Michael Giacchino's SPIDER-MAN: NO WAY HOME (2021)

[Giftheck 916]

It's more likely that they're laughing at

 

Spoiler

Either Andrew or Tobey claiming they're Peter Parker.

 

[TSMefford 1,509]

3 hours ago, Arpy said:

Then...

 

Fuck trailers for false advertising.

 

Yeah I know. Unfortunately it's extremely common. Nothing new. It was common even before the Marvel era. 

 

I've seen trailers change plot points, include footage and scenes that don't make it into the film, alternate takes, early versions of VFX, and of course rearrange and recut dialog. Occasionally they'll even grab specific shots only for use in the trailers.

 

Having extensively spoken to several people who actually work in that industry and asked questions about it, many times trailer editors are given early cuts of the film and, as I was told, if you have good footage, you use it. Since they're early versions as well you can sometimes end up with VFX that changes as you get closer to the movie. For example, in the trailers for The Chronicles of Narnia: Prince Caspian the same shot of Aslan roaring is featured in multiple trailers throughout the campaign and nearly every time it's used Aslan is bigger or more visually refined.

 

Trailer editors will even give the studio a call (who will then pass the request to the editor or assistant editor) to ask for specific shots that could even be sourced from the raw dailies. For example, if they want a reaction shot that doesn't appear in the film, they can call the editor and see if they have the kind of reaction they're looking for. That's also how you end up with, for example, in trailers for comedy films, someone tells a joke or does something slapstick and there's a laugh or another joke in retort or something from clearly an entirely separate scene.

 

As far as changing plot points and recutting dialog, it's usually just to get to the point faster (something I'm not capable of when I post things here). For example, in National Treasure 2 (from 2007) there's a cipher on a diary page, that leads to a clue, then another, then another, and finally leads to another clue where they locate a symbol. One of the trailers opted instead to get to the point and changes the dialog and the visuals of the first scene I mentioned to just say that there's a symbol stamped into the diary page itself.

 

At the end of the day, these are entertainment marketing firms that are trying to help the studio sell the idea of the movie, it doesn't matter to them if a scene ends up getting cut out (which half the time they don't even find out) or if it's manipulative. They just want to make a cool piece of content that will bring people to the theaters. 

 

Going back to what I said earlier about "having good footage and using it"- if the editors for the Spider-Man No Way Home trailers are specifically given a mandate to not reveal certain things, they will still find a way to utilize what they can for a moment in the trailer.

 

I don't really like it either, but it's just sort of the way trailers have always been done since the early 2000s at the very least (but I'm sure before that as well). Definitely not Marvel exclusive, but they certainly do it more often than not these days to keep secrets.

[Jay 37,281]

So I was just realizing, that Giacchino must have recorded this score by now, because the film opens in 2 weeks!  Yet strangely, he didn't make any social media posts about recording it, even though he made a bunch of posts as Jurassic World Dominion and The Batman scores were recorded.  Maybe Marvel demands supreme secrecy or something?

Hopefully we get score album details soon.

 

IIRC, the Far From Home OST was a CDR in the USA, but a pressed CD in Europe.

[Cerebral Cortex 3,357]

Very interesting point. You're absolutely right. As best as I can tell, this is the only thing he has tweeted about it over the last few months. Next to nothing. 

 

We got the cover art for FFH 14 days before the film dropped, information about a physical CD release 13 days before the film dropped, and track listings 12 days before the film dropped. So hopefully the ball starts rolling tomorrow for NWH? 

[Jay 37,281]

Sweet

[John F 100]

I am so ready for this film and score.

[blondheim 1,157]

On 02/12/2021 at 8:41 PM, John F said:

I am so ready for this film and score.

 

Hard same

[Alex 2,833]

I assume this will be very much like the Star Wars sequel trilogy where the track names will be released at the very last minute? Although, Giacchino may have done his usual jokey titles.

[Evanus 216]

Welp, apparently the entire score leaked. 
 

 

[Jay 37,281]

Nothing on Amazon US yet, but a physical CD edition is up for pre-order on various European Amazons now.  Sony Classical label, no release date listed

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B09MYVXH51

https://www.amazon.de/dp/B09MYVXH51

https://www.amazon.es/dp/B09MYVXH51

https://www.amazon.fr/dp/B09MYVXH51

https://www.amazon.it/dp/B09MYVXH51

 

5 hours ago, Evanus said:

Welp, apparently the entire score leaked. 

 

No, not a session leak, just the OST album early

[Evanus 216]

3 minutes ago, Jay said:

No, not a session leak, just the OST album early

Yeah I know, that's what I meant. But still, pretty crazy. 

[Giftheck 916]

If this is indeed legit, then that music cinches it: that's Tobey's theme right at the end.

 

Also, according to that video, they're using Horner's theme, not Zimmer's, for Andrew.

[Jay 37,281]

Mysterio's Theme in track 3

 

MJ's theme in track 4

 

Dr. Strange's theme in track 5

 

Track 6 has more Dr Strange material

[Giftheck 916]

Track 7 has Doc Ock's theme from Spider-Man 2 at the beginning and at the end (3:55)

 

Track 10 has Doctor Strange's Theme

 

Track 12 also has Doc Ock's theme(0:05), and also what sounds like a variation of Sandman's theme from Spider-Man 3 (2:36)

 

Track 18 - Goblin's theme at the beginning, Ock's theme also (1:47).

 

Track 19 - Strange's theme, Andrew's Theme (1:12) Tobey's theme (1:50)

[JNHFan2000 2,943]

16 minutes ago, Giftheck said:

Track 7 has Doc Ock's theme from Spider-Man 2 at the end.

 

Track 10 has Doctor Strange's Theme

 

Track 12 also has Doc Ock's theme, and also what sounds like a variation of Sandman's theme from Spider-Man 3.

 

Track 18 - Goblin's theme at the beginning, Ock's theme also.

 

Track 19 - Strange's theme, Tobey's theme!

Do you have timestamps for the Goblin, Doc Ock & Sandman ones

 

[Giftheck 916]

4 minutes ago, JNHFan2000 said:

Do you have timestamps for the Goblin, Doc Ock & Sandman ones

 

 

Done.

[JNHFan2000 2,943]

34 minutes ago, Giftheck said:

 

 

Track 19 - Strange's theme, Tobey's theme (1:50)

Horner's theme starts at 1:12

[Giftheck 916]

It's been some time since I listened to Horner's score, I'm gonna have to do a marathon of all five scores before. I couldn't hear any of Zimmer's themes, which makes me think Giacchino wrote a new theme for Electro, or else they just tracked it in for the film from TASM2.

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

23 minutes ago, Giftheck said:

It's been some time since I listened to Horner's score, I'm gonna have to do a marathon of all five scores before. I couldn't hear any of Zimmer's themes, which makes me think Giacchino wrote a new theme for Electro, or else they just tracked it in for the film from TASM2.

Who would have done the rapping?  Giacchino?

[Jay 37,281]

Did the chorus in track 12 sing something like "pick up the flame"? 

[MedigoScan 324]

Zimmers Spiderman work is seriously under-appreciated

Sure the vocal parts of the Electro theme wouldnt work well. But the sound itself could still have fit.. (plus its not like the movie used the 'rapping' outside of the Times Square scene)

[Giftheck 916]

Personally, I'm okay with TASM2's score. Some of it's corny, but the main theme's not bad, and the actual composition of Electro's theme is good too.

 

Having said that, hearing them side-by-side, I think Horner's theme definitely fits better with Elfman's theme.

[Jay 37,281]

The film is over 2 1/2 hours long and this is a 74 minute score album. There could be score cues that use Elfman/Young/Horner/Zimmer material that just didn't make the album

[JNHFan2000 2,943]

I'm surprised the album is 74 minutes. Actually only 64 minus the 10min suite. For such a big film. That's not a lot.

[Giftheck 916]

It just seems odd, if that is the case, to include nothing for Electro, one of the villains they revealed fairly early on, yet include material for Tobey and Andrew, even though they keep denying they're in the film.

[Jay 37,281]

Well the street date of the OST album is after the film is out 

[Erik Woods 555]

34 minutes ago, MedigoScan said:

Zimmers Spiderman work is seriously under-appreciated

Sure the vocal parts of the Electro theme wouldnt work well. But the sound itself could still have fit.. (plus its not like the movie used the 'rapping' outside of the Times Square scene)

Agreed! I actually think Zimmer’s score for TASM2 is rather brilliant. And I absolutely love the Electro material… and Spidey’s theme is sensational as well. Zimmer and co. Score > Horner’s score, IMO.

[Jay 37,281]

Ha! The suite is only 9 1/2 minutes, when it ends the OST has a bonus cue that's Giacchino's Spidey theme orchestrated with Dr Strange orchestration 

[Jurassic Shark 12,024]

3 hours ago, Erik Woods said:

Zimmer and co.

 

Fixed.

[JohnnyD 1,220]

2 hours ago, Jay said:

Mysterio's Theme in track 3

 

MJ's theme in track 4

 

Dr. Strange's theme in track 5

 

Track 6 has more Dr Strange material

 

2 hours ago, Giftheck said:

Track 7 has Doc Ock's theme from Spider-Man 2 at the beginning and at the end (3:55)

 

Track 10 has Doctor Strange's Theme

 

Track 12 also has Doc Ock's theme(0:05), and also what sounds like a variation of Sandman's theme from Spider-Man 3 (2:36)

 

Track 18 - Goblin's theme at the beginning, Ock's theme also (1:47).

 

YES!!!! Not going to listen until I see the film and get the soundtrack via Apple, but so glad to have it officially confirmed that Michael Giacchino utilizes Danny Elfman's Green Goblin and Doc Ock themes.

[Giftheck 916]

I must say, listening to this, I'd say this is on par with Jurassic World Fallen Kingdom as far as how Giacchino implements past themes. Much better than Rogue One. It just fits together quite well, even though the themes all come from different 'musical universes', so to speak.

[Alex 2,833]

Kevin Feige must be losing his mind right now.

[TheUlyssesian 2,473]

Listening to them one after the other confirms it - 

 

Elfman's Theme > Horner's Theme > Gia's Theme

[bored 306]

49 minutes ago, TheUlyssesian said:

Listening to them one after the other confirms it - 

 

Elfman's Theme > Horner's Theme > Gia's Theme

 

I know this isn't the most popular take, but that's also my ranking for which Spider-Men I like best.

 

On another note, given how tracks 21 and 22 sound, it's very possible that 

Spoiler

Tom Holland Spider-Man or at least one of his friends will die in this film. Track 21 feels like a requiem, and track 22 sounds similar but with a triumphant ending that might be going for a bittersweet sort of note to end on. Also, if I'm not mistaken, Holland's contract ends with this movie so that could be another indication for the ending.

 

[Alex 2,833]

Can anyone explain the last minute of the final track?

[JNHFan2000 2,943]

42 minutes ago, superultramegaa said:

On another note, given how tracks 21 and 22 sound, it's very possible that 

  Reveal hidden contents

Tom Holland Spider-Man or at least one of his friends will die in this film. Track 21 feels like a requiem, and track 22 sounds similar but with a triumphant ending that might be going for a bittersweet sort of note to end on. Also, if I'm not mistaken, Holland's contract ends with this movie so that could be another indication for the ending.

 

Spoiler

He has 3 more movies coming. Announced last week.

 

4 minutes ago, Alex said:

Can anyone explain the last minute of the final track?

Maybe it's an in movie joke or something

[Giftheck 916]

20 minutes ago, JNHFan2000 said:

  Reveal hidden contents

He has 3 more movies coming. Announced last week.

 

Maybe it's an in movie joke or something

Kind of like how they had those tracks at the end of the Homecoming OST - one was the bank jingle, and the other was a terrible school brass band attempting to play a scale.

[Jay 37,281]

All the returning themes on the OST album

 

Track 1 - Marvel Studios Fanfare (Giacchino) 

Track 2 - none

Track 3 - Spider-Man (Giacchino), Mysterio (Giacchino)

Track 4 - MJ (Giacchino)

Track 5 - Dr. Strange (Giacchino)

Track 6 - Dr. Strange (Giacchino), Spider-Man (Giacchino)

Track 7 - Dr. Octopus (Elfman), Spider-Man (Giacchino)

Track 8 - Spider-Man (Giacchino)

Track 9 - none

Track 10 - Spider-Man (Giacchino), Dr.Strange (Giacchino)

Track 11 - Spider-Man (Giacchino)

Track 12 - Dr. Octopus (Elfman), Sandman (Young), Spider-Man (Giacchino)

Track 13 - none

Track 14 - Spider-Man (Giacchino)

Track 15 - Spider-Man (Giacchino)

Track 16 - Spider-Man (Giacchino)

Track 17 - Spider-Man (Giacchino)

Track 18 - Green Goblin (Elfman), Dr. Octopus (Elfman)

Track 19 - Dr. Strange (Giacchino), Spider-man (Horner), Peter Parker / Responsibility (Danny Elfman), Spider-Man (Giacchino)

Track 20 - Spider-Man (Giacchino)

Track 21 - Spider-Man (Giacchino), Dr. Strange (Giacchino)

Track 22 - Spider-Man (Giacchino)

Track 23 - Spider-Man (Giacchino)
 

[Alex 2,833]

With all the hype around who is or who is not in this film, I think I forgot how big a part Dr Strange would play in this, so it is great to hear his theme fleshed out. Track 10 is a riot.

[Mr. Who 919]

Some covers:

[TSMefford 1,509]

Gotta hard disagree with any praise for Zimmer's TAS2 score. It just felt so soulless to me at best and at worst ridiculous. I suppose I could also be nicer and simply say that it's not my thing. Which it's not. I'm glad some people like it though.

 

I am ecstatic to hear that Horner's theme is used here mostly. It is vastly superior and more memorable to me. Can't wait to listen to more.

[HunterTech 987]

This is soulless?

 

 

I'm starting to think after this and WW84, you don't like lighthearted Zimmer very much.

 

In any case, I'm happy to see just how much Giacchino went wild with the past references otherwise. Sandman (if it's actually his theme) being particularly exciting, since this will have now been the first instance where anything SM3 related actually got officially released. I don't know if I want to wait until I actually see the film (despite my continuing skepticism), but this gives me plenty to look forward to!

 

 

 

[Disco Stu 15,495]

56 minutes ago, Alex said:

With all the hype around who is or who is not in this film, I think I forgot how big a part Dr Strange would play in this, so it is great to hear his theme fleshed out. Track 10 is a riot.

 

It's true, a fine consolation prize for him not scoring Multiverse of Madness.

[bored 306]

28 minutes ago, HunterTech said:

This is soulless?

 

Honestly that's not even my favorite example. What Zimmer & Mazarro do with the new responsibility and Spider-Man theme in this track here is genuinely heartfelt and inspiring. Plus I love the almost Howard Shore-esque wandering chords at 3:35. 

 

Edit: 4:34 onward is also one of my favorite moments in any Spider-Man score ever. 

 

 

[Edmilson 7,384]

Sorry, but Horner's ASM >>>> Zimmer's (and co.) ASM 2. I wouldn't say it's souless, but it's a pretty bad score except for the beginning and the end.

 

Gia was write to quote Horner's theme, although I think he did it because the first Amazing movie was more successful with critics and at the box office than the second one. 

[bored 306]

I think the Electro stuff is bad because that rapping never stops. The whisper is always there, the lyrics are terrible, Zimmer looks uncomfortable next to Pharrell in interviews, but if it wasn't for that, and the dubstep that is only there because Sony execs thought it would be hip with the kids, I like the melody and the meek clarinet and bassoons.

 

I have no problem with anything else. Richard Parker's theme is decent, Harry's theme is simplistic at first, but I like the longer melody line that plays when he transforms into the Goblin, Spider-Man and the new responsibility theme are really good, Gwen's theme is nice. It's just that Electro theme just-doesn't-work. I do agree that Horner's score is better overall, but even that I find to be far blander than Elfman and Young's efforts. 

[SilverTrumpet 638]

I'm a Horner lover and a Zimmer hater and maybe a year or so ago I did a full listen of both Amazing scores and was super surprised how much more 2 did it for me than 1. 

[Manakin Skywalker 4,889]

1 hour ago, superultramegaa said:

I think the Electro stuff is bad because that rapping never stops.

 

I've never heard any of the TASM2 score, just looking into the Electro stuff for the first time; yikes. It sounds like main menu music for a shitty PS2 video game. I'm sorry, but that's just not film music, and it has no business being used as underscore.

[Taikomochi 1,136]

My friends who have very little interest in scoring and I still roast the Electro music regularly all these years later. It is uniquely bad film music.

[TSMefford 1,509]

2 hours ago, HunterTech said:

This is soulless?

 

I'm starting to think after this and WW84, you don't like lighthearted Zimmer very much.

 

To me? Yes. This doesn't really do a thing for me. My issue is that this lacks any kind of humanity and impact. Wonder Woman 1984 had the same problem for me. It just feels very...corporate? Like a track you could purchase off a stock library? I don't like the Man of Steel and Batman V Superman scores, but I think those both actually have more personality than this does. And I never thought I'd say that. Lol.

 

I do actually like some lighthearted Zimmer, but nothing about his recent work, including 1984 reminds me of the Zimmer from the 90s, 2000s, and 2010s that I liked. 

 

The sample that @superultramegaashared is actually quite a bit better, but that's a completely different vibe. The composition is pretty nice, but it still doesn't feel very human to me at least not until 5:35 or so. That being said, even at the timestamp I mentioned... you know, it actually kind of reminds of an evening news fanfare or something to me? Still has a bit of that corporate feel and doesn't feel very "Spider-Man" to me. I really do think there's also something with the performances or the mixing or something that just pulls all the humanity out of these tracks for me. It all feels very made in a computer and not performed by an orchestra.

 

I really, truly wish I could explain it, because it really sounds like I just blindly hate Zimmer no matter what, but I don't. He used to be top of my list back in the day. I don't know what to tell you, but this just doesn't seem to be doing for me what it is for you guys. And that's okay, but my vote is for Horners material all the way...between Zimmer and Horner in the Amazing series of films that is.

 

17 minutes ago, Taikomochi said:

My friends who have very little interest in scoring and I still roast the Electro music regularly all these years later. It is uniquely bad film music.

 

I very much agree. I didn't like his Lex Luthor material either (although I actually can't recall if that was him or Holkenborg) so I don't seem to care for his villain themes at all in these films lol. Electro is a very unique kind of bad though. It did not do the character in the film any favors.

 

EDIT: Thanks very much @Jay for that breakdown!