Richard Penna 3,684 Posted March 27, 2021 Share Posted March 27, 2021 5 hours ago, Edmilson said: Besides being a sex criminal and a creep, Singer was also a hugely overrated director. Returns is not good enough to be memorable nor bad enough to be entertaining. It's just a mediocre and utterly tedious flick that you forget after you watch it. I completely respect your opinion, but don't really understand it I saw it back at some film society showing at uni, and enjoyed it for what it was. A few bits of Ottman's score have always stayed with me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted March 27, 2021 Share Posted March 27, 2021 3 minutes ago, Richard Penna said: A few bits of Ottman's score have always stayed with me. Maybe you'll like Horner's Brainstorm too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted March 27, 2021 Share Posted March 27, 2021 Athough I could never stand the despairing 8 note "Lois in peril" motif in the same cue, parts of the plane rescue music are genuinely quite thrilling, I remember being pumped. It's obviously the standout sequence of the film. I remember that being my main complaint with the movie, that there wasn't enough action or that the action overall wasn't satisfying enough, wasn't showy enough. I wanted to see moar shots of Superman in the air, physically in the scene. The originals always showed plenty of Chris up in air, on wires. It was great! Remember the tag, "You'll believe a man can fly"? I think newer filmmakers forget or don't realise how key that was. CG flight is not in the slightest bit wondrous and it just looks boring. That, and Kate Bosworth was horrible as Lois Lane. Like, literally the extreme opposite of good casting. So my memories of Superman Returns are minimal, it's a forgotten movie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 7,434 Posted March 27, 2021 Share Posted March 27, 2021 4 hours ago, Richard Penna said: I completely respect your opinion, but don't really understand it I saw it back at some film society showing at uni, and enjoyed it for what it was. A few bits of Ottman's score have always stayed with me. Ottman's score is the best thing about the movie. There's some really good cues in there. Bespin and TSMefford 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,645 Posted March 28, 2021 Author Share Posted March 28, 2021 In no way am I saying that it’s a great movie. I’m saying it has a thoroughly heartfelt feel good message, it’s a guilt free feel good movie, and I dare say it has a tiny sparkle of classic Hollywood - and all of this is brought to the surface because the movies that came after are bleak, depressing, and ridden with guilt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,515 Posted March 28, 2021 Share Posted March 28, 2021 Let's not forget that, for all it's "dark realism", SUPERMAN RETURNS actually made more money than BATMAN BEGINS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 7,434 Posted March 28, 2021 Share Posted March 28, 2021 20 minutes ago, Naïve Old Fart said: Let's not forget that, for all it's "dark realism", SUPERMAN RETURNS actually made more money than BATMAN BEGINS. Yeah, but it was way more expensive than BB. SR lost Warner Brothers a lot of money, while Begins eventually turned to a profit thanks to the huge home video sales. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,645 Posted March 29, 2021 Author Share Posted March 29, 2021 I‘d never watch BB again. I don’t want superhero films to be depressing. They made Superman beating Zod depressing. That requires special talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 Why was Superman so upset that he killed Zod? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gkgyver 1,645 Posted March 29, 2021 Author Share Posted March 29, 2021 Superman Returns has better CGI than Justice League as well. Yes I said it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post bored 309 Posted March 29, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted March 29, 2021 I don't really get the Nolan Batman hate on this forum. Those movies really aren't that depressing aside from certain plot points, there's plenty of banter to lighten the mood every now and then, and not really sure what you mean by antiheroes? Every villain is pretty obviously crazy/evil, and Batman is pretty much comic book dark, but heroic Batman (not including the fucking awful voice in TDK and TDKR). TDKR hate I get because there's a lot of stupid lines/decisions, weird plot points, and a lame Talia Al Ghul. But I always thought BB and TDK were pretty solid in terms of capturing the Batman tone. Even Arkham Asylum, City and Origins aped quite a lot from the first 2 Nolan Batman movies. HunterTech, TSMefford, Raiders of the SoundtrArk and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSMefford 1,509 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 The Nolan batman films honestly end up being as cheery and colorful as Superman Returns apparently is when you compare them to Snyder's Batman V. Superman. I'll rewatch all the Nolan films in one go before I'd ever watch BvS again. Edmilson and bored 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GerateWohl 4,356 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 If people were actually aiming for more light hearted fantasy action then I wonder why then Luc Besson's Valerian isn't held in higher esteem. StarFox and TSMefford 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 Cuz that film is just fuckin horrible! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSMefford 1,509 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 If Superman Returns can get praise like this, then so can Valerian. I enjoyed it. StarFox 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 7,434 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 Valerian is okay. Fun movie with some great visuals, but unfortunately the story and characters are a little forgettable. The Splat's score is the best thing about it. TSMefford 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSMefford 1,509 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 11 minutes ago, Edmilson said: Valerian is okay. Fun movie with some great visuals, but unfortunately the story and characters are a little forgettable. The Splat's score is the best thing about it. Oh for sure. It's not great, but I had fun with it. I just think it got a little unfairly slammed in it's reviews. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,331 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 8 hours ago, GerateWohl said: If people were actually aiming for more light hearted fantasy action then I wonder why then Luc Besson's Valerian isn't held in higher esteem. Because it's silly? (and not in a good way?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GerateWohl 4,356 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 9 minutes ago, AC1 said: Because it's silly? Yes, just like Superman Returns. Watching Valerian was a little bit like watching Jeunet's Alien Resurrection. Instead of suspense and horror you get some kind of slapstik. 9 minutes ago, AC1 said: (and not in a good way?) That's probably a matter of taste. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,331 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 1 minute ago, GerateWohl said: That's probably a matter of taste. I don't know of many people who think every superman movie is silly or as silly as Valerian, but yeah, it's a matter of taste. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Jay 37,346 Posted March 29, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted March 29, 2021 I find the old Christopher Reeve films silly (for the most part) and enjoyed the heck out of Valerian. I think the old Superman films were aiming to be taken more seriously though, while Valerian knows exactly what it is and revels in it from minute 1 StarFox, TSMefford and GerateWohl 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 3 minutes ago, Jay said: I find the old Christopher Reeves films silly (for the most part) and enjoyed the heck out of Valerian. I think the old Superman films were aiming to be taken more seriously though, while Valerian knows exactly what it is and revels in it form minute 1 Who is Christopher Reeves? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,346 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 Typo fixed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,331 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 25 minutes ago, Jay said: ... while Valerian knows exactly what it is and revels in it form minute 1 And was gravely disliked for it, because it wasn't funny silly, just bad silly, like the second half of The Fifth Element. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 The two leads were awful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koray Savas 2,251 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 Ben Affleck is my favorite Superman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,331 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 That was a pretty good movie. Don't understand why people say Affleck can't act. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,346 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 I thought Delevingne was good, but was DeHaan was absolutely terrible, and completely miscast. He not only had no chemistry with Delevingne , but came off as a creep (largely as a result of his performance, but also due to some of the writing). He was written to be this charismatic fun space adventurer, but DeHaan played him all dour and boring and I don't know why Besson cast him in the first place, or why he didn't try to get a different performance out of him once he was cast. I'd be fine with a sequel that replaced him with someone else! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GerateWohl 4,356 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 Seems for these fantasy space adventures Besson doesn't mind to create any compassion of sympathy in the audience for the main characters. It seems all so ironic without being funny. Like a parody on the script. Same with Fifth Element. But I agree with Jay, I believe it is on purpose. TSMefford 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,493 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 It's part of the "Cinéma du look" movement that Besson was part of in the 80s and 90s (or "Cinema du Luc", as I once called it in an article). Along with Leos Carax and Jean-Jacques Beineix (Jeunet was not included in it, for some reason, but I include him anyway). It's not supposed to be complex narratives and complex characters; it's more about post-modern fetishism of the image itself. It's one of the reasons for why Besson remains one of my favourite directors - and why I was moved to tears when he returned back to form with LUCY a few years ago. Was never too hot on the MINIMOY movies and all that. His new film ANNA is right around the corner, on Netflix, and I'm hoping it's another LUCY in quality, tone and look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,346 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 Anna right around the corner? What do you mean? We watched that 2 years ago Has it not released in Norway yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,493 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 1 minute ago, Jay said: Anna right around the corner? What do you mean? We watched that 2 years ago Has it not released in Norway yet? Nope. Premieres on Netflix over here the day after tomorrow. It never got a theatrical screening here, as far as I can recall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,346 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 Huh. What is the point of delaying it like that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,493 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 Don't know. It wasn't picked up by any distributors for theatrical release over here back in 2019. IMDB says that it got an 'internet' release here that year, but that must be some streaming service I don't have access to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,346 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 Probably just means VOD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 7,434 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 Didn't Besson got #metoo'ed recently? I remember seeing that a few women accused him of wrongdoing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,493 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 There were some allegations, yes, which he denied categorically. But I don't care. I like what I like, regardless of whatever personal troubles said person has or doesn't have. Naïve Old Fart 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,331 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 1 hour ago, GerateWohl said: Seems for these fantasy space adventures Besson doesn't mind to create any compassion of sympathy in the audience for the main characters. It seems all so ironic without being funny. Like a parody on the script. Same with Fifth Element. But I agree with Jay, I believe it is on purpose. What is on purpose? That it's silly but not funny? What does that accomplish? At least Clark Kent's silliness in Donner's Supes was purposeful (forming a contrast with Superman), endearing and full of heart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GerateWohl 4,356 Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 2 minutes ago, AC1 said: What is on purpose? That it's silly but not funny? What does that accomplish? At least Clark Kent's silliness in Donner's Supes was endearing and full of heart. Peut être c'est quelque chose francaise. J'ne sait pas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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