John Williams' Oliver Stone scores won't be sold as a box set

[Amer 2,271]

For all of those clamouring for an Oliver Stone Box set from LLL as a possibility...

 

Mike Matessino had the following to say at the FSM LLL June 2020 thread:

 

https://www.filmscoremonthly.com/board/posts.cfm?threadID=140451&forumID=1&archive=0&pageID=1&r=748#bottom

 

Quote

I don't see this ever happening as a collection no matter who makes a call, polite or otherwise.

JFK = WB / Warner Music
Born on the Fourth of July = Uni / UME
Nixon = Disney
It was a simple matter for Varese to license Pete 'n' Tillie for one compilation to add to a title they control. The Disaster collection is technically three separate releases and got done only because of that fact and because WB deferred entirely to Fox on The Towering Inferno.

 

[Disco Stu 15,503]

I don’t really care if it’s a box set or not.  The music is what I want, not the window dressing.

[crocodile 8,611]

It would have been great as a collection for convenience's sake and the fact there isn't probably that much unreleased music between them. But it doesn't really matter much as it would probably cost more or less the same as three individual releases. I'm not quite sure what is there to gain from JFK expansion but the other two would be most welcome.

 

Karol

[Incanus 5,820]

22 minutes ago, crocodile said:

It would have been great as a collection for convenience's sake and the fact there isn't probably that much unreleased music between them. But it doesn't really matter much as it would probably cost more or less the same as three individual releases. I'm not quite sure what is there to gain from JFK expansion but the other two would be most welcome.

 

Karol

Yeah it would have been sort of convenient to get this "trilogy" in one box but I would be just as happy with individual releases of these scores.

 

Born on the Fourth of July is missing about half of the score (give or take 25 minutes) plus some 10 minutes or more of alternates if you go by the bootleg which has been floating around for ages.

JFK is a bit tougher to gauge since JW recorded those longer thematic suites to be edited into the film but there are pieces scored directly to the film as well that were not on the original album, quite a few in fact even if some of them are quite short.

Nixon also contains quite a few cues that didn't make it to the OST album. Some that material is actually very clearly melodic precursor to the darker dramatic music of the Prequel trilogy, especially the laments of Shmi's Funeral from AOTC and Anakin's Betrayal from ROTS.

 

So I would love to have expanded versions of all three at some point. All three are fantastic scores.

[crocodile 8,611]

I had no idea Williams ever recorded anything for JFK to picture. The score as heard in the film is such a mishmash that it's hard to judge. An effective mishmash, I might add.

 

I just noticed it's included free on Prime. Might watch it later to refresh my memory of it. It's been quite a few years.

 

Karol

[Brundlefly 2,395]

3 hours ago, crocodile said:

An effective mishmash, I might add.

Indeed, sometimes it feels like the chopped up score is mimicking the chopped up cut. I really like how it plays out together, to be honest.

[Incanus 5,820]

3 hours ago, crocodile said:

I had no idea Williams ever recorded anything for JFK to picture. The score as heard in the film is such a mishmash that it's hard to judge. An effective mishmash, I might add.

 

I just noticed it's included free on Prime. Might watch it later to refresh my memory of it. It's been quite a few years.

 

Karol

Yeah the editorial scoring approach complements Stone's editing style quite perfectly.

[Not Mr. Big 4,741]

Disney's Nixon

[Arpy 4,159]

15 minutes ago, Not Mr. Big said:

Disney's Nixon

Songs by Alan Menken.

[1977 1,746]

I'll be quite happy with individual releases, I hate boxed sets.

[Luke Skywalker 1,970]

As long as they are released the same day i dont care....

 

 

[Marian Schedenig 9,151]

1 hour ago, Luke Skywalker said:

As long as they are released the same day i dont care....

 

Well, two options, assuming they all get released:

 

a) They're all ready at the same time anyway and therefore get released on the same day

b) They're not ready at the same time, so they're either released one after the other, or they're released simultaneously when the last one is finished

 

I'll take them as they come.  

[crocodile 8,611]

2 hours ago, Not Mr. Big said:

Disney's Nixon

 

Karol

[BrotherSound 2,295]

12 hours ago, Incanus said:

Nixon also contains quite a few cues that didn't make it to the OST album.

I think the others would probably fit on a single disc, but seems like Nixon would need to be a 2-CD release.

 

Here’s the complete cue list:

 

Nixon Trailer

1M1 Opening Emblem

1M3 Opening Credits

1M3 Gen. Haig Insert

1M6 They Want To Believe The President

1M7 It’s The Lie

1M8 Lewis J. Fielding, M.D.

3M1 Did I Approve

3M3 T.V. Debate

3M4 Election Results

3M5 I Hate Losing

4M1 Mother’s Faithful Dog

4M2 Sound Like Mother

4M4 Football In Whittier

4M4R Football To Campaigning

4M7ABC Early Days (Pat And Dick Theme)

4M7ABC Early Days (Pat And Dick Theme) Alternate Version

4M8 I Want A Divorce

5M3/6M1 Camelot Overture [source, composed by Frederick Loewe]

6M4+5 Love Field

7M1 Johnson’s Farewell

8M5 Track Two

8M7 Talking With Lincoln

9M1 Harold’s Death

9M2 Battle Hymn Of The Republic [source, composed by William Steefe]

9M3+4 The Miami Convention

10M3 Meeting On The Potomac

12M2 Family Chat

12M5+6 It’s The Lie

13M4 Hoover’s Death And The Jones Ranch

13M5 Harp Introduction

13M5 The Meeting With Mao

16M1 Firing Of Associates & Dinner Scene

16M3 Father Daughter Scene

17M2 Nixon To The Hospital

17M4 Back To Life

21M1 Praying

21M2 I Am That Sacrifice

22M1 Farewell Speech

Brass Theme

Cuban Connection

Funeral Cortège Drums [source]

Tape Machine Motif

 

And a breakdown of the OST:

 

1 1960’s, The Turbulent Years (5:04)

0:00-0:37 1M1 Opening Emblem

0:37-end Nixon Trailer

 

2 Main Title… The White House Gate (4:16)

0:00-2:57 1M3 Opening Credits

2:57-end 1M3 Gen. Haig Insert

 

3 Growing Up In Whittier (2:42)

4M7ABC Early Days (Pat And Dick Theme) 

 

4 The Ellsburg Break-In And Watergate (2:43)

0:00-0:28 Cuban Connection

0:28-1:36 17M2 Nixon To The Hospital 

1:36-end 1M8 Lewis J. Fielding, M.D.

 

5 Love Field - Dallas, November 1963 (4:52)

6M4+5 Love Field

 

6 Losing A Brother (3:17)

16M3 Father Daughter Scene

 

7 The Battle Hymn Of The Republic (1:03)

9M2 Battle Hymn Of The Republic

 

8 Making A Comeback (2:21)

0:00-0:36 Brass Theme

0:36-end 7M1 Johnson’s Farewell

 

9 Track 2 And The Bay Of Pigs (4:46)

0:00-3:23 16M1 Firing Of Associates & Dinner Scene

3:23-end 8M5 Track Two

 

10 Miami Convention, 1968 (3:19)

9M3+4 The Miami Convention

 

11 The Meeting With Mao (3:09)

0:00-0:15 13M5 Harp Introduction

0:15-end 13M5 The Meeting With Mao

 

12 I Am That Sacrifice (4:49)

21M2 I Am That Sacrifice

 

13 The Farewell Scene (5:01)

22M1 Farewell Speech

[Jay 39,764]

Woah, that's amazing, thank you!!!

[BrotherSound 2,295]

1 hour ago, Jay said:

Woah, that's amazing, thank you!!!

No problem!

 

I’ve previously shared the cue list for JFK:

Spoiler

1M1 Main Title Part I

1M1 Main Title Part II
1M1 Main Title - Long Version
1M2A Theme Over Scottish Drums
1M4 Receiving the News
4M1 The Railroad Yard
4M3 Bannisters Office
5M1A Cubans Everywhere!
6M4 Effects [synthesizer - "low explosions at varying pitches"]
8M1 Ruby and Warren
8M2 Under the Rifle Sights
9M1 Easter Sunday Morning
9M6 Shaw's Exit

10M3A David Ferrie's Apartment
12M3 Circles of Power
12M5A End Note Bar 65
12M6A Bar 55 Crossover
13M3 Bedtime T.V.
13M5 Oswald Visits Hosts
13MX The Porch Scene
14M3 The Bedroom Scene
Arlington
Arlington Insert (Dialogue Version)
The Conspirators
Drum Loop
Garrison's Obsession
The Motorcade
End Credits
Theme From "J.F.K"
Theme From "J.F.K." (Piano Version)

 

Source music:

Reel 3 - Eternal Father, Strong to Save (Navy Hymn)

Reel 9 - "Maryland My Maryland"

But not the OST breakdown:

 

1 Prologue (4:00)

0:00-2:03 1M1 Main Title Part I

2:03-end End Credits

 

2 The Motorcade (5:15)

The Motorcade

 

3 Drummers’ Salute (2:55)

Drummers Salute [source]

 

4 Theme From JFK (2:23)

Theme from “J.F.K.” (Piano Version)

 

5 Eternal Father, Strong To Save (1:19)

Reel 3 - Eternal Father, Strong To Save (Navy Hymn) [source]

 

6 Garrison’s Obsession (2:34)

Garrison’s Obsession

 

7 Sidney Bechet - On The Sunny Side Of The Street

 

8 The Conspirators

The Conspirators

 

9 The Death of David Ferrie (2:47)

10M3A David Ferrie’s Apartment

 

10 Tony Bennett - Maybe September

 

11 Garrison Family Theme (2:15)

0:00-1:10 13MX The Porch Scene

1:10-end 9M2 Easter Sunday Morning

 

12 Brent Lewis - Ode To Buckwheat

 

13 Ray Barretto - El Watusi

 

14 The Witnesses (2:47)

0:00-0:53 5M1A Cubans Everywhere!

0:53-end 4M1 The Railroad Yard

 

15 Mozart - Concerto No. 2 for Horn and Orchestra

 

16 Arlington (6:30)

Arlington

 

17 Theme from JFK (Reprise) (3:15)

End Credits

 

[King Mark 3,730]

I prefer individual releases.

[The Train Station 8,873]

Great! Can't wait!

[crumbs 14,904]

The Disney ownership of Nixon would be problematic. BOT4J seems like a no-brainer for LLL (given their ties with Universal), likewise JFK and WB (though WB are apparently harder to deal with since a management change), but Nixon seems like Intrada territory.

 

As long as we get all 3 scores eventually, not too phased whether it's in a box set or not. Just seemed like the most logical follow-up JW box set since they've become a staple recently (JP, Harry Potter and the Disaster Boxes, the latter personally requested by Williams himself, so he's clearly not averse to the concept).

[King Mark 3,730]

Is this thread confirmation these scores will be released?

[John Dutton 7,503]

No. Keep dreaming!

[King Mark 3,730]

oh, so it's like, when they are released 25 years from now it won't be a box set

[The Train Station 8,873]

Why bother making them if they're not a boxset?

[Edmilson 9,134]

5 hours ago, BrotherSound said:

1 1960’s, The Turbulent Years (5:04)

0:00-0:37 1M1 Opening Emblem

0:37-end Nixon Trailer

 

 

Wait a minute, so The Turbulent Years is actually music JW recorded for the movie's trailer? Really?

 

That's a little unfortunate to be honest, I love this cue and I always thought it played in the movie.

[crumbs 14,904]

2 hours ago, King Mark said:

Is this thread confirmation these scores will be released?

 

No confirmation either way. Maybe the labels have already looked into it and decided it wasn't feasible (and have already started on standalone releases), or maybe they just know it would be a waste of time trying and nothing's been done. 

[Thor 8,505]

Not sure why one would want this in a boxed set when all the soundtracks are readily available individually.

 

Give me a boxed set of, say, ALCOA PREMIERE THEATRE, and we're talking!

[Jay 39,764]

On 07/06/2020 at 12:32 AM, Edmilson said:

 

Wait a minute, so The Turbulent Years is actually music JW recorded for the movie's trailer? Really?

 

That's a little unfortunate to be honest, I love this cue and I always thought it played in the movie.

 

Why would the media that a piece of music was written for affect your enjoyment of the music?

[crocodile 8,611]

1 hour ago, Thor said:

Not sure why one would want this in a boxed set when all the soundtracks are readily available individually.

I think they're all out of print.

 

Karol

[Thor 8,505]

1 minute ago, crocodile said:

I think they're all out of print.

 

Karol

 

Perhaps, but fairly easy to find for a reasonable amount. Especially BOT4OJ.

 

Now, an Altman/Williams box would have been really interesting (if we're keeping this to director boxes). THE LONG GOODBYE has been more than sufficiently released already (overkill, almost, for such a mono-thematic and 'gimmicky' score), but IMAGES needs serious remastering. And then you could throw in THE KATHERINE REED STORY short, as well all the KRAFT episodes they did together. I'd buy that!

[Smeltington 1,603]

I'd like a JFK CD I can put in my CD player and listen to all the way through, without interruptions from Tony Bennett et al.

[Edmilson 9,134]

1 hour ago, Jay said:

Why would the media a piece of music was written for affect your enjoyment of the music?

 

The track is too good to be trailer music, should've been a movie cue. 

[Jay 39,764]

Sorry, I still don't understand. Can you explain more what you mean? 

[thx99 1,896]

48 minutes ago, Edmilson said:

 

The track is too good to be trailer music, should've been a movie cue. 

 

Should've been a Star Wars movie cue, for a baddie!!

[1977 1,746]

3 hours ago, crocodile said:

I think they're all out of print.

 

Karol

 

I have two extra copies of JFK if anyone is interested.

 

2 hours ago, Smeltington said:

I'd like a JFK CD I can put in my CD player and listen to all the way through, without interruptions from Tony Bennett et al.

 

Watutsi!

 

1 hour ago, Edmilson said:

The track is too good to be trailer music, should've been a movie cue. 

 

I understand and agree completely.

[Edmilson 9,134]

2 hours ago, Jay said:

Sorry, I still don't understand. Can you explain more what you mean? 

 

Trailer music shouldn't be this good. It's a piece of music created to market a movie, it must be effective but it doesn't have to be this great. 

 

I don't know, maybe it's the years listening to horrible trailer music made me surprised when I knew that a piece so good as The Turbulent Years was used in nothing more than a publicity stunt.

[Marian Schedenig 9,151]

What about Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Stone? Or Hook?

[Romão 2,323]

14 minutes ago, Edmilson said:

 

Trailer music shouldn't be this good. It's a piece of music created to market a movie, it must be effective but it doesn't have to be this great. 

 

I don't know, maybe it's the years listening to horrible trailer music made me surprised when I knew that a piece so good as The Turbulent Years was used in nothing more than a publicity stunt.

 

It's a piece that introduces all the major thematic ideas for the film. It works wonderfully in the trailer, doesn't really have a place in the movie per se. It's a brilliant overture and perfect encapsulation of the score. Being used in the movie or not does not diminish it in any way. It's like saying overtures or main titles are disappointingly only used over text and not dramatic scenes

[Jurassic Shark 13,365]

4 minutes ago, Romão said:

overtures or main titles are disappointingly only used over text and not dramatic scenes

 

Agreed!

[BrotherSound 2,295]

Might as well complete the triptych and break down Born On The Fourth Of July, too, though it’s by far the most straightforward of the three, with no cue combinations at all.

 

Cue list:

 

1MX Trumpet Prologue

1M1 Acting Out The Future

1M1 Alt - Kids At Play

1M1A Earliest Memories

1M5 Early Days

2M1 On The Mat

2M2 The Call To Duty

2M3 Recruiting Scene

2M4 After The Soda Shoppe

4M2 The Shooting Of Wilson

5M1 (New Start) Ron Is Hit

5M1 Ron Is Hit

5MA Approaching The Village

7M1 The Homecoming

8M3X Parade Overlay

8M4 Off The Platform

10M1 Campus Rally

11M2 To Mexico

12M5 Shopping For Present

12M7 Montage Of Girls

12M8 Writing The Wilsons

13M1 To Georgia

13M1 Insert

15M1 Convention Disturbance

15M2 The 1972 Convention

15M3 Alternate

15M3 Short Version

End Credit Intro

End Credits

Ron’s Theme

 

OST breakdown:

 

1–8 Various pop songs

 

9 Prologue 1:24

1M1 Acting Out The Future

 

10 The Early Days, Massapequa 5:00

1M5 Early Days

 

11 The Shooting Of Wilson 5:09

4M2 The Shooting Of Wilson

 

12 Cua Viet River, Vietnam, 1968 5:20

0:00-0:31 5M1 (New Start) Ron Is Hit

0:31-end 5M1 Ron Is Hit

 

13 Homecoming 2:39

0:00-0:55 13M1 To Georgia

0:55-end 13M1 Insert

 

14 Born On The Fourth Of July 5:42

End Credits

[Edmilson 9,134]

On the 90s, trailer music used to be as good as the best piece on the Nixon OST. These days, the quality is simply abysmal. Most trailer music is just slow, dark versions of well known songs and pieces. The 2015 movie San Andreas has the most laughable of these abominations:

 

 

[Thor 8,505]

I had the BOT4OJ expanded bootleg once (don't ask me why), and it was dreadful. The OST has the perfect representation of the score. I physically broke the CD-R in two and threw it in the trash bin!

[Holko 10,401]

Good! You really showed that illegally burned piece of plastic who's the big boy.

[John Dutton 7,503]

He's a strong advocate for official releases and anti-piracy.

[Thor 8,505]

1 hour ago, Holko said:

Good! You really showed that illegally burned piece of plastic who's the big boy.

 

Ha, ha. Indeed.

[Alan 711]

I can't hear a good portion of 'The 1960's: The Turblent Years' without imagining that it could easily be some sort of alternate for Anakin vs Obi Wan. Always thought that its more than passing resemblence to Across the Stars in parts with the action feel made it quite a good fit for the mood of the scene!

[John Dutton 7,503]

Reminds me of the Imperial March.

[Edmilson 9,134]

I guess that was probably the point, to compare Richard Nixon with Darth Vader.

 

Is JW a democrat?

[The Train Station 8,873]

Reform Party.

[Thor 8,505]

7 hours ago, Edmilson said:

Is JW a democrat?

 

He rarely makes political comments, but yes -- obviously. He's composed themes for both Michael Dukakis and Obama.

[Jurassic Shark 13,365]

He's an aristocat!