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FIDDLER ON THE ROOF: 50th Anniversary Remastered Edition from La-La Land Records (3-CD)


Chewy

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Kind of amazing to think that Topol was only 34 when he starred in the film, and he’s still alive and kicking.   Now that’s an autograph I would love to have on my cd booklet!

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My discs arrived on Thursday, but I was out of town so just opened them now!

 

I am curious on people's decisions about album art and tagging for this set. Often, with multiple disc sets that includes a remastered original album, I will rip the remaster as a separate albums in my digital library from the rest of the material (which gets its own album). I like to use different album covers to better distinguish between the two.

 

For Fiddler, I think I will make each of the 3 discs as an album entry. Given the way Mike has laid out the tracks and spoken about the intent with this amazing set, that feels right. For album art, I decided to use the back of the CD booklet (with the large hand drawn Tevye & daughters in front of the house) as disc 1. Disc 2 will get the front of the CD booklet (painted dancing Tevye surrounded by various other character images) for disc 2, and then Jim Titus' amazing main cover for disc 3. Obviously, there is nothing particularly right or wrong about this. Just choices.

 

And at some point, I will make a playlist that basically takes all the pieces from above and create a program I like covering all parts of the film. Sort of my own film order complete playlist. 

 

What are others doing/planning to do?

 

In terms of Album Artist, I guess I will go with "Jerry Bock & Sheldon Harnick / John Williams." Curious what other people are using, or are they just using the compilation flag for the whole set?

 

A huge thanks and shout out to LLL, Mike, Jim and everyone else involved. This is truly spectacular. 

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4 hours ago, lairdo said:

What are others doing/planning to do?

If I had it, I guess, I would probably listen to the music.

 

Can anybody tell, how much additional music there is on this release compared to the 30th anniversary edition, not counting alternates or film versions of tracks?

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Quote

Mike Matessino was on RTE Lyric FM with Aedin Gormley yesterday, briefly talking about this release and introducing a couple of tracks. He can be heard around 1:40 into the programme...

https://www.rte.ie/radio/lyricfm/movies-and-musicals/programmes/2021/1211/1266199-movies-and-musicals-saturday-11-december-2021/

 

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Excitement of having received this and Always in the post today somewhat cooled by both cases being pretty smashed up! :(

 

Oh well, just the chance you take with ordering online from overseas I suppose! A little surprised it was just a jiffy bag rather than a box for two sets though.

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On 13/12/2021 at 12:19 AM, Jay said:

24. Exodus (Excerpt) 1:30

 

Out of interest, why is this track labelled Excerpt in parenthesis?

 

I assume the liner notes explain it but I'm holding out until LLL have a few more titles in stock.

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30 minutes ago, Alan said:

Excitement of having received this and Always in the post today somewhat cooled by both cases being pretty smashed up! :(

 

Oh well, just the chance you take with ordering online from overseas I suppose! A little surprised it was just a jiffy bag rather than a box for two sets though.

 

If you write to them about it they'll send replacements for the damaged parts.

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3 hours ago, crumbs said:

 

Out of interest, why is this track labelled Excerpt in parenthesis?

 

I assume the liner notes explain it but I'm holding out until LLL have a few more titles in stock.

 

Nah the liner notes don't say anything about it. I'd assume it's because there was sound effects over some part of it that couldn't be cleaned up, so Mike released the portion he could, and labeled it an excerpt to make it clear its not the whole composition. 

 

Easy enough to verify by going into the film and seeing how long the cue is there, and if there's sound effects over a portion of it

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15 hours ago, Alan said:

Excitement of having received this and Always in the post today somewhat cooled by both cases being pretty smashed up! :(

 

Oh well, just the chance you take with ordering online from overseas I suppose! A little surprised it was just a jiffy bag rather than a box for two sets though.

Next time I'd suggest asking for extra bubble wrap, they always add another layer and I haven't had a cracked case since.

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Listened to Disc 1. Two problems: the orchestra in Tradition is insanely overbrightened, and the program jumps ahead big steps, leaving some tracks like Rejection Scene less effective without the buildup it was meant to pay off. Thankfully the Disc 2 Tradition, while still not great, is much better, and the additional cues on Disc 3 will help buff up the program. Otherwise it's all fantastic, sounds very good, orchestral cues like Entr'acte and Finale sound great!

 

I love the added little line for Mike's usual credit where previous scores he worked on are listed. Can't wait to listen to D2 and 3 and read the booklet tomorrow and start comparing and assembling!

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Here is a great article "TO LIFE! REMEMBERING "FIDDLER ON THE ROOF" ON ITS 50TH ANNIVERSARY" by Michael Coate including passages from a sampling of original film reviews, the roadshow engagements and interviews with Mike Matessino, Greg Carson etc.

 

http://thedigitalbits.com/columns/history-legacy-showmanship/fiddler-on-the-roof-50th

 

 

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OK then...anyone managed to create a chronological film programme they'd like to share? I tried to search the thread but couldn't find any. But then, I am a lazy bastard and can't be bothered to be thorough. Life is too busy these days.

 

Karol

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I'm really enjoying the chronological film version playlist. Nice to those little cues in between the cues. There's really no reason for me to listen to the first disc as I have been listening to it for the past 20 years or so. Will read the liner notes tonight. Really great release, this. :)

 

Karol

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There are generally not many instantly noticeable differences on Disc 2 - will need to do a deep dive investigation, will share the results! Disc 3 is a just slightly mixed bag - some film stem cues ended up much better than some others. The playback versions are more noticeably different in places. I found it strange that Tradition had no playback version until I realised it's all offscreen choir, some barebones rhythmic choreography and Topol's on-set monologue! I'm glad Any Day Now was removed from the film in the end, it's a pretty authentic sounding communist movement march which aren't remembered fondly around these parts in general.

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LLL has replied to say they'll be sending replacement cases to me when they get back in January. As always, it's not the problem that matters but how it's resolved.

 

Fantastic notes by Mike as always. The music sounds great and it's surprising how much like Williams it all sounds. Goes to show how much of an impact that "adapted and conducted by" credit can have. It's an interesting release to be sure - never thought I'd be satisfied with an official expansion that included sound effects in some tracks due to the lack of clean elements, but they actually work for me. I'll try the suggested chronological playlist. Suppose I actually need to watch the film now!

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53 minutes ago, Alan said:

Suppose I actually need to watch the film now!

Yes, please do!

 

 

 

Mike's liner notes are wonderful. They go through the history of the stories, the play, the movie, JW's association with it and the place where he was in his career, then comes a track-by-track breakdown explaining the backgrounds and context of the songs and the motifs, noting JW's score cues where relevant, briefly going into the sources and assembly of this release, the whole hefty booklet concluding with an overview of how JW continued and still continues his association with Fiddler and the violin itself. I'm very happy he went through the trouble of collecting all this information and that LLL allowed it all without length limitations!

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Prologue and Main Title

0:26-1:22 - Tevye's narration overlay is a completely different take, D1 has the less enthusiastic album version, D2 has the energetic film version.

5:28-5:30 - The punchline of the rabbi's blessing for the tzar is a different take between the two, D2 has the film version.

6:09-6:58 - Tevye's narration is a completely different take, D1 has the album version, D2 has the film version.

D2 7:00-7:08 - The buildup and commotion around the horse's age is edited down on the album, this section is missing, D1's missing the dialogue overlay D2 has.

D1 7:46-8:54, D2 7:55-9:01 - Different takes of the solo fiddle. D1 has the prerecording, D2 has the revised recording matched to the footage that failed to match the prerecording.

The rest is all the same takes, with only mixing differences.

Disc 3's Fiddler on the Roof (Instrumental) only matches up perfectly with the very opening, then gets out of sync speed-and performancewise. It's probably a raw take, possibly prerecording that got partially used?

 

Matchmaker

D3 first 40 seconds are "The Conspiracy", the JW cue leading into the song (unfortunately in pretty bad sound), 4:15-end is "Donkey Serenade", an unused addendum according to the booklet - good question where it comes from then! Was the film stem Mike got an early version or something?

The singing vocals and as far as I can tell, the underlying music are all the same between the 3 versions. D1 has dialogue for the opening and the bridge, D2 doesn't have these, just the music under them (the bridge slightly shortened because of a silence), D3 has the bridge dialogue but a different take of it. D3, the playback, also has slightly different timings here and there and a slightly extended (or if it's the same take, not edited down) orchestral ending.

 

If I Were A Rich Man

Same takes, different mixes, D3 runs a bit slower. D1 starts with 27 seconds of dialogue, D2 doesn't have these, D3 starts instead with piano notes giving the tempo. Instruments fade in a bit later on D2.

 

Sabbath Prayer

D1 and D3 are missing the Isaac Stern overlay D2 has. Lots of differences in mixing choices for voices/chorus vs orchestra - though it's understandable the former would be mixed higher for a playback version.

 

To Life!

D1 starts with album version dialogue, D2 doesn't have any, D3 starts with film version dialogue.

D1 and D3 have different takes of dialogue in the bridge section, D2 has none. D1 and D2 are edited down, D3 has the full take with the intro to the second round playing twice.

The second round of L'chaim definitely has differences in the orchestral music here and there between D1/2 and D3

When the second round erupts into dancing, D2 and D3 have Tevye and some others singing along before the choir enters, D1 doesn't.

D3 has a different soloist and choir for the Russians.

For the "standoff" near the end when we're waiting if Tevye joins in or not, D3, the playback has 3 ascending notes, D2 only has the first 2, and D1 only has the third. The final section on D3 only has Tevye and a couple others singing then they drop out, D1 and D2 have a choir.

 

Whew, this is harder than I thought it'd be! To be continued.

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47 minutes ago, Holko said:

Disc 3's Fiddler on the Roof (Instrumental) only matches up perfectly with the very opening, then gets out of sync speed-and performancewise. It's probably a raw take, possibly prerecording that got partially used?

 

It's an unused take of the Prologue that the makers of the 30th anniversary edition put on that album instead of the proper film/album take.  Mike it included it on the LLL set so that there would be nothing on the 30th album that remained exclusive to it.

 

47 minutes ago, Holko said:

Sabbath Prayer

D1 and D2 are missing the Isaac Stern overlay D2 has. 

 

Minor typo here

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6 minutes ago, Jay said:

Minor typo here

And I absolutely remember that I noticed it and was planning to fix it! :lol:

6 minutes ago, Jay said:

It's an unused take of the Prologue that the makers of the 30th anniversary edition put on that album instead of the proper film/album take.  Mike it included it on the LLL set so that there would be nothing on the 30th album that remained exclusive to it.

Ah. Partially unused then because those first few seconds do match.

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The film/album take is probably actually a performance edit of multiple takes, while on the 30th its one single take uncut, would be my guess

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My physical copy arrived in today's mail

 

Wow, the art looks GREAT in printed form!  This is a really, REALLY nicely designed set.

 

It better get nominated at the IFMCA's this year after Matessino and Titus were completely snubbed last year!

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2 minutes ago, Jay said:

Wow, the art looks GREAT in printed form!  This is a really, REALLY nicely designed set.

 

One thing just to be myself: page 13 is printed as page 12A, something to fix for the second printing.

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Miracle of Miracles

The first 0:22 of D3 is the building, grand and joyous film version intro, replacing the first 7 seconds of the simpler album version which both D1 and D2 have. The small instrumental rest between verses is smaller and on D3, less brass and only one figure then holding until the end instead of two figures and big brass like on D1 and D2. D1 and D3 have the album version ending, D2 has the longer revised film version.

 

Tevye's Dream

D1 has the album version dialogue intro with less talk and more clean music, D2 has the film version with more talk, they're different until "Even your great-uncle Mordecai was there". During the Fruma Sarah segment, some screams are more musical on D1, more screamy on D2, some Tevye/Golde screams are included on D2 too. On D2 the ending loop until the final note is unedited, on D1 it's edited down to be shorter.

 

Wedding Procession

Two different takes. D3 one is longer and has longer form development, D1 hits transitional points quicker. D1 has punchier percussion and Stern joining in, making it feel overall bigger.

 

Sunrise, Sunset

The first very different one! D3 has a lot of different vocal takes than D1 and D2, including solo lines, mixed vs female choir, Tevye joining in prominently with the choir or not. D1 and D2 also have an overlay of Stern joining in with a new string line - parts of it are dialed out on D1 but are present all the way on D2.

 

Wedding Celebration and The Bottle Dance

D1 has various on-set lines and crowd noises all the way through, D2 has none. I have to admit that some of the singing along does add to the mood but would feel out of place without the other crowd sounds.

 

Any Day Now

D2 has minor additional dialogue in front that D3 doesn't have. D3 seems to run faster this time but different timings and pause lengths make that comparison more difficult. D3 has choir come in later, D2 only has the solo voice.

 

Do You Love Me?

D1 has dialogue over the intro, D2 has it clean, otherwise they're the same.

D3 is completely different: different vocal take, different more subdued music, hell, I think it's in a different key!

 

Far From the Home I Love

D1/D2 same case as above: D1 has dialogue over the intro and outro, D2 doesn't.

D3 is different again: different vocals, different key, different music with for example more prominent balalaika.

 

Chava Ballet Sequence

D2 has an additional orchestral overlay of warm shimmery strings and twinkly harp and glockenspiel.

 

The Rejection Scene

D1 has dialogue all the way through, D2 does not.

 

Anatevka

D1 starts with album dialogue, D2 instrumentally then with the film version of some lines. D1 has dialogue at the end, D2 does not. D2 has more of Stern. D1 has more dramatic voices, D2 has more subdued voices. D3 has some slightly different vocals in the beginning, more subdued orchestra, D2's more subdued vocals, and it's missing a chorus at the end.

 

Finale

D2 includes the initial sounds of the fiddler which makes Tevye look back and invite him along, and his final sounds are slightly different.

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17 hours ago, Holko said:

One thing just to be myself: page 13 is printed as page 12A, something to fix for the second printing.

 

Mike tells me that this is not a mistake, but was deliberate!

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Received mine the other day and had a listen at work with @Turbo playlist. I'm not one for musicals but quite enjoyed it and having not seen the film like the that the musical tracks still tell the story. Definitely got a Williams vibe in the orchestral cue's. The few cue's that have sfx are not bad, but then again listening to fan edit's of scores with sfx for many years I'm kinda used to it. The inclusion of the playback song's also gives me hope for the unreleased Hook songs in a hopeful future revisit. As always Mike Matessino and La La Land have done a great job of making this a definitive edition and I'm glad to have grabbed it.

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