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Should I switch to the original OST releases for the OT soundtracks or keep using the 1997 Special Editions?


Jofi_

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I originally got all my Star Wars music from the public library and listened to it off of their CDs for a while. 

 

The problem is, the library only had the 1997 Special Edition soundtrack releases for the Original Trilogy, but the Prequel and Sequel soundtracks were the highly edited versions that are widely used.

 

I enjoy having all the extra music in the Special Editions, but it bothers me that a 3rd of my Star Wars music is more expanded on than the rest.

 

I've gotten used to the longer, edited versions of the Prequel and Sequel soundtracks, and to the more complete versions of the OT Special Editions.

 

So should I make the downgrade to the originally released OT soundtracks for consistency, or should I fix the rest of my music to be more complete? (this would be a pain especially with the sequels, ESPECIALLY with TROS).

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1 minute ago, Holko said:

You should just wait for proper expansions!

They said more coming soon in what...2019?

At this point I'll graduate college before they release expansions

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The 2015 OST presentations of the Original Trilogy scores from Sony are the only versions you need, for now. The problem is they're only digital computer downloads meant for computers, but they're in Flack format.

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49 minutes ago, crumbs said:

 

360_F_540795386_6V22Ck3NT2ESDrxwVPn9Fi7y

 


I was doing my nightly oil pulling when I saw this, and nearly spat a mouthful of coconut oil on the screen.

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2 hours ago, Jofi_ said:

So should I make the downgrade to the originally released OT soundtracks for consistency, or should I fix the rest of my music to be more complete? (this would be a pain especially with the sequels, ESPECIALLY with TROS).

 

1. It's a always an UPgrade, not a downgrade, to go for the OSTs

2. You shouldn't get them for consistency, but because they're better listening experiences

3. While the OSTs of the OT were brilliant, I've always felt the Arista box versions (rather than the 1997 special editions) represented the scores properly, like the subsequent prequel and sequel OSTs also did. So nothing wrong with mixing it up a bit.

4. Ultimately, it's up to you. What we think about what you should and shouldn't do, is really of no significance.

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By getting the OT OST you don't necessarily get more consistency as these were created to fit into an LP or double LP program. The OSTs from the Prequels were the first originally published on CD, just like the Arista box for the OT. So, in a way the Arista Box was the first edition published on CD and therefore the program is probably the one to go to if you are aiming for consistency with the Prequel and Sequel OSTs.

 

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The 2015 Sony OST releases overall have the best sound quality in terms of dynamic range, clarity and airiness. They're mastered for hi-fi stereo systems, like the prequels.

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3 hours ago, Unlucky Bastard said:

The 2015 OST presentations of the Original Trilogy scores from Sony are the only versions you need, for now. The problem is they're only digital computer downloads meant for computers, but they're in Flack format.

 

It took a random Star Wars thread to lure you back!

 

1 hour ago, Mr. Hooper said:

I was doing my nightly oil pulling

 

What?

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3 hours ago, Holko said:

You should just wait another fifty years for proper expansions!

Fixed.

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31 minutes ago, Jurassic Shark said:

 

It took a random Star Wars thread to lure you back!

 

The death of Joeinar... is like an open wound. It seems that I have left the noblest part of myself, back there, on that newly curated OST.

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8 hours ago, Schilkeman said:

Yeah, I suspect if we don't get them before or by 2027, we're just not getting them at all.


I'm holding out hope that our champion, Mike Matessino, has pleaded the case that the 50th anniversary is the best time to capitalize and release a boxed set to rule them all.

 

If 2027 goes by without a word, I'll officially give up hoping.

 

8 hours ago, Jurassic Shark said:

What?

 

 

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10 hours ago, Thor said:

 

1. It's a always an UPgrade, not a downgrade, to go for the OSTs

2. You shouldn't get them for consistency, but because they're better listening experiences

3. While the OSTs of the OT were brilliant, I've always felt the Arista box versions (rather than the 1997 special editions) represented the scores properly, like the subsequent prequel and sequel OSTs also did. So nothing wrong with mixing it up a bit.

4. Ultimately, it's up to you. What we think about what you should and shouldn't do, is really of no significance.

Yes I have to agree with 3.

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11 hours ago, Thor said:

1. It's a always an UPgrade, not a downgrade, to go for the OSTs

 

Dude, you changed your avatar. I was going to say "What are you, Thor?" Then I read the name rather than just looking at the picture. Well done, sir!

 

@Jofi_ you should listen to what makes you happy. If you can listen to Return of the Jedi with most of the Jabba music missing or even Star Wars without "Learn about the Force" or whatever they call it then go back to the OST. Actually, for Jedi never go back to the OST. That album was deficient. But the OSTs of Star Wars and Empire were great. I listen to them often.

 

Some have said the RCA discs are sonically inferior, but I've never heard it. Not saying they're wrong, of course.

 

And like Thor said, the Arista box is a great middle of the road.

 

Really, listen to the music that you enjoy.

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I've only heard the 97 SEs (actually, the 2004 re-release by Sony). Never heard the original 70s/80s OSTs, never will. One of the perks of starting to listen to film scores after the "expanded era" began, I think.

 

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47 minutes ago, Thor said:

 

il_570xN.2350608904_b89f.jpg



The bootleg Mask release of Barry's 'King Kong' makes a fine coaster, I think—though it filled a need for a time.

 

image.jpeg

 

49 minutes ago, Edmilson said:

You wouldn't like to know ;)


No, please tell us. :)

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Listen to whatever makes you happy. The OT scores are filled to the brim with incredible music and they flow really well in expanded form, so if you want to listen to those, do it. The lack of complete releases for the other six scores is, of course, an ongoing travesty, but that's no reason to stick to the OSTs for the OT.

 

On the other hand, if you prefer the sound quality and/or more concise presentations on the OSTs, listen to those.

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19 hours ago, Jofi_ said:

 

So should I make the downgrade to the originally released OT soundtracks for consistency

 

Absolutely not.

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I would never attempt listening to complete releases of the sequels, especially TLJ, since I struggled through that tedious 77 minute album. All TLJ needs is a good culling in its runtime and it could work. I'd give TROS a go in complete form maybe because it at least has more variety. TFA needs some audio issues fixed.

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On 21/05/2024 at 2:02 PM, Tallguy said:

Some have said the RCA discs are sonically inferior, but I've never heard it. Not saying they're wrong, of course.

 Technically the 1997 ESB doesn't sound "bad" at all, it's not like there are technical or sound quality issues with it. Technically and sonically, it sounds great - the main issue I have with it is that most of the tracks are remixed and sound nothing like the film mix, usually made more mono.

 

That said, it's not terribly dissimilar to the remixes done for the 1977/1980 OST albums. I find it really strange how many people will say the 1997 ESB sounds like shit but then will heartily recommend the 2016 digital OST reissues

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Is the general consensus that the best sounding ESB music is available via the Dolby Atmos remix of the OST?

 

I thought that fixed most of the weird sound issues on the 2018 Demasters.

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Who the hell wants to listen to music in Dolby Atmos? Only really committed home theatre geeks with 17 ceiling speakers would be able to hear the difference.

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18 minutes ago, crumbs said:

Is the general consensus that the best sounding ESB music so available via the Dolby Atmos remix of the OST?

 

I thought that fixed most of the weird sound issues on the 2018 Demasters.

I've read this before. I haven't started comparing the ESB tracks in detail yet like I have with the first film but I'm going to make a stereo downmix of the Atmos files and compare those to the original 2018 release.

 

 

I'm gonna bet that the theory about the LCR channels being wrong on the original is probably what happened

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39 minutes ago, enderdrag64 said:

I've read this before. I haven't started comparing the ESB tracks in detail yet like I have with the first film but I'm going to make a stereo downmix of the Atmos files and compare those to the original 2018 release.

 

 

I'm gonna bet that the theory about the LCR channels being wrong on the original is probably what happened

 

I may have spoken too soon. The godawful excessive reverb (and resulting artifacts) in Asteroid Field are actually worse in the Atmos version, even with the fake surrounds muted. The sheer incompetence of whoever 'mastered' that track and thought, "yeah, that sounds good!"

 

To my ears, the high-res album master transfer from the 2016 Sony collection sounds vastly better, even if lacks a wide stereo field. So whatever source was used for the Disney releases, it probably wasn't first-generation and the reverb was a (poor) attempt at hiding it.

 

The Atmos master did fix that bizarre AQ dip at the end of The Heroics of Luke and Han though, so I guess there's that (although that track is also smothered with artificial reverb).

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See? They're deliberately making existing music sound shitter just to slap their proprietary labels on it, like they tried with that MQA garbage.

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10 hours ago, crumbs said:

 

I may have spoken too soon. The godawful excessive reverb (and resulting artifacts) in Asteroid Field are actually worse in the Atmos version, even with the fake surrounds muted. The sheer incompetence of whoever 'mastered' that track and thought, "yeah, that sounds good!"

 

To my ears, the high-res album master transfer from the 2016 Sony collection sounds vastly better, even if lacks a wide stereo field. So whatever source was used for the Disney releases, it probably wasn't first-generation and the reverb was a (poor) attempt at hiding it.

That's intriguing because the multitrack elements for Asteroid Field (according to Chris Malone, "from pre-edited 24-
track backup rolls") was used for the 97 SE, and subsquent remixed for the 2005 DVD that came with RoTS OST. It definitely sounds better than the 97 SE, but it has some dialog and SFX included unfortunately.

 

Here's what he had to say about the 2005 remix:

 

"it appears that the multi-track tapes have been remixed specifically for the DVD by Shawn Murphy. A central cue to the score, titled “The Asteroid Field,” accompanies the Millennium Falcon’s pursuit by Darth Vader’s TIE fighters with propulsive rhythms and complex woodwind passages. For this cue, the woodwinds are more clearly defined on the DVD, with a noticeable absence of minor distortion on the piccolo runs and some of the loud brass passages that affected both the album master and 4CD set. The french horns are correctly spatially placed on the left as compared with right on the disappointing 2CD Special Edition mixes. The horns are also slightly raised in level to match the balance heard in the film, revealing extra detail in their orchestration. The violins have a new air to them with an extended upper frequency range and the basses retain their low grunt, which was something noticeably absent from the lifeless sound of the 2CD Special Edition version. The centre channel provides solidarity and focus featuring mainly woodwinds, timpani and violas as well as bleed from other instruments, notably brasses. There is some pizzicato work from the violas at the conclusion of the cue that is almost inaudible in previous releases. The harp is placed to the right versus left in the film. There is also a noticeable improvement in dynamic range for this cue on DVD. The woodwinds that open the piece are about 13 dB down from the peak level compared with 7 dB for the 4CD box set and 13 dB for the 2CD set. The average RMS power is improved to about 20 dB compared with 16 dB or so for other releases."

 

I'd say that the 2018 dismater didn't use the multitrack elements for Asteroid Field.

 

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All analysis points to the 3-track LCR masters being used for the Disney Demasters for ESB, infamously downmixed to stereo incorrectly.

 

They seemingly corrected that particular issue for the Atmos remix but it sounds like the same source overall (the surrounds are fake).

 

Why create fake Atmos mixes from an LCR master instead of making proper Atmos mixes from the 24 track masters? Laziness, probably.

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2 hours ago, crumbs said:

All analysis points to the 3-track LCR masters being used for the Disney Demasters for ESB, infamously downmixed to stereo incorrectly.

I spent a lot of time last night playing around with the LCR channels from the ATMOS releases and I can't seem to recreate the stereo 2018 releases. I genuinely have no idea what they did to get them to sound like that.

 

If you just downmix the ATMOS to stereo correctly you get mixes that sound like the 1993/film, which is what they should sound like.

 

No matter what I did I wasn't able to replicate the left heavy mix of the original 2018 sets

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11 minutes ago, Manakin Skywalker said:

They seem to have been done from the ground up considering the synth in ESB is suddenly missing.

Yeah I recall you mentioning that before, but it doesn't seem to be missing in my copy, at least not in Yoda and the Force

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1 hour ago, enderdrag64 said:

Yeah I recall you mentioning that before, but it doesn't seem to be missing in my copy, at least not in Yoda and the Force

 

It might just be The Magic Tree then? Still very odd.

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On 21/5/2024 at 12:50 AM, Schilkeman said:

Yeah, I suspect if we don't get them before or by 2027, we're just not getting them at all.

I’m coming around to the idea that the 50th anniversary of Star Wars will be when this finally happens. Think about it—Disney is going to go all out to celebrate this milestone and that makes the release of fully expanded, remastered SW soundtracks an absolute necessity. Because other than those, there’s nothing Disney could offer that would live up to the anniversary. The movies themselves have been reissued a hundred times already and there’s nothing new to present to the public (other than maybe the original, “de-specialized” version of SW, which we know won’t happen). There may be a new SW movie in theaters in 2027 and undoubtedly there’ll be some SW crossover content with other pop culture properties, but those will be incidental activities. Maybe there’ll be a new line of figurines or other collectible crap, but those will only go so far. No, the only thing left, the only thing that will truly make a splash, is a sumptuous, definitive collection of all the music JW wrote for SW.

 

I’m gonna channel my inner Mattris here and say that this was Disney’s plan all along: The repeated reissues of the OST’s, the demastered box set, the endless fuckups with the recent release of a soundtrack relating to another beloved George Lucas/JW property… all of it was designed to beat us down into hopelessness, so that when the long-awaited announcement is made in 2027, our reactions will be orders of magnitude more ecstatic.

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8 hours ago, Unlucky Bastard said:

The great thing about 40 minute OSTs is they usually don't overstay their welcome.

 

But 40 isn't enough for Star Wars. Or Empire. Certainly not enough for Jedi. I wonder if I would think 40 was enough for Return of the Jedi if it didn't have THREE concert suites?

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5 minutes ago, Tallguy said:

 

But 40 isn't enough for Star Wars. Or Empire. Certainly not enough for Jedi. I wonder if I would think 40 was enough for Return of the Jedi if it didn't have THREE concert suites?

 

They made the Polydor CD for ESB only 40 minutes. It's fine. And I love the ROTJ OST, it made me fall in love with the score again after so many years being stuck with the RCA.

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