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Michael Giacchino & Nami Melumad's THOR: LOVE AND THUNDER (2022)


Jay

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I can't say I found much to enjoy in any of the previous 3 Thor scores, so I might end up liking this one the most!


I know Doyle's has a lot of fans though, Motherbaugh's too.  Don't hear much talk about Tyler's

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Is anybody a bit of sick of Gia.

 

He's now scored - 

 

Pixar

Star Trek

Star Wars

Mission Impossible

Planet of the Apes

Spiderman

Jurassic Park

Marvel

DC

 

He's a heartbeat away from Zimmer at this point. Isn't he also a total corporate franchise shill now?

 

Does he have any interest in scoring dramas? In narrative storytelling? Or all he wants score is 200 million dollar blizzards of CGI pixels?

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3 minutes ago, TheUlyssesian said:

Does he have any interest in scoring dramas? In narrative storytelling? Or all he wants score is 200 million dollar blizzards of CGI pixels?

Well, to be fair, he did a bunch of non-blockbuster movies recently, like Jojo Rabbit and Bad Times at the El Royale. But yeah, aside from that he probably scored almost every major intelectual property Hollywood has to offer.

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16 minutes ago, Jay said:

 

Nah

 

 

Yea

 

 

What do you mean?

 

 

1x1.gif 500x500bb.webp 500x500bb.webp 500x500bb.webp 500x500bb.webp 500x500bb.webp

 

And that's just within the past 4 years

 

I know these. I had to go to his IMDB to assemble the list above. 

 

I just wonder if any director is making a serious drama or epic would Gia even be on the shortlist? 

 

Like for example Williams is unable to score Fablemans, would Spielberg even consider Gia now?

 

I just think if Gia wants to be a serious respected composer, he maybe should have some variety. It's like just non stop superhero films with him.

 

Williams scored one superhero. Horner too. Technically Elfman too before he was brought on in unusual circumstances for Justice League.

 

I don't know, I just feel Gia is becoming this corporate blockbuster composer and any film that requires more artful scoring probably will not have Gia on shortlist. Let's just say if Schindler's List were to be made today, nobody would trust Gia to write that score.

 

I know I am probably alone in my opinion here but my frustration is two-folder - of hearing the same guys get this scoring gigs over and over and seeing a composer I liked mired in sameness. 

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I enjoy plenty of scores by composers who don't do a lot of intimate dramas.  And I have never once thought that was a problem of any kind.

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15 minutes ago, TheUlyssesian said:

Williams scored one superhero. Horner too. Technically Elfman too before he was brought on in unusual circumstances for Justice League.

Elfman one? He scored two Spiderman, one Hulk, one Avengers and I think some more.

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Danny Elfman has scored 10 superhero films

  1. Batman (1989)
  2. Darkman (1990)
  3. Batman Returns (1992)
  4. Spider-man (2002)
  5. Hulk (2003)
  6. Spider-man 2 (2004)
  7. Hellboy II (2008)
  8. Avengers 2 (2015)
  9. Justice League (2017)
  10. Dr. Strange 2 (2022)

    Zimmer has scored 8

    1. Batman Begins (2005)
    2. The Dark Knight (2008)
    3. The Dark Knight Rises (2012)
    4. Man Of Steel (2013)
    5. The Amazing Spider-man 2 (2014)
    6. Batman V Superman (2016)
    7. Dark Phoenix (2019)
    8. Wonder Woman 1984 (2020)

    Giacchino has only scored 6

    1. Dr Strange (2016)
    2. Spider-man (2017)
    3. Spider-man 2 (2019)
    4. Spider-man 3 (2021)
    5. The Batman (2022)
    6. Thor 4 (2022)
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    And yet at the same time, do you have any particular composers you'd want to take his place? We have our Pemberton's, Britell's, Hurwitz's, Kraemer's, and others, but they seem to mainly operate in very specific corners of film (though in the case of the latter not by choice, unfortunately). Who could feasibly fit the bill just as well that isn't from the RCP factory? We'd all like Powell, but it seems either the interest or offers aren't there.

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    Finally Thor is going to get a good score.

     

    Doyle’s is basically polished Zimmer.

     

    Tyler’s is too damn loud and overbearing. 

     

    As much as I loved Ragnarok, I don’t remember any of the music.

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    I think Doyle's theme was the most refined of the bunch - giving Thor a regal identity and was definitely memorable.

     

    The first 50 seconds of this track state the theme well.

     

     

    And below is a heroic version (though the drums are a bit RCP). But there is atleast the sense of a concrete melody which is not just a power anthem but a real theme.

     

     

    Part of the frustration with modern franchise scores is just the complete lack of consistency in thematic material. Like someone said above, this would be the 4th Thor theme in 4 films. It's like they never build a consistent thematic base for characters anymore. And one of the reasons for that is changing composers every film.

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    I know many find Giacchino underwhelming, but I do see it as a positive that Marvel seem to be pretty flexible when it comes to directors choosing a composer to work with.
     

    Elfman/Raimi

    Cretton/West

    Coogler/Goransson

     

     

    Waititi and Gia obviously worked well together on Jojo Rabbit.

     

    They could be just shipping all their movies out to HZ and his RCP clones.

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    Well. No surprises there. Directors rarely jump ship after they work with MG on something. MG is Marvel's favorite right composer too now, isn't he? I also remember seeing some "buddy photo" shoots with MG and Waititi during the awards seasons. It all fits.

     

    Gotta say though, MG sure is following Hans' playbook when it comes to forging friendships with directors who seem to have promising future.

     

    I wish JNH could do that too.

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    9 hours ago, TheUlyssesian said:

    Part of the frustration with modern franchise scores is just the complete lack of consistency in thematic material. Like someone said above, this would be the 4th Thor theme in 4 films. It's like they never build a consistent thematic base for characters anymore. And one of the reasons for that is changing composers every film.

     

    Imagine just for a second, a little tiny second, all MCU movies from Iron Man to No Way Home scored by John Williams. *Phew!* At least half of them.

     

    Might have been a waste of craft and creativity. But it would have been great.

     

    Only disadvantage would be that we would have missed all the existing scores of the past 12 years, that we got from Mr. Williams, because he would not have had time for them.

     

    Btw. I don't understand the wide antipathy against Giacchino around here. I am not a fan of his music, but there are some scores I like. I usually don't like his sequels to Williams scores, but he has done some nice Pixar work.

     

    Still I don't see, what makes for example a Harry Gregson-Williams better than a Michael Giacchino.

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    13 minutes ago, bruce marshall said:

    The sequel to this:

    THOR: I hate Giacchino!

     

    ;)

     

    As I said over on FSM:

     

    The irony of my composer "nemesis" scoring a movie with the words "Thor" and "love" is not lost on me.

    Thankfully, I have minimal interest in superhero stuff these days, so he can rummage through those as much as he wants. Just stay out of my beloved ALIEN franchise (one of the last, major franchises he hasn't yet taken over).

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    On 10/12/2021 at 11:12 AM, GerateWohl said:

    Still I don't see, what makes for example a Harry Gregson-Williams better than a Michael Giacchino.

     

    Most likely what we see here is not about MG's music at all.

     

    In all careers and workplaces, people are liked only for as long as they are "underrated", "underused", etc.

     

    If it was HGW who was landing (and surviving) these big gigs instead of MG here, I am sure he'd be the recipient of these criticism.

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    17 hours ago, Edmilson said:

    That's sad, Mothersbaugh's score for Ragnarok was one of the best from the MCU. I was hoping he would return.

    Ditto. Granted, the theme itself was a bit underwhelming but the score on the whole was a lot of fun. 

     

    Karol

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    Ragnarok is the best score from the three so far even though I think Doyle's theme is the most memorable while the rest of his score is not that interresting. Tyler didn't write a stunning score but one that just make the job in the movie.

    Overall I'll say:

    • Thor: so-so score but terrific theme
    • The Dark World: okay score with an okay theme
    • Ragnarok great score with an okay theme
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    Wrong composer.

     

    18 hours ago, Jay said:

    He doesn't like to score films where people solve their problems with violence, though.

     

    This is an interesting choice. He could do the Tintin sequel we're never getting.

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    19 hours ago, Jay said:

    The biggest franchises / brands he hasn't scored for yet are Harry Potter, James Bond, Fast&Furious, Middle Earth, and Dreamworks Animation

    I can't see him doing a F&F movie since those already belong to Brian Tyler, whose style is quite different from Giacchino's.

     

    I don't think Amazon will ask him to do the Middle Earth TV show either, since he apparently has moved away to doing exclusively films.

     

    As for Potter... Who knows? WB will probably make a Cursed Child movie in the future, but I think it'll be scored by someone who has already worked for the franchise, whether it's Williams, Desplat or JNH.

     

    That just leaves Bond and DWA as the most likely candidates. And I don't think it's far fetched to think that the Broccolis will ask him to do the next Bond reboot.

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    I actually think Bond would be a good fit for Giacchino.  Obviously his Incredibles scores are heavily Barry inspired, but also I tend to think of Giacchino's music as a bit simplistic or straightforward, which lends itself well to Bond

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    Gia has written my two favorite Marvel scores (Dr. Strange and Homecoming - I know, I just haven't gotten into Far From Home).

     

    I loved Doyle's Thor and I liked Tyler's Dark World. Ragnarok was... OK. It had the same problem as the film: It was too tongue in cheek. It fit right in with Mothersbaugh: Mitchels vs the Machine's, Cloudy with a Chance of Meatballs, Lego Movie. All kind of heroic but in a "Hey, isn't this kind of stupid?" kind of way.

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    I used to love Gia, but honestly, the last score I really thought he knocked out of the park was Spider-Man: Homecoming. His themes from more recent scores just bore me. I still play the hell out of Jupiter Ascending though.

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    I think Far from Home was one of the best blockbuster scores fo 2019. Incredibles 2 from the previous year was pretty good too, although obviously inferior to the first score. Fallen Kingdom, on the other hand, did nothing for me.

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    On 09/12/2021 at 1:50 PM, HunterTech said:

    And yet at the same time, do you have any particular composers you'd want to take his place? We have our Pemberton's, Britell's, Hurwitz's, Kraemer's, and others, but they seem to mainly operate in very specific corners of film (though in the case of the latter not by choice, unfortunately). Who could feasibly fit the bill just as well that isn't from the RCP factory? We'd all like Powell, but it seems either the interest or offers aren't there.

     

    Yes. Are you serious?

     

    George Kallis

    Bear McCreary

    Panu Aaltio 

    Christopher Drake

    Ludwig Göransson

    Dan Romer

    Nicolas Britell

    Johnny Klimek and Tom Tykwer

    Debbie Wiseman

    Germaine Franco

    Austin Wintory
    Kris Bowers

    Anne-Kathrin Dern

    Christopher Lennertz
     

    RCP composers I would take over Gia not including Zimmer:

     

    John Powell

    Ramin Djawadi

    Benjamin Wallfisch

    Lorne Balfe

     

    And this is not because Gia can't write a great score. He can. It is because there are a lot of diverse pool of talent out there besides Gia that could use more work like this.

     

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    20 minutes ago, Mephariel said:

    Yes. Are you serious?

     

    Not really. I was more trying to ask some of the others that, since they sure go quiet when it comes to mentioning any of the other talent that is out there.

     

    Also, good luck convincing anyone here that Klimek and Tykwer have any worth with the "mixed at best" response Matrix Resurrections has gotten so far.

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    2 hours ago, Mephariel said:

    RCP composers I would take over Gia not including Zimmer:

     

    John Powell

     

    I don't think Powell really deserves to be lumped into the "RCP composers" category. He's better than any of Zimmer's other proteges.

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    21 minutes ago, A. A. Ron said:

    He's better than any of Zimmer's other proteges.

    Exactly.  I think it's even unfair to Jackman, Balfe and the others to compare them with Powell. They can write decent scores but not something as great as Powell's best works. 

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    5 hours ago, Mephariel said:

     

    Yes. Are you serious?

     

    George Kallis

    Bear McCreary

    Panu Aaltio 

    Christopher Drake

    Ludwig Göransson

    Dan Romer

    Nicolas Britell

    Johnny Klimek and Tom Tykwer

    Debbie Wiseman

    Germaine Franco

    Austin Wintory
    Kris Bowers

    Anne-Kathrin Dern

    Christopher Lennertz
     

    RCP composers I would take over Gia not including Zimmer:

     

    John Powell

    Ramin Djawadi

    Benjamin Wallfisch

    Lorne Balfe

     

    And this is not because Gia can't write a great score. He can. It is because there are a lot of diverse pool of talent out there besides Gia that could use more work like this.

     

    And it is not as if some of these composers doesn’t get good opportunities as well. Lorne Balfe has a marvel and an original movie with a good concept this year, Benjamin also had some interesting projects lately. I can’t imagine someone like Dan Romer being able to handle the pressure and being able to leave his confort zone. Agreed on  Lennetz tho. He deserves a good assignments

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