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The John Williams Concert Work Listening and Discussion Thread


SteveMc

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Whereas the fanfare for the clearly non-Asian Prince Philipp has a slight oriental feel, IMO, "Sound the Bells", written for an Asian royal couple, sounds quite occidental, I've always thought. Not that Williams is scoring the geography or nationality or whatever (nor does "For Sejii!", which we'll get to later, have any particular Japanese colours) -- they're both celebratory pieces for particular events -- but I've always found that a bit interesting.

 

Not sure I get JURASSIC PARK in "Sound the Bells". The spacey use of chimes and bells have a more HOME ALONE feel, if one is to draw any film connections. It's a good piece, but it also feels like it's building towards a more defined melodic line that never comes. Perhaps this structure is a comment about a burgeoning marriage.

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Especially in the beginning with the chimes the piece has some "Anna and the King of Siam" vibe to me.

But I think, it is a good choice not to let it sound too 50s asian cliché pentatonic.

 

I said it before. I am not necessarily a big fan of these fanfares. But this one I really like.

 

If I need to compare it with something else in Williams work, parts remind me of the TPM fanfares, for example:

 

https://youtu.be/MxV64lzMsBo?t=111

 

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Regarding Sound the Bells, here's the only commercial recording of the original version:

 

Lately, whenever a band version is performed, the arrangement by Paul Lavender, based on the full orchestra version, is used:

 

@Thor I'm amazed you find "Aloft... to the Royal Masthead!" Asian tinted... Never heard it. To me, it brings me to my mind a lot of British composers.

"Tributes, For Seiji" certainly isn't meant to sound Japanese, despite of being dedicated to Ozawa's 25th anniversary with the BSO. Williams seemed more interested in describing the orchestra itself.

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1 hour ago, Miguel Andrade said:

 I'm amazed you find "Aloft... to the Royal Masthead!" Asian tinted... Never heard it. To me, it brings me to my mind a lot of British composers.

 

Yeah, I don't know what it is -- whether it's the scale or the instrumentation?

 

1 hour ago, Miguel Andrade said:

"Tributes, For Seiji" certainly isn't meant to sound Japanese, despite of being dedicated to Ozawa's 25th anniversary with the BSO. Williams seemed more interested in describing the orchestra itself.

 

Yes, of course. It would be silly if it did. It's surprisingly dark and explorative, though, for a dedication piece.

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I have never thought of any of these pieces in terms of capturing an ethnic or regional flavor.  But, now that it is mentioned, the original version of Sound the Bells--in which the bells are more at the forefront, seems to give it a bit of an Asian tinge.  But, it doesn't really matter.  

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7 hours ago, Thor said:

Yes, of course. It would be silly if it did. It's surprisingly dark and explorative, though, for a dedication piece.

 

Funny, I feel "Tributes: For Seiji" as a quite festive and fun work. But we've talked before as I'm much more welcome to some sort of more out there, atonal, darker, whatever, than you are :)

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I could perhaps attribute some of my perceived "darkness" to the rather muffled sound quality of the bootleg recording I had for years. When it finally became available in better sound, it opened up a bit more. But it does not sound like a celebratory piece to me -- more like a dark and mysterious tone poem.

 

But hey, we're jumping the gun here. Steve is not at "For Sejii" yet. We'll just have to refer back to these comments when he gets there. :)

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6 hours ago, SteveMc said:

Cello Concerto (1994)

The Cello Concerto, a post-romantic work in four movements, was written by John Williams for the world renowned Yo Yo Ma at the suggestion of Boston Symphony conductor Seiji Ozawa.  It is a generally bright and accessible work that definitely feels like an event.  It was written to showcase the Ma's talent and the public's appreciation for his craft.  As such, it seldom drifts into too heavy territory, instead inviting the audience to join the soloist and orchestra on a journey through musical moods that, while not quite completely in the style of Williams's film music, evoke a certain familiar response.  

 

Williams gave program notes for each of the movements, which can be found in full here:

https://www.hollywoodbowl.com/musicdb/pieces/1338/concerto-for-cello-and-orchestra

 

The first movement, Theme and Cadenza sets out right away "immediately casts the cello in a kind of hero’s role, making it the unquestioned center of attention. It’s a movement that attempts to put the cello on display in the time-honored sense of 'concerto,'" in Williams's words.  The central theme is most prominent as the cello and orchestra builds up to a couple of of flourishing climaxes that segue into the extended cadenza.  The main theme returns before the soft ending.

 

Flowing directly, the second movement Blues is perhaps the most modernist segment of the concerto.  The material here is mysteriously dissonant.  Williams also notes influence from Strayhorn and Ellington here.  The textures are compelling. 

 

Scherzo is the third movement and it also follows without interruption.  The speed and vigor pick up, while the tone remains generally modern, though approaching more consonance.  Williams notes an athleticism where "the orchestra and cello try to dominate and out-do each other."   

 

The last and longest movement is Song, which opens to a restatement of the first movement's theme before the cello comes in and unfolds a flowing exploration of lyrical mood.  Williams's intention was to to provide a soundspace for Ma especially to "connect" with the audience through the cello writing. 

 

Overall, it is a significant work, and one of Williams's most noteworthy efforts for the concert hall.  For a good time, I could not truly gel with the piece.  It seemed to me to lack some overall structural direction and unity.  I've warmed more to it.  

 

The piece has gone through several revisions over the years, with some of the character and direction changing, especially through orchestration.  I am not currently aware of any recording of the original 1994 version, but the second version was recorded by Ma and Williams and is probably the definitive version of the piece, even if it is not my favorite one.

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The next revision was recorded by the Detroit Symphony.  This one is slightly more bold in orchestration, with a more resolute ending.

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The next version marks a significant change, with a new quiet opening being the first indication of a marked different character.  Williams and Ma presented this fourth revision in 2012 in Houston.  Overall, the piece is smoother, though some of the original's aplomb is missing.

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Finally, there is a fifth revision.  Interestingly, it was this version that first keyed me into the work.  Williams leaned into the smoothness he had brought into the piece, and achieved a sort of unity that I feel had been lacking.  It ends up remarkably different a work than the 2002 version, which I've come to appreciate more while preparing for this post.  But this latest version remains my favorite.  

Here it is performed by Toke Moldrup in Copenhagen.  

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It’s interesting how much JW has revised some of his concert music. Especially since this isn’t an early work he’s revisited with the benefit of experience but a relatively mature work and a very fine one indeed. I have to admit that, for the orchestral performance in particular, I actually prefer the Slatkin/Detroit album on Naxos. The playing and recording are much more incisive and the results much more dynamic and exciting than Williams own version which feel a bit soft (I can’t find a better way to describe it). 

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I wonder, why Williams changed the opening, which I found quite catchy and effective.

And I asked myself if he probably found out that it already existed in some other piece so he wanted to change it into something more original?

At least that thought comes to my mind if something is revised into something less concise.

 

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13 hours ago, SteveMc said:

Finally, there is a fifth revision.  Interestingly, it was this version that first keyed me into the work.  Williams leaned into the smoothness he had brought into the piece, and achieved a sort of unity that I feel had been lacking.  It ends up remarkably different a work than the 2002 version, which I've come to appreciate more while preparing for this post.  But this latest version remains my favorite.  

Here it is performed by Toke Moldrup in Copenhagen.  

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Thanks for posting this, I wasn't aware of this recording. Cellist Steve Erdody told me during our podcast interview that John worked a lot with Lynn Harrell on the various revisions, and apparently he considers the piece still not right enough.

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The cello concerto is fine, and while I appreciate the "Yo Yo Ma period" in the 90s and early 2000s where they did lots of stuff together, it doesn't ignite me the way some of his other instrument pieces do. Except the elegy, of course. That's right up there among the best.

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3 hours ago, SteveMc said:

The revised "Song For World Peace" is a bit less unique, and really misses the choral parts.  But it is still an enjoyable listen.

 

Yup, that's pretty much my take on it too. The revised version is fine, but the original "Satelite Celebration" is better. Alas, the chance of seeing that version recorded is next to nill now that the revised edition is the "official version". So the old, crappy-sounding boot recording is all we'll have.

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Hello everyone, I'm searching for full score in pdf format of orchestral Suite "American Journey" in 6 movements. Does any faithful follower of the Maestro have it to send me? Thanks in advance.

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On 9/15/2021 at 9:30 AM, Thor said:

 

Yup, that's pretty much my take on it too. The revised version is fine, but the original "Satelite Celebration" is better. Alas, the chance of seeing that version recorded is next to nill now that the revised edition is the "official version". So the old, crappy-sounding boot recording is all we'll have.

 

If memory serves, the orchestral version has been at least revised twice since the recording on "American Journey".

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37 minutes ago, Miguel Andrade said:

 

If memory serves, the orchestral version has been at least revised twice since the recording on "American Journey".

 

Interesting. Is there any recordings of these revisions floating around?

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1 hour ago, Jurassic Shark said:

 

Interesting. Is there any recordings of these revisions floating around?

If memory serves, the newer version was performed at some point with the BPO and had a radio broadcast (quite good--nicely extended violin part). But I do not have a recording and do not remember the year of the broadcast.  

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27 minutes ago, Tom said:

If memory serves, the newer version was performed at some point with the BPO and had a radio broadcast (quite good--nicely extended violin part). But I do not have a recording and do not remember the year of the broadcast.  

 

Yes, there was a live performance with the Boston Pops at Tanglewood, I believe from 2016 or 17.

Prior to that, there was an earlier revision performed at a Chicago SO concert.

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If memory serves, he performed a version of it at the concert I attended in Boston in 2014. But I don't know which of the revised versions it was. There have been too many.

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Happy Birthday Variations (1995)

So, a concert piece I had not heard before tonight.  An interesting  little orchestral jaunt through the famous birthday song.  It was written as a birthday tribute to Seiji Ozawa, Yo-Yo Ma, Itzhak Perlman and Leon Fleischer.

  I kind of like it, manages to be both fun and challenging.

Some discussion here: 

And here is a recording.

 

 

 

 

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It's a funny little piece, but ultimately a parenthesis in his canon. I had a crappy-sounding bootleg recording for many, many years untill it was commercially released on the Sony compilation.

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The bootleg used the audio from a Japanese television broadcast celebrating Ozawa's birthday, with the great Mtislav Rostropovich conducting the Williams piece. It was great as it ended with everybody actually singing Happy Birthday to Seiji.

A few years ago a decent transfer of the video appeared on youtube but the poster as since then deleted all his content.

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2 hours ago, Miguel Andrade said:

It was great as it ended with everybody actually singing Happy Birthday to Seiji.

 

That's true! I had forgotten about that.

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On 9/16/2021 at 11:05 AM, Miguel Andrade said:

 

If memory serves, the orchestral version has been at least revised twice since the recording on "American Journey".

 

Thanks Miguel, 

all the great composers have revised their compositions and I did not ask if there have been any revisions of the work, I would like to follow the recording of the cd with the score. Anyone have the first version? Thanks again.

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On 9/18/2021 at 9:57 AM, Gilderoy said:

 

Thanks Miguel, 

all the great composers have revised their compositions and I did not ask if there have been any revisions of the work, I would like to follow the recording of the cd with the score. Anyone have the first version? Thanks again.

You are not really in the correct thread for this question and your response to Miguel comes off as a bit rude.  We were discussing the revisions made to the Song for World Peace.  To answer your question, yes, there is a signature edition of American Journey in the works, but it will not be the six movements as heard in the original version (I doubt there is an original score available).  Contact Hal Leonard for when they plan to release it.  

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On 9/18/2021 at 9:57 AM, Gilderoy said:

 

Thanks Miguel, 

all the great composers have revised their compositions and I did not ask if there have been any revisions of the work, I would like to follow the recording of the cd with the score. Anyone have the first version? Thanks again.

 

Yeah, of course, and we all heard the stories about Brahms going back to his symphonie's scores making little modifications...

As Thor said, there is no printed score release of the whole Unfinished/American Journey music. You're best shot is contacting Williams' representatives in the hope they might lend it to you, but usually they request proof of an upcoming performance, for this scores that remain unpublished.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Probably Williams best concerto (with the Tuba concerto), it's really the one which made me want to discover all the others.

I think that the movement Tortan is really the more accessible movement of Williams' concerti because of its more cinematic sound

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Agreed. It's my favourite of his longer concert pieces -- maybe due to its programmatic nature. But also because I'm a woodwind buff, and it utlilzes the bassoon both cleverly and pastorally.

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14 hours ago, SteveMc said:

Bassoon Concerto The Five Sacred Trees(1995)

John Williams: "The Five Sacred Trees" Bassoon Concerto (1995) - YouTube

Williams's Bassoon Concerto is a programmatic work in five movements originally written for bassoonist the New York Philharmonic's Judith LeClair.  The programmatic intent of the work perhaps led Williams to choose a clearly lyrical and often quite consonant language for the concerto.  While premiered in 1995 to mark the NY Phil's 100th anniversary, there is some copyright indication that the piece was completed in 1993.

Williams provided names and program notes that tied each of the movements to mythological Celtic guardian trees themselves tied to certain tree varieties.

 

The first movement, Eó Mugna, represents the oak as a source of mystical wisdom and a bridge to the spirit realm.  The movement is perhaps the most sophisticated incarnation up to this point of Williams's preferred first movement approach.  The opening consists of a long, lyrical cadenza for solo bassoon, with the orchestra joining in the lyrical motion with some shades of Ralph Vaughn Williams and Holst, building up to a very Williams resounding climax.  This sets off a second cadenza, before the movement ends with a sort of mysterious, even vaguely threatening quiet conclusion.  

 

The second movement follows, entitles Tortan.  This tree was an ash in legend, representing dark magic.  Not surprisingly, Williams brings a solo violin to play the role of evil fiddle in a spooky yet sophisticated dance with the bassoon.  Energetic bursts from the orchestra punctuate the proceedings.

 

The third movement, Eó Rossa, feels a lot like 1993 Williams to me for some reason.  This is a quiet movement, where lyricism is tinged with pain instead of romance.  Williams noted that he sought to explore the intersection between death and rebirth that characterized the mythology around the movement's namesake mythological tree, a yew with life and death powers.  The movement has a definite united beauty.

 

The fourth movement, Craeb Uisnig, deals with a war-like ash.  This movement is the most dissonant of the five.  Yet, it has a drive that connects it with a lot of Williams's action and suspense writing, if perhaps a bit more creatively orchestrated. 

 

The fourth movement dissolves directly into the fifth, Dathi, which has a definite elegiac character.  It seems to be the movement with the most dialogue and immediacy with the listener.  Lyrical melody and dissonance blend in a resolute manner, and the overall structure calls to mind the first movement but with more finality and introspection.  I can't help but hear elemental parallels to passages from works like the upcoming Elegy for Cello and Orchestra and Schindler's List and The Book Thief here.   The movement and the work ends on a gentle passage of acceptance from the bassoon.

 

Two major recordings of the piece are LeClair's with the London Symphony under Williams's direction from 1997 and, from 2015, Slatkin conducting Robert Williams and the Detroit Symphony.

Here is LeClair's recording with sheet music of the bassoon part

      

 

p.s. sorry for the long gap between posts.  I'm going to try to prevent that from happening in the future.  

Lovely synopsis and it inspired me to listen to the Slatkin/Williams (R)/Detroit version which I enjoyed thoroughly and (as often seems to be the case) more than Williams' original recording. The Bassoon has a lot more presence on the Slatkin recording (perhaps arguably artificial given that it's not exactly the most assertive of instruments, lovely though the tone is) and the orchestra a bit more bite. I like his version of the Cello Concerto more for similar reasons. It is a great work though and I do love the bassoon too.

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Such a great piece.

 

I can't remember if I had seen "moving images" of Williams before I saw him conduct at the opening ceremony live on Norwegian TV in '96 . There was no Youtube then, I had no VHS tapes with "extra features"....there was only websites with still images. I might have received a CD-R with some videos or seen him in the NIXON CD-ROM material prior to this, but I can't remember the chronology for sure. Either way it was a goosebump moment.

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22 hours ago, SteveMc said:

Summon The Heroes (1996)

Williams returns to the subject of the Olympics for this overture written for the 1996 Atlanta Games.  It opens with trumpets heralding the uncommon man (and woman) with a melodic contour that strongly brings to mind Copland.  The melody then goes through a very Williams pastoral-heroic Americana treatment by solo trumpet, before the theatrics begin again with characteristic Williams flourishes in brass and strings, with a b-theme introduced.  Similar to the theme for the 84 games, Williams brings in a passage of intricate anticipation that sets off a rousing restatement and climax.

It's a pretty great work all around.

 

 

One of my all time favorite JW pieces, film music or concert work. It is incredible. I love how the theme is played throughout, especially the triumphant version in the second half after the percussion. 

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Some thoughts on both pieces above.  I had the pleasure to see Williams conduct Five Sacred Trees in Pittsburgh back in the 90s (he also conducted The Planets, which was also very cool).  A riveting piece. The fourth movement is particularly cool live, as some of the hits rip through the orchestra from left to right.

 

I remember reading a newspaper review of the Summons album (which was released before the Olympics), which is was alerted me to its existence (ah, the days before JWfan). The review was very positive and described the piece as Williams in full Star Wars mode.  I rushed out to buy it and was immediately blown away.  I get what the reviewer meant, though the piece never sounded Star Warsy, just perfecting bombastic--the last minute and a half are as good as music gets.  It was also the first time I heard the 88 Olympic piece (and Javelin--among my favorites of non-JW contemporary pieces).  

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  • 2 weeks later...

Trumpet Concerto (1996)

Thomas Hooten, John Williams - Hooten Plays Williams - Amazon.com Music

The Trumpet Concerto is one of Williams's most mature and fully realized concert works.  There is a focus here in direction that makes it perhaps the most traditionally and straightforwardly structured of his concerti.  At the same time, it furthers Williams's personal compositional goal of a kind of modern romanticism, blended here with a unique rhythmic sense and some echoes of Americana. 

 

The concerto is in three movements.

The first, Maestoso, opens with a rousing interval based theme for the soloist, with the orchestra backing and helping build anticipation that leads to a resolute theme for the brass followed by the soloist going through rhythmic and quasi-lyrical motions, culminating in a more clearly lyrical if not quite melodic passage.  This emphasis on shifting motion and direction characterizes the rest of the movement, as the motives and colors set forth in the introduction are explored thoroughly, yet efficiently.  After a stirring orchestral high point, the soloist returns and, with the orchestra, sets a new pace, returns to the opening fanfare motive to introduce a cadenza with continued reference and development of the central motifs.  Originally, the typical quiet JW first movement ending rounded out the movement, dissolving into the second, but the 2018 revision saw Williams change this in favor of the orchestra returning for a definite and forceful conclusion.

 

The second movement, marked Slowly, is full of lyrical mystery and contemplation.  The opening is mysterious, with trumpet weaving through a unique orchestral and percussive backdrop.  The principal theme is then introduced by the trumpet on a bed of strings, which proceeds to weave around the strings and woodwinds.  A secondary thematic thread consists of a figure for the winds and a new lyrical theme for the trumpet, which leads to a return of the strings, first in pizzicato, then outright for a poignant passage where they restate the principal theme, which has a few shades of Rozsa to my ears in the melodic contour, with the overall treatment being unmistakably Williams.  A faster section for trumpet and flute follows and leads to another restatement of the main theme and a coda with a quasi-cadenza element.  

 

The third movement, Allegro-deciso, is the most freely formed of the three.  Thematic motifs are brief musical bursts and orchestral interjections.  Broadly, there are alternating fast and jagged clusters and longer lined interludes for structure.  The rhythmic vitality, even in those interludes, is strong.  Yet, there is seemingly an increasing hurried formality as the movement goes on, as if the music is realizing it has to be going and is politely making its exit, closing the door rather suddenly still.

 

The piece was written for Cleveland Orchestra principle trumpet Michael Sachs, although Sachs has not recorded the work despite having performed it on a number of occasions. 

 

The first recording was with Ron Feldman conducting Arturo Sandoval and the London Symphony.  This was the first version I heard and for many years I disliked the concerto because of it.  I found Sandoval's tone too harsh and unchanging and Feldman's direction too jagged.  The second movement interested me, (Sandoval does show adroitness here) but I felt it lacked something.  Nevertheless, this interpretation is not afraid to let a certain raw power in the concerto run free.

Spoiler

 

 

The interpretation that made me realize the beauty and integrity of the concerto was that of Jouko Harjanne and the Finnish Radio Orchestra.  Harjanne does not sacrifice too much of the concerto's power and unique elements, but he better brings out its neoromantic, heroic and even American nature amidst the interpretation's general cosmopolitan feel.  There is a classical touch to the string approach, and an almost playful creativity for some of the passages for solo trumpet.  I do not think this version was too much revised from the original released version, but it certainly feels like a fresh piece.  I still revisit Harjanne's take regularly.  

Spoiler

 

 

Finally, for what in my estimation the definitive version and recording of the work.  Williams conducting LA Phil principle Thomas Hooten and the Recording Arts Orchestra of LA.  Williams revised the piece, adding color and cohesion in the orchestration and some structural changes, like the aforementioned resolved ending of the first movement which was first written for and heard in a performance of the movement with Hooten and the Marine Band.  

The story of how this recording came to be is well documented here on JWFan, including by Hooten himself.

 

I can't remember exactly, but I think I contributed a little to the Kickstarter for the project, as many of us in this community did, so it feels good to have been a small part of doing this wonderful piece of American classical music justice.

 

Here is the recording:

Spoiler

 

 

And here is an academic piece that goes into far more detail about the piece than I could ever dream of doing:

https://scholarship.miami.edu/esploro/outputs/doctoral/A-Performers-Guide-to-Concertos-for/991031447862802976

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Never been able to warm properly to the trumpet concerto, for some reason, even though it's fine (maybe because I'm no big brass fan). I prefer the old, original Sandoval recording from the early 2000s, which I have on CD. Only have the Hooten in digital file format.

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