Bellosh 3,317 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 It's safe to say that Kingdom of the Crystal Skull is not cracking anyone's top 10 JW scores any time soon. I don't even think an expansion can do that. But if it was the ONLY Indy score, would it? Keep in mind it would be the first time you hear the amazing Raiders March and Marion's Theme. The other themes in it might carry some more weight as well. Is that alone, enough? I liken it to The Force Awakens. If TFA was the only Star Wars score/film, I'm sure it'd be in many top 10's here. And that's not to compare either scores, TFA might be a better score overall, but the concept remains the same. Ultimately KOTCS will always (whether unfair or not) be compared to the untouchable trilogy but, for me, KOTCS would easily be in the top 10, maybe top 5 if it was the ONLY Indy score bruce marshall 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Thor 7,385 Posted November 19, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 19, 2020 No, it wouldn't. But for all the times I keep saying that his post-2005 scores are disappointing to me, it's always in relation to Williams' own oeuvre. Compared to most anything and anyone else, they still hold a very high standard. So, for example, INDY 4 would no doubt feature on my top 10 list of 2008 scores. blondheim, Edmilson, SilverTrumpet and 3 others 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crocodile 7,939 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 There are a few dead spots here and there but I rather like it. But it us no top 10 material. Karol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,042 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 Nah. I love this score, but the man has simply written at least 10 other scores that are better than it, even if you try to wrap your brain into a world where you have to put all the Impact of the Raiders March and Marion themes into this score Smeltington 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 Indy vs Jason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabulin 3,505 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 22 minutes ago, Jay said: Nah. I love this score, but the man has simply written at least 10 other scores that are better than it, even if you try to wrap your brain into a world where you have to put all the Impact of the Raiders March and Mario themes into this score Smeltington and A. A. Ron 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,042 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 Typo fixed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeinAR 1,949 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 Keep in mind it has the Raiders March, Marion's theme and that amazing endtitle. If thoses were the first time you ever heard the Indy march(raiders doesn't exist). Yes absolutely because the Raiders march is a cinema score classic. It would be a Jerry Goldsmith/esqe JW classic. Mediocre film and a unique score with amazing themes again never before heard in a film Bellosh 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheUlyssesian 2,467 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 Hell yeah. I mean any score which has a main theme as great as Indy's theme is going to be one of the best ever - given the assumption that this is the first time that theme is featured. Bellosh and Cerebral Cortex 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Fabulin 3,505 Posted November 19, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted November 19, 2020 Don't forget that KOTCS also features the Ark Theme and Henry Jones' Theme! JoeinAR, Bellosh and Cerebral Cortex 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,042 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 Hmm, that's a good point... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,306 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 Where can I hear " Warehouse Fight". Definitely a highlight IN THE FILM - but I haven't heard it as a standalone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bellosh 3,317 Posted November 19, 2020 Author Share Posted November 19, 2020 6 minutes ago, bruce marshall said: Where can I hear " Warehouse Fight". Definitely a highlight IN THE FILM - but I haven't heard it as a standalone Oh so NOW you want some of that expanded stuff... crumbs 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,306 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 IF it includes GREAT STUFF.... I AM NOT THOR!😅😅😅😅 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,615 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 I never understood the general hate towards this score. The OST is not a good representation of the music but there's a sessions leak.It's a bit like RotS where I was disappointed by the OST until the unreleased music was available It's top tier and equal to all the SW Prequel and Sequel scores Bellosh 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,042 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 1 hour ago, bruce marshall said: Where can I hear " Warehouse Fight". Definitely a highlight IN THE FILM - but I haven't heard it as a standalone followed by bruce marshall 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bellosh 3,317 Posted November 19, 2020 Author Share Posted November 19, 2020 Surprised it's only got 5 votes so far. I know hypothetical questions can get tricky, but I really think a lot of people are sleeping on how much they would love the Raiders March if it was first presented in 2008. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,205 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 2 hours ago, King Mark said: It's top tier and equal to all the SW Prequel and Sequel scores Never!!!! Especially to sequel scores. Huge difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bellosh 3,317 Posted November 19, 2020 Author Share Posted November 19, 2020 1 minute ago, theBT said: Never!!!! Maybe not prequels, but definitely on par with the sequels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joni Wiljami 1,205 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 41 minutes ago, Bellosh said: Maybe not prequels, but definitely on par with the sequels. Not par with even prequels, definitely not on par with my beloved sequels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy 4,000 Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 3 hours ago, King Mark said: It's top tier and equal to all the SW Prequel and Sequel scores I often have similar sensibilities as KM, but this time, no. There is quite a bit of material that doesn't accelerate, or get you from point A to B. The action music noisy, the comedy music over the top. So, it can't quite be top tier because it really seems to lack focus. Which is a dang shame, because the end credits prove all the ingredients are there; they just don't come together well. Irina's theme is criminally underused. The Russian music from the End Credits is unique to the End Credits. Dovchenko could've been more obviously "leitmotifed" with it. The arrangement of Mutt's theme in the End Credits seems to know what it wants to do more than even the concert piece. Whirl Through Academe is just a bit too frantic to be fun. Ants! offers some rhythmic promise, but never comes remotely close to Airplane Fight or Slave Children's fist fight. Having said all of that... It would definitely be in the top 10 just on the strength of the legacy themes and the complimentary new themes. The End Credits is splendid... It really is. I just wish it was more representative of the whole of the score. I'll also take this opportunity to say that I've been listening to this score a lot lately, so my take is fresh. I actually do like the film, as I do the Star Wars Sequels. But as a fan of both, I don't feel Williams captured the magic here like he did on the Sequels. Too bad that wonderful new counterpoint arranged into Indy's theme is only heard in the final seconds of the score. That made the hairs on my neck stand up in the theater as the Credits were finishing. Bellosh and oierem 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,306 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 After watching and listening to " Warehouse Escape" and the complete " Jungle Chase" I can't say my opinion has changed much. The former is very good indeed, and the scene is great!. But, the latter still falls flat for me. It's two parts - MUTTS THEME and DESERT CHASE. I really dislike Mutts theme and we heard DEZERT in ROTLA. So, I'm agnostic if this really will benefit greatly from expansion. Improved, yes. LAST CRUSADE is my favorite film and score😍 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 On 11/19/2020 at 9:13 AM, Thor said: No, it wouldn't. But for all the times I keep saying that his post-2005 scores are disappointing to me, it's always in relation to Williams' own oeuvre. Compared to most anything and anyone else, they still hold a very high standard. So, for example, INDY 4 would no doubt feature on my top 10 list of 2008 scores. It would, but it's still kinda boring. The 10-minute Jungle Chase is a lonely highlight (and even that repeats large strokes of prior stylistics) and i cannot bear how all these AI/MR/WotW minimalist/dissonant licks have found their way into IJ territory. crumbs 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,275 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 49 minutes ago, publicist said: It would, but it's still kinda boring. The 10-minute Jungle Chase is a lonely highlight (and even that repeats large strokes of prior stylistics) and i cannot bear how all these AI/MR/WotW minimalist/dissonant licks have found their way into IJ territory. The underscore is woefully dull in KOCS, which is thoroughly unlike the underscore in the original 3. You could take any atmospheric, 'quiet' track from TOD and it would wipe the floor with the underscore in KOCS. That Williams saw fit to populate his OST with so many of those tracks is even more perplexing. There was just an exuberant energy to those earlier films and scores that KOCS simply couldn't recapture. Richard Penna 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,306 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 I still think it's a better FILM than TOD ( sorry Bellosh) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Parker 3,040 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 55 minutes ago, crumbs said: The underscore is woefully dull in KOCS, which is thoroughly unlike the underscore in the original 3. You could take any atmospheric, 'quiet' track from TOD and it would wipe the floor with the underscore in KOCS. That Williams saw fit to populate his OST with so many of those tracks is even more perplexing. There was just an exuberant energy to those earlier films and scores that KOCS simply couldn't recapture. I can't help but wonder if part of it was Williams feeling pressure, whether from without or within (most likely the former), to consciously imitate what came before, much like the film itself, and later the Star Wars sequels (cue hornist: ) I think the moments that came closest to matching the glory moments of the first three--such as the build and climax of Hidden Treasure and the City of Gold--were ones that were laced with some of stylistic fabric of the originals, but still deeply natural with Williams' current style at that time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blondheim 1,157 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 I am very fond of the theme suites on that disc but I do not believe it is the strongest scene-by-scene scoring of his career. I don't know if the full score would seem all that coherent after the incredible focus of his early 2000's work. It would feel like a nebulous Tintin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,306 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 I still maintain that , unlike Goldsmith, JW needs to be inspired by the film he is scoring. Listening to E.T. , you can FEEL he poured his heart and soul into that one. Same with WAR HORSE. He is an ARTIST, after all😊 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Penna 3,617 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 On 11/19/2020 at 8:26 PM, King Mark said: I never understood the general hate towards this score. The OST is not a good representation of the music but there's a sessions leak.It's a bit like RotS where I was disappointed by the OST until the unreleased music was available It's top tier and equal to all the SW Prequel and Sequel scores One can certainly make an excellent album from the sessions, if you include more of the action material instead. But.... this: 10 hours ago, crumbs said: The underscore is woefully dull in KOCS, which is thoroughly unlike the underscore in the original 3. You could take any atmospheric, 'quiet' track from TOD and it would wipe the floor with the underscore in KOCS. That Williams saw fit to populate his OST with so many of those tracks is even more perplexing. There was just an exuberant energy to those earlier films and scores that KOCS simply couldn't recapture. BTW, I never see it as a mystery why JW includes all the 'dull' stuff. It clearly isn't dull to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,306 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 24 minutes ago, Richard Penna said: One can certainly make an excellent album from the sessions, if you include more of the action material instead. But.... this: BTW, I never see it as a mystery why JW includes all the 'dull' stuff. It clearly isn't dull to him. He does it just to bother the c + c fetishists on this board. Lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bellosh 3,317 Posted November 21, 2020 Author Share Posted November 21, 2020 Bruce every other post you make talks about expansions and people who prefer them. Maybe you're the one obsessed? bruce marshall 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blondheim 1,157 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 What people on here tend to think of as the dull stuff, I often find the most fascinating sections of a score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,042 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 1 hour ago, Bellosh said: Bruce every other post you make talks about expansions and people who prefer them. Maybe you're the one obsessed? This guy gets it. bruce marshall 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 11,956 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 Geez, are you a psychologist now? bruce marshall 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,042 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 No I've just been using the internet for almost 30 years and know a troll when I see one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 11,956 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 Why don't you ban him then? bruce marshall 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,306 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 I was just joking. Again. " lol"? Geez. Lighten up already. 35 minutes ago, Jay said: No I've just been using the internet for almost 30 years and know a troll when I see one You need to look up the definition of " troll". It won't say " a person who good naturedly teases friends about a shared interest". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,042 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 You have to make friends with the people here and endear yourself to them before you can start teasing them. That's how life works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruce marshall 1,306 Posted November 21, 2020 Share Posted November 21, 2020 You have to be able to laugh at at yourself and not take life so seriously. Many people think my posts are 😅 crumbs 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrTenma 116 Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 I like the score very much but Williams has many scores even better... A top 10 of Williams is very competitive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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