Fabulin 3,510 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 7,398 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 At World's End is one of my favorite scores ever, pirates or not. However, I'm not that into the other POTC scores... Curse of the Black Pearl was composed by 20 or so people and it's a clear case of "too many cooks". Dead Man's Chest is okay but nowhere near AWE and by the fourth one it was clear Zimmer was tired of the franchise. As for Korngold, I haven't listened much of his works yet Bounty95 and Cerebral Cortex 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,478 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 I prefer Zimmer over Korngold in general, but Korngold wins this particular category. It's not Zimmer's pirate music, in particular, that attracts me to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Disco Stu 15,495 Posted December 6, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted December 6, 2021 I don't really see how to compare them, operating in completely different paradigms. But Zimmer does nothing for me and I adore Korngold's scores so I'm voting that way without really comparing them necessarily. Yavar Moradi, Remco and Ollie 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheUlyssesian 2,473 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 Pardon me but this is an outrageous comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ollie 1,059 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 50 minutes ago, Disco Stu said: I don't really see how to compare them, operating in completely different paradigms. But Zimmer does nothing for me and I adore Korngold's scores so I'm voting that way without really comparing them necessarily. Ditto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,508 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 Korngold vs. Zimmer? Korngold vs. Zimmer?????!!!! @Fabulin, are you 'aving a giraffe, mate???!!! Yavar Moradi and Fabulin 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drawgoon 100 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 Neither. Bear McCreary's title theme for "Black Sails", or Jesper Kyd's "Pirates: Tides of Fortune" are closer to my liking there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toa_of_Pi 3 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 Easily Zimmer. At World's End is one of my favorite scores that he's done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oomoog the Ecstatic 314 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 I prefer the pirate music of Michael Land and the Monkey Island series. I love how when venturing far off you eventually reencounter the same themes in new ways, for example, The Scumm Bar and then Lucre Town. Drawgoon 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,478 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 Should we a top 10 favourite pirate scores, or has it been done already? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koray Savas 2,251 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 48 minutes ago, Drawgoon said: Neither. Bear McCreary's title theme for "Black Sails", or Jesper Kyd's "Pirates: Tides of Fortune" are closer to my liking there. The Black Sails theme is awesome, but clearly inspired by Zimmer and Tyler’s Black Flag. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drawgoon 100 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 Wouldn't it make more sense to set Hans Zimmer's work for Muppet Treasure Island against those Korngold titles instead? They are still not in the same league obviously but at least we are crossing the "Bruckheimer" factor out of the list. I mean, could Korngold write any of that stuff if those films had Bruckheimer as the producer? 5 minutes ago, Koray Savas said: The Black Sails theme is awesome, but clearly inspired by Zimmer and Tyler’s Black Flag. Any particular HZ cues to help me see the connection? Falstaft and ChrisAfonso 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Muad'Dib 1,801 Posted December 6, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted December 6, 2021 Cerebral Cortex, Naïve Old Fart, Koray Savas and 1 other 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,508 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 19 minutes ago, Thor said: Should we a top 10 favourite pirate scores, or has it been done already? 1 HOOK 2 PIRATES 3 THE SCARLET BUCCANEER 4 THE SEA HAWK 5 CUTTHROAT ISLAND GerateWohl 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 4,640 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 I am too lazy to look this up, but isn't Klaus Badeat the composer the of the main pirate theme for POTC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bored 306 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 2 minutes ago, Tom said: I am too lazy to look this up, but isn't Klaus Badeat the composer the of the main pirate theme for POTC? No, I think Zimmer gave him credit to get his name out there, and he was originally supposed to write the score himself, but something happened that caused the score to be rushed, and therefore to need many other composers, with Zimmer as the new head. He composed the main theme and suite, Sparrow's material, and some other stuff like Bootstrap Bill's theme (I think). Klaus mainly handled the undead themes (with the "Moonlight Serenade" one from the complete score being written by Geoff Zanelli). As for the poll, I haven't listened to Korngold yet either so I have to vote Zimmer for now, even though I'm sure Korngold's work is technically better and more fitting. Tom 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Marian Schedenig 8,179 Posted December 6, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted December 6, 2021 "Films: Kubrick vs Boll" Romão, TheUlyssesian and Naïve Old Fart 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GerateWohl 4,344 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 With Klaus Badelt and Pirates of the Caribean seems to be some kind of Monty Norman situation. 2 hours ago, Thor said: Should we a top 10 favourite pirate scores, or has it been done already? I know hardly 10 pirate movies. Top 5 would be more than enough. Drawgoon 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Lord Zimmer 211 Posted December 6, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted December 6, 2021 No one even knows who that loser Korngold is. Edmilson, badbu, Remco and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 7,398 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 My top Pirates scores: 1. POTC: At World's End (HZ) 2. Cutthroat Island (JD) 3. Treasure Planet (JNH) 4. Hook (JW) 5. POTC: Dead Man's Chest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muad'Dib 1,801 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 3 hours ago, superultramegaa said: No, I think Zimmer gave him credit to get his name out there, and he was originally supposed to write the score himself, but something happened that caused the score to be rushed, and therefore to need many other composers, with Zimmer as the new head. He composed the main theme and suite, Sparrow's material, and some other stuff like Bootstrap Bill's theme (I think). Klaus mainly handled the undead themes (with the "Moonlight Serenade" one from the complete score being written by Geoff Zanelli). As for the poll, I haven't listened to Korngold yet either so I have to vote Zimmer for now, even though I'm sure Korngold's work is technically better and more fitting. Yeah, as far as I can remember there was some exclusivity deal with a film Hans was doing at the time (I *think* it was The Last Samurai) so he couldn't legally put his name on the credits as "Music by" on POTC, but as Silvestri was fired very late in the game despite writing demos for less than a third of the movie's runtime, Bruckheimer called Hans and they worked it out so that Badelt would get main credit and Zimmer could provide the foundational work so that team could compose and record the score in what I remember was less than 12 days. The details are fuzzy, so those who have the actual scoop don't hesitate to correct me, but that's what I can remember right now. bored and Edmilson 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koray Savas 2,251 Posted December 6, 2021 Share Posted December 6, 2021 That’s pretty much correct. There was a large team that wrote the score, but not 20 as someone said earlier. Zanelli is the backbone to the music for those films. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romão 2,274 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 I like Zimmer just fine, but this comparasion is a bit preposterous, to a point that it's actually unfair to Zimmer. Korngold, of course, wins by landslide. But the Monkey Island scores will always be my sentimental favorite when it comes to Pirate music Falstaft and Jurassic Shark 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,508 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 11 hours ago, Marian Schedenig said: "Films: Kubrick vs Boll" "Films: Bergman vs Bay" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mephariel 451 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 At World's End is my favorite. But The Sea Hawk is better than any of Zimmer's other Pirates scores. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raiders of the SoundtrArk 2,429 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 I prefer Williams' Pirates music. The Adventures of Tintin and Hook are far superior to anything those composers ever wrote. Jurassic Shark and publicist 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fabulin 3,510 Posted December 7, 2021 Author Share Posted December 7, 2021 1 hour ago, Mephariel said: At World's End is my favorite. But The Sea Hawk is better than any of Zimmer's other Pirates scores. Maybe I should have made it just about At World's End vs The Sea Hawk – the comparison that actually sparked this question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,033 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 Captain Blood is also bloody great! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thor 7,478 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 2 hours ago, Naïve Old Fart said: "Films: Bergman vs Bay" Obviously incompatible sizes in style and approach, but I'm a fan of both. In fact, as much as I enjoy several Bergman films, I think I'd have to go for Bay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,033 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 Bergman could have done more explosions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GerateWohl 4,344 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 I would have prefered to see Bergmann's remake or The Texas Chainsaw Massacre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Penna 3,676 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 3 hours ago, Fabulin said: Maybe I should have made it just about At World's End vs The Sea Hawk – the comparison that actually sparked this question. I'd be surprised but heartened if there were actually a serious discussion about AWE being better, given that we're comparing a golden age score with Zimmer. But I guess this isn't a typical JWFan Zimmer-bashing thread I'd completely agree that AWS is by miles the best score in that franchise. The first score is just a hodgepodge of things, the second one is more consistent, but outside of Davy Jones' and Jack Sparrow's themes, pretty forgettable. AWE made an instant positive impression on album, with really catchy melodies, and action which largely escapes the typical RCP style. I have a Sea Hawk Suite from god knows where - probably a Silva compilation. I originally knew about it due to WIlliams including it in the Oscar medley from a decade or so ago. The bit he included is nice.... the rest not really my thing. Yavar Moradi 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GerateWohl 4,344 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 I mentioned it before in another thread where somebody asked for good examples of pirate music. My personal favorite pirate music is neither from The Sea Hawk nor from Pirates of the Caribean, but from the old animated Disney Classic Peter Pan. It is probably the pirate music I heard most often in my life. As a kid I had the audio play from the movie on LP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edmilson 7,398 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 3 hours ago, Jurassic Shark said: Bergman could have done more explosions. I'd watch a Transformers remake directed by Bergman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,033 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 He'd take boringness to new heights. Edmilson 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marian Schedenig 8,179 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 13 hours ago, Romão said: I like Zimmer just fine, but this comparasion is a bit preposterous, to a point that it's actually unfair to Zimmer. Korngold, of course, wins by landslide. But the Monkey Island scores will always be my sentimental favorite when it comes to Pirate music I like some Zimmer just fine. I even like most of AWE, even though I strongly dislike most of the rest of (what I've heard of) his POTC stuff. But I'll easily rank the Monkey Islands much closer to Korngold than Zimmer on this scale. Romão 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romão 2,274 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 7 minutes ago, Marian Schedenig said: I like some Zimmer just fine. I even like most of AWE, even though I strongly dislike most of the rest of (what I've heard of) his POTC stuff. But I'll easily rank the Monkey Islands much closer to Korngold than Zimmer on this scale. Agree on all counts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,033 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 45 minutes ago, Marian Schedenig said: the Monkey Island RCP, you mean? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Penna 3,676 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 14 hours ago, Romão said: I like Zimmer just fine, but this comparasion is a bit preposterous, to a point that it's actually unfair to Zimmer. Korngold, of course, wins by landslide. But the Monkey Island scores will always be my sentimental favorite when it comes to Pirate music Actually I just re-read the poll title, and it's 'prefer' not 'best'. Although even if it were 'best', it's a dark day when it's a hard and fast rule that a score by a golden age composer is automatically better than a contemporary one. That's unfair to everyone composing today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 This isn't just any golden age composer. It's effing Korngold. He defined what a swashbuckler score is! 70 years later Zimmer was still basically working within (or at least reacting to) parameters set by Korngold. Tom Guernsey and Naïve Old Fart 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jurassic Shark 12,033 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 And HanZ pissed on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marian Schedenig 8,179 Posted December 7, 2021 Share Posted December 7, 2021 1 hour ago, Jurassic Shark said: RCP, you mean? Jay 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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