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Natalie Holt's OBI-WAN KENOBI (2022)


Jay
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12 minutes ago, Luke Skywalker said:

In the end rcp entered starwars…

 

If we wanna get technical, that happened with John Powell ;)

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  • 3 weeks later...

Interesting:

 

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Holt wrote her own Obi-Wan theme, before it was clear that Williams would be contributing, “and weirdly, it’s very similar to his,” she says.

 

and:

 

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For “Obi-Wan,” he did more than just write a theme, Holt discloses. “He did a suite, including the main theme, which is used in the titles, and different versions of it. So we have this ‘Obi-Wan’ suite that we used within the show as appropriate.

 

Cue raging arguments over who wrote what specific bit! :lol:

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So there was recording in London after all!!

 

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Seventy-five L.A. musicians played the music for the six-part series, although Holt reports that she “had a couple of percussion sessions” in London while also recording famed cellist Caroline Dale and Swedish folk musician Ale Möller, whose “huge ancient hunting horn had such a powerful sound” that she couldn’t resist incorporating it too.

 

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So far ep1 has been a very modern action score. Slow strings for slow scenes. Loud drums, furious strings and some brass for action scenes. Obi Wan's theme during key moments. It's been a very average score. Let's see if it picks up in the coming eps.

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1000 times better then the mandalorian. Love it!!! 

So good to see Ewan back as obi wan :)

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I thought it was pretty good. I have about the same reaction as with Mando/TBBF, but with the added bonus of Williams. Definitely more "Star Wars-y" sounding than Mando, for those that didn't like Ludwig's stuff.

 

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I've seen the first two episodes. I rolled my eyes at some of it and liked some of it. I haven't determined how I feel about the series yet but I really like Williams' Obi-Wan theme. Maybe even love it. 

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The first episode is nice and it's great to see Ewan McGregor again in the role! 

 

The music is functional. Lot's of different variations on Williams Obi-Wan Theme, which I quite like. The rest of the music felt a bit generic at parts.

 

Spoiler

I liked the music in the Alderaan scenes, but it bothered me a bit that Holt didn't made any reference to Leia's Theme during her scenes, or even a brief reference to the main theme when Obi-Wan sees Luke, but perhaps they're saving the Williams references for key scenes in the following episodes

 

I hope that at least Williams theme suite gets released soon

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There’s an action scene in the second episode, a moment when Obi-Wan is chasing after Leia on the rooftops, that sounds similar to (isn’t) Williams’ theme. I wonder if that was Holt’s version?

 

I quite liked her music, especially the gorgeous Alderaan stuff. I’d like to hear the Inquisitor material more closely, especially when they first show up at Tatooine, it was interesting. Overall I think there’s a nice blend between her music and the Williams/Ross material, it’s pretty cohesive all things considered.

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1 hour ago, Knight of Ren said:

The first episode is nice and it's great to see Ewan McGregor again in the role! 

 

The music is functional. Lot's of different variations on Williams Obi-Wan Theme, which I quite like. The rest of the music felt a bit generic at parts.

 

  Hide contents

I liked the music in the Alderaan scenes, but it bothered me a bit that Holt didn't made any reference to Leia's Theme during her scenes, or even a brief reference to the main theme when Obi-Wan sees Luke, but perhaps they're saving the Williams references for key scenes in the following episodes

 

I hope that at least Williams theme suite gets released soon

Not sure if this is really any kind of spoiler, that needs to be hiddeen but...

Spoiler

...I found the Alderaan music especially disappointing. Yes, no reference to Leias theme, actually no theme at all. Just these generic ostinati. Apart from Obi Wan's Theme this actually would have been an opportunity to write something classical Star Wars-ish somehow. Big missed opportunity.

 

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The score at least on a first listen and in the context of the two episodes is a very strange experience for me. It feels like half of it is Star Wars and the other half is just aimless experimentation with a lot of modern sounds and techniques which ironically make it even more wallpaper-y. The only times I really stood up and took notice of the music was when it echoed a traditional orchestral sound, it's really hard to reconcile the rest of it as being a part of the same score

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20 minutes ago, JNHFan2000 said:

 


I just realized, you consciously never post in the main Williams sub forum don’t you?

 

Obviously new Williams music is being discussed there.

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42 minutes ago, Stu said:


I just realized, you consciously never post in the main Williams sub forum don’t you?

 

Obviously new Williams music is being discussed there.

That's not at all consiously. I really don't think about it.

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Spoiler

I kinda like her Young Leia theme if that's what it is, but I did find it weird not to have Leia's theme referenced anywhere. Idk if that's something she's gonna build up to or if she's just gonna ignore it. Kinda weird to see Obi-Wan use the Force and not hear the Force theme after being conditioned to hear it every single goddamn time lol. And the Anakin reveal without the Imperial March.

 

I guess we'll see as the show goes but it's gonna be pretty odd if this show keeps going without any thematic references, considering its characters and place in the continuity. 

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Haven't seen the show yet, but here's my biggest question right now.

 

Imagine a world where JW wasn't brought in to write and record a theme, and Ross wasn't brought it to adapt that theme into new cues - A world where Natalie Holt's score was used as originally intended.

 

What would the end credits cue have been like?  What would have been released as the single for the show today?

Will these arrangements be on the score album, or will they be locked away in the vault for decades?

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38 minutes ago, mrbellamy said:
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I kinda like her Young Leia theme if that's what it is, but I did find it weird not to have Leia's theme referenced anywhere. Idk if that's something she's gonna build up to or if she's just gonna ignore it. Kinda weird to see Obi-Wan use the Force and not hear the Force theme after being conditioned to hear it every single goddamn time lol. And the Anakin reveal without the Imperial March.

 

I guess we'll see as the show goes but it's gonna be pretty odd if this show keeps going without any thematic references, considering its characters and place in the continuity. 

Spoiler

TBF, It'd be more than a little odd to use a love theme for a little kid.

 

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15 minutes ago, greenturnedblue said:

Everyone complained there was no force theme in Mando S1 when grogu uses the force to deflect the flamethrower, and when it finally played in the S2 finale it had a much deeper effect. Imagine if it was used constantly like Last Jedi! It would have no meaning if it played during something important. They are probably saving the force theme, imperial March etc for later

Not using the force theme Vs using the greatest Character theme ever for that character are 2 very different things both should be used

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Agree not using the Force theme is a thing (silly IMO but why not). Not using the most iconic theme of cinema history to replace it by a poor variation while it has chronologically already been introduce is simply a nonsense!

You don't replace the Imperial March

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Yea, the RCP type action scoring in the opening order 66 scene was a downer for me. I instantly knew how the rest of the score would sound. In this article, she said:

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For me as a violinist and as someone who’s a lover of big orchestral sounds, it was just a chance to pay homage to John Williams. It’s kind of a collaboration with the history of Star Wars and his new theme, and then also bringing a bit of modernity to it.

By big orchestral sounds and modernity, I guess she meant RCP type orchestral. I didn't hear much homage yet in the first two eps in style, tone, or themes. So I am hoping it picks up in the last 4 eps or this is just an average or borderline forgettable score with a stellar Williams theme.

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On 26/5/2022 at 1:06 PM, Jay said:

So there was recording in London after all!!


Also, looks like the LA session were split between Sony/Streisand for Williams material, and Fox/Newman for Holt:

 

image.jpeg

 

Curious that both JW and Ross are credited as orchestrators for the material recorded at Sony. I wonder if this means JW wrote any additional material?
 

Also of note: “Additional Music by Peter Nickalls • Jon Opstad • Max Aruj”

 

Nice to see all the musicians credited on screen for once!

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I think Kennedy knows the value of Williams and the traditional score approach, but she also knows that not many can do it effectively--particularly for a TV project.  So, she lets the directors go with their own sensibilities, which veers towards RCP crap, as it is the in thing and thereby safe.  I wonder, though, if Ocelot's reports were not accurate, that in this case, she reallly wanted something more and somewhat last minute convinced Williams to do what he did.  

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13 hours ago, Van_Etten said:

Does anyone have a feeling the music plays almost the entire time? It just can't shut up. Most of the time Holt just plays pure ambience, but there's no emotional background to the scene.

absolutely, yes. It is wall to wall.  So much more could be done with less music, written better, and spotted better for more impact. 


I’m disappointed. The one and only time Holt’s material tickled my ears at all was 

Spoiler

When Leia is introduced running in the woods

But the lovely tones were soured by synthy percussion. 
 

I honestly would’ve preferred something vastly different like Goransson. At least his material stood out.   This is just background, and I really wanted to like it.   Most of the time it just feels like sound design, music that was not written, but engineered.   I feel bad being negative about it, but only the Williams and Ross contributions are worthy of praise. 

7 hours ago, Jay said:

Imagine a world where JW wasn't brought in to write and record a theme, and Ross wasn't brought it to adapt that theme into new cues - A world where Natalie Holt's score was used as originally intended.

 

What would the end credits cue have been like?  What would have been released as the single for the show today?


A great thought experiment.  Nothing of Holt’s leaves much of an impression.  There must’ve been an Obi Theme that was rejected. Because I can’t imagine being a composer and given this dream project and producing something so generic.   There had to have been more. 
 

Edit:  just saw Jay’s post in the show thread confirming that Holt did indeed have a theme rejected. 

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Just a reminder that those additional composer guys took to social media to tout their work once the final mix was done.


Clicky

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I have trouble distinguishing any of Holt/The Balfe Buddies's contributions from Edward Shire's Boba Fett gruel or most library music.   Except maybe that it's more overtly influenced by Zimmer at times 

 

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I'm glad I saw Williams conduct the suite before seeing the episode, as it made me quickly realise that every piece of music I enjoyed in ep1 was based on the Williams material. And when I saw William Ross appear in the credits, I realised it was probably arranged by him!

 

The episode started so promisingly with the new logo cue, but am I to assume that was neither Williams, Ross or Holt? And then within seconds, we were into Holt's generic modern-day drumming action music stuff. Ugh.

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So far none of the music has been standout except for the moments JW's theme is used and even those moments are just ok. The music just isn't having much of an impact in the show. I'm not sure it's bad music, it's just generic and just kind of there.

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22 minutes ago, JTWfan77 said:

I wonder how Williams feels about this if he truly hated MG's Rogue One.

The only thing we sort of know is that he wasn't happy about the initial presentation of his themes. That can mean many things and something tells me Giacchino's writing has little to do with it. More likely it was the extent to which they were originally used and, more importantly, the resulting screen credit. And even that is mostly speculation. 

 

Karol

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36 minutes ago, artguy360 said:

So far none of the music has been standout except for the moments JW's theme is used and even those moments are just ok. The music just isn't having much of an impact in the show. I'm not sure it's bad music, it's just generic and just kind of there.

 

I've only watched episode 1, but the show isn't exactly that inspiring to begin with.

 

Spoiler

I enjoyed seeing a-day-in-the-life-of Obi-Wan, but then we saw it two more times. So little actually happened. The Jedi hunter villains are terrible, the chase in the forest was comically bad - how can 3 dudes not outrun a tiny child?! They were literally tripping over each other like they were completely inept. Yet in the next scene, we're supposed to feel threatened by them? Other than McGregor, the acting is terrible.

 

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7 hours ago, Andy said:

A great thought experiment.  Nothing of Holt’s leaves much of an impression.  There must’ve been an Obi Theme that was rejected. Because I can’t imagine being a composer and given this dream project and producing something so generic.   There had to have been more. 
 

Edit:  just saw Jay’s post in the show thread confirming that Holt did indeed have a theme rejected. 

Again, 8f she likes to write Star Wars themes there would have been more than enough opportunity to do it for the scenes and places without Obi Wan, most prominently Alderaan. But what we are hearing there is neither a theme nor Star Wars, it is just rhythmic chord pastiche, like @Edmilson wrote, "RCP trailer style epicness".

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