95th Academy Awards (2023 ceremony for 2022 films)

[Naïve Old Fart 9,488]

Whatever you say about EEAAO (I'm afraid that I cannot comment on the film, as I have not seen it), it makes a change from all those "serious" films, that have won, over the last 20 or so years.

You know the ones I mean: paraplegic boxers; nervous kings; domestic horror stories; the abuse of children, or some other general stuff about a po', black, fat, disabled lesbian, trying to put her  daughter through college.

At least EEAAO is a comedy (apparently).

[Sweeping Strings 2,342]

I haven't seen it either. The title just makes it sound like an exhausting viewing experience for anyone over 25 or so. 

[Edmilson 7,367]

Are Michelle Yeoh and Ke Huy Quan the first performers who do martial arts in the roles they were awarded? I don't remember other martial artists winning an Oscar for a role where they needed to show their fighting talent.

[mrbellamy 6,270]

You know, the Harrison Ford and Ke Huy Quan lovefest reminds me that not only were Steven Spielberg and John Williams also in that room, but Kate Capshaw as well! I hope someone thought to get her in on a photo op...

 

Here's one at least

 

[Richard Penna 3,664]

I started EEAAO with some skepticism, but I ended up rather liking it. Certainly, by the last 20 minutes or so you're either going to not really know what's going on with the 'bagel' and it just comes across as a mother and daughter reconciling, or you 'get it' and I found it rather emotional.

 

I definitely understand, and mostly support its winning best picture/director, along with the acting winners. It does come together astonishingly well for a 2 1/2 hour film, and the editing mostly comes together.

 

The music definitely deserved to win more than Alll Quiet... that was just ridiculous.

[JNHFan2000 2,938]

I'm actually quite happy about the results.

 

I'm a major fan of EEAAO, so I couldn't be happier.

 

There were 3 awards I wasn't fully happy with.

Animated Feature: I love Pinocchio, but I loved Puss In Boots more.

Supporting Actress: Same thing. I thought Curtis deserved it very much. But Bassett was better in her film.

Score: Why? Seriously. Awful choice

[Tallguy 3,359]

7 hours ago, Manakin Skywalker said:

 

Pirates of the Caribbean?

 

EDIT: Milliseconds too late 

 

Heh. How often do they play music from Best Score winners? When they aren't a) by John Williams or b) over 60 years old?

 

I do not have a "woke" bone in my body (erm, ok, go with it) and Everything, Everywhere, All at Once was monumentally deserving of the love it got. Especially the two supporting actors. And, hell, best actress.

 

A sci-fi, multi-dimensional, martial arts movie just won best picture. And not grudgingly like Return of the "Hell, we can't believe you actually made these movies" King.

 

There was nothing about these particular awards that was in any way "token". I'm sure for a lot of academy members they were happy that their interests coincided this year, sure. If it was for EEAAO I would have been outraged that Top Gun: Maverick didn't win.

 

I suppose I need to go listen to All Quiet. Because I did something wrong in a past life?

[Thor 7,451]

43 minutes ago, mrbellamy said:

You know, the Harrison Ford and Ke Huy Quan lovefest reminds me that not only were Steven Spielberg and John Williams also in that room, but Kate Capshaw as well! I hope someone thought to get her in on a photo op...

 

Here's one at least

 

 

Is that Guillermo del Toro taking the picture?

[Naïve Old Fart 9,488]

Some eejit at the BBC said that Yeoh was the first Asian woman to play the lead in a Western-made film.

Has the stupid man forgotten that she was the female lead, in TOMORROW NEVER DIES?!

[Richard Penna 3,664]

3 hours ago, Thor said:

I hated EVERYTHING EVERYWHERE ALL AT ONCE. One of the worst movies last year, not for the representation bit, but its sheer aggravating style. And I'm so friggin' tired of woke penetrating....well, everything and everywhere all at once. As for the score award, I'm not surprised JW didn't win. Sad, of course, because it was the only worthwhile score among the nominees, but that's just how it is these days.

 

I really liked the film, but I realise is style is rather polarising. It's very in your face during some of the later bits. One bit should probably come with a health warning given the speed at which the shots were changing. I can imagine many laughs in a cinema during the 'rocks' scene.

 

I came to rather like the score surprisingly, once you get used to the style they went for. Detractors (i.e, orchestral purists) don't even look at the album - it's only about 20 mins shorter than the film, which means it's probably complete, or close to.

 

Not sure what you mean by 'woke penetrating' though. I assume you mean something further than just asian actors comprising most of the primary cast?

[King Mark 3,624]

1 hour ago, Tallguy said:

There was nothing about these particular awards that was in any way "token". I'm sure for a lot of academy members they were happy that their interests coincided this year, sure.

 In the end I think it's what happened. A somewhat good movie the general public liked that happened to have  an "underrepresented" cast . Perfect for them to make it less obvious than voting for Tar, the woman lesbian conductor movie.

 

Even more perfect for them is they could split their vote with All Quiet in separate categories, even for it's lack of representation (all white hetero male cast), to show their anti-war activism.

 

2 birds with 1 stone.

[Richard Penna 3,664]

9 minutes ago, King Mark said:

 In the end I think it's what happened. A somewhat good movie the general public liked that happened to have  an "underrepresented" cast .

 

Fresh from having watched it just over 12 hours ago, I feel confident that if they had made it with an all-white cast it would have zero creative impact. The basic creative premise of the film was ambitious and carried an oscar friendly message.

 

I think Tallguy is right that they just happened to make it with a primarily asian central cast, and for some voters no doubt, perhaps solidified that they were making the right choice.

[King Mark 3,624]

well yes that's what I'm trying to say 

[Tallguy 3,359]

10 minutes ago, King Mark said:

 In the end I think it's what happened. A somewhat good movie the general public liked that happened to have  an "underrepresented" cast . Perfect for them to make it less obvious than voting for Tar, the woman lesbian conductor movie.

 

I know it's a matter of taste (which is what awards are) but the "it's what happened" that I described included the fact that it was a genuine best picture.

 

13 minutes ago, Richard Penna said:

I can imagine many laughs in a cinema during the 'rocks' scene.

 

The rocks are what made it best picture for me. Seriously. it was a bonkers original idea, it was hilarious, AND it was heartbreakingly moving. It was my favorite part of a movie not just this year, but in many years.

 

I don't know if this was mentioned anywhere but for me Ke Huy Quan won the Oscar in the scene where he and Michelle Yeoh are in the alley in one of the alternates and he just becomes a freaking movie star! Playing against type not only against himself but against the rest of the film.

 

1 minute ago, Richard Penna said:

Fresh from having watched it just over 12 hours ago, I feel confident that if they had made it with an all-white cast it would have zero creative impact. The basic creative premise of the film was ambitious and carried an oscar friendly message.

 

This.

[King Mark 3,624]

It it was an all white cast the movie might have had the same impact and message (if I read correctly that's what you guys mean) , but the usual "politically correct" choice like Tar or Women Talking would have won by default instead.  They've conditioned me to think this way over the past few years.

 

Like in  the late 70's  and 80's the "quirky Woody Allen comedies" and serious dramas would automatically win over now iconic films like Jaws, Star Wars, Raiders...

 

So actually, the choices for best picture have almost never coincided with what I consider a great movie all of my life. 

[Loert 2,509]

So, none of the films I was rooting for won anything. Great

 

I didn't like EEAAO at all (fascinating how a single movie can be so polarising), but I think Ke Huy Quan and Michelle Yeoh fully deserved their wins. Those were not easy roles to pull off.

 

And All Quiet for best original score?...Those Three Notes reminded me in terms of effect of Fiedel's Terminator motif (dun dun dun dun), but it just didn't work as well for me.

 

Oh well. Until next year.

 

11 hours ago, Edmilson said:

I wonder what John Williams thought of it.

 

Here is recorded footage of his reaction:

 

[Yavar Moradi 2,576]

Apparently it’s that time again, to remind folks what “woke” actually means…

 

 

 

[King Mark 3,624]

Yes, that's the original definition of the term that some people will shove in your face as an attempt to expose your bigotry or racism if your use the term in a more derogatory way, but it's evolved and that's not what it means to most people now.

[Tydirium 1,166]

6 minutes ago, Yavar Moradi said:

Apparently it’s that time again, to remind folks what “woke” actually means…

 

 

 

 

It's more nuanced than that, and you know it. There are plenty of people who are "conscious of racial discrimination in society and other forms of oppression and injustice" yet do not identify with the word "woke." It's a loaded term at this point. Urban Dictionary would be more helpful.

[Tallguy 3,359]

17 minutes ago, Yavar Moradi said:

Apparently it’s that time again, to remind folks what “woke” actually means…

 

 

 

 

Except I've literally read people saying Star Trek Picard is a step backward because it's being written by and starring white men. It's not just "conscious". There is often a very active or us vs. them component.

 

Does anyone actually use the term seriously or genuinely? Or is it only used in a derisive, backlash kind of meaning? It went south fast.

[Yavar Moradi 2,576]

So we are actually just okay with letting Fox News hijack the literal dictionary definition of words (which have had that definition for DECADES) and totally pervert and corrupt their meaning for *everyone* in the course of just a few years?

 

 

The only reason someone is okay with THAT is because they share an agenda THERE.

[King Mark 3,624]

Even freaking CNN talked about this recently and agrees the term means something different now.  Bill Maher also uses the term in a derogatory way pretty much all the time and as far as I know he's not a Fox News commentator.

[Loert 2,509]

I mean, "woke" has been the past simple of "to wake" for longer than that. If we can let one group of people "hijack" a word's meaning then we can let others "hijack" it too.

 

(Btw I don't think EEAAO had anything "woke" about it, seems clear to me that that wasn't its driving force)

[Glóin the Dark 1,218]

9 hours ago, Edmilson said:

Yeah, for the most part the movie that actually wins the award is not the best of the year: 

 

My assessment of whether each winner was the best of its year would be something like:

• 2000: Gladiator - not remotely
• 2001: A Beautiful Mind - not remotely
• 2002: Chicago - not remotely
• 2003: The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King - possibly
• 2004: Million Dollar Baby - not remotely
• 2005: Crash - haven't seen it
• 2006: The Departed - no
• 2007: No Country for Old Men - no
• 2008: Slumdog Millionaire - not remotely
• 2009: The Hurt Locker - not remotely
• 2010: The King's Speech - not remotely
• 2011: The Artist - haven't seen it
• 2012: Argo - not remotely
• 2013: 12 Years a Slave - no
• 2014: Birdman - not remotely
• 2015: Spotlight - not remotely
• 2016: Moonlight - no
• 2017: The Shape of Water - not remotely
• 2018: Green Book - haha!
• 2019: Parasite - no
• 2020: Nomadland - no
• 2021: CODA - hahaha!
• 2022: Everything Everywhere All at Once - not remotely

 

[Yavar Moradi 2,576]

1 hour ago, King Mark said:

Even freaking CNN talked about this recently and agrees the term means something different now

“Even freaking CNN”? They’re about as woke (in the AAVE sense of the term) as Fox News.

 

1 hour ago, Loert said:

I mean, "woke" has been the past simple of "to wake" for longer than that. If we can let one group of people "hijack" a word's meaning then we can let others "hijack" it too.

Oh good grief. One major difference is evident from even your post. “Woke” as an adjective in AAVE developed culturally over decades, sure, based on a form of the verb “to wake”. But that wasn’t a hijacking, at all. Wake = become conscious -> aware (and they quite understandably and reasonably used it in a context referring to awareness of issues relating racial prejudice/discrimination/justice).

 

Then, in just the past 5-8 years (hmmm… that timing!), American conservatives made a concerted effort to hijack the AAVE adjective and somehow turn it into a pejorative, the opposite of what it was. Gee, could that be because their own political agenda was opposed to the AAVE definition? Gotta turn wokeness into a bogeyman with everything else, until even people in other countries start using it as a pejorative. I gotta hand it to them; it’s an impressive victory in just a few years, to take away African Americans’ term.

 

If you use the “new meaning” (so new and with such partisan motivation that it still isn’t even the definition that shows up in dictionaries and Wikipedia with a simple Google search) that just reveals you’re okay with that. It wasn’t even really a new definition that conservatives provided (if it was, tell me the definition and point to someone providing it); it was just making people afraid of the AAVE term; that was their literal point of departure, like they were unironically inspired by 1984.

 

Yavar

[Jay 37,249]

Yea political talk isn't allowed on JWFan guys, you all know this

[Yavar Moradi 2,576]

Just for the record, anyone using “woke” as a pejorative (particularly if it’s relating to literally only the second woman of color to win Best Actress in the entire history of the Oscars, lol) is engaging in “political talk”.

 

Yavar

[King Mark 3,624]

yeah whatever, but as soon as you say "second woman of color" it means woke and I'm also comfortable using the term as I currently understand it.

 

 

[mstrox 6,637]

Congratulations to The Fabelmans for winning “Worst Title.”  Well-deserved Oscar gold

[Yavar Moradi 2,576]

Ah, so it’s a bad thing that for the second time in all of history, a non-white woman won Best Actress. Got it!

 

This is the real “woke mind virus”. 🙄 

 

Yavar

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

5 hours ago, Sweeping Strings said:

I haven't seen it either. The title just makes it sound like an exhausting viewing experience for anyone over 25 or so. 

It is.  Like a 2 and a half hour Rick and Morty gag episode

[Tydirium 1,166]

2 minutes ago, Yavar Moradi said:

Ah, so it’s a bad thing that for the second time in all of history, a non-white woman won Best Actress. Got it!

 

This is the real “woke mind virus”. 🙄 

 

Yavar

 

He never said nor even implied that...

[GerateWohl 4,320]

This morning I thought, with a quota of less than 10% of wins from his nominations Williams might have one of the worst quotas of all oscar winners ever. Could that be?

Average quota should be 20% (one out of five nominees wins).

Less than 10% is really... bad luck?

[mstrox 6,637]

There are lots of people who have won 0% of their Oscar nominations.

[Tydirium 1,166]

4 minutes ago, GerateWohl said:

This morning I thought, with a quota of less than 10% of wins from his nominations Williams might have one of the worst quotas of all oscar winners ever. Could that be?

Average quota should be 20% (one out of five nominees wins).

Less than 10% is really... bad luck?

 

At this point, it has to be intentional. The Academy is well aware of how many Oscars JW has been nominated for/has won, but some people would no doubt complain if he won even a 5th of those nominations.

 

But also, I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of it has to do with the taste (or lack thereof) of the Academy.

[Nick1Ø66 4,687]

I'm waiting for the inevitable sequel...."Nothing, Nowhere, None of the Time"

[Sweeping Strings 2,342]

2 minutes ago, Not Mr. Big said:

It is.  Like a 2 and a half hour Rick and Morty gag episode

I quite like Rick And Morty, but yeah - I doubt I'd want to watch 7 episodes back-to-back.  

[Glóin the Dark 1,218]

I, by contrast, have won 100% of my Oscar nominations.

[GerateWohl 4,320]

4 minutes ago, mstrox said:

There are lots of people who have won 0% of their Oscar nominations.

Right. That is why I talked about one of the worst quotas of oscar winners.

That excludes the 0% win participants.

[mstrox 6,637]

The reason they say “it’s an honor just to be nominated” is because you are nominated by your peers in your section of the Academy.  Once you’re nominated, good luck making it past the whims of the general Academy voter.  Williams’ nomination for The Fabelmans (a score which is just fine) and his being nominated for pretty much everything he’s done lately is a mark of respect from the people at the Academy who work in film music, and as is true every year, awards shows and who wins at the shows are completely meaningless.

5 minutes ago, Sweeping Strings said:

I quite like Rick And Morty, but yeah - I doubt I'd want to watch 7 episodes back-to-back.  

It’s nothing like Rick and Morty.  It’s a story about a woman losing control of her life and family and coming to a place of understanding, acceptance and peace for herself and others, told through a fantasy (multiverse) framework. (not) Mr Big just has an axe to grind!

[GerateWohl 4,320]

2 minutes ago, mstrox said:

and as is true every year, awards shows and who wins at the shows are completely meaningless.

Tell that to the winners.

I think, John Williams is a smart person. And I bet that his wins mean something to him.

[Yavar Moradi 2,576]

12 minutes ago, Tydirium said:

 

He never said nor even implied that...

Oh, what did he imply? That it’s just a bad thing to recognize/celebrate a woman of color winning Best Actress for the second time in history? Or is it just wokebad to even use the term “woman of color”?

 

Yavar

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

10 minutes ago, mstrox said:

 

It’s nothing like Rick and Morty.  It’s a story about a woman losing control of her life and family and coming to a place of understanding, acceptance and peace for herself and others, told through a fantasy (multiverse) framework. (not) Mr Big just has an axe to grind!

That plot could still describe a Rick and Morty episode.

[Tallguy 3,359]

14 minutes ago, Yavar Moradi said:

Ah, so it’s a bad thing that for the second time in all of history, a non-white woman won Best Actress. Got it!

 

This is the real “woke mind virus”. 🙄 

 

Yavar

 

It's a bad thing that she won it because she wasn't white. Otherwise it's an achievement.

 

Which goes back to my argument that Everything Everywhere won the Oscars it won because it was a deserving film. It's not good if a film and its participants win because they're woke or white or "the right kind of people". It's not good if they lose for the same reasons.

 

Just now, Not Mr. Big said:

That plot could still describe a Rick and Morty episode.

 

It's kind of the how Edge of Tomorrow and Groundhog Day are the same film.

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

2 minutes ago, Tallguy said:

It's kind of the how Edge of Tomorrow and Groundhog Day are the same film.

The execution is the main thing that makes it feel like Rick and Morty.  The Pickle Rick brand of "crazy random humor" but still very meme like (like the Hot Dog fingers universe or the Racoon Ratatouille parody).  

[GerateWohl 4,320]

4 minutes ago, Tallguy said:

It's a bad thing that she won it because she wasn't white. Otherwise it's an achievement.

 

Which goes back to my argument that Everything Everywhere won the Oscars it won because it was a deserving film. It's not good if a film and its participants win because they're woke or white or "the right kind of people". It's not good if they lose for the same reasons.

I just learned form @mstrox that winning an oscar is meaningless and that it is only the nomination that counts.

 

So, letting out of the nominated the member of a minority win is the possibility to give some meaning to it. And that is a good thing.

 

And if it is just paying into limiting the discrimination record of the academy from the past decades.

[Yavar Moradi 2,576]

26 minutes ago, GerateWohl said:

This morning I thought, with a quota of less than 10% of wins from his nominations Williams might have one of the worst quotas of all oscar winners ever. Could that be?

Average quota should be 20% (one out of five nominees wins).

Less than 10% is really... bad luck?

Compare his percentage to Goldsmith and he’s looking pretty darn fortunate.

 

Yavar

[Not Mr. Big 4,639]

One positive thing I will say about this year is that the lot of nominated films is the best and most varied in a while.  A good mix of blockbusters and more traditional type Oscar films

 

Which makes it even worse that only two films really won anything 

[GerateWohl 4,320]

5 minutes ago, Yavar Moradi said:

Compare his percentage to Goldsmith and he’s looking pretty darn fortunate.

 

Yavar

I just looked it up. You are right. Goldsmith won less that 6%.

[mstrox 6,637]

2 minutes ago, GerateWohl said:

Tell that to the winners.

I think, John Williams is a smart person. And I bet that his wins mean something to him.

Im sure it’s very personally meaningful to the winners - meaningful to Williams and meaningful to the All Quiet guy and meaningful to Zimmer and Reznor and Hildur and etc etc.  But the actual winning of the award is not and has never been a mark of quality.

20 minutes ago, Not Mr. Big said:

That plot could still describe a Rick and Morty episode.

Rick and Morty has never had that level of sensitivity towards any of its characters! (Nor should it, as a comedy cartoon).

19 minutes ago, Not Mr. Big said:

The execution is the main thing that makes it feel like Rick and Morty.  The Pickle Rick brand of "crazy random humor" but still very meme like (like the Hot Dog fingers universe or the Racoon Ratatouille parody).  

But unlike Rick and Morty, both of those random joke moments turned into affecting (yet still funny) character moments - Yeoh’s character seeing Curtis’ character as a person in the former, and in the latter realizing the impact of a decision she made and working to rectify it.