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Any music by JW you wish he had done differently?

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Coincidentally I also thought that the very ending of TROS could have gone a different way. I love the ending of the concert piece "The Rise of Skywalker", because it has this long, loong slowing down and resolution, fitting for the end of a 20-hour cycle of epic musical storytelling.

 

 

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That's a good idea.  You can definitely combine slow powerful music that fades peacefully.  A great example of the titanic ending to Wagner's 14 hour Ring operatic cycle with these huge resonate chords.  Here is the destruction of Valhalla which we heard introduced during the first opera composed decades earlier.  It's a gorgeous culmination to a mythology, a composer's grand cycle, and a lifetimes work.

 

 

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I wish he had approached films like JOHN GOLDFARB PLEASE COME HOME and 1941 differently, I suppose. They're comedy noisefests mostly devoid of humour, and Williams piles on by doing frenetic/comic overkill -- thus losing any hopes of a laugh or of engrossment. A bit of restraint would have suited the films better, but probably not saved them.

 

You could also argue that 'restraint' is something he could have used a litte bit more of now and then (John Adams' courtroom speech in AMISTAD comes to mind), but then there are other cases where the tongue-in-cheek, melodramatic exaggeration has its own value, whether it's an Indiana Jones or Harry Potter or Star Wars or what-have-you.

 

But in general, I'm less keen on 'what-could-have-beens' and more interested in what actually was; and evaluating them based on that.

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My complaints then to be how little he gives us in terms of concert pieces from scores.  There is an awesome 10-15 minute suite just waiting to happen for most of his films.  

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11 minutes ago, Quintus said:

I wish he'd put snares and boom tish in March of the Resistance. 

What’s boom tish? I’ve seen that term used here before. 

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1 hour ago, Quintus said:

I wish he'd put snares and boom tish in March of the Resistance. 

 

Indeed. Snares, and percussion-driven marches are one thing I'm a bit perplexed is so lacking in the ST, compared to OT and PT. Besides a little during the first sequences of TFA and TLJ respectively and the very opening of "The Battle of Crait" there's really not much for the snare drum at all, is there.

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I wish Williams had scored the T-Rex attack in Jurassic Park even though Spielberg knew the scene didn't need any scoring - it would fill out the album listening experience immensely

 

I wish Williams recorded in full the cues he originally came up with for the climax of Phantom Menace instead of never recording stuff that was fully orchestrated just because Lucas had already re-edited the film

 

I wish Williams had written cues for the end of Harry Potter 2 that used his great Chamber theme instead of Ross re-using the Stones motif

 

I wish Williams wrote more concert arrangements of his themes

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I wish he wasn't so rushed for time in 2002.

 

I'd have liked a proper conclusion for Act III of Attack of the Clones.  The chop job is atrocious in the film, and just missing on the score.

 

I'd have liked a more thematic approach to Minority Report.  There are some highlights, but the lush "New Beginning" at the finale shows that the score could've been friendlier on the ears.  I know the film was meant to feel more sterile and future cold, but I think Spielberg's assessment that the score is "black and white" is not very complimentary.

 

I actually feel like 2002 was a turning point in action music scoring for the Maestro, but it has evolved to a better place since then.

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28 minutes ago, Jay said:

I wish Williams had written cues for the end of Harry Potter 2 that used his great Chamber theme instead of Ross re-using the Stones motif

 

 

Precisely that. I wish Williams was more involved with Chamber of Secrets in general, instead of just letting Ross fill the voids with Philosopher's Stone music.

 

Maybe if WB decided to release the movie in summer 2003 instead of November 2002, Williams would've have more time. And they'd have another hit alongside Matrix Reloaded for the upcoming year.

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16 minutes ago, Hedji said:

I wish he wasn't so rushed for time in 2002.

 

I'd have liked a proper conclusion for Act III of Attack of the Clones.  The chop job is atrocious in the film, and just missing on the score.

 

 

If I remember the interviews from back then, the reason for the chop job was less Williams's time and more Lucas/ILM working until the last minute on that part. 

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2 minutes ago, Edmilson said:

 

Precisely that. I wish Williams was more involved with Chamber of Secrets in general, instead of just letting Ross fill the voids with Philosopher's Stone music.

 

Maybe if WB decided to release the movie in summer 2003 instead of November 2002, Williams would've have more time. And they'd have another hit alongside Matrix Reloaded for the upcoming year.

 

Or if Spielberg delayed Catch Me If You Can into 2003, same result (and then Leo wouldn't have to compete against himself in Gangs of New York for the Oscar)

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1 hour ago, Tom said:

If I remember the interviews from back then, the reason for the chop job was less Williams's time and more Lucas/ILM working until the last minute on that part. 

 

The score was recorded in January 2002, four months before the premiere (and earlier than both TPM and ROTS). Hardly "the last minute".

Williams could've scored the scenes if the recording sessions were conducted in March. I don't know they had to record so early because of the schedule of the LSO or because Williams needed to start on Minory Report by February. 

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4 times in the early 2000s Spielberg scheduled a movie right after a Potter or Star Wars film and screwed things up

 

  • Williams couldn't score every scene in Attack of the Clones because of Minority Report
  • Williams couldn't score every scene in Harry Potter 2 because of Catch Me If You Can
  • Williams scored some super early cut of Harry Potter 3 because of The Terminal
  • Williams couldn't score every scene in Revenge of the Sith because of War of the Worlds

In some parallel dimension where Spielberg's films were released at different times, I wonder what those Potter and Star Wars scores are like...

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And he didn't have time to score Ready Player One

 

I would have liked a full concert version of Rose's Theme, Sophie's Theme and Tintin's Heroic Theme .

I don't especially like the Main Titles to Tintin either .

BFG should have been less restrained in general.

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11 hours ago, Jay said:

4 times in the early 2000s Spielberg scheduled a movie right after a Potter or Star Wars film and screwed things up

 

  • Williams couldn't score every scene in Attack of the Clones because of Minority Report
  • Williams couldn't score every scene in Harry Potter 2 because of Catch Me If You Can
  • Williams scored some super early cut of Harry Potter 3 because of The Terminal
  • Williams couldn't score every scene in Revenge of the Sith because of War of the Worlds

In some parallel dimension where Spielberg's films were released at different times, I wonder what those Potter and Star Wars scores are like...

That's right, but I think some of it also has to do with the traditional way Williams works. He writes one score at a time, and doesn't do multiple recording sessions (except for the recent SW films). That leads to some very early scoring (January/February for a May release for each of the prequels, for example), with no oportunity for late revisions or additional music. 

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12 hours ago, bruce marshall said:

I always wished he had saved the "flying " music from SUPE and used it in E.T.

 

The hokey "Can You Read My Mind?". No, thank you.

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I definitely agree with the CoS comments. Whether by choice or not, JW devoted his time more fully to CMIYC, and it feels like CoS suffered as a result with all the tracked/rearranged music. I suspect he felt that the opportunity for a jazzy period style attracted him more.

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20 hours ago, Thor said:

You could also argue that 'restraint' is something he could have used a litte bit more of now and then (John Adams' courtroom speech in AMISTAD comes to mind), but then there are other cases where the tongue-in-cheek, melodramatic exaggeration has its own value, whether it's an Indiana Jones or Harry Potter or Star Wars or what-have-you.

 

The John Adams' Americana cues are the highlights of the Amistad score, IMO.  No such thing as too much. :)

 

19 hours ago, publicist said:

More presidential americana.


Not sure if you're being sarcastic or not, but his "presidential americana" music is fantastic.  If there's anything I wish Williams would undertake it's a suite of his trumpet-driven Presidential Americana themes with new specially-composed transitions, a la:

  • "The Long Road to Justice" (Amistad) [for John Adams]
  • "Growing Up in Whittier" (Nixon)
  • "Prologue" (JFK)
  • "The Peterson House and Finale" (Lincoln) [latter half of the track]

 

EDIT:  After posting this, I seem to recall there being some sort of arrangement of some of his Presidential themes (possibly by someone else), but a quick search isn't turning up anything.

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34 minutes ago, thx99 said:

The John Adams' Americana cues are the highlights of the Amistad score, IMO.  No such thing as too much. :)

 

I like them on album. I was coming to this from the perspective of how it is used in the film.

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Just now, Thor said:

 

What then? The epic fanfare stuff? That seems at odds with E.T. or what the film is about. He's not a superhero!

When SUPE and Lois take off from her balcony.

I always here THAT music when I picture the first flying scene in E.T.

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Just now, bruce marshall said:

When SUPE and Lois take off from her balcony.

 

Yes, isn't that the love theme aka "Can You Read My Mind?"? Haven't seen the film in a while, so can't remember.

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@thx99 There's totally a concert suite of "Growing Up in Whittier."  It's called "Dobby the House-Elf." B-)

 

Personally, I wish "The Birth of the Twins" had had at least some nod toward any of the three character themes that existed for Luke and/or Leia by that point. 

 

I don't know if I would ultimately want it used, but I'm desperately curious to know what Williams would have proffered to Lucas as an alternate main title for the prequel trilogy.  Things being how they are, though, it's just as well that all nine movies got the same fanfare.  I think it the constant return of the Main Title kept Williams' music grounded in the old sound in a way, preventing it from going totally 21st-century-Williams on us.

 

And I wish he could have found a way to squeeze more new themes out of TLJ's theme-phobic plot.  A First Order theme of some kind, march or otherwise, could have been plastered all over that movie.  Heck, even Benicio Del Toro could have used a slinky, cynical motif.

 

EDIT: And of course, six more movies' worth of the droid motif!  Or at least a proper BB-8 melody.

 

 

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42 minutes ago, bruce marshall said:

I wish he stopped scoring SW after JEDI and passed the baton.

Imagine six more JFKs or NIXON!

 

Words cannot express how much I utterly and completely disagree with that.

 

On 9/22/2020 at 1:33 PM, Bayesian said:

What’s boom tish? I’ve seen that term used here before. 

 

I'm not 100% certain, but I imagine they're referring to the bass drum > cymbal thing that he does a lot (e.g. starting after the first minute of The Asteroid Field). Kind of like "ba dum tish"

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11 minutes ago, Manakin Skywalker said:

 

Words cannot express how much I utterly and completely disagree with that.

 

 

 

You don't need words.

Your avatar and screen name say it all!😄

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On 9/24/2020 at 1:18 AM, bruce marshall said:

I wish he stopped scoring SW after JEDI and passed the baton.

Imagine six more JFKs or NIXON!

Or, SCHINDLERS!

SW monopolized too much of his late career with  middling results.

 

What the hell? 

JFKs, Nixons and Shindlers are nice, probably just in the top 100 

He should have skipped the whole 90's no wonder he was done and wanted to retire. 

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For TLW: 

 

More use of polyrhythm. (I don't think there's actually any in the score but I could be mistaken)

 

A cue dedicated entirely to the percussion section, like a mini percussion concerto.

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3 hours ago, Muad'Dib said:

For TLW: 

A cue dedicated entirely to the percussion section, like a mini percussion concerto.

 

What scene do you think should have been scored with percussion only?

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