver," and another character replied; "Nah, that's a stupid Rian Johnson screw up. We can't do that sh*t bro."

 

...Or it may have been "that's a one in a million shot."

 

Same thing, of course.

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4 minutes ago, Alex said:

Doesn’t Snoke encourage Kylo to kill Rey? Or at least hint that that’s what he should do?

 

But if he’s being controlled my Palpatine and Palpatine wants Rey... ugh, they really should have planned this better.

 

Isn't it the same as Yoda not wanting Luke to go rescue Leia, being cavalier about her possible death at Vader's hands, and taking comfort in the idea of "another"...only for Return of the Jedi to reveal that this other was Leia herself? If she was so important, surely Yoda should have encouraged Luke to go rescue her.

 

None of these trilogies were planned out: that's NOT the problem here.

 

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2 minutes ago, gkgyver said:

 

Also, thank god they arrived on that planet on the exact day this celebration takes place every 32 years, so that Rey can be given a necklace to reveal to Kylo where she was. 

Not just on a specific day every year. A specific day every 32 years. 

 

I believe it was actually 42 years. Honestly. So even better storytelling...

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5 minutes ago, Chen G. said:

 

Isn't it the same as Yoda not wanting Luke to go rescue Leia, being cavalier about her possible death at Vader's hands, and taking comfort in the idea of "another"...only for Return of the Jedi to reveal that this other was Leia herself? If she was so important, surely Yoda should have encouraged Luke to go rescue her.

 

None of these trilogies were planned out: that's NOT the problem here.

 


That’s true... from a certain point of view.

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It was also great storytelling when Hux said he was the mole because he wants Kylo to fail, even though in TLJ he was holding a blaster as he stood over an unconscious Kylo and could have just killed him right there.

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8 minutes ago, Chen G. said:

 

None of these trilogies were planned out: that's NOT the problem here.

 

 

It's a problem that excists within all 3 trilogies, though its not the biggest problem.

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13 hours ago, Manakin Skywalker said:

Wait so who was Palpatine's child? Rey's mother or her father? Also who would bang Palpatine?!

 

That's not even addressed.

 

Some people will not be happy with this movie -- and for good reason.

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20 minutes ago, leeallen01 said:

Can anyone make sense of this incredible writing? - Rey went to kill the Emperor, and before she could, he made sure to tell her that if she does kill him (which he wanted her to do) then she will be inhabited by his spirit and all the Sith, which of course makes her not want to kill him. But then she does kill him, and she doesn't get inhabited by him or the Sith...she just dies because she was tired? Then she's resurrected by Ben, who then dies himself because he was tired? Just like his mother Leia who died earlier because she was tired? Just like her brother Luke who died earlier because he was tired?

 

Man that force sure does make people sleepy.

 

They clearly all "lost the will to live". 

 

Leave it to the prequels to make sense of things. 

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Did anyone notice that every 5 minutes in the movie, some character said "if this fails, it would have all been for nothing."

 

Talk about a meta statement.

 

Rey - "If I fail, then we've achieved nothing." = J.J's inner monologue.

 

Poe - "If this mission fails, it was all for nothing." - Disney's inner monologue.

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34 minutes ago, gkgyver said:

Finn and Rose seemed to share romantic feelings. Not ever followed up on.

 

Now that you said this, I just remembered...

 

When they are sinking and falling over that cave where the hidden Sith artifact was located or whatever, Finn yells at Rey that he wanted to tell her something. Then, when they are entering the cave, Rey asks what it is, Finn says he'll tell her later, and Poe whines about they don't want him to hear that.

 

It is implied that Finn was going to admit his romantics feelings towards Rey, which of course would've made his subplot with Rose on the last movie completly pointless, but who cares, right? In any case, after that they seem to COMPLETLY FORGET what Finn was going to tell Rey, and then they just arrange some other partner for him, that archer lady (are they trying to attract the Hunger Games fans)?

 

That is Finn the Stormtrooper, everyone: on each movie of the trilogy he falls in love with a different girl, only to completely forget about it on the next movie. A fine example of a character who only thinks with his dick.

 

Therefore, that thing about he wanting to tell Rey something was just there because the filmmakers (?) wanted the trio to bitch about something to make the audience entertained during the boring cave scene.

 

My gosh, the script for this mess seems to be written by complete morons...

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1 hour ago, Rom√£o said:

Or why didn't he use his son or some sort of evil plan? Did the Force skip a generation or something?

 

Palpatine is a cheater who became powerfull not only because of his use of the Dark side of the Force, but also because of Sith magic.

 

I don‚Äôt know what he tried with his natural child, but obviously it didn‚Äôt make a new ¬ę Anakin ¬Ľ LOL

 

Anakin was far way more stronger than Palpatine in the Force... It explain Palpatine’s fascination for the Skywalkers...

 

Did I told you I think Plagueis’s name was surely... Skywalker?

 

ūüėĚ

 

History repeats itself... it’s a repeating circle...

 

Oh, I love Star Wars so much!

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One positive thing I will say about the movie, and that's about it, is that it's showing Yoda's saying "fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering" well and adequately with Rey. 

She fears what she might become, therefore she's angry, therefore she vents her anger by hating herself and Ren, which results in her killing Ren. 

 

 

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When Ben had his vision of his father, you could see that Han looked different because he had the beginnings of a beard growing. So it was nice of Ben to imagine his father that way. It definitely wasn't because Ford couldn't be bothered to shave for his scene.

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Were Snoke and Rey related?

2 minutes ago, leeallen01 said:

 It definitely wasn't because Ford couldn't be bothered to shave for his scene.

 

It could be that he was required to keep it because of another role? 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Stefancos said:

So Palpatine used his own DNA to create Anakin?

 

 

 

Not exactly his DNA, more like he influenced the Force to create not only Anakin, but (I believe) Rey's father as well. Now, about why her father was just an idiot who got know as a drunken moron on Jakku and not a powerful Force practicioner, well...

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10 minutes ago, Stefancos said:

But if thats the case Rey isn't related to any Skywalker.

 

On real life, we have 50% of our father's DNA and 50% of our mother's. But Anakin wasn't generated by the common way, I mean, Sheev didn't pass by Tattooeine and had sex with Shmi (and I think he neither did that with Rey's Grandmother). He just used the Dark Side of the Force to generate a new life inside Shmi's womb.

 

Now, if this new life only has Shmi's DNA or hers and Palpatine's, that's difficult to answer. I think Palpatine put a little of himself and his own powers on that new life too. Shmi was a loving caring mother, but her son grew up to be, well, Darth Vader. He probably put a little of himself on Rey's lineage as well, hence her dark thoughts and she being tempted by the Dark Side throughout the Sequel Trilogy.

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35 minutes ago, Edmilson said:

So, after this movie, this is the Skywalker/Palpatine family tree, right? Vader is Rey's uncle (and half brother of her father), Luke and Leia are her cousins.

 

 

skywalker family tree.PNG

 

No, Skywalker and Shmi are Anakin’s parents.

 

Why Sidious would have had a natural child if he could have created life using the force?

 

Do we saw the same movies?

 

ūüėā

 

 

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When Rey threw away the lightsaber and force-ghost Luke caught it and basically said "a Jedi's weapon deserves more respect." 

 

WOW. I actually wanted to cheer.

 

That was a very strong "F**K YOU RIAN JOHNSON." courtesy of J.J. 

 

It made me respect J.J a tiny bit.

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Think about this - The Skywalker line is dead. But the Palpatine line lives on.

 

I think that's the true message George Lucas intended, and the true meaning of Star Wars...

 

But considering it's 2019 and you can 'identify' as anything you want; Rey can just 'identify' as a Skywalker.

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That’s my understanding of the Skywalker saga conclusion.  Do you see the repeating pattern? The circle has been closed.

 

7B4E717E-0CE1-41EC-B3BB-FF853AD9B18E.jpeg

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23 minutes ago, leeallen01 said:

Think about this - The Skywalker line is dead. But the Palpatine line lives on.

 

 

15 years from now, you'll see on the internet:

 

"Coming to theaters on Christmas 2035, the much anticipated blockbuster Star Wars Episode X: The Sith's Return!. The movie will be starred by Jacob Tremblay as Tim Skywalker, Luke's long lost son, as he trains with the Jedi Master Rey Palpatine-Skywalker (Daisy Ridley) to prepare for the battle with Kade Palpatine (Finn Wolfhard), another secretly created great-grandson of the legendary Sith Emperor Palpatine!

 

The screenplay and directing will be by George Lucas' clone, called Lucas George, who intends to follow his creator's blueprint of a twelve movie saga. Music composed and conducted by Mick Giacchino, son of the legendary Michael Giacchino, composer of the iconic score for Rogue One: A Star Wars Story!"

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All of my sarcasm and hatred aside for this film and Disney's trilogy as a whole, I loved hearing Luke and Leia's theme (my favourite from Williams in Star Wars) at the end when they were all celebrating. My emotions were actually being restarted like a stopped heart.

 

But seeing Luke and Leia, Han and Lando, Chewie and R2 and 3PO having glimpses of their true characters throughout this film just made me very sad to be honest. What could have been is truly heartbreaking to think about. But now impossible to attain. 

 

 

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I loved most of the score (the way Williams took the menace out of Kylo Ren's theme after his heart was turned, the variations on Rey's theme, the thunderous Resistance March), but that Luke and Leia theme - beautiful though it may be - had nothing to do with anything, as did Yoda's theme.

 

Plus, ending on Binary Sunset again. Ufff...

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3 minutes ago, Chen G. said:

 but that Luke and Leia theme - beautiful though it may be - had nothing to do with anything, as did Yoda's theme.

 

Plus, ending on Binary Sunset again. Ufff...

 

Of course the use of Yoda's and Luke and Leia's themes weren't directly covering a moment between Luke and Leia or Yoda, but it could be seen as an overall montage of Williams just giving us a big farewell from himself with all his most haunting and melodic themes. 

 

Let's face it, he's done it before in A New Hope with Leia's theme playing over the death of Obi Wan.

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Come on, guys, we all knew Williams was going to end the movie with Binary Sunset. Actually, all of the three of the ST. These movies are too nostalgic to allow him to end with something other than the Force Theme.

 

Even if he had recorded something else, I'm pretty sure Abrams or Johnson would've tracked Binary Sunset from somewhere else and put in there.

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10 minutes ago, leeallen01 said:

it could be seen as an overall montage of Williams just giving us a big farewell from himself with all his most haunting and melodic themes. 

 

Let's face it, he's done it before in A New Hope with Leia's theme playing over the death of Obi Wan.

 

Yeah, Williams does that sort of thing: Yoda's theme in Cloud City, Duel of the Fates in Tatooine, The Force Theme everywhere in The Last Jedi.

 

Still, I wish that for the final denoument of the series (certainly for him) he would have stuck more to his own thematic architecture, and left the parade of leitmotives for the end-credits.

 

Its by no means a deal-breaker:  the score is much better than the movie. In some ways, its the best of the three recent scores.

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I'm pretty sure the spotting session for the final scenes went like this -

 

Williams - "So which themes do you want to use here, J.J? Luke and Leia's or Han and Leia's or Yoda's or Resistance March or Leia's or Rebel Fanfare or Rey's or the Force theme?

 

J.J - "Yes."

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