Michael Giacchino's SPIDER-MAN: NO WAY HOME (2021)

[Erik Woods 555]

1 hour ago, Taikomochi said:

My friends who have very little interest in scoring and I still roast the Electro music regularly all these years later. It is uniquely bad film music.

Interesting... I'd like to hear why it's "bad film music"

 

Here's my brief take on TASM2

Personally, I think it's a fun, smart, intellectual score. Usually, I find Hans' overthinking or doing new for new sake is mostly over the top nonsense, however, with TASM2, IMO, he really nailed it. He not only perfectly captured the free-spirited character of Spider-Man with his Coplandesque trumpet call but as he did with The Joker in The Dark Knight, he really got to the core of not only the psychotic, schizophrenic nature of the Electro character but also of the obsessive Max Dillon and his internal struggles. The duality of the theme is extremely well crafted. The Electro suite is simply sublime, smart film music. What's a truly appreciate about the Electro music is that the main melody is performed in two different ways. The first in a quirky, organic performance to convey the silly, clumsy side of Max Dillion‚ which then transformed into a heavy, electronic dub step style with underlining vocals (rap) that represents Electro's inner turmoil.  The rap is literally the voices in Max/Electro's head. Love it!

 

Harry Osborn even gets a terrifying motif.
 

The rest of the score is a fantastic mix of electronic and organic orchestral sounds with a gigantic choral backing.  I love the battle of the organic (Spidey's theme) with the electronic (Electro's) themes that plays throughout the scores playing time.

 

IMO, Zimmer and co's score is extremely well thought out score with purpose that, for me, is an absolute pleasure to listen to.  This is Hans Zimmer at his very best, IMO.

You might not agree but at least I gave you multiple reasons why I like it.

 

-Erik-

[TSMefford 1,509]

28 minutes ago, Erik Woods said:

You might not agree but at least I gave you multiple reasons why I like it.

 

Well, I certainly can't bring myself to agree with most of that I'm afraid, but hey, I am truly glad that it does all that for you. Wish it did the same for me as well so something in that movie would've been a saving grace, but oh well.

 

We can't all like the same things. Thanks for your well thought out response Erik!

[bored 301]

I'm surprised you didn't consider most of the "Rhino Returns" cue to be more human-sounding superhero writing. I can understand it with the Rhino motif and the almost stock-sounding piano rendition of Spidey's theme in the beginning, but the rest of that cue always stood out to me as feeling far more in-line with Horner or Elfman's emotional writing, with more of a noble, grand twist to it. But hey, as you noted, not everyone likes the same music. 

[Cerebral Cortex 3,357]

Love the civil discussion and exchange of thoughts. Warms me heart. ❤️

[TSMefford 1,509]

11 minutes ago, superultramegaa said:

I'm surprised you didn't consider most of the "Rhino Returns" cue to be more human-sounding superhero writing. I can understand it with the Rhino motif and the almost stock-sounding piano rendition of Spidey's theme in the beginning, but the rest of that cue always stood out to me as feeling far more in-line with Horner or Elfman's emotional writing, with more of a noble, grand twist to it. But hey, as you noted, not everyone likes the same music. 

 

It's not the writing that doesn't feel human to me actually. I tried to acknowledge that the composition itself on that particular piece was better than I remember it being. It's the performance, or perhaps how the performance is being portrayed (through the mixing and mastering, etc). It's hard to say what it is exactly, which is why I always worry that these conversations on Zimmer's recent work make me sound like I just hate him and his music no matter what he does. 

 

It's almost like how you can have wonderful vibrant dialog or a powerfully worded speech that comes across inauthentic if the delivery is wooden. Something is just off for some reason and it's coming across as inauthentic to mee (perhaps "soulless" was too strong a term for it), which is why it feels corporate and the theme at the end reminds me of an evening news fanfare. All the notes are there, I feel like I should be feeling something, but it just isn't clicking. It's missing that spark/magic for me.

 

I sure wish I could explain myself on this better, but I am, quite often, horrid at conveying my thoughts on things.

[Matt C 452]

12 hours ago, Giftheck said:

It just seems odd, if that is the case, to include nothing for Electro, one of the villains they revealed fairly early on, yet include material for Tobey and Andrew, even though they keep denying they're in the film.

 

It's called a gag order. 

 

Only bits of Giacchino's score I found on YT were two clips playing the Tobey and Andrew motifs.

I found the OST leak.

 

There's some needless filler (which could've been ditched for a better listening experience), but Giacchino skillfully incorporates the Elfman and Horner material better than I thought he would. Especially in track #19 (which I will admit brought tears to my eyes).

 

It should be interesting to see how much music was left off the OST.

[MedigoScan 324]

His spiderman scores usually have all the important highlights.

But this is the first time he's filled his Marvel OST work with a massive suite, so who knows.

[Giftheck 916]

3 hours ago, Matt C said:

 

It's called a gag order.

 

I know what an NDA is, thank you very much. That wasn't the point of my comment.

[crumbs 14,287]

5 hours ago, Matt C said:

It should be interesting to see how much music was left off the OST.

 

Don't worry, it's a Giacchino score -- the sessions will leak within 6 months.

[JNHFan2000 2,938]

2 hours ago, MedigoScan said:

His spiderman scores usually have all the important highlights.

But this is the first time he's filled his Marvel OST work with a massive suite, so who knows.

Far From Home had a big suite. And Homecoming had a 6 minute suite that brought the total runtime to an hour. Far From Home had the biggest release with just under 80 minutes and about 70 minutes of in film music.

 

Probably not gonna happen, but maybe they'll do a Deluxe Edition like with Infinity War.

[MedigoScan 324]

Man my mind is very good at creating memoryholes apparently.

[TownerFan 4,983]

Looks like Marvel honchos took very literally that YouTube video that went viral a few years ago (which basically said "All your scores don't have memorable themes and you should be ashamed") if now they're asking a major composer like MG to fill his score with a zillion quotes from so many respectable peers like Horner, Zimmer and Elfman. Whoever had to compile the cue sheets to calculate copyright residuals is probably still having a headache.

[Jay 37,249]

I didn't make this observation on my own, but the timpani line starting at 0:33 of track 1 is a slowed down version of Giacchino's Marvel Studios fanfare

 

 

I guess the 0:00-0:33 part is for Sony logo.

[Edmilson 7,367]

The OSTs for Gia's previous two Spider-Man scores had pretty much all of the highlights, except for some brief action cues, so I expect this one to be the same.

 

Unless the movie is 2 and a half hours long and he had to write more music than the usual.

[Jay 37,249]

It's 2 hours, 36 minutes long

[Drawgoon 100]

Hah! Looks like I missed the party. I ignored the thread with the assumption that all the recent posts are just more speculation(s) about the album program and boom, there just had to be an album leak out of the blue while I wasn't looking, and Sony just had to step in and clean all traces of this mess before I even finished reading the word "leak" at FSM. hehe Story of my life. Thankfully, I have parted with "impatience" a long time ago. Happy to wait forever for things to happen when its their time now. Growing old isn't a bad thing after all. Looking forward to hearing this once it officially lands.

 

On the other hand I like what I am reading here. Good to read that many familiar themes are brought back - especially that of Doc Ock, which is my most favorite villain theme in the Spidey universe yet.

 

I wonder what inspired this creative decision though. Was it MG being MG, and therefore showing respect for the established sounds and continuity? Or was he actually asked for it?

 

It also makes curious as to how Elfman's going to handle MG's tunes for the Strange sequels now. Sure, Elfman did say he will be using MG's themes in a similar fashion as how he infused Silvestri's Avengers tune into AoU (which kind of sort of translates to "bare minimal" to me, though I admit I never listened to Ultron carefully). But will he be asked to weave MG's stuff into his work more deeply? Or maybe Elfman will show the same or similar level of respect for MG's themes in return for MG's tribute to Elfman's themes? A bit naive, if not wishful thinking, true, but it is probably not entirely out of question either.

[Jay 37,249]

Is the very first thing in track 11 a slowed down version of Mysterio's theme, or just something that sounds coincidentally similar?

[Matt C 452]

1 hour ago, Drawgoon said:

On the other hand I like what I am reading here. Good to read that many familiar themes are brought back - especially that of Doc Ock, which is my most favorite villain theme in the Spidey universe yet.

 

I wonder what inspired this creative decision though. Was it MG being MG, and therefore showing respect for the established sounds and continuity? Or was he actually asked for it?

 

 

I'm pretty sure it's a mix of both. In track #19, the way he introduces Horner's theme and it segue smoothly to Elfman's responsibility/main theme is quite beautiful. It's less clunkier than his SW references in Rogue One.

 

I honestly can't wait to see the movie and see how much is left off. I'm positive we will hear more Horner/Elfman motifs than just that single OST track.

[Jay 37,249]

On 05/12/2021 at 10:22 AM, Giftheck said:

Track 12 also has [...] what sounds like a variation of Sandman's theme from Spider-Man 3 (2:36)

 

I hear Giacchino's Spider-man main theme at 2:36. Did you mean a different timestamp?

[Once 604]

3 hours ago, Drawgoon said:

It also makes curious as to how Elfman's going to handle MG's tunes for the Strange sequels now. Sure, Elfman did say he will be using MG's themes in a similar fashion as how he infused Silvestri's Avengers tune into AoU (which kind of sort of translates to "bare minimal" to me, though I admit I never listened to Ultron carefully).

I thought Elfman utilized Silvestri's theme amazingly in Age of Ultron, I just wish he had been hired to score the whole movie from the start.

As for No Way Home/In the Madness of the Multiverse, I imagene Giacchino and Elfman must have had some sort of conversation about it. I'm sure Elfman will do what Raimi and Feige will ask for, though.

[Giftheck 916]

33 minutes ago, Jay said:

 

I hear Giacchino's Spider-man main theme at 2:36. Did you mean a different timestamp?

 

No. It starts with the horns doing the first four notes of Sandman's theme (usually played by Saxophone in Spider-Man 3) before going into the Giacchino Spider-Man theme.

[Jay 37,249]

I don't hear what you're hearing.  2:36 is two notes, then 2:38 is 3 followup notes.  2:42 is the first 2 notes again, then 2:46 is a full statement of Giacchino's Spider-man theme which reveals the "2 notes, then 3" was setting up this theme... no?

 

I can kinda hear how the 2 notes at 2:36 and the 2 notes at 2:42 are sort of like the first 4 notes of Sandman's theme, but the 3 notes in the middle as well as the fact it doesn't continue into the actual theme after those 4 notes, means it's not his theme here,  I'd say.   

 

I hope his theme is used though!

 

Good statements of Young's Sandman theme is at 2:30 and 4:25 of this video

 

 

 

[Giftheck 916]

10 minutes ago, Jay said:

I don't hear what you're hearing.  2:36 is two notes, then 2:38 is 3 followup notes.  2:42 is the first 2 notes again, then 2:46 is a full statement of Giacchino's Spider-man theme which reveals the "2 notes, then 3" was setting up this theme... no?

You're saying the 2 notes at 2:36 and the 2 notes at 2:42 are Sandman's theme?

 

I think of Sandman's theme as the theme at 2:30, and 4:25, of this video

 

 

 

That is exactly what I am saying. It's playing at a much higher key, but I'm certain that those four french horn notes are Sandman's theme.

[Jay 37,249]

Huh.

Does anybody else agree / disagree?

 

I feel like if Giacchino was going to integrate Young's theme into a scene featuring Sandman, he'd use the full theme and just the first 4 notes, personally.

[Manakin Skywalker 4,889]

17 hours ago, crumbs said:

Don't worry, it's a Giacchino score -- the sessions will leak within 6 months.

 

Unless it's Star Wars. I hear Lucasfilm uses Flex Seal, which is why their music hardly ever leaks.

[bored 301]

38 minutes ago, Jay said:

I feel like if Giacchino was going to integrate Young's theme into a scene featuring Sandman, he'd use the full theme and just the first 4 notes, personally.

Not necessarily. Every quote of the Doc Ock theme in the OST only has the first 4 notes and never expands into the full melody as far as I remember. 

[Jay 37,249]

Hmmm, interesting!

 

So does this mean you guys think the opening of track 17 is Sandman's theme, too?

[Jay 37,249]

What do people think of the three NEW THEMES?

 

Ominous Theme

• Track 12 1:35-2:20 / 3:54-4:21
• Track 23 2:16-4:20

Sad Theme

• Track 13 0:00-end
• Track 14 0:00-1:00
• Track 21 2:58-5:29
• Track 23 4:20-5:58

Mysterious Theme

• Track 15 0:20-1:25
• Track 20 2:58-3:36

 

I think the Sad Theme is not that great, and takes up way too much OST space (9 of its 74 minutes, and all variants are pretty similar to each other!)

 

The Ominous Theme is cool, could this be a new theme for Electro?  Or Lizard? Or Sandman?  I dunno.  I wish I could tell what words the choir was singing in track 12.  I hope this theme appears in more film cues that just the one on the OST - he did include it in the suite, so hopefully that's the case...

 

I like The Mysterious Theme a lot, although I keep wanting it to resolve into something more exciting - it's kind of interesting that both OST instances resolve into the main theme instead.... and that Giacchino didn't include this theme in the suite...

 

Overall, the suite is too heavy on the main theme, even if a lot of is the new choir-backed version, but still...

[Jay 37,249]

I also like these little moments, which I thought each had potential to maybe also be a recurring theme, but I didn't hear them more than once on the OST so who knows

Track 3 1:38-end
Track 5 0:00-1:00
Track 7 2:00-2:38
Track 7 3:39-3:50 (the ostinato - so catchy!)
Track 9 (the whole track sounds like the slow introduction of a new theme, but I guess not)
Track 16 1:15-end
Track 17 0:49-1:01
Track 19 3:41-4:01 (sounds like the end of Firestorm from ID4)
Track 19 4:29-4:42 (the choir)
 

[HunterTech 982]

So for anyone who's as familiar with the prior Gia Spidey scores as I am, does his Iron Man theme show up? Here it is if you need a reminder:

 

 

 

In the meantime, I'm currently in the process of hearing the first two scores OSTs, as its been a while since I heard the one for Homecoming (plus wanting to get more time with FFH).

 

 

[Jay 37,249]

None of Giacchino's prior Spider-man themes recurr except the main theme, MJ, and Mysterio.

So no Iron Man, Vulture, Fury/SHIELD, Elementals, Homecoming love theme, etc etc

[HunterTech 982]

Ah okay. I kind of wondered, since it had carried over from Homecoming to FFH.

 

In any case, I just finished the Homecoming OST. A perfectly average score that improves as it goes along. As much as I really do enjoy the more down to earth take for the character, it kind of stretches itself thin as a result of staying within the same lane for the whole duration. It finishes off strong enough that I leave feeling fairly satisfied, even if with little inclination to revisit it much.

 

Also, I am conflicted as to if I find this presentation better than the full thing. The real culprit is the lack of many quiet moments, as it kind of just goes from action bit to action bit for a good while. Specifically, the first love theme is essentially kind of absent outside of the suite itself. It never particularly developed in the film outside of its (potentially intentional) superficial exterior, but it was a regular presence at least. At the same time, however, just about all the highlights are accounted for here, and moves at a pretty solid pace, so I wouldn't really know what to change about it exactly.

 

Just starting FFH, which I am excited to go through, as my last listen of it was particularly strong.

[HunterTech 982]

Wrapped up on FFH hours ago. It doesn't quite have the punch it did last time, but it definitely serves to highlight just how much more confident Gia got with his vision for the character. Especially with how rock solid the climax is, plus a couple of early cues worth highlighting.

 

Now on to NWH!

[Jay 37,249]

Does anybody else think the final note of track 22 is a really bad edit?  Like, there's no way it was recorded that way, it got fudged for the commercial release right?

Maybe the cue as recorded goes into material they didn't want on the OST?

[SilverTrumpet 638]

21 hours ago, Matt C said:

I honestly can't wait to see the movie and see how much is left off. I'm positive we will hear more Horner/Elfman motifs than just that single OST track.

 

What if what you hear in that track is basically all that's in the movie?

 

I'm just getting a feeling that most of the returning characters are the villains, and then the end of the movie is the other two Spider-Mans showing up in suit, and then taking their masks off after the battle and that's basically it.

 

Sneaking suspicion, but we'll see what happens.

[Jurassic Shark 12,008]

SPIDER-MAN: NO WAY HOME ALONE

[Faleel 5,326]

2 hours ago, Jay said:

Does anybody else think the final note of track 22 is a really bad edit?  Like, there's no way it was recorded that way, it got fudged for the commercial release right?

Maybe the cue as recorded goes into material they didn't want on the OST?

Or they wanted a hard ending.

[Jay 37,249]

What do you mean?

[Edmilson 7,367]

.

[Jay 37,249]

.

[bored 301]

Recently saw some titles posted for the No Way Home score. Could be fake, but they definitely sound legitimate. If you want to avoid spoilers, do not read the rest of this post!

 

Spoiler

01. Titles (1:12)
02. Opening Scene (0:53)
03. Peter Parker is Spider-Man! (2:18)
04. Downbeat / Price of Fame (1:06)
05. Go To The Wizard? (1:53)
06. Casting the Spell (3:26)
07. Doc Ock Bridge Attack (4:20)
08. Goblin / No Way Home (2:48)
09. Villains Captured (1:46)
10. Spidey vs Strange (5:01)
11. Help The Villains? (3:35)
12. Sinister (5:01)
13. May’s Death (4:16)
14. Sadness (2:01)
15. Need Some Help? (1:36)
16. Science Bros (1:29)
17. Statue of Liberty (1:22)
18. Final Battle (2:58)
19. Spider-Men (4:52)
20. Now Choose! (3:55)
21. Goodbye (6:50)
22. Responsibility / Ending Scene (1:32)
23. End Credits / Music Suite (10:07)

 

[Jurassic Shark 12,008]

6 minutes ago, superultramegaa said:

Peter Parker is Spider-Man!

 

Jesus man!

[John F 100]

16 minutes ago, superultramegaa said:

Recently saw some titles posted for the No Way Home score. Could be fake, but they definitely sound legitimate. If you want to avoid spoilers, do not read the rest of this post!

 

  Hide contents

01. Titles (1:12)
02. Opening Scene (0:53)
03. Peter Parker is Spider-Man! (2:18)
04. Downbeat / Price of Fame (1:06)
05. Go To The Wizard? (1:53)
06. Casting the Spell (3:26)
07. Doc Ock Bridge Attack (4:20)
08. Goblin / No Way Home (2:48)
09. Villains Captured (1:46)
10. Spidey vs Strange (5:01)
11. Help The Villains? (3:35)
12. Sinister (5:01)
13. May’s Death (4:16)
14. Sadness (2:01)
15. Need Some Help? (1:36)
16. Science Bros (1:29)
17. Statue of Liberty (1:22)
18. Final Battle (2:58)
19. Spider-Men (4:52)
20. Now Choose! (3:55)
21. Goodbye (6:50)
22. Responsibility / Ending Scene (1:32)
23. End Credits / Music Suite (10:07)

 

I am already disappointed the score is not longer and I haven’t heard a note yet.

[Jay 37,249]

Those titles keep getting posted everywhere and were in the original reddit thread this all started it, and its completely fake of course. The real titles haven't leaked or been officially announced yet

[JNHFan2000 2,938]

9 hours ago, Jay said:

Those titles keep getting posted everywhere and were in the original reddit thread this all started it, and its completely fake of course. The real titles haven't leaked or been officially announced yet

I agree that those titles aren't real. Giacchino almost always has had puns in his tracks for the last 15 years. And no way would a studio like Marvel put spoilers like that in a score tracklist of a movie of this size.

I think the last time that something like that happened was with The Phantom Menace and Qui-Gon's Demise. Never seen anything like that again.

[Giftheck 916]

Only one time comes to mind in the last 5 years, and that's Rogue One (though he did post an alternative tracklist with pun titles IIRC)

[Arpy 4,145]

2 hours ago, JNHFan2000 said:

I agree that those titles aren't real. Giacchino almost always has had puns in his tracks for the last 15 years. And no way would a studio like Marvel put spoilers like that in a score tracklist of a movie of this size.

I think the last time that something like that happened was with The Phantom Menace and Qui-Gon's Demise. Never seen anything like that again.

Qui-Gon's Noble End

[LewWho95 14]

3 hours ago, Giftheck said:

Only one time comes to mind in the last 5 years, and that's Rogue One (though he did post an alternative tracklist with pun titles IIRC)

I think that was mostly due to Lucasfilm not wanting pun titles as the official track titles for what was a rather dark and serious Star Wars film. 

[liamdude5 0]

How is nobody pointing out that the track May's Death is literally just a stock track composed by Kevin MacLeod? Kinda shoots this leak's validity in the foot for me.

[Giftheck 916]

Joined three minutes ago, this is the only post, it's non specific about what it's supposed to be 'straight up' being and there's no actual context about what track is what on the leak since the 'tracklist' is nothing but a redditor's guesses as to what's supposed to be playing, nobody is mentioning anything here about open spoilers (because there's a thread for that, and spoiler tags are used outside of it)...

 

Also, Sony keeps DMCAing anybody who uploads the set. If it were fake, like the guy who's actually been creating a fake soundtrack on YouTube (he's been open about it, BTW), then they'd not bother. Sony has better things to be getting on with.

 

Hi, Sony rep trying to damage control!

 

1 hour ago, LewWho95 said:

I think that was mostly due to Lucasfilm not wanting pun titles as the official track titles for what was a rather dark and serious Star Wars film. 

 

That is a fairly good point, though he still came up with pun titles and posted them to his Instagram IIRC