John Powell's HOW TO TRAIN YOUR DRAGON (2010) - 2020 Varese 2CD Deluxe Edition

[Richard Penna 3,669]

Yeah, I use 'Filename to Tag' in Mp3Tag, just be nice if I didn't have to

[Faleel 5,329]

8 minutes ago, Richard Penna said:

Yeah, I use 'Filename to Tag' in Mp3Tag, just be nice if I didn't have to

Ah okay.

 

MP3 tag can be a lifesaver, removing track numbers, composer names, adding accents, changing  - to  /  and vice versa etc.

[Richard Penna 3,669]

Yes, I use it by default to correct the usual metadata and attach a good album cover.

[Jay 37,281]

mp3tag is amazing software, I use it all the time

[Holko 9,498]

Same

[bollemanneke 3,337]

Just finishing this set. I was really surprised to discover something in those demos. What I love is that you can clearly hear the higher instruments playing every single note, whereas if a real orchestra does it, you often don't hear all those little things.

[BryonDavis 172]

On 10/16/2020 at 7:47 AM, Jay said:

 

The HTTYD2 OST was issued by Relativity Music Group (a subsidiary of UMG), so they own the mechanical rights to release (any form of) the score. DreamWorks Animation owns all the music that wasn't on the OST. A label would have to get licenses from both entities to make an expansion happen. It's possible for Varese to do this, or any of our specialty labels. 

 

HTTYD3 is different. That OST was issued by Back Lot Music - a subsidiary of Universal Pictures. So the same company owns the mechanical rights AND all the music that wasn't on the OST. Theoretically it's possible for them to license out rights to a specialty label, but that doesn't really happen. More than likely is that someone within Back Lot would have to be interested in making an expansion happen and then it would come out on the Back Lot label. 

 

The whole LA vs overseas thing is a separate issue not related to the ability to get a license at all. All that issue means is post 2005 scores cost more. So there's nothing preventing a specialty label from getting a license to, I dunno, Memoirs of a Geisha, it's just that the amount of money they'd have to spend on union fees would be too much for it to be worthwhile to get the license and do the work

 

Relativity Music was part of the film company that went famously bankrupt a couple years back  (Google Ryan Kavanaugh).  Looks like, yes, UMG controls the rights but is only the licensee (looks like since Relativity went BK they were part of UMG's subsidiary Ingrooves as a 3rd party label distribution deal so UMG may have the rights because they have the product and handled digital rights).  In the end, any expansion would most likely need to be a manufacturing deal with UMG (similar to the ones you see where a 2-CD set has one disc from the original album and the second or more containing the expansion) for those rights and the rest has to be licensed from Universal Pictures (and both companies are not related as you all know).

[Jurassic Shark 12,023]

6 hours ago, BryonDavis said:

The CD is out of print but digital is still available so the question is who bought the rights to the Relativity Films music label catalog?

 

It's still available, courtesy of Sony Classical.

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00K613XMU/

[Arpy 4,145]

Yes, I believe Sony Classical was the distributor for the CD over here in Australia too.

[Jay 37,281]

5 hours ago, BryonDavis said:

Relativity Music was part of the film company that went famously bankrupt a couple years back  (Google Ryan Kavanaugh).  Looks like, yes, UMG controls the rights but is only the licensee (looks like since Relativity went BK they were part of UMG's subsidiary Ingrooves as a 3rd party label distribution deal so UMG may have the rights because they have the product and handled digital rights).  In the end, any expansion would most likely need to be a manufacturing deal with UMG (similar to the ones you see where a 2-CD set has one disc from the original album and the second or more containing the expansion) for those rights and the rest has to be licensed from Universal Pictures (and both companies are not related as you all know).

 

Thanks for the updated info.

 

 

So.... does that mean a HTTYD2 Deluxe Edition is forthcoming by Varese?  

[bollemanneke 3,337]

It better had be since it's an even better score.

[Edmilson 7,381]

Indeed. 

 

Every new HTTYD score manages to be superior to the last one, so Dragon 3 > Dragon 2 > Dragon 1.

[Faleel 5,329]

Eh.

 

2 and 1

3

[Jay 37,281]

6 hours ago, Jurassic Shark said:

It's still available, courtesy of Sony Classical.

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00K613XMU/

 

Is that a jewel case edition?  £5.64 is temping if so...

 

 

Sealed copies of the US Relativity Music (digipak) edition are going for $50!

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00JLKHTCW

[Jurassic Shark 12,023]

1 hour ago, Jay said:

Is that a jewel case edition?  £5.64 is temping if so...

 

You don't like digipaks either? I don't know if it's a jewel case edition, but from the square format of the front cover I'd say it's likely a jewel case, unless the picture is from the front of the booklet.

[Jay 37,281]

I've really been enjoying this release!  It took me a decade, but I feel like I'm finally picking up everything Powell's putting down with this score.

 

So I figured hey, maybe I'll re-watch the first film, and finally see for the first time the 2nd and 3rd films.  Had a laugh when I checked out Just Watch

 

HTTYD1 is streaming on Amazon Prime

HTTYD2 is streaming on Netflix

HTTYD3 is streaming on Hulu

 

You cannot sit down and use one service to watch all three.  Luckily we have those 3 services, but seriously...

[Richard Penna 3,669]

I've been waiting forever for #3 to come on Prime or Netflix, and all I ever find is the first two.

[Holko 9,498]

Not missing much.

 

Unlike the previous ones, this has an excess of filler, an idea of where to end but no idea how to get there, a terrible bland cliche villain, it makes Toothless into an unlikeable jerk, it doesn't follow through on setups from the first 2, it's very bland visually, and the ending is incredibly disappointingly stupidly reasoned and 100% unearned. The series did not manage to grow up with its target audience.

[Gurkensalat 336]

Those are movies that really benefit from 3D, so if you have the hardware, I recommend the 3D Blu-rays very much. Extremely well done! 

[Jay 37,281]

I definitely did not purchase a 3D TV nor a 3D Blu Ray player.  3D is just not for me

[Tom Guernsey 2,279]

2 minutes ago, Jay said:

I definitely did not purchase a 3D TV nor a 3D Blu Ray player.  3D is just not for me

Agreed. It just doesn’t work at tv scale. It’s like watching live subbutio football players running around. 

[Edmilson 7,381]

The only one I watched in theaters was the second. Can't remember if I saw it in 3D or not though.

[Gurkensalat 336]

3 hours ago, Tom Guernsey said:

Agreed. It just doesn’t work at tv scale. It’s like watching live subbutio football players running around. 

 

That is why I have a front projector in the living room :-). 

 

3 hours ago, Jay said:

I definitely did not purchase a 3D TV nor a 3D Blu Ray player.  3D is just not for me

 

After my first cinema experiences I thought that too. But when I found that my new projector has 3D capability, I tried it and was pleasantly surprised. I enjoy 3D at home much more than at the cinema, I don’t know why. Now I have a collection of 80 3D movies; at least 50 of them I regard as a clear advantage over the 2D version, like the HTTYD movies and most other DreamWorks animations, but also several recent Marvel movies. Others, not so much like the last 2 Harry Potters.

[Smeltington 1,436]

1 minute ago, Gurkensalat said:

Others, not so much like the last 2 Harry Potters.

 

Yeah those were poorly converted, unfortunately.

[A. A. Ron 1,738]

5 hours ago, Holko said:

Not missing much.

 

Unlike the previous ones, this has an excess of filler, an idea of where to end but no idea how to get there, a terrible bland cliche villain, it makes Toothless into an unlikeable jerk, it doesn't follow through on setups from the first 2, it's very bland visually, and the ending is incredibly disappointingly stupidly reasoned and 100% unearned. The series did not manage to grow up with its target audience.

I 100% disagree. After an uneven second installment, the third film brought so much warmth and heart to the table that I reevaluated the whole trilogy. It’s a great ending and Powell’s incredible score reflects that.

[Faleel 5,329]

In my opinion, the first has an even distribution of humour and quotable lines through all the characters, where the second film basically just focused on Hiccup, Toothless, and the parents.

 

The third was kind of subdued.

[Holko 9,498]

7 hours ago, A. A. Ron said:

I 100% disagree. After an uneven second installment, the third film brought so much warmth and heart to the table that I reevaluated the whole trilogy. It’s a great ending and Powell’s incredible score reflects that.

Really? "Oh no, another problem we kind of easily overcame, let's just give up forever." "I have a best friend ever, I became the Alpha of my group, I protect them and take care of the- oh my, is that some sweet pussy? Fuck all them, I have a girlfriend now, I'll even growl at my best friend ever when he asks me for help."

 

Maybe if the danger came from inside, like they were going around showing others he Dragom Rider way and how good it is, but then it turns out the mum and many riders are more radical and not afraid to kill people or at least let them die or something if they don't agree - and this time the dragons are not under some potion or hypnotisation that can be overcome by a better alpha, it really is bad or not great people making good dragons do bad things. Now THAT I could see leading to a climax where they decide all dragons must just be sent away, we're not good enough for them.

[Arpy 4,145]

8 hours ago, A. A. Ron said:

I 100% disagree. After an uneven second installment, the third film brought so much warmth and heart to the table that I reevaluated the whole trilogy. It’s a great ending and Powell’s incredible score reflects that.

The Hidden World Theme is ace! I often revisit that score and marvel at how Powell was able to bring the trilogy together and consistently deliver such brilliant music. It's a great musical tapestry that I don't think most animated films are afforded.

[Tom Guernsey 2,279]

11 minutes ago, Arpy said:

The Hidden World Theme is ace! I often revisit that score and marvel at how Powell was able to bring the trilogy together and consistently deliver such brilliant music. It's a great musical tapestry that I don't think most animated films are afforded.

Agreed. I was surprised that it took me a number of listens to really get into it. I don't think it helps that the first few tracks aren't the strongest, but once it hits its stride, it's terrific. Sometimes I can't hear some of the original themes without then hearing them segue into some of the Hidden World themes. The dragon romance cues and the finale track in particularly is absolutely magical, that modal choral writing is wonderful. I enjoyed the film, but I think my enjoyment of the scores slightly coloured my view of it, but I'd like to watch them all again at some point as they are still a pretty strong series of movies.

[Arpy 4,145]

I really appreciated going back to the earlier tracks and hearing the themes begin to develop and grow as the score goes on, 

[BryonDavis 172]

19 hours ago, Jay said:

 

Thanks for the updated info.

 

 

So.... does that mean a HTTYD2 Deluxe Edition is forthcoming by Varese?  

 

Not at this time.

22 hours ago, Arpy said:

Yes, I believe Sony Classical was the distributor for the CD over here in Australia too.

Relativity may have had worldwide rights but it's a good bet Sony controls it outside the USA.

[Bofur01 245]

Unsure if it's been reported before, but Powell said in a FB comment that this release will be available for some form of digital purchase/streaming in December.

[Jay 37,281]

The fact that it will get a digital release was reported on day 1:

 

 

On 10/3/2020 at 8:39 AM, Smaug The Iron said:

Powell confirms that it will get a digital release. 

 

 

 

But the "December" part is new information as far as I know!

[crumbs 14,296]

Interesting, does that mean Varese got digital/streaming rights for this score?

[Jay 37,281]

Or the digital version could be released by Paramount

[BryonDavis 172]

7 hours ago, Jay said:

Or the digital version could be released by Paramount

 

Keep in mind DW Animation is controlled by Universal Pictures.

[Jay 37,281]

Or by Universal Pictures 

[Holko 9,498]

Holy shit we have this complete officially.

 

 

Holy fucking shit what a great score.

 

 

And it sounds so great! Great clarity and everything, I've heard subtleties I have no memory of, like the marimba in a lot of places, all of Forbidden Friendship actually being very busy, etc. And of course the action sounds great and not as overbearing.

 

So, as usual, here's my quick edit, I know the score inside out so I knew what I wanted.

I use only the film version opening, I don't like the double intro as it is on the disc, Anybody See That stuck to the end of the first cue to complete the opening setpiece in one track. Hiccup Comes Home stuck to the end of Dragon Training. Percussion intro included for See You Tomorrow. Teamwork and Charming joined. The 3 short Astrid cues joined into one. Overlapped Not a Viking and Ready. The whole final battle in one track, Over/Less OK joined with Wings overlapping to keep the intended flow, Counter Attack joined to it while still keeping some silence there. Finale is the alternate opening plus the non-alternate Vikings Have Their Tea. Unfortunately the demos sound very demoey and mostly not actually very compositionally different so those are kinda a one off, listen and forget deal to me.

 

Isn't it interesting how in both 1 and 2, the only major different recorded alternate is the very opening, in both cases the film version is more quiet and the alternate is more big and bombastic, and both of the alternates are featured in the credits?

 

[Holko 9,498]

The booklet has great quotes from the directors!

 

It doesn't actually go into as much of a thematic enumeration, breakdown and definite naming as I thought from Faleel's post. I will happily continue calling the Berk theme the Berk theme and the Friendship Arpeggio the Night Fury theme.

[Faleel 5,329]

4 hours ago, Holko said:

The booklet has great quotes from the directors!

 

It doesn't actually go into as much of a thematic enumeration, breakdown and definite naming as I thought from Faleel's post. I will happily continue calling the Berk theme the Berk theme and the Friendship Arpeggio the Night Fury theme.

Yeah, surprised it wasn't that obvious, what with all the slashes ("/") seperating "alternate" names...

[Smeltington 1,436]

10 hours ago, Holko said:

The booklet has great quotes from the directors!

 

With all these quotes, this is actually the most I've EVER enjoyed reading the liner notes for an expanded soundtrack. There's amazing lessons in there about the fundamentals of the art of film scoring. And a great demonstration of how filmmakers can COLLABORATE with a composer - not just hand the film over to them. I loved the line about building "houses" for music in a film.

 

I never heard this score before, it's a ton of fun, I'm excited to have it!

 

When I opened the shrinkwrap, the case had a little piece missing on the side, and fingerprints all over it (despite being sealed), plus a leftover remnant of a peeled-off sticker along the top, like you'd see on a store-bought CD. Seems like they put the inserts and disks into a used 2CD jewel case?? And then added shrinkwrap over it. Very weird.

[Holko 9,498]

So, I did a little thematic breakdown writeup. It was not the easiest I ever did - I counted 15 (yes, 15 (yes, fifteen)) themes/recurring things, some of them some might classify as parts of one thing, some of them opening on the same note, some sharing a phrase, almost all of them only partially played multiple times but almost always in different guises, Powell riffs on themes and adds or subtracts notes. Therefore, if anyone notices any discrepancies, stuff I missed or got wrong, feel free to point it out, or add stuff if you have input to add!

 

 

Theme: number of appearances, preferably clean complete statement timestamp

description

 

Big ones:

Night Fury (Friendship arpeggio): 31, Forbidden Friendship (D1T12) 2:19-2:26

A descending melody later used as an ostinato.

Friendship : 17, Where's Hiccup (D2T7) 1:19-1:43

A rising melody, AA', sometimes followed by BB' which is close to A and A' but higher pitched, climbing toward...

Flying: 13, Coming Back Around (D2T8) 1:34-1:55

Soaring melody climbing up and down, AA'BC.

Winds of Change (Hiccup): 10, The Vikings Have Their Tea (D2T10) 0:00-0:24

A gentle kind-hearted theme, ABA'C

Viking Fun (Berk): 10, This Is Berk (D1T2) 1:12-1:20

An almost shanty-like energetic theme, 4 phrases, ABA'C.

Viking Heroism: 14, This Is Berk (D1T2) 5:19-5:34

As the name says, a heroic theme for the Vikings, climbing up.

Viking Warrior: 14, Ready/Confront (D2T2) 0:06-0:27

A more gritty action theme than the previous one.

Viking Warrior 2 (Stoick): 3, The Vikings Have Their Tea alternate (D2T11) 0:49-1:24(?)

A grim and stout one, AA'BBCD+, doesn't play enough time to truly tell what's still part of it, where it ends. Interestingly, its A is Winds of Change(Hiccup)'s A with a descending end rather than ascending and less decorated.

Dragons: 18, This Is Berk (D1T2) 4:21-4:50

A drawn-out serpentine melody often returning to phrases and slowly climbing higher.

Love theme: 6, Romantic Flight (D1T22) 0:20-0:48

Classic love theme.

 

Smaller ones:

Fate: 6, Training Out There (D1T5) 1:04-1:31

Descending, "Jewish" melody as the booklet says.

Jig: 3, See You Tomorrow (D1T16) 0:18-0:26

Like the name says, a lively dance melody.

Falling: 2, Test Drive (D1T17) 1:31-1:53

Exciting utility theme to add to the Flying repertoire in time of need.

Fighting Dragons: 5, Over / Less Okay (D2T4) 2:39-2:41

Rythmic descending figure, mostly as an ostinato.

Friendly Dragons: 4, New Tail (D1T13) 0:53-1:04

A small gentle figure.

 

So, let's go through the Varese set!

 

1m2alt This Is Berk (film version) - The story begins with a mood not unlike Shrek's Fairytale. Noble brass opens with Friendship (first two phrases, then a single climbing one fading away), then a swinging lullaby bassoon Viking Fun over fitting percussion rythm supported by humming female choir and high strings brings us to a similar solo string and woodwind Flying.

 

1m2 This Is Berk (original) - A much more bombastic introduction featuring a slow reading of Viking Heroism, then continuing with a similar but faster paced Viking Fun then Flying combination as the other version.

 

1m3-4 ??? - A snappy string 1-2-1234 rythm (not dissimilar to the structure of Viking Heroism) leads into a multilayered buildup that erupts in a grand Viking Fun. Viking Warrior comes in after 2 of them and then another Viking Fun follows. Male choir and brass take Viking Warrior 2, then Fun returns again. Another statement, this time on quieter winds gives space to Heroism, an interlude, then Viking Warrior comes back in full force on brass then male choir, when suddenly the Love theme enters to change the atmosphere. After that, the following is a lot calmer too, Winds of Change on clarinet with busy sawing strings and a more heroic statement that quickly fizzes out into nonthematic material and one more fanfaric Heroism.

 

1m5 Dragon Battle - Snarling brass leads to our first introduction to two threatening Dragons statements until Viking Heroism overtakes it, but Dragons comes right back in in a strangely heroic setting.

 

1m6 Anybody See That? - Anticipatory textures and a not quite resolving chord open, then a comic joyous Winds of Change as Hiccup celebrates his lucky shot, but then Viking Warrior as the dragon chases him and Viking Fun finishes as Stoick steps in to finish the dragon off.

 

So, between the two versions, the opening setpiece introduces... 9 of the 15 themes. Not bad!

 

1m7a War Room - Solo brass playing a fragment of Viking Warrior leads to Hiccup's clarinet and a flute opening up a militaristic but slow Warrior setting with percussion and male hummers.

 

1m7b Training Out There - As Hiccup wanders the forest looking for his "kill", we get our first Night Fury on harp, then Viking Warrior first on his clarinet and then a comically mock-heroic brass and male hummers one lead to a bassoon Winds of Change and an oboe and clarinet Fate, illustrating his true personality. After some stingers, anticipatory held notes and chords reminiscent of that in Anybody See That?, strings take up a rythm and brass plays Viking Heroism as Hiccup plans to strike down the trapped dragon, but the conclusion only leads to a loud miserable string Night Fury, and a low brass Friendship to play it off, as the seed of their relationship is planted here. After the dragon is freed and he threatens the boy but leaves him instead of killing him, we get a hardanger Night Fury with electric guitar.

 

2m8 Hiccup Comes Home - An uneasy and uncharacteristically fast Dragons reading.

 

2m9 Dragon Training - Opening with a slow reverent Viking Heroism not unlike the original opening, there follows a unique introduction and action bit with pieces of many melodies, until Heroism, including the first appearance of its ending, and eventually Dragons weave their way into it.

 

2m10 Wounded - Sliding strings and female choir play a curious Friendship. A second statement as Hiccup disovers he caused the dragon to be disabled is interrupted,  then it restarts in a different mood with brass and male hummers.

 

2m11 Dragon Book follows with more of the string and hummer Friendship, but marimba and sawing strings start a rythm that eventually takes over with Dragons as Hiccup looks through the book at the many different species, Night Fury on the dulcimer (?) noting the last, empty page on the breed. As the scene changes to the Viking fleet, we get a hardanger Viking Warrior then unique dark percussive material.

 

2m12 Hiccup Focus - Right off the bat we jump into an action Dragons over an ostinato of Fighting Dragons, strings playing a not very heroic Viking Warrior before the action temporarily stops. A muted Heroism fanfare (starting a couple notes in) leads to a string Warrior and then a more heroic brass Heroism fanfare and a descending phrase. The action grows more frantic, the ostinato keeping Fighting Dragons' rythm but losing the melody.

 

2m13 Offering - A glassy Friendship just barely sneaks in between glassy textures as Hiccup sneaks back to the Night Fury to get to know him better, ending up naming him Toothless.

 

2m14 Forbidden Friendship - As the booklet says, a huge array of uncommon glassy instruments layer, play rythms, and eventually the Night Fury motif starts being passed back and forth between them, growing more and more in the process as the two leads grow closer together. It's through this cue that the motif that until now has only had lone appearances will become the driving repeating arpeggio heralding and supporting the strongest Friendship and Flying appearances. Only a sopilka solo playing a part of the Flying theme interrupts the monothematic nature of the cue.

 

2m15 New Tail - After a hardanger intro, Fate picks up on woodwinds then the entire orchestra as Hiccup builds the prototype mechanical tail. A calm setting of Friendly Dragons follows, then eventually a rythm picks up and Viking Fun plays on flute and then the whole orchestra as Toothless realises he's whole and can fly again - but not without his friend.

 

3m16 Teamwork - Fighting Dragons moving back and forth between instrument groups, then a slow Dragons spreads on strings as the smoke envelops the kids.

 

3m17 Charming the Pziiffelback - A return of Friendly Dragons as Hiccup peacefully defeats the beast.

 

3m18 See You Tomorrow - A cue-unique motif on winds and strings sets off our first union of Night Fury (strings) and Friendship (brass), then after a comic sting Jig takes over on winds. Fate enters on a brass-string dialogue, then the unique motif brings us to more Night Fury, then more Fate, then the Jig comes back. The rythm stops for a bit and another buildup starts, strings and winds leading to a lowkey harp Night Fury heralding then supporting an anticipatory Friendship, now in their classic setting foreshadowing the next cue. Fate takes back its lead and plays down until the frantic finale. In the ending we get a defeated bassoon Viking Warrior as the ships return.

 

3m20 Test Drive - Night Fury starts confidently, first on pipes, then picked up by strings. Friendship takes over on woodwinds, Flying finally takes its place as its conclusion on brass. Friendship comes back, but problems arise - after a tense section, Falling appears for the first time, leading to a determined Night Fury on strings and a soaring Flying on brass supported by electric guitar (and pretty much everything else too) in its most classic setting as Hiccup and Toothless pull out of the dive successfully. A quick additional Night Fury plays off the triumphantly climbing finale.

 

3m21 Not So Fireproof - Gentle fun clarinet Dragons readings interrupted once by a brass fragmentary Night Fury and followed by the ending of Flying.

 

3m22 This Time for Sure - Fun, different Viking Fun segments with a Viking Warrior interlude like in the opening.

 

3m23 Astrid Finds Toothless - Alert Night Fury variations.

 

3m24 Astrid Goes for a Spin - More Viking Fun with the Jig as an interlude.

 

3m25 Romantic Flight - A solo violin and female choir take the Love theme into a whole new realm, then a fuller statement moves onto the whole orchestra. An unexpected romantic Night Fury development leads to an even bigger orchestral Love statement.

 

3m26b Dragon's Den - A unique introduction with a hidden low brass Dragons builds and builds to a monumental Dragons statement as the characters enter the den, strings sneakily playing Friendship at its tail end. For the heroes' escape we get an action Dragons statement.

 

3m26c Let's Find Dad - After Friendship, a harmonium then solo woodwind Love theme takes over.

 

4m27-28 Kill Ring / Stop the Fight - as Hiccup gets ready to enter an arena, a complete brass Winds of Change interrupted by a Night Fury plays. Brass then alludes to Dragons. A unique bit of action and tension material later, the plan to change Stoick's mind fails, Dragons takes over in an action setting, Night Fury playing in a panicked setting as in the distance Toothless hears Hiccup's screams. The action grows more and more frantic, then a quickening Night Fury erupting in an at least somewhat triumphant Flying signals the dragon overcoming his disability and managing to arrive to help his friend. A brass setting of Dragons over stabbing strings scores his fight with the arena dragon, then the bitter triumph is scored with a sad string Night Fury.

 

4m30 Not a Viking - A quietly threatening Dragons grows louder and leads to a disquieting Night Fury development, then a slowly determined-growing Viking Warrior finishes the cue.

 

4m31 Ready / Confront - A militarised Warrior on brass then pipes starts the Viking excursion to eliminate the dragon den, then a bitingly ironic tragic Flying plays as we see Toothless strapped down in chains. Viking Heroism takes over, then the percussion and rythm subsides. As Hiccup and Astrid watch the horizon, Fate plays on a solo woodwind then strings then both, moving to clarinet. Winds of Change scores the conception of a plan, and the cue gains drive and rythm again, building to a transition to Dragons as we cut to the ships, then as the warriors land, we cut back to Friendly Dragons. More tense writing scores another cut back to the vikings getting ready.

 

4m33-4 Relax / Stroke / Hell - An uncharacteristic Dragons plays as the kids get friendly with the animals, eventually erupting in a quasi-Night Fury ostinato and the culmination of Friendly Dragons, then the last transition back to the den, with a massive lumbering brass Viking Warrior. After the wall is broken down, the Dragons setting over rythmic stabs from Stop the Fight returns as they all fly out.

 

4m35-37 Over / Less Okay - As the Red (Green? Grey.) Death emerges, strings play an ostinato based on supporting material from the end of Dragon's Den, then a big threatening Dragons moves forward, played by the orchestra, then choir. As Stoick quickly rethinks his plan, Viking Heroism plays finally in a truly heroic guise again. Soon though the dragon riders arrive with a joyous explosion of Winds of Change, changing the rythm. Viking Warrior 2 takes over, then a strange unsuccessful setting of Winds of Change follows. Fighting Dragons takes the lead, though the fanfarified Heroism and a Warrior supported by Night Fury interrupt it once. After its return with a string Winds of Change and then one more Heroism fanfare, the descending phrase from Hiccup Focus plays it off. The battle resumes with Dragons, but dies off as Hiccup dives into the water to try and save the chained up sinking Toothless to a Night Fury reading very similar to the one in Training Out There when he was in the flipside of this situation trying to kill him and failing whereas now he's trying to save his life and failing. As Stoick saves his son and jumps back to save the dragon too, another Night Fury plays but on the hardanger and choir. Toothless is free and brings the viking back to the surface with a joyous Friendship+Night Fury, which then moves onto a quiet Flying, then back to Friendship as the friends take off. The rythm is not fast-paced and optimistic, the battle is going well. Falling interrupts the joyride, but Night Fury and another glorious Flying lead to the grand buildup finale, designed to lead into...

 

4m38 Wings - As the Red (Green? Grey.) Death unfurls its wings, a cumbersome slow male choir picks up Dragons, then the quickening tempo leads to a Viking Herosim, followed interestingly by a heroic Dragon setting, with everyone finally seeing they're not necessarily all enemies and vicious beasts, returning to Heroism before the end.

 

5m39 Counter Attack starts off with a panicked Night Fury as the villainous mammoth gains the upper hand, then after unique action bits, at the moment when Toothless sends a fire shot to reignite the flammable gas inside the beast, a triumphant brass Winds of Change plays. The villain falls, but Hiccup falls off his saddle too, Toothless rushing to his help with a frantic quick Night Fury.

 

5m40 Where's Hiccup - Lamentary male and female choirs mourn the hero with Stoick, until Toothless reveals he did manage to save his friend - mostly. A celebratory Night Fury (not unlike the romantic setting) marks the moment, then solo piano takes over when Hiccup wakes up days later. Friendship leads to Flying, the last notes left off, not resolving, as the boy realises his leg's missing, paralleling how he crippled Toothless early in the movie. Strings come in and Friendship plays once again, going into Night Fury.

 

5m41 Coming Back Around - As we see Berk has finally come around to living with dragons, a jolly setting of the Love theme and the romantic Night Fury setting plays, parts of the Love theme returning after it. As Hiccup gears up to fly with Toothless once again and deliver his closing speech, Night Fury gears up as well on pipes, Friendship takes a running start, and Flying lifts off and starts soaring, Night Fury playing it off in the end... But then the supposedly intended credits opener starts, with Friendship and Flying given a percussion-heavy Scottish Military Tattoo treatment!

 

5m50 The Vikings Have Their Tea - After that bombastic finale, we close with what was presumably the intended end of the credits, or an album exclusive piece, a humorously sophisticated rendition of Winds of Change and Viking Warrior 2 for hardanger, woodwind and pizzicato strings. The final version is more of a dialogue between the hardanger and the woodwind, coming together for the reprise, but the alternate has them playing together pretty much all the way. Depending on your way of interpreting/naming the themes, this is either a father/son reconciliation piece, or a signal of comfortable peace between the old and new ways. Oh wait, it's both.

[Faleel 5,329]

I always thought of the Friendly Dragons as the "Exotic theme"

[Holko 9,498]

By then I was thinking "not another one! Ah, all these scenes are about taming friendly dragons, let's just call it that." I already had to record myself humming some of them and play them back until I finally learned which one's Stoick, Heroic and Warrior!  

[Edmilson 7,381]

Thanks! I'll re-listen to the album again accompanied by your track by track analysis.

[Smaug The Iron 510]

Finally got my copie! 

This score is Amazing!! 

[Jay 37,281]

Hooray for another theme analysis!  I admit this score never FULLY clicked with me (for a decade now!) until we started talking about the themes last week and I re-listened and just "got it" finally.

 

I am curious though, Holko, when you talk about theme names, are you saying you fundamentally disagree with the names/designations Grieving used for the booklet, or are you saying you are sure he's right, but can't undo in your brain the names you've been using for a decade?

[Holko 9,498]

I did adapt some of them! Like Fate and Winds of Change. But something like Berk just feels so Berk, and I already had Heroic Viking and Warrior Viking, no need for a Fun Viking to be more confusing. Also I listed a lot more of them that I named myself, and he doesn't list his out with definitive names anyway, so I felt comfortable doing this mishmash.

[Tom Guernsey 2,279]

19 minutes ago, Holko said:

I did adapt some of them! Like Fate and Winds of Change. But something like Berk just feels so Berk, and I already had Heroic Viking and Warrior Viking, no need for a Fun Viking to be more confusing. Also I listed a lot more of them that I named myself, and he doesn't list his out with definitive names anyway, so I felt comfortable doing this mishmash.

Very cool analysis, I'll have to sit and listen along at the weekend. Cheers!

[Faleel 5,329]

28 minutes ago, Holko said:

 Berk just feels so Berk,

Aside from the fact it disapears halfway through the film, and probably appears apart from Berk in later films