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What are your non-Williams film score holy grails now?


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On 24/06/2022 at 12:23 AM, Holko said:

Spider-Man

 

On 24/06/2022 at 7:48 AM, crocodile said:

Spider-Man

 

On 24/06/2022 at 12:01 PM, DemonStar said:

Spider-Man

 

On 24/06/2022 at 12:52 PM, Anthony said:

Spider-Man - Danny Elfman

 

Fulfilled!

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Haha, and now that I checked it out I decided against buying it! However, looking back at that post...

On 24/06/2022 at 6:23 AM, Holko said:

Occhio Alla Penna

Hell yeah! Even if I had to remaster it a bit myself and grab a better source for one of the tracks.

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  • 4 months later...

Any reactions after listening? I was shocked at how much better it sounded than the Varese Deluxe Edition, especially since I already thought that album sounded quite good! But I guess that's what happens when you go back to the original analogue masters rather than an old DAT.

 

Yavar

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Just now, Yavar Moradi said:

Any reactions after listening? I was shocked at how much better it sounded than the Varese Deluxe Edition, especially since I already thought that album sounded quite good! But I guess that's what happens when you go back to the original analogue masters rather than an old DAT.

 

Yavar

 

Night and day difference. Like you, I didn't even suspect the score could sound this good. Makes me glad I had never pulled the trigger and spent quite a bit of money of the Varese edition

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  • 6 months later...
On 23/06/2022 at 5:37 PM, Edmilson said:

Mask of Zorro and Legend of Zorro (Horner)

 

On 24/06/2022 at 4:17 AM, publicist said:

Horner: all the Zorro's

 

On 24/06/2022 at 7:48 AM, crocodile said:

The Mask of Zorro

 

On 24/06/2022 at 12:52 PM, Anthony said:

The Mask Of Zorro - James Horner

 

Fulfilled!

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On 17/11/2022 at 8:59 AM, Thor said:

There is so much to listen to in my current collection, so much new stuff to sample, so much old stuff to explore and so on, that my desire for any particular archival title isn't that great. But it would have to be something completely unreleased, of course, I have zero interest in expansions. And within that, anything completely unreleased by Williams, Elfman and Goldenthal, all of whom I am a completist.

 

Beyond that, not that much. Maybe Faltermeyer's TOP GUN, but for the moment I'm pleased with an excellent-sounding boot of that; will work fine temporarily. I'm kinda surprised they didn't use MAVERICK as an opportunity to release it, but I know that LLL has tried and run into all kinds of hurdles. Hopefully some day.

 

To expound a little upon my post from last year.

 

1. I'd like anything completely unrelesed by Williams. List here.

2. I'd like anything completely unreleased by Elfman. List here.

3. I'd like anything completely unreleased by Goldenthal. List here.

4. Harold Faltermeyer's TOP GUN and FLETCH. I have a great-sounding boot for TOP GUN, beautifully curated. So a replication of that, commercially released, would be fantastic.

5. Jean Michel Jarre's QUI VEUT DEVENIR UNE STAR? (2002) -- his second out of only two scores he did

6. Pink Floyd's THE COMMITEE (1968). Also David Gilmour's RUBY TAKES A TRIP (1991).

7. A number of completely unreleased Norwegian scores that none of you have heard of, like Bøhren & Åserud's SOLENS SØNN OG MÅNENS DATTER and PLASTPOSEN

8. Giorgio Moroder's IMPRESSIONEN UNTER WASSER (2002)

9. A great number of Vangelis scores, including MISSING, BITTER MOON, the Cousteau documentaries, a number of the Rossif documentaries etc. etc.

10. Other bits and bobs, many of them 80s synth scores by people like Sylvester Levay and Tim Truman. A proper, remastered edition of Tangerine Dream's THE KEEP. Etc.

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I have a few grails left:

 

Never had a score album

  • Digimon: The Movie. They released a songs album, and Udi Harpaz posted 50 tracks from the score on his SoundCloud, but it's not everything (the last third of the film has only one cue representing it on Harpaz's posting) and it's not HQ either. With the movie being re-released alongside new, uncut versions of its constituent films, now would actually be a good time for it.
  • Spider-Man 3. Hopefully Elfman's now in a good enough place to allow this, if the rumours he was blocking the original score album are true.

Has an official soundtrack but no expanded release

  • Terminator 2: Judgment Day.
  • Spider-Man: No Way Home.
  • Spider-Man 2.
  • Godzilla: King Of The Monsters.
  • Jurassic World Fallen Kingdom.

Has an official expanded release, but could be improved upon

  • Star Trek 2009. It doesn't contain everything the film has, misses out the choir and alternatvie recordings.
  • Star Trek Into Darkness. Pretty much for the same reasons as the 2009 film.
  • The Lion King 1994. Probably never going to happen, but a better, less-clipped release would be welcome, at least. There's also the matter of a few officially-unreleased alternatives (one in the film, two on the bootleg that we know of for sure).
  • The Matrix Reloaded. The original expansion is really nice, and I get that there were issues licensing Komit and Dread Rock (I get the former, but didn't Oakenfold write Dread Rock specifically for the official soundtrack?) But that doesn't mean they couldn't have gotten a few of those missing alternates in there. Heck, I'd take a Komit-less version of the film version of Free Flight.
  • The Matrix Revolutions. Pretty much for the same reasons as Reloaded: missing alternates used in the film.
  • The Terminator. The last release fixes quite a lot of the issues with the 'Definite' version but it was not complete, and even between the two releases you don't get everything.
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3 minutes ago, Giftheck said:
  • The Matrix Reloaded. The original expansion is really nice, and I get that there were issues licensing Komit and Dread Rock (I get the former, but didn't Oakenfold write Dread Rock specifically for the official soundtrack?) But that doesn't mean they couldn't have gotten a few of those missing alternates in there. Heck, I'd take a Komit-less version of the film version of Free Flight.
  • The Matrix Revolutions. Pretty much for the same reasons as Reloaded: missing alternates used in the film.
  •  

Really? The 2013 LLL Reloaded and Revolutions are not complete? :(

 

I like those albums so much...

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7 hours ago, Thor said:

 

To expound a little upon my post from last year.

 

1. I'd like anything completely unrelesed by Williams. List here.

2. I'd like anything completely unreleased by Elfman. List here.

3. I'd like anything completely unreleased by Goldenthal. List here.

4. Harold Faltermeyer's TOP GUN and FLETCH. I have a great-sounding boot for TOP GUN, beautifully curated. So a replication of that, commercially released, would be fantastic.

5. Jean Michel Jarre's QUI VEUT DEVENIR UNE STAR? (2002) -- his second out of only two scores he did

6. Pink Floyd's THE COMMITEE (1968). Also David Gilmour's RUBY TAKES A TRIP (1991).

7. A number of completely unreleased Norwegian scores that none of you have heard of, like Bøhren & Åserud's SOLENS SØNN OG MÅNENS DATTER and PLASTPOSEN

8. Giorgio Moroder's IMPRESSIONEN UNTER WASSER (2002)

9. A great number of Vangelis scores, including MISSING, BITTER MOON, the Cousteau documentaries, a number of the Rossif documentaries etc. etc.

10. Other bits and bobs, many of them 80s synth scores by people like Sylvester Levay, Tim Truman etc.

I think Faltermeyer may be the only composer for whom I agree with you about curated releases, haha

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17 hours ago, crocodile said:

Is Trinity vs Car not simply a case of tracking?

 

Karol

 

Is it? I'm not sure where that different section would have come from. It's not one I recognise as being from one of the released cues, in any case.

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20 hours ago, Giftheck said:

 

  • Given Dread Rock was apparently written for the original soundtrack, I can't fathom what those issues would be

 $$$$$$.  It’s a track from an artist who has their own songwriting publishing and probably was under contract to a record label at the time.  They could of course license any track from the soundtrack, but it would cost too much money - drive it up past the $30 price point and make it sell worse.

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On 24/11/2023 at 5:48 AM, filmmusic said:

The one I could think of now, that would be a holy grail for me, is Jarre's Jesus of Nazareth complete.

 

YES! The score is fantastic; the series speaks for itself.

A c&c THE FINAL CONFLICT would be nice, but my non-JW holy grail will always be BRAINSTORM.

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1 hour ago, mstrox said:

 $$$$$$.  It’s a track from an artist who has their own songwriting publishing and probably was under contract to a record label at the time.  They could of course license any track from the soundtrack, but it would cost too much money - drive it up past the $30 price point and make it sell worse.

 

I'd be a bit surprised in that case that the artist wouldn't give the speciality label a break. If they made it for the film and they understood the target market of few thousand, instead of tens/hundreds of millions of copies, you'd think they'd do what the AFM does occasionally and do a special arrangement.

 

Of course, it's time and effort for the labels to contact and talk to a normal artist. I fully understand that they want to put their attention elsewhere.

 

---

 

I do like this thread as a way to reflect on the year. I've barely bought anything actually, but had a few other interesting things emerge.

 

My top two grails are unchanged:

 

#1: JP/// - for those less enthused, and wondering why some of us keep banging on about it, the OST is arranged to a Williams level of unneededness, misses a third of the score, and the promo is full of alternates and sounds like crap.

#2: Gladiator - only second place because a leak way back contains probably everything there is, just in suboptimal noughties era 192k mp3. Just needs a proper mastering and any other bonus stuff there is.

 

Everything else I'd like is just sort of nice to have really. I won't lie though - a ton of stuff is out in sessions where I wanted just two or three cues that weren't on the OST. I'm really not that bothered about official versions of those.

 

Plus on the flip side, I was very happy to come across leaks of Bishara's The Conjuring 1 and 2. Mark Isham did some cues for the first score, most of which were unreleased. The sequel is missing nearly 30 minutes of music. Thankfully I came across perfect sounding sessions from both. No one's ever going to bother expanding stuff like this.

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Glad I can finally cross a new one

 

Premiere Releases

  • Community by Ludwig Göransson (everything written for the show)
  • Batman & Robin by Elliot Goldenthal

 

Expansions

  • An American Tail: Fievel Goes West by James Horner
  • Avatar by James Horner
  • Brainstorm by James Horner
  • Deep Impact by James Horner
  • Enemy at the Gates by James Horner
  • Sneakers by James Horner:woop:
  • The Amazing Spider-Man by James Horner
  • The Perfect Storm by James Horner
  • Willow by James Horner  :woop:
  • The Orville Season 1, 2 & 3 (complete) by Bruce Broughton, Joel McNeely, Andrew Cottee, Kevin Kaska
  • Brazil by Michael Kamen
  • Sphere by Elliot Goldenthal
  • Mission Impossible: Rogue Nation by Joe Kraemer
  • Top Gun by Harold Faltermeyer

 

Reissues

  • Starship Troopers by Basil Poledouris
  • Patriot Games by James Horner:woop:
  • Clear and Present Danger by James Horner:woop:
  • Capricorn One by Jerry Goldsmith
  • King Solomon's Mines by Jerry Goldsmith
  • The Edge by Jerry Goldsmith
  • Batman Forever by Elliot Goldenthal
  • The Abyss by Alan Silvestri
  • Back to the Future part. III by Alan Silvestri
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  • 2 weeks later...

Mine's are Howard Shore's LotR's - everything he recorded for the films (used/unused), properly mixed (i.e. no pushing the choir all the way back, no pushing some instruments way to the front), meticulously mastered (not brickwalled), without any kind of edits, cross-fades, etc. I do appreciate the CR releases but I am more than certain that they can be done better.

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I wonder if the Complete Recordings didn't exist we already would have "proper" versions of the LOTR scores done by Matessino and released by LLL or other label, like the JW HP scores (which are also Warner Bros movies).

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  • 3 months later...

Certainly is! If I were a rich man (tadadada). But $50 (incl. shipping) was far too much for me. Besides, the autographed copies vanished before I could blink. Hopefully, there will be a future where I have the cash and I can acquire it, autograph or no autograph. I do have a Faltermeyer-autographed TANGO & CASH; that's some comfort.

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I'm starting to wonder if I have any. Buckaroo Banzai is still on my list. Oh! The Rankin / Bass Hobbit!

 

I'm thinking what else is there where I used to make tapes of the film itself just to hear the music. (Looking at you, Helicopter Sequence from Superman.)

 

A re-release of Innerspace would be nice just because I missed it.

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3 minutes ago, Naïve Old Fart said:

Hold on, I'll have a wee think.

 

 

Yep, still BRAINSTORM :D

 

I love Brainstorm but I don't know what I'm missing.

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It's been years since the discussion with the post-Townson Varese guys about aborted releases, and a desire to see some titles out. Must be something about Brainstorm that is really complex (or makes it not possible at all) given how many titles have flown out since 2020 or so.

 

And of course, I'm not letting a 'grail' thread be without my routine whine about JP /// :P 

 

On 04/12/2023 at 5:37 PM, Drawgoon said:

Mine's are Howard Shore's LotR's - everything he recorded for the films (used/unused), properly mixed (i.e. no pushing the choir all the way back, no pushing some instruments way to the front), meticulously mastered (not brickwalled), without any kind of edits, cross-fades, etc. I do appreciate the CR releases but I am more than certain that they can be done better.

 

I think FotR is the only one that needs a ground-up rebuild from the sessions, including major alternates and theatrical versions where appropriate - something that would rival the Hook set without breaking a sweat. Although I don't think we need literally everything recorded, and this score is pretty much my #1 score.

 

TTT and RotK are assembled with a different mindset, and really the only issue I have with those is the lack of properly released alternates and theatricals.

 

Hopefully Shore isn't in a mindset where he feels the CRs are enough and he's moved on.

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13 minutes ago, Edmilson said:

A lot

 

I thought the original album was generally complete? I haven't seen the film in almost 40 years.

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2 hours ago, Tallguy said:

 

I thought the original album was generally complete? I haven't seen the film in almost 40 years.


The original album was not the film recording, which is quite different and 100% unreleased. (See also: Miklos Rozsa’s Eye of the Needle, also strangely controlled in perpetuity by Varese just because of their album recording.)

 

Yavar

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Is there something specific about Brainstorm that would cause Townson to kibosh an expansion in the first place? Like, is it considered to be a lesser score in Horner's ouvre or a more experimental one? It's clear that he felt a number of scores weren't of a calibre to be released on his precious label, but why this score?

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13 hours ago, Richard Penna said:

It's been years since the discussion with the post-Townson Varese guys about aborted releases, and a desire to see some titles out. Must be something about Brainstorm that is really complex (or makes it not possible at all) given how many titles have flown out since 2020 or so.

 

And of course, I'm not letting a 'grail' thread be without my routine whine about JP /// :P 

 

 

I think FotR is the only one that needs a ground-up rebuild from the sessions, including major alternates and theatrical versions where appropriate - something that would rival the Hook set without breaking a sweat. Although I don't think we need literally everything recorded, and this score is pretty much my #1 score.

 

TTT and RotK are assembled with a different mindset, and really the only issue I have with those is the lack of properly released alternates and theatricals.

 

Hopefully Shore isn't in a mindset where he feels the CRs are enough and he's moved on.

TTT is missing a theme statement from a EE cue, and ROTK is missing an unused cue for Aragorn and Legolas outside Edora prior to The Palantir

 

There also some cues on the CR presented with solos dialed out leaving just non-melodic material behind, namely Fellowship Reunited (fiddle on the OST and Symphony, whistle heard in the Use Well the Days Documentary), Stairs of Cirith Ungol, and Battle of the Pelennor Fields

 

The full version of Frodo's Song under the Rarities interview, that only can be reconstructed from the CR, Rarities, and Use Well the Days doc.

On 07/03/2024 at 4:27 PM, Tallguy said:

I'm starting to wonder if I have any. Buckaroo Banzai is still on my list. Oh! The Rankin / Bass Hobbit!

 

I

R/B ROTK!!

 

Geoffrey Burgon's Narnia scores.

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13 hours ago, Richard Penna said:

Is there something specific about Brainstorm that would cause Townson to kibosh an expansion in the first place? Like, is it considered to be a lesser score in Horner's ouvre or a more experimental one? It's clear that he felt a number of scores weren't of a calibre to be released on his precious label, but why this score?

I mean, Horner produced a dedicated album recording with the London Symphony Orchestra of this score. So, I would guess, this might be a precious work in his eyes. For me it is an essential Horner. But I missed the album. 

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6 hours ago, Faleel said:

Geoffrey Burgon's Narnia scores.

 

Damn good choice!

 

 

 

5 minutes ago, GerateWohl said:

I mean, Horner produced a dedicated album recording with the London Symphony Orchestra of this score. So, I would guess, this might be a precious work in his eyes. For me it is an essential Horner. But I missed the album. 

 

Even though the recording is almost 41 years old (!), it still sounds as fresh as a daisy.

I don't know if recording it direct to 2-track was intentional, or not, but it sure helped.

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4 hours ago, Naïve Old Fart said:

 

Even though the recording is almost 41 years old (!), it still sounds as fresh as a daisy.

I don't know if recording it direct to 2-track was intentional, or not, but it sure helped.

 

This is why it's not a grail for me. But then, I didn't realize how much I wanted a complete Field of Dreams either.

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The High And the Mighty (Tiomkin)

 

To Kill A Mockingbird (Bernstein)

 

The Old Man And The Sea (Tiomkin)

 

Whatever Goldsmith and Horner scores are left

 

The remaining Bond scores

 

Any Giacchino scores

 

There have aleady been 2 releases but if anymore of Carl Stalling's Looney Tunes works are salvageable.

 

Psycho (original tracks)

 

Cape Fear - ditto

 

Torn Curtain - ditto

 

One of our Dinosaurs is Missing - Goodwin

 

Sphere

 

Batman & Robin

 

A Shot In The Dark - Mancini

 

The Pink Panther - Mancini

 

Return of the Pink Panther - Mancini

 

Howard Shore's King Kong

 

The Postman - JNH

 

Dinosaur - JNH

 

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On 21/11/2022 at 9:38 AM, ThePenitentMan1 said:

-Premieres:

Herbie Goes To Monte Carlo (1977) [Frank De Vol] (It probably goes without saying that if Disney does this one, the other Herbie movies will be done, too, but it's mainly this one that I consider a grail.)

Cubix: Robots For Everyone (2001-2003) [John Loeffler/Rave Music]

 

-Premiere Expansions:

Pokemon: The First Movie (1999) [John Loeffler/Rave Music]

 

-Revisited Expansions:

Secret Of NIMH (1982) [Goldsmith] (Either from recovered elements or as a full re-recording)

 

I'll go ahead and go into a little more detail about what is, without a doubt, the most obscure of my grails.

 

The original Korean episodes of Cubix used lots of different music from various places (I don't actually know for sure how much of it was original, aside from a clip here and there taken from Broughton's Lost In Space), but the 4Kids dub uses entirely original music by Rave Music, led by John Siegler and John Loeffler.

 

Those who grew up with Kids WB in the early 2000s, or had the promotional VHS tape from Burger King, will probably remember this show to at least some extent, and those who watched it via the 4Kids dub will definitely remember Cubix's heroic theme, which plays most prominently in his many transformation sequences:

 

 

The variation at 1:00, most likely a general variation not written for any specific scene, saw quite a bit of use in the show—a little too much, perhaps; it's used three times in the first season examples in this video alone, and the second season uses it even more—but the first season had so many more unique variations on the theme that it still manages to stay interesting.

 

I really like the variations at 0:18 (from S1E02 Electrix) and 3:03 (From S1E07 Hurricane Havoc).  And the variation at 4:32-4:49, from S1E11 Office Politix, is just so perfectly bittersweet as it scores Cubix, covered in mini-robots that are about to blow him up, transforms and flies away so his friends don't get caught in the blast. (He gets better later, as you can see at 5:00)

 

But it's not just the transformation music, this show has a good deal of other great musical highlights, too!

 

For instance, the opening teaser (0:00-0:58) and entire climax of The Underground Of Bubbletown (18:12-21:25):

 

Oh, and 15:15-15:59, too!  Actually, nearly everything in the last half of this episode is a musical highlight!

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Here's a very unlikely grail: Aquaman by Rupert Gregson-Williams.

 

I really enjoy the movie and wish I could dive in (no pun intended) in the score, which I'm sure plays much better in complete and chronological form than in its horrible OST. The sessions haven't leaked (unlike RGW's Wonder Woman) and the only evidence of its existence is its page on the HZ fansite, but it hasn't appeared anywhere in the internet. And since it was recorded in LA in 2018 an expansion seems rather unlikely... Still, I hope to listen to the complete score + the suites one day.

 

Another one that hasn't surfaced yet is Zimmer's Dunkirk. I have a weird relationship with this score, it's not exactly the kind of music I like to hear and it can be credited as being one of the creators of the "wall of music" style of score that Nolan and Villeneuve LOVE, but still I do wish to listen to the complete score as it was recorded to compare with the movie. The (awful) OST only has parts of the score and I'd like to get to know it in complete form. We don't even have the cue and reel/part numbers (as far as I know) yet. 

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