Alan Menken's The Hunchback of Notre Dame (1996) - 2021 Walt Disney Records Legacy Collection

[mstrox 6,647]

I wish they’d release more scores that have had no substantive release (Sword in the Stone, Fox and the Hound, Rescuers, the older wartime compilation films, etc.).  Robin Hood was a good start.

[igger6 894]

The German version of "Top of the World" ("Uber der Weldt"?  Something like that...) also blows the updated one out of the water.  Cutting back on the silliness of the gargoyles in the new show meant this song had to change, but the "A Guy Like You"-esque counterpoint vocals in the original are fantastic (better than "A Guy Like You," in fact).  And unlike most of these spectacular 1999 songs, you can actually hear this one in English, thanks to this fantastic YouTube cover from a few years back.  There's a sort of "B theme" to Esmerelda's part of the song ("When my outlook is a glum one...") that just oozes peak Menken, and it's totally gone in the 2017 version.  Plus the back and forth between the gargoyles and Quasimodo in the finale of the song is heartwarming and ingenious.

 

The same account also did "Out of Love (Reprise)," which is also excellent, and sadly they stopped there.  An English version of "Balancing Act" is still on my "Things to Finance When I'm a Billionaire" list.

 

Incidentally, while we're pooping on the 2017 downgrades to the musical—truly a carousel of unforced errors—you should also check out the original version of "Esmerelda," the Act I closer, which was equally maimed in the updated show.  The original can be seen in English on YouTube in a weird, iffily acted but incredibly well-funded and absurdly talented Florida high school production that remains, I think, the only publicly staged English performance of the 1999 show.  Unlike the bloated, aimlessly operatic 2017 version, nearly every melody that's sung in this brilliant pseudo-"One Day More" is drawn from somewhere else in the score, and it ties together Quasi, Phoebus, Frollo, and Esmerelda in an absolutely mesmerizing piece of musical theatre that mostly comes through even when  performed by teenage amateurs.  (One key line of Phoebus's from the German version is randomly transferred to Frollo here...see if you can guess which it is!)

 

Naturally, that production's performance of "Balancing Act," if it ever existed, is not preserved on the YouTube playlist. *sigh*  As you can see, Comparative Hunchback Studies is my long-lost college major.  But it's a heck of a field!

[WampaRat 1,105]

10 hours ago, igger6 said:

There's a sort of "B theme" to Esmerelda's part of the song ("When my outlook is a glum one...") that just oozes peak Menken, and it's totally gone in the 2017 version. 

Oh yeah! I love that little bridge. A perfect little melody in “top of the world”. I miss it.  Wonder what the motivation was to change that. The version in the 2017 production sounds like it was a sketch of what would be fully formed in the 99 version lol.

[JohnnyD 1,220]

What previously unreleased piece and/or highlight from Alan Menken’s score are you looking forward to hearing the most?

[Yavar Moradi 2,590]

1 hour ago, JohnnyD said:

What previously unreleased piece and/or highlight from Alan Menken’s score are you looking forward to hearing the most?

 

Jon Turner at the Intrada board recently wrote the following which all sounds pretty good to me...:

Quote

It's arguably Alan Menken's magnum opus. The stage musical upstages (pun intended) it, but the original film score is still haunting and powerful. There were quite a bit of music tracks that didn't make it into the first release, and it pleases me to see them make it here. There were extended portions in the "Paris Burning" and "He Shall Smite The Wicked" cues that were cut the first time. To see them restored again is a treat. There was also that frightening cue which plays in the scene where Quasi tries to hide Phoebus from Frollo. It's great stuff IMO.

http://www.intrada.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=6164&p=84333#p84333

 

Yavar

[WampaRat 1,105]

I forget, on these releases are there usually pretty detailed liner notes with the physical CDs?

[blondheim 1,157]

2 minutes ago, WampaRat said:

I forget, on these releases are there usually pretty detailed liner notes with the physical CDs?

 

There's behind the scenes information and concept art. No track-by-track or thematic analayis so far, that I am aware

[JohnnyD 1,220]

I hope the choir that is heard the moment Esmeralda enters the Cathedral is included. I know it is source music, but that choir singing the Latin hymn moves me deeply, not just as a love for music, but as a Catholic as well.

[igger6 894]

39 minutes ago, JohnnyD said:

I hope the choir that is heard the moment Esmeralda enters the Cathedral is included. I know it is source music, but that choir singing the Latin hymn moves me deeply, not just as a love for music, but as a Catholic as well.

 

Amen!  Just about everything I know about Mass parts in Latin I originally learned from this soundtrack, squinting to make out tiny black italic text on that absurdly reddish-brown cassette insert!

[JohnnyD 1,220]

A major part of the brilliance of the score is the way Alan Menken and Stephen Shwartz incorporated sections of the Latin text of the Requiem Mass and the Kyrie into the score. It not only applies to what is happening on screen; it adds a richer and deeper subtext. Even the Fractio panis is sung at one point in the score (refer to OST track “Humiliation”). The transition from Heaven’s Light to Hellfire is the Confiteor, and part of it is also juxtaposed during Hellfire. The Confiteor is a prayer where one honestly and truly confesses to God one’s sins and asks for forgiveness and intercession; this contrasts with Frollo. Sanctuary is the highlight and explicitly includes a great majority of the Latin text of the Requiem Mass, as does And He Shall Smite the Wicked. The Bells of Notre Dame, The Pillory, Heaven’s Light/Hellfire, Find the Girl, Sanctuary, And He Shall Smite the Wicked; all of these cues incorporate the Latin text (Kryie eleison is Greek, of course).

[MedigoScan 324]

6 hours ago, Yavar Moradi said:

 

Jon Turner at the Intrada board recently wrote the following which all sounds pretty good to me...:

http://www.intrada.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=6164&p=84333#p84333

 

Yavar

The Frollo and Quasimodo track is the one I've been missing the most. but its good to have those other tracks restored to full too.

(and I assume Sanctuary will have its Wicked Witch segment again, lol)

[4te 24]

According to the disneymusicemporium instagram account, the Hunchback Legacy Collection arrives tomorrow?! Perhaps on streaming platforms (and shipping is as-of Sept 22??) Either way ... 

 

This kind of makes sense because Release Radar on Spotify updates every Friday which is sort of the unofficial weekday for album releases now

[crumbs 14,301]

Quick! Everyone spam their Instagram with comments demanding Star Wars expansions!

[mstrox 6,647]

They’ll listen and give us the OSTs plus a few already released tracks as “bonus tracks.”  On vinyl and streaming only.

[Jay 37,287]

1 hour ago, 4te said:

This kind of makes sense because Release Radar on Spotify updates every Friday which is sort of the unofficial weekday for album releases now

 

Music albums started releasing on Fridays instead of Tuesdays 6 years ago now.

[JohnnyD 1,220]

9 hours ago, 4te said:

According to the disneymusicemporium instagram account, the Hunchback Legacy Collection arrives tomorrow?! Perhaps on streaming platforms (and shipping is as-of Sept 22??) Either way ... 

 

This kind of makes sense because Release Radar on Spotify updates every Friday which is sort of the unofficial weekday for album releases now

 

SWEET!

[4te 24]

Indeed, it’s here!!  (listening now)

[JohnnyD 1,220]

It sounds great, but...cross-fading...NOOOOOO!

On 8/9/2021 at 8:43 PM, JohnnyD said:

I REALLY hope, among other things, that the bells which accompany the quiet choral singing of a few verses of "Someday" in Latin at the very beginning of "The Bells of Notre Dame" are included in the first track of the same name.

 

Well, that is not included. However, there are bells after the opening choir that have not been heard previously. Interesting. It seems the bells heard in the film are an overlay that was recorded separately.

On 10/9/2021 at 3:16 PM, JohnnyD said:

I hope the choir that is heard the moment Esmeralda enters the Cathedral is included. I know it is source music, but that choir singing the Latin hymn moves me deeply, not just as a love for music, but as a Catholic as well.

 

This is not included either! I know it is source music, but I was hoping it would be included. Oh, well.

 

In Escape, the reprise of Heaven's Light seems to be micro-edited out (oddly).

 

And He Shall Smite the Wicked DOES NOT INCLUDE the sequence for which the track is named! The sequence ends when the next cue that starts when Frollo searches for Quasi and Esmeralda with the sword should begin. Emergence is the next cue after that. An entire sequence is missing! HOW WAS THIS ON THE ORIGINAL ALBUM BUT NOT INCLUDED HERE!?!?

[Luke Skywalker 1,792]

What? Damn 😕

[crumbs 14,301]

Sigh. I don't know this score at all but it's still sad to read about issues like this (especially for the fans who have craved this score for so long).

[Faleel 5,340]

Who worked on this one besides Botnick?

[Holko 9,499]

1 hour ago, JohnnyD said:

In Escape, the reprise of Heaven's Light seems to be micro-edited out (oddly).

 

And He Shall Smite the Wicked DOES NOT INCLUDE the sequence for which the track is named! The sequence ends when the next cue that starts when Frollo searches fro Quasi and Esmeralda with the sword should begin.

Just grasping at straws with a fool's hope - could it be that these were just tracked in the movie and not replicated here?

[crumbs 14,301]

Does Disney have a tradition of screwing up these Legacy releases with stupid assembly choices like crossfades, microedits, etc.?

 

I thought it was their premium line by people who knew what they were doing?

[Holko 9,499]

3 minutes ago, crumbs said:

releases with stupid assembly choices like crossfades, microedits, etc.?

I know they previously left off some leaked non-album versions in favour of song demos and shit, or even when there was plenty of space left on the disc.

[Faleel 5,340]

4 minutes ago, crumbs said:

Does Disney have a tradition of screwing up these Legacy releases with stupid assembly choices like crossfades, microedits, etc.?

 

I thought it was their premium line by people who knew what they were doing?

Neil Bulk worked on Little Mermaid, and it still had a messed up Finale cue.

[HunterTech 987]

From my recollection, the Toy Story one was considered fairly comprehensive, but that's probably because there's only like 3 songs there, leaving pretty much the main score to be the focus there.

 

Lion King is a bit of an interesting one, since it was a brand new mix supervised by Zimmer, since the original one was handled by Jay Rifkin (whom he and HZ had a falling out in the early 2000s). As such, any changed or removed elements could be chocked up to purely him for that release.

 

I have very little awareness of any other release's details. All I know is that it's a respected enough line to where people want more releases, likely because it'd be the only form in which Disney would handle expanded releases of their own main canon/Pixar material.

 

If anything, I hear more complaints about the mastering, which absolutely reeks of excessive modernization. Brickwalling do be damned.

[Holko 9,499]

Well, what do we expect from people who can't push enter to make their tracklist legible? And don't credit the people who made this for them to sell?

 

Also, nice cover.

 

[Tom Guernsey 2,280]

26 minutes ago, crumbs said:

Does Disney have a tradition of screwing up these Legacy releases with stupid assembly choices like crossfades, microedits, etc.?

 

I thought it was their premium line by people who knew what they were doing?

This kinda harks back to my comments in whatever thread it was discussing the Star Wars scores and the crappy de-mastering and so on. We should be grateful that LLL, Intrada, Quartet etc. actually have such dedicated and skilled people working for them. However it is entirely baffling that Disney who, as I said before, could basically afford anyone they liked and virtually limitless resources in terms of equipment, yet the results are mixed, at best... weird.

[crumbs 14,301]

3 hours ago, Holko said:

Also, nice cover.

 

 

This is exciting... they just added a listing for Star Wars!

 

 

[MedigoScan 324]

3 hours ago, Holko said:

Just grasping at straws with a fool's hope - could it be that these were just tracked in the movie and not replicated here?

Nah the Smite the Wicked cue is clearly entirely original music.

Honestly the cue titles are a bit weird in general, since this CDs Sanctuary now only covers the opening of the original album cue (along with the previously unreleased Frollo attacking the court scene)

 

The actual SACNTUARY! scene now is added to He Shall Smite the Wicked. Maybe they forgot a track and didnt account for it with the cue titles. (at least the wicked witch insert is back now)

[Holko 9,499]

Damn! You should write to Botnick or someone and ask.

[JNHFan2000 2,944]

36 minutes ago, crumbs said:

 

This is exciting... they just added a listing for Star Wars!

 

 

900 bucks!! Is this real?

[Holko 9,499]

2 minutes ago, JNHFan2000 said:

900 bucks!! Is this real?

no

[Nick Parker 3,040]

EDIT

[JNHFan2000 2,944]

31 minutes ago, Holko said:

no

The price or the product

[Holko 9,499]

Scroll up, he just modified my screenshot. Or look on the source page.

[crumbs 14,301]

1 hour ago, JNHFan2000 said:

900 bucks!! Is this real?

 

It's just a Photoshop gag, sorry.

 

As much as we'd all love it to be real, there's no Star Wars score expansions on the horizon.

[Demondm810 399]

The mastering sounds off to me too, the instrumental cues seem to be louder.  Vocals in the songs seem dialed down and they carry a fair amount of somewhat distracting echo.  But maybe it's just me.  ::shrug::

[JohnnyD 1,220]

The OST is not obsolete, clearly. In order to be complete, one has to edit the second part of the track “And He Shall Smite the Wicked” into the end of the track on the Legacy release…BUT ONE SHOULD NOT HAVE NEEDED TO DO THAT IN THE FIRST PLACE! This is a surprising and disappointing oversight considering Bruce Botnick was directly involved with this release. They basically skipped a MAJOR part of the film score, the death of Frollo. How was this part of the score NOT included in this Legacy release when it was on the original soundtrack album?!? The rest of the score is included!

[Jay 37,287]

6 hours ago, Grace Under Pressure said:

Neil Bulk worked on Little Mermaid, and it still had a messed up Finale cue.

 

I remembering reading him post somewhere that the master he submitted to Disney was fine, and then the people at Disney Records messed things up between that and the final pressing

[Tom Guernsey 2,280]

1 minute ago, Jay said:

 

I remembering reading him post somewhere that the master he submitted to Disney was fine, and then the people at Disney Records messed things up between that and the final pressing

At the risk of casting aspersions and sweeping generalisations, the people at Disney Records seem kinda inept... at least when it comes to this kind of historic release. The issues our lovely soundtrack labels have are small fry considering, especially given (as I state over and over, sorry!) the limited resources our labels have at their disposals. It's really quite aggravating.

[JohnnyD 1,220]

Thank God I have the OST track on digital. As soon as this arrives in the mail, I am going to meticulously edit the necessary cue into the end of the Legacy track, and have the newly restored track and the rest of CD 1 burned onto a freshly blank CD; this way NOTHING is left out physically AND digitally.

 

Never have I had to do this, but one of THE most important parts of the film narrative is left out when it never should have been left out.

[MedigoScan 324]

If not for the crossfade, I would have been tempted to separate the He Shall Smite the Wicked track back into its own 4minute segment. 

[JohnnyD 1,220]

16 hours ago, Holko said:

Damn! You should write to Botnick or someone and ask.

@Henry Sítrónu Please do so!

[Holko 9,499]

Oh god. Botnick said the discs were packed full. This isn't because of some braindead baboon going "gee, 78 minutes, better chop it down to 74", is it???

[MedigoScan 324]

It is curious that the missing music would be at the exact end of disc 1.

[Drawgoon 100]

2 hours ago, crumbs said:

As much as we'd all love it to be real, there's no Star Wars score expansions on the horizon.

 

I'd be very surprised if any SW score arrived under the Legacy Collection banner/brand. That naming seems more relevant to the stuff that people associate with Disney the most - irrespective of Disney's ownership.

 

11 minutes ago, Holko said:

Oh god. Botnick said the discs were packed full. This isn't because of some braindead baboon going "gee, 78 minutes, better chop it down to 74", is it???

 

Makes me wonder if this was going to be a completely different product if it was digital only.

[crumbs 14,301]

Is there a variation between the tracklist on their website and the actual album? Is it just some amateurish mastering/assembly mistake? 

[Holko 9,499]

 

OST on top, Legacy on bottom. Fucking horseshit. Not paying a cent for this trash. Leaving off the villain death climax... And my awful theory's holding up, the missing cue is in the gap between discs.

[JNHFan2000 2,944]

I love these Legacy Collections but it's a shame there are never instrumentals of the song.

I would kill for high quality version of The Bells Of Notre Dame, Out There, God Help The Outcasts, Colors Of The Wind, Belle amd so on.

A shame

1 minute ago, Holko said:

 

OST on top, Legacy on bottom. Fucking horseshit. Not paying a cent for this trash. Leaving off the villain death climax... And my awful theory's holding up, the missing cue is in the gap between discs.

Something has to have gone wrong. Maybe it's only on the digital?