Has the Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra ever played Williams's music?

[Fabulin 3,511]

It seems that all concerts of or featuring Williams' music performed at the Royal Concertgebouw in Amsterdam have been performed by visiting orchestras, such as:

Netherlands Philharmonic Orchestra

Staatsorchester Rheinische Philharmonie, or

The Hague Philharmonic (Het Residentie Orkest)

 

Meanwhile the Concertgebouworkest, sometimes considered world's greatest orchestra (Grammophone 2008, 2010), and usually compared to Berlin and Vienna Philharmonics, does not seem to play it. Such concerts (of visiting orchestras) are labelled on the official website of the hall as being of the genre: "other".

 

Considering that even the VPO, more internationally known for conservatism, played Williams' music before, in 2010, I wonder what's the matter with those Concertgebouwers being Williams abstinents A.D. 2020.

[Steve 593]

I only know about this short performance, brass only

 

 

[JAMOcl 14]

I think we can explain that by the fact the RCO is far more conservative actually than the WP, they've had principal conductors for many many years which leads to little innoivation over the years. Recently Danielle Gatti who was ther last principal conductor seemed to be leaning towards opening the musical field, but he was fired (for rightdul reasons).

 

[SteveMc 2,674]

The suite from The Book Thief would be appropriate to break the ice, I feel.  A soloist should come in and bring it on the program in front of one of the shorter concertos in the repertoire. 

[Fabulin 3,511]

It seems they have recorded some film music by Shostakovich, so the precedent is there...

 

 

[mrbellamy 6,286]

I love those, that was my first exposure to Shosty. I was obsessed with the scherzo from Pirogov.

 

 

[Marian Schedenig 8,193]

 

1 hour ago, Fabulin said:

 

 

Just for the record, this one doesn't have film music, but it does have the Jazz Suite recording used in Eyes Wide Shut as far as I recall.

[Bespin 8,481]

My greatest disapointment about Eyes Wide Shut, was that we don't see Tom Cruise's bums.

 

But those who watched All The right Moves knows he's circumsized.

 

That's not the point.

 

OK, what was the point?

[Fabulin 3,511]

9 hours ago, Marian Schedenig said:

 

 

Just for the record, this one doesn't have film music, but it does have the Jazz Suite recording used in Eyes Wide Shut as far as I recall.

It contains the Suite for a Variety Orchestra, which consists mostly of film pieces.

[Thor 7,504]

And THE GADFLY, which is a bonafide original film score.

[Marian Schedenig 8,193]

3 hours ago, Fabulin said:

It contains the Suite for a Variety Orchestra, which consists mostly of film pieces.

 

Interesting! It's called Jazz Suite No. 2 on this album, and I was never aware that it has since been identified as a different work (or that it was partly based on film stuff).

 

2 hours ago, Thor said:

And THE GADFLY, which is a bonafide original film score.

 

No, that's the other album. I was specifically referring to The Jazz Album.

[Thor 7,504]

14 minutes ago, Marian Schedenig said:

No, that's the other album. I was specifically referring to The Jazz Album.

 

Oh, OK.

[Jurassic Shark 12,074]

3 hours ago, Marian Schedenig said:

Interesting! It's called Jazz Suite No. 2 on this album, and I was never aware that it has since been identified as a different work (or that it was partly based on film stuff).

 

That explains why what we knew as Jazz suite no. 2 wasn't very jazzy.

 

[Marian Schedenig 8,193]

16 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

That explains why what we knew as Jazz suite no. 2 wasn't very jazzy.

 

I remember that the liner notes of the album explain that Russians at the time considered this jazz, because they had few opportunities of hearing "real" jazz. But perhaps the authors just thought that because they weren't aware that this wasn't actually the real jazz suite.

[Caliburn 72]

I have been following film music concerts in the Netherlands for a while now, and I have never seen or heard "the Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra" and "film music" in one sentence. Their venue is amazing though.

[Fabulin 3,511]

They could just call Williams classical and play.

[Caliburn 72]

I did a quick search, I have not found any evidence of them playing a John Williams piece, which blows my mind.

[Jurassic Shark 12,074]

It's surely too "light" for them.

[Steve 593]

1 minute ago, Jurassic Shark said:

It's surely too "light" for them.

Maybe their brass section is too weak for Johnnys demanding work.

[Jurassic Shark 12,074]

15 minutes ago, Steve said:

Maybe their brass section is too weak for Johnnys demanding work.

 

I don't know about that - they're famous for their brass sound.

[Fabulin 3,511]

.

[Steve 593]

46 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

 

I don't know about that - they're famous for their brass sound.

Never heard that. Only about the Chicago Symphony. 

[Jurassic Shark 12,074]

Never heard of their golden brass sound?

[Caliburn 72]

23 hours ago, Jurassic Shark said:

Never heard of their golden brass sound?

 

I have ever listened to that orchestra. I am not into classical music :-)

[Jurassic Shark 12,074]

OK, Steve.

[Remco 685]

As far as I can judge, this is the situation: The younger generation of players Concertgebouw Orchestra musicians would probably like to do it (like in Vienna) but the management has always been extremely conservative. I see it as much more elitist than the VPO. They’ve done some lighter music but I frankly don’t think they’d consider JW as an option.

 

Then there’s this: The audience that comes to their concerts is some of the most snobbish you can imagine and they certainly wouldn’t want to hear JW’s music. On the other hand, we have *plenty* of occasions during the year when JW’s music gets played in the same hall, but by different orchestras. Not on the same level, but still excellent. 

[Fabulin 3,511]

1 hour ago, Remco said:

As far as I can judge, this is the situation: The younger generation of players Concertgebouw Orchestra musicians would probably like to do it (like in Vienna) but the management has always been extremely conservative. I see it as much more elitist than the VPO. They’ve done some lighter music but I frankly don’t think they’d consider JW as an option.

 

Then there’s this: The audience that comes to their concerts is some of the most snobbish you can imagine and they certainly wouldn’t want to hear JW’s music. On the other hand, we have *plenty* of occasions during the year when JW’s music gets played in the same hall, but by different orchestras. Not on the same level, but still excellent. 

I'm sure that at least a few of the members have played JW's music before, such as Katy Woolley, their principal hornist, who used to be the first horn of the Philharmonia Orchestra.  Let's hope a change is just a decade or so away, when the younger generation will be the older generation.

 

As for the concert-goers, the audience in Vienna wasn't the typical VPO audience either. It was in a large part a young and mobile demographic that flew in to the city and country. There were also some local V.I.P-s visiting, as well as (so I've heard) some famous (younger generation) soloists and other musicians.

 

The relegation to the lesser orchestras is the real problem, because the anti-Williams forces can always point to there already being "enough exposure" in the same hall...

[Marian Schedenig 8,193]

7 hours ago, Remco said:

As far as I can judge, this is the situation: The younger generation of players Concertgebouw Orchestra musicians would probably like to do it (like in Vienna) but the management has always been extremely conservative. I see it as much more elitist than the VPO. They’ve done some lighter music but I frankly don’t think they’d consider JW as an option.

 

Then there’s this: The audience that comes to their concerts is some of the most snobbish you can imagine and they certainly wouldn’t want to hear JW’s music.

 

But that's what I'd been saying about the Philharmoniker for years, too.

 

7 hours ago, Remco said:

On the other hand, we have *plenty* of occasions during the year when JW’s music gets played in the same hall, but by different orchestras. Not on the same level, but still excellent. 

 

And on the other hand, that's more than can be said for the Musikverein so far.

[Omen II 1,235]

10 hours ago, Fabulin said:

I'm sure that at least a few of the members have played JW's music before, such as Katy Woolley, their principal hornist, who used to be the first horn of the Philharmonia Orchestra.

 

Those who attended the 'not John Williams' LSO concert at the Royal Albert Hall in October 2018 will remember Katy Woolley's flawless performance of the opening horn solo in Jurassic Park.  I have also seen her slay the exposed horn part at the beginning of the Love Theme from Superman with the Philharmonia at Watford Colosseum.  Completely randomly (and nothing to do with the subject at hand), she was sitting directly in front of me with one of her pals at one of the last concerts I attended before lockdown, when the LSO played Beethoven's Christ on the Mount of Olives under Sir Simon Rattle at the Barbican last February.

 

Principal double bass Dominic Seldis, another Brit in the Royal Concertgebouw, has played on film soundtracks such as The English Patient and Harry Potter, so would have actually worked under the baton of John Williams himself.  He is also a regular member of the John Wilson Orchestra so has played tons of film music, including pieces by John Williams (you can glimpse him in a YouTube clip of Harry's Wondrous World from the 2019 Proms, for example).

[Jurassic Shark 12,074]

1 minute ago, Omen II said:

Completely randomly (and nothing to do with the subject at hand), she was sitting directly in front of me with one of her pals at one of the last concerts I attended before lockdown, when the LSO played Beethoven's Christ on the Mount of Olives under Sir Simon Rattle at the Barbican last February.

 

Interesting. Did you touch her?

[Remco 685]

The orchestra will have a new manager and they just announced there will be a concert next season with works by American composers - Among them Bernard Herrmann and John Williams!

 

https://www.parool.nl/kunst-media/artistiek-directeur-ulrike-niehoff-vaart-nieuwe-koers-met-concertgebouworkest~b64f3078f/?referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com%2F

[Remco 685]

Not surprisingly, it's Stéphan Denève conducting!

 

https://www.concertgebouworkest.nl/nl/concert/made-in-america-3

 

John WilliamsE.T.: ADVENTURES ON EARTH

John WilliamsSTAR WARS: PRINCESS LEIA'S THEME

John WilliamsSTAR WARS: MAIN TITLE

[Fabulin 3,511]

Thanks for the heads up. I will try to be there  

[SteveMc 2,674]

This is great!  The old guard is finally embracing one of the 20th century's titans.

[Remco 685]

Reminds me of the fact that Willem Mengelberg championed the young Korngold's 'Sinfonietta' more than a century ago and angry listeners would send letters complaining of the inclusion of this 'kwajongensbombast' ('bad boy's bombast'). Wonder what will happen now!

[Fabulin 3,511]

4 minutes ago, Remco said:

Reminds me of the fact that Willem Mengelberg championed the young Korngold's 'Sinfonietta' more than a century ago and angry listeners would send letters complaining of the inclusion of this 'kwajongensbombast' ('bad boy's bombast'). Wonder what will happen now!

 

The demographics from Vienna (typical -10 years) will probably repeat.