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Natalie Holt's OBI-WAN KENOBI (2022)


Jay
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I would have scored this with JW orchestrations and also synth and also no action music whatsoever, because I like mayhem

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4 hours ago, Drew said:

15 years ago, the score to episode 2 would have been soundly rejected for being unlistenable. This is how badly the standards have fallen. Saying this score is better than nothing is enabling this tragic fall of quality standards. Don’t be an enabler. Of course, don’t bring vitriol either.

but it was really cool- the music when GI was on screen was cool and the parkour music with the brass was sick.

ok everything else was a bit dodge but like its ok

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21 minutes ago, Jay said:

I have only seen the first episode so far, but I really liked:

 

-the short title card cue

 

-All the wonderful variations of Williams' theme that underscore most Obi-wan scenes

 

-The end credits cue.

 

I assume all of those are Ross's doing and nothing Holt was involved with, though.

 

So as for the remaining music in the episode that was likely hers: Honestly, I didn't notice any of it!  This is how most things go when I watch them the first time - I am consuming the episode itself and not specifically trying to hear what the score is like, unless it specifically stands out as being exceptionally interesting or exceptionally bad.  Holt's music in this episode did neither, so I'll have to wait for the album to see what she did in this episode. 

 

Maybe episode 2 will be different.

 

You'll most likely notice it on further viewing but the chances are you won't remember it.

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I definitely didn't enjoy the episode enough to want to watch it again, but yes, in general a second viewing of things leads me to hear what the score is doing significantly more than first watch

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6 hours ago, DarthDementous said:

I was thinking about this earlier how Star Wars really needs an 'Orville' equivalent that learns from the mistakes of the modern incarnation and delivers on what people love about the franchise even if it's not necessarily in the same universe


Yes, exactly this. Star Wars is in a state that I frankly hate precisely because of this genuinely toxic attitude to just 'shut up and let people enjoy what they like' whenever the slightest bit of critical thinking enters into the mix. Just once I'd like to be able to express criticism without being lumped into this gigantic category that puts all this stuff on me that I don't believe in at all. There is literally zero downside to being critical of what you watch, if more people did that then there would be a demand for higher quality entertainment which means everyone wins

Constantly giving Star Wars a pass over and over is just going to lead it into the inevitable dumpster fire that so many other beloved franchises have become, and at least some of those had the excuse of scarce releases. Star Wars has turned into the MCU in terms of its quantity and yet people are still treating it like it's special and something to be cherished when something new comes out? It makes absolutely no sense, like it's a ghost being defended instead of the actual thing it is now

If I don't at least attempt to be honest with how I feel about something and hopefully explaining why that that is, ideally encouraging others to do the same, then the audience remains complacent and the quality of these products remains stagnant or in the worst case scenario actually gets worse. If I 'shut up and let people enjoy what they like' then it's contributing to making the products in a franchise I love worse which has a direct effect on my enjoyment, so of course I give a damn and want to say something

Stop regurgitating the same lazy rhetoric over and over again, 'it's a space fantasy so writing doesn't matter', 'no one hates Star Wars more than Star Wars fans', 'just be happy you're getting anything at all', you have absolutely no idea how detrimental this is to the discourse or how widespread these beliefs are. Actually engage with what people are saying specifically, don't lump them all into some anomalous category so you don't have to address anything they said. You're holding this series to such a low standard when the series has been at a far higher standard before, hold it to what it was at its best because otherwise the bar just gets exponentially lowered

Apologies for the rant, I'm just so very sick of seeing the same lazy engagements over and over again

 

Couldn't have said it better! I agree 100%.

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Couple of edits I wanted to share that are cool music-wise. Both are for the second episode.

Spoiler

Really like how this was integrated into this. The brass over the strings and how it transitions with what's already there... it just works so well. 

 
And another one: 
 

Spoiler

This one is more so an edit of the scene. It's to change that the Second Sister knows who Vader really is - in this she doesn't know. But I like the use of that bit from Revenge of the Sith in the music - one of my favorites. Just wanted to share as the discussion here makes me yearn for music like that in this show.

 

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You know what I find interesting about a lot of the complaints about Natalie's score? Natalie said that every planet would have its own style of music. The Tatooine material is very different from Alderaan. And Alderaan sounds very different from Daiyu. Daiyu has a very Blade Runner vibe to it, so a Vangelis/Hans Zimmer-esque score makes a lot of sense.

So all this doom and gloom over how Natalie is tearing apart Star Wars' musical legacy and ruining life as we know seem a little too dramatic for my liking. Also don't forget, Natalie said her music was "deeper rooted in Star Wars tradition than Ludwig's music for The Mandalorian" was. I think she knows what she's doing.

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49 minutes ago, CourtneyNeedsAW said:

You know what I find interesting about a lot of the complaints about Natalie's score? Natalie said that every planet would have its own style of music. The Tatooine material is very different from Alderaan. And Alderaan sounds very different from Daiyu. Daiyu has a very Blade Runner vibe to it, so a Vangelis/Hans Zimmer-esque score makes a lot of sense.

So all this doom and gloom over how Natalie is tearing apart Star Wars' musical legacy and ruining life as we know seem a little too dramatic for my liking. Also don't forget, Natalie said her music was "deeper rooted in Star Wars tradition than Ludwig's music for The Mandalorian" was. I think she knows what she's doing.

 

Which planet is going to have a "John Williams" vibe to it? That's the planet I'm excited to visit... (And don't say Tatooine; that's basically William Ross.)

 

Also, Kamino had a very different sound in AOTC from Mustafar in ROTS, which had a different sound from Tatooine in ANH, etc. It's possible to make planets sound different, while still staying in the overall Star Wars musical language... 

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11 minutes ago, Tydirium said:

 

Which planet is going to have a "John Williams" vibe to it? That's the planet I'm excited to visit... (And don't say Tatooine; that's basically William Ross.)

 

Also, Kamino had a very different sound in AOTC from Mustafar in ROTS, which had a different sound from Tatooine in ANH, etc. It's possible to make planets sound different, while still staying in the overall Star Wars musical language... 

 

Joseph Shirley had the arrogance to say that Tatooine, after all the JW style classicism that graced it, now had a, well whatever you want to call the sound that was Book of Boba Fett. That somehow Tatooine's "sound" changed after ROTJ. It's nothing but an attempt at a clever excuse.

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@TydiriumI would say the music was scoring the drama of the scenes that took place on those planets, not so much the textures like Shore did for LotR. Mystery and intrigue for the creation of the Clone Army on Kamino, and pounding drum fanfares for the events that surround the duel on Mustafar. Williams'music for Tatooine was really only explored in TPM and ANH that you could say was scoring the feel of the planet.

 

 

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2 hours ago, CourtneyNeedsAW said:

You know what I find interesting about a lot of the complaints about Natalie's score? Natalie said that every planet would have its own style of music. The Tatooine material is very different from Alderaan. And Alderaan sounds very different from Daiyu. Daiyu has a very Blade Runner vibe to it, so a Vangelis/Hans Zimmer-esque score makes a lot of sense.

So all this doom and gloom over how Natalie is tearing apart Star Wars' musical legacy and ruining life as we know seem a little too dramatic for my liking. Also don't forget, Natalie said her music was "deeper rooted in Star Wars tradition than Ludwig's music for The Mandalorian" was. I think she knows what she's doing.


I believe she made a point to emphasize in the quote that the score is only a margin closer to traditional Star Wars in comparison to The Mandalorian. I can only judge off what I've heard, I'm fully happy to revise my opinion if the music significantly changes in style over the course of these next episodes but I think it would be naive to expect that

4 hours ago, artus_grayboot said:

Couple of edits I wanted to share that are cool music-wise. Both are for the second episode.

  Reveal hidden contents

 
And another one: 
 

  Reveal hidden contents

 


Thanks for sharing! I enjoyed these a lot, as well as their subtlety with what they were invoking. Particularly with that last cue if you're not super familiar with ROTS' score then I think that would work really well on a sub-conscious level, gently nudging you to be reminded of Anakin's assault on Mustafar

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I really liked that low building noise (I have no idea if it was a synth or instrument but it was REALLY GOOD) during the imperial scenes. 

I think the "tense" music was very good on the transport and when Vader was in the village.

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7 minutes ago, DIamondFire said:

I really liked that low building noise (I have no idea if it was a synth or instrument but it was REALLY GOOD) during the imperial scenes. 

I think the "tense" music was very good on the transport and when Vader was in the village.

 

Can you please just tell me how any of this sounds like Star Wars?

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On 28/05/2022 at 6:20 PM, JTWfan77 said:

If she scores Vader's entrance with the Horn of Doom I'm outahere.

 

Execute Order 66

And yet again Natalie Holt can't come up with anything slightly thematic or lyrical to carry the drama. Everything's tapestral underscore.

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Best Disney+ episode yet. Sadly it's a real shame how big of a letdown the music has been and probably will be. Not using the Imperial March is inexcusable. it's a real shame that this will probably be the worst disney+ score.

Has there been a single JW theme used besides his Obi Wan theme?

1 minute ago, Gibster said:

Best Disney+ episode yet. Sadly it's a real shame how big of a letdown the music has been and probably will be. Not using the Imperial March is inexcusable. it's a real shame that this will probably be the worst disney+ score.

Has there been a single JW theme used besides his Obi Wan theme?

the music picked up towards the end but no Imperial March ruins everything

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Lucasfilm hiring Williams was just for publicity. Other than that it seems they don't care much about setting the show musically between the trilogies. All roads lead to the Mandalorian and its soundscapes.

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34 minutes ago, Falstaft said:

This show is testing my patience, musically. 

How do you think it got to this point though, trying to do something new or just Not Caring/not knowing star wars music?

I assume it’s the ladder 

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Looks like we may not be getting a Vol 1 album this Friday, as its not up on that Disney site

 

https://www.disneymusiclicensing.com/albums?orderBy=original_release_date&orderDest=desc


Of course, the Obi-Wan single isn't listed there either, so who knows

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1 minute ago, Jay said:

Looks like we may not be getting a Vol 1 album this Friday, as its not up on that Disney site

 

https://www.disneymusiclicensing.com/albums?orderBy=original_release_date&orderDest=desc


Of course, the Obi-Wan single isn't listed there either, so who knows

 I'll wait until tomorrow round the time it's already friday in New Zealand. Most of the time there will be an album on itunes.

Either that or they'll do one big release like the last Disney+ show: Moon Knight

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I watched episode 2 last night.  Score-wise, what a difference from episode 1!


This time I noticed a lot of Holt's score throughout, and really liked a lot of what I heard!  Definitely looking forward to hearing the album now.

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5 hours ago, JNHFan2000 said:

I thought I heard the stormtrooper motif in a variation somewhere in the episode on low brass. But the credits said nothing off it. But to me it really sounded like it


That’s the thing that made me laugh really hard, we don’t get any continuity with one of the most iconic themes of all time but we  get continuity with the incredibly niche Imperial motif from A New Hope

 

I like the Imperial motif quite a bit for the record, I just found it hilarious that of all the themes that’s the one that came back

1 hour ago, Gibster said:

such a joke that they use all of this stuff in the promos yet run from them in the show

I think this is one of those rare and ironic cases that I wish the actual score sounded more like the promotional music

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6 minutes ago, Tydirium said:

 

Don't think so. There's a theme that sounds a bit similar to the ANH stormtrooper theme... but remember, Holt said she composed her own stormtrooper theme. So, it's not that.

 

It's really sad when you think of all the themes that one could reasonably expect to be in this show, based on the characters and locations... Battle of the Heroes, Imperial March, Qui-Gon's theme, Mustafar theme, Princess Leia's theme, stormtrooper theme, Force theme. Yet not one of those has really shown up yet. I just can't believe what a wasted opportunity this is.

my thoughts exactly

I remember being able to hear this image in my head when they released this, it's a shame what they used for this.

Why are they even playing John Williams music on set?

image.jpeg

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I can appreciate Holt's soundscape so far, but do agree with everyone posting ignoring the longstanding themes is pretty much unacceptable. 

 

I kind of like how the Imperial march was relegated to a theme for just Vader in R1 and not the entire imperial army. But then again in ESB they used it pretty much every time the Imperials were on screen. But I also dont think Gia's new Imperial theme was necessary. Not sure what the solution would've been especially considering much of Gia's Williams quotes were reportedly scrapped. Maybe all of his new imperial themes used to be the imperial march but was replaced last minute with the new one

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18 hours ago, Tydirium said:

 

Which planet is going to have a "John Williams" vibe to it? That's the planet I'm excited to visit... (And don't say Tatooine; that's basically William Ross.)

 

Also, Kamino had a very different sound in AOTC from Mustafar in ROTS, which had a different sound from Tatooine in ANH, etc. It's possible to make planets sound different, while still staying in the overall Star Wars musical language... 

John Williams is John Williams. Unless he's doing a source cue, all of Williams' cues are gonna have Williams DNA. Natalie has her own voice and is doing the same thing, she's just connecting her musical styles with each other. Judging by the music in the baby duel in Episode 3, the music during the real fight between Obi-Wan and Vader is most likely gonna go all John Williams with it.

Just like how Ludwig built up to using Binary Sunset in the Season 2 finale of The Mandalorian. Patience is key. The progression is moving.

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