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Since 1990, has John Williams ever scored a bad movie, and how did his score impact the film?


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2 hours ago, Brundlefly said:

Why Amistad? It is one of Spielberg's best, despite his usual stylistic exaggeration. Take Rosewood instead, that was a clichéd and racist garbage...

" racist"?!😡

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5 hours ago, Brundlefly said:

Why Amistad? It is one of Spielberg's best, despite his usual stylistic exaggeration. Take Rosewood instead, that was a clichéd and racist garbage movie. Besides I don't think that The Patriot lives up to the promise of its title and director (which is of course a good thing).

 

When Amistad is good, it's brilliant, when it's bad, it's really bad (JW sadly contributes more than his share to this, imho). Not more to be said. 

 

The Patriot, for the uninitiated, was one of those movies that heralded a new era (in retrospect it's already a very Trump-ian movie), posing as classic 'quality' film making, but being no more than a shallow historical comic book full of reductive characterizations.

 

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On 21/05/2022 at 1:21 PM, publicist said:

 

I saw that but don't remember anything about it. Though i like Williams' modal, Vaughan-Williams-tinged score on it's own, i felt he completely missed the point and atmosphere of the story. Seen through the eyes of a child, which is what AA is all about, being all adagio and elegiac just doesn't cut it. The choice of the piano as lead solo for a story about the poor, an instrument culturally attached to the higher social strata and elegant drawing rooms, confirms a certain detachment on JW's part.

I was thinking about that when listening to it last month.  I think the jauntier pizzicato and "The Lanes of Limerick" sections better capture the slightly comic tone of the book 

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On 21/05/2022 at 11:46 PM, Groovygoth666 said:

I like the score for Sleepers just fine, hhhmm maybe it's not so much the film isn't able to live up to the score, but as you said Williams was a wrong fit for it.

 

What would your list look like?

Of the JW scored films I've seen that are post 1990, and all Star Wars films aside, I would name:

 

Sabrina - I think the romance doesn't feel authentic. The two leads just don't work for me. I like JW's score for the film although I don't listen to any of it aside from the main theme.

 

 

Stepmom - the story is compelling but there are some real cliche moments and a lot of the child acting is rough. Another solid score from JW.

 

The Patriot - frankly the film is insulting in many ways both historical and in terms of characterization. A score with very good moments. Some period-tinged, full blast JW Americana is always fun.

 

Maybe the 2nd Harry Potter movie and definitely the 4th Indiana Jones movie. I love JW's new themes for the 2nd HP movie. I don't love anything about IJ4, and that includes JW's score.

 

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The Phantom Menace was the biggest letdown in motion picture history, and yet even that film is better than Attack of the Clones, a film where Lucas learned nothing from his mistakes from The Phantom Menace, and makes Anakin unlikable and unsympathetic 2 films into the trilogy. Even the score reuses exact cues from Phantom Menace alot.

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2 hours ago, Ian Stouffer said:

Even the score reuses exact cues from Phantom Menace alot.

 

*Flashback to the Schafrillas/Sideways video where they bashed/expressed their disappointment in the score for TPM, and then turned around and praised the climax of the AotC score, while showing clips of tracked music from TPM*

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Episodes II & III are now more digestible, when you accept that it needed 7 seasons of Clone Wars between them to finally be able to understand a thing about this story.

 

Now TPM still needs some background explanations... I think Lucasfilm will adress the issue in the next years. Showing Anakin too young in Episode I was perhaps a mistake, but a calculated one. TPM was meant to introduce Obi-Wan and the duel that sealed his fate.

 

Now, talking about the music... I never had any problems with the scores of John Williams for the prequels... apart that we desperatly need them to be expanded...

 

I SAY PATIENCE.

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17 minutes ago, Bespin said:

when you accept that it needed 7 seasons of Clone Wars between them to finally be able to understand a thing about this story

Filler episode on top of filler episode on top of filler story arc on top of filler story arc? It doesn't help at all. Most CW does is make whiny Hayden Anakin even more insufferable when you see how much better he could have been.

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Anyway, that's a thread to talk about "ordinary" movies and the impact of JW's music about the way they are now remembered.

 

The Star Wars movies were mentioned in error here.

 

Let’s keep moving forward!

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On 24/05/2022 at 6:51 AM, artguy360 said:

Of the JW scored films I've seen that are post 1990, and all Star Wars films aside, I would name:

 

Sabrina - I think the romance doesn't feel authentic. The two leads just don't work for me. I like JW's score for the film although I don't listen to any of it aside from the main theme.

 

 

Stepmom - the story is compelling but there are some real cliche moments and a lot of the child acting is rough. Another solid score from JW.

 

The Patriot - frankly the film is insulting in many ways both historical and in terms of characterization. A score with very good moments. Some period-tinged, full blast JW Americana is always fun.

 

Maybe the 2nd Harry Potter movie and definitely the 4th Indiana Jones movie. I love JW's new themes for the 2nd HP movie. I don't love anything about IJ4, and that includes JW's score.

 

Interesting that you'd include COS as a bad movie, any particular reasons?

 

IJ4 is definitely not a good movie, Spielberg tried really hard while promoting it to say that it was meant to be more reflective of B-movies of the 50's, but that didn't translate to the screen. For me the best part of the film is Williams score even if it feels like he's on autopilot for a lot of it. Overall I'd say the film's biggest problem is that the creatives behind it were making the film out of obligation rather than actual inspiration to tell a story. I like the new theme's Williams wrote, and there's fun stuff throughout the score, but it just doesn't feel as inspired as the first three.

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CoS is not a good movie, and frequently dips into “bad” territory. Overly-long, with anaemic pacing, an unimaginative script adapted from Rowling’s weakest novel, laughably bad acting (even from the adults), decidedly un-cinematic direction, and unconvincing CGI even for its time… The only reason I’d watch it now is for the score, and even that’s weak compared to JW’s other Potter scores, but worst of all it’s barely audible in the mix.

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