Episode III Scoring (Non) News

[Lurker 5]

There was a chat with Rick McCallum at Star Wars.com's "Hyperspace" section recently. Someone asked if Williams had started scoring "Episode III" yet ( ). He said Williams will not start writing it until November 2004.

And this one is great and cannot be paraphrased:

Hello there Mr. McCallum, it is an honor to post with you. I felt that something Episode II really lacked was a good score. A lot of the music in Episode II was recycled from Episode I. Do you know if there will be more original music composed for Episode III? If so, will it be more blended with themes from the original trilogy to ease the transition? Thank you!

I agree with you. But it's still too early to tell until we get the final cut of the picture.

Neil

[ocelot 508]

I see..... Making sense as usual...... I would love to know what pills they are on in Lucas Film.......

[stewdog1 50]

I'm curious what he agrees with. The whole post? Or just the last question?

[Dole 17]

Well...at least someone asked the question. After the whole TPM editing mess and now internet chat questions about AOTC, maybe people at Lucasland are beginning to understand that Star Wars fans don't appreciate the scores being treated like garbage.

Dole- who thinks that AOTC would be a much more popular score on this board if there was 15 minutes of original battle music on the album. Take away The Droid Battle", "The Droid Invasion", and "Panaka and the Queen's Protectors" and The Phantom Menace album isn't all that great either!

[ocelot 508]

but that's also what makes the SW scores, the battle sequences are incredible. Also, I dissagree about Phantom Menace..... Some of the writing in there is very advanced orchestrally, it's fantastic, but that is only my opinion.

[Dole 17]

I totally agree with you ocelot. I was just saying that the battle music tracks from TPM are many people's favorites and are standout highlights of the soundtrack album. We didn't get any new "end battle" music from AOTC and that's one of the reasons I think many people don't seem to appreciate that score. It's hard to evaluate ESB without the great Hoth battle music or ROTJ without the great Endor battle music, and yet we have to evaluate AOTC without any Geonosis battle music. I actually think that the AOTC soundtrack is more listenable than the TPM soundtrack, but that's just my opinion. They're both good scores though.

Dole

[King Mark 3,631]

Well...at least someone asked the question.  After the whole TPM editing mess and now internet chat questions about AOTC, maybe people at Lucasland are beginning to understand that Star Wars fans don't appreciate the scores being treated like garbage.  

!

yes,I hope at least a few people attached with the production are reading/noticing a lot of the discussion going on here and sites like TFNet about the score editing/looping/recycling,so they might consider beeing more carefull with the scores as lots of SW fans are Williams fans and notice the score a lot more than maybe they think they do.

K.M.

[King Mark 3,631]

Actually,I think if we all e-mailed Lucasfilm about it,they might be even more aware of it.They do seem to take notice of Internet fan input.

K.M.

[UCFKevin 0]

He's probably agreeing that Episode II lacked a good score.

[Eplicon 53]

Episode II actually lacked a good movie.

[woodwindmaster06 0]

Why is everyone saying how bad these new prequel scores are so bad. In my oppinion they are not that bad. Given that they are not as good as the originals but Williams is in a different time period he is in a different writing style then he was in the 80s he is in a period of darker scores and his style has changed a bit from the classic 70s and 80s.

But his scores have added new great themes to them, and in Anakins Theme there is a motif to build up to the Imperial March and one reason the scores are not as good as they were just has to do with the story at where it is right now. There is no powerful emperor yet, there is no darth vader so he can not write this powerful and classic score it is not a strong fight good against evil like it was in the original trilogy, the prequel is a set of stories leading up to the evil times, but for now Williams is composing accordingly in my taste, although I dont like That speeder chase track in EpII at all it was just a choice Williams made about how he wanted to write it.

Its not bad its just different. The 3rd score should be up to class with the other original trilogy scores since it will be a very emotional film and dark film it should be more like the original trilogy. This next film should be one of williams fineist scores he knows it is his last Star Wars film and will make sure it is perfect and come up to his standards, as for me I cant wait till the 2 disc Episode II AOTC Expanded Edition comes out whenever it happens I will buy it, there is so much good music missing off the soundtrack.

THERES MY 2 CENTS

[UCFKevin 0]

They AREN'T that bad, but they're nowhere near as great as the OT.

[King Mark 3,631]

anyways,haven we discussed that enough already?

K.M.

[Saxman717 22]

How long did Williams have to write the scores to the OT? It had to be longer than what he's getting now. With these blasted CGI scenes that get editted up until like late April and early May of the year of release, Williams has no time to write a phenomenal score.

November 2004??????? Is anyone else worried about that? That is ludicrous and shows how much the music to the prequel trilogy is on the back burner in Lucasfilm's mind. They're all about CGI now......no more Wagneresque, grandiose scores that Williams can pour his heart and soul into.

November 2004.......&@#$(*&@!!!! banghead

[King Mark 3,631]

yeah,i was reading in the liner notes of E.T. how Williams worked very hard trying to write and record the Bycicle Chase so that it fit the movie edit to the nanosecond(before he was told to forget about it).guess he doesn't really has to bother about that lately with Harry Potter and Star Wars,and writes "approximate" music

K.M.

[woodwindmaster06 0]

I have a feeling that John Williams is probably working out new themes and stuff like that before november, he wont have any time constraints, he did JP and Shiendlers List in the same year remind you. He has been known to put out great scores with little time to write them, he will be thinking of themes before november, like concert suites and a full theme and he will be ready.

[King Mark 3,631]

maybe he writes some themes and specific scene sketches in advance when he is inspired then puts them aside untill he gets the movie so he can work on the actual score cues.

K.M.who would probably do that if he was a composer.

[Guest]

Well, Williams has said in interviews that he works from the visuals, doesn't read scripts etc. His compositional skill is so advanced that creating new themes would be very easy for him, I doubt he stockpiles themes and melodies.

Horner, on the other hand, probably does.

[nja 0]

Well, Williams has said in interviews that he works from the visuals, doesn't read scripts etc. His compositional skill is so advanced that creating new themes would be very easy for him, I doubt he stockpiles themes and melodies.  

Horner, on the other hand, probably does.

Hey now there's a thought for starving composers- construct melodies 8 hours a day, copyright a collection and pawn em off to the highest bidder.

You could probably even get some ebay action going . . .

(Sorry it's getting late)

[Chris ChrusherComix 46]

I said it once before and I'll say it again:

If there was not enough time to do the exact music to the scene, Williams should have done one of those "album/concert versions" like ROTJ's "The Forest Battle", with approximate times and what's basically going on. Then, if Lucas was smart, edit the action to the music, or at least have something close enough (and with original "composed-for" music) to edit to.

TPM's score is almost as good as the OT, if not equally as good. The OST CD and the UE were bad examples, and so far every single fan-made version that I have heard (from my own to KM's to EJ's to Takis's) were much superior, making me wonder just what the hell is going on over there in Sony/Lucas's music and scoring departments.

But AOTC's is not close to any Star Wars score (even though I do like it alot, it's NOT nearly as good as the previous four). The reason: The absolutely horrid music editing in the movie and the apparent fact that most of the end scenes were not scored. It's sophomoric movie-making, and Lucas & co. ought to be ashemed of themselves. I don't think TPM was as bad as most people thought, but I do think AOTC deserves the bad comments.

Don't get me wrong, I still love every Star Wars film to date, but the quality and respect for the franchise has suffered greatly. And I still believe that the music editing and the overall editing (pacing) is indeed the reason for this.

Lucas made OT Special Editions. I liked them because they introduced never-before-seen footage and got us expanded CD scores released. But I didn't like the editing (they were all shortened via mini-edits on nearly every scene, and this effects the music more than it effects anything else). If any movies need "Special Editions" the 1st two Prequels do. And with REVISED scores with the mishandled/misedited scenes being re-scored BY WILLIAMS. Only then can this franchise be saved from TOTAL embarassment.

I also feel that a project like Williams trying to repair the prequel scores (and I feel such a thing would easily make them comparable to his classic OT works) would be better than doing another boring movie score to a boring movie. I love Spielberg's movies, but I also feel Williams' talents are wasted on films like Minority Report and Catch Me If You Can. Good scores to good films, agreed... but I'd rather have a well-done (and NOT mis-edited to hell) Star Wars score than either of those any day.

Maybe after Episode 3 Lucas will try to salvage all three prequels for DVD. Let's hope, although what are the chances?

[Simon R. 10]

How long did Williams have to write the scores to the OT?  It had to be longer than what he's getting now.  With these blasted CGI scenes that get editted up until like late April and early May of the year of release, Williams has no time to write a phenomenal score.

November 2004???????  Is anyone else worried about that?  That is ludicrous and shows how much the music to the prequel trilogy is on the back burner in Lucasfilm's mind.  They're all about CGI now......no more Wagneresque, grandiose scores that Williams can pour his heart and soul into.  

November 2004.......&@#$(*&@!!!! banghead

What's the problem with nov 2004? This should give Williams a good 3-4 months to write the score. That's plenty.

[Dole 17]

What's the problem with nov 2004? This should give Williams a good 3-4 months to write the score. That's plenty.

Maybe not if he's recording the score in January again. He first saw TPM in October of 1998 and recorded the score in Feb. and March of 1999. He recorded the AOTC score in January and February and was so time-pressed by the project (plus the Olympics) that he had to cancel an appearance at a concert with the Boston Pops if I recall correctly.

Dole

[Simon R. 10]

Let's say he starts recording mid january and begins writing Nov 1st. That's still 10 weeks - however, I think it's likely that they won't record that early, if he really only starts writing in november. My guess is they'll record february at the earlist. For a composer, working with a deadline is no bad thing and doesn't make the music any worse. Sometimes it can be a plus to be under pressure, at least that's my experience, although I haven't tried writing 120 minutes of music in three months:) Still, for an expert composer like Williams, turning out 2 minutes of music in a day is not a problem.

[CYPHER 1]

If there was not enough time to do the exact music to the scene, Williams should have done one of those "album/concert versions" like ROTJ's "The Forest Battle", with approximate times and what's basically going on. Then, if Lucas was smart, edit the action to the music, or at least have something close enough (and with original "composed-for" music) to edit to.

I agree wholeheartedly.

If any movies need "Special Editions" the 1st two Prequels do. And with REVISED scores with the mishandled/misedited scenes being re-scored BY WILLIAMS.  

Maybe after Episode 3 Lucas will try to salvage all three prequels for DVD.

What a great idea! This way Lucas' insane revisionism would actually work in our favour by possibly giving us an improved listening experience. Emphasis on the word 'possibly' though. As you yourself said Chris, the Special Edition OT (or is that an oxymoron? ) did not do wonders for the role of the music in the films (although the SE CD releases are another thing altogether ). I think even old Georgie-Porgie would be too embarrassed to release Special Editions of a bunch of films so soon after he's just finished making them. Then again, I'm sure some people here would not put such behaviour past him

CYPHER

[FossMan 1]

I don't know... after all the entire Lord of the Rings trilogy is being released in standard format, then two months later in SE format. I think a precedent has been set.