New ‘Lord of the Rings’ Movie From Stephen Colbert and His Son in Development at Warner Bros.

[Yavar Moradi 4,416]

On 25/03/2026 at 2:19 PM, TheTennisBallKid said:

if Shore is writing music for this, yay! If not…well, hmmm.

 

Oooh, we could potentially have dueling McCreary and Shore Tom Bombadil songs! If it happens, I'm here for it...

 

 

On 29/03/2026 at 6:48 AM, Chen G. said:

And my structural-minded self finds it...intruiging, shall we say...that Peter is now producing effectively another trilogy, with one film in the beginning of the series, one smack dab in the middle, and one at the end.

 

Wait... what's the one at the end? The Scouring of the Shire would make sense, if they hadn't already closed off that possibility with the EE of Return of the King. Aren't both The Hunt for Gollum and Shadow of the Past in the middle?

Yavar

[Chen G. 6,149]

1 hour ago, Yavar Moradi said:

Aren't both The Hunt for Gollum and Shadow of the Past in the middle?

 

Hunt for Gollum, yes. But Shadow of the Past starts 14 years AFTER Return of the King and then flashes back (well, presumably: it's a little unclear). I did a whole speculative three-act diagram. It's...well, it's very Chen  and since I know that stuff gives the board here a good laugh:

 

[Yavar Moradi 4,416]

Well from that perspective then the Hobbit trilogy is "at the end" too.

 

Yavar

[Chen G. 6,149]

No. It's from the morning of the Farewell Party. There are even some minor felicities here. For instance, in this shot Bilbo is all brooding over the Ring:

 

 

BECAUSE, in Fellowship of the Ring we learn that only a few moments earlier he had a minor freak-out over it:

 

 

I'm not even sure they thought of this, but it's nice serendipity if nothing else.

[Rachael Foley 10,174]

7 hours ago, Yavar Moradi said:

 

Oooh, we could potentially have dueling McCreary and Shore Tom Bombadil songs! If it happens, I'm here for it...

Probably not, it would most likely be dueling McCreary and Fran, Phillippa, Plan 9 Tom Bombadil songs.

[Nick1Ø66 8,341]

8 hours ago, Chen G. said:

I'm not even sure they thought of this, but it's nice serendipity if nothing else

 

Haha. I'm not sure if it was intentional either, but well spotted! Even if unintentional, that's the beauty of art.

[Yavar Moradi 4,416]

On 17/04/2026 at 5:30 PM, Rachael Foley said:

Probably not, it would most likely be dueling McCreary and Fran, Phillippa, Plan 9 Tom Bombadil songs.

 

Maybe! But Shore wrote several songs for LotR too, Gollum's Song being my very favorite. So I'm still going to hold out a bit of hope that Colbert may have him set Tom Bombadil lyrics to music, instead of Plan 9.

 

But hey, I love Plan 9's Misty Mountains song from AUJ, and Shore's orchestral use of it in that score. So I'll keep an open mind in any case.

 

Yavar

[Chen G. 6,149]

Plan 9 and David Long are in many ways the unsung heroes of the music of these films (and season one of Rings of Power). The liner notes, annotated scores and Doug's book understandably focus on Howard's compositions, and this leaves Plan 9's work somewhat underserved. The Complete Recordings and Rarities archive again understandably endeavoured to reproduce as much of Howard's music as they could, but left any number of works by Plan 9 and David Long unaccounted for.

 

To me, their work goes together with Howard's. Not that they're always totally congruous on musical grounds - although they often are - but because ultimately BOTH are music written for and featured within the Lord of the Rings films. The way I choose to look at it is the Plan 9 et al pieces are little ornamental additions that adorn Howard's compositions: another way to look at it would be as a more artistic version of what Hans does with his army of co-composers. It's "Howard Shore and Co" (Gallagher also counts here).

 

Ultimately, the most memorable piece of music from An Unexpected Journey? By Plan 9 and David Long. Arguably the most memorable piece of music from Rings of Power season one? By Plan 9 and David Long. And who doesn't like their drinking song from The Return of the King?

[Nick1Ø66 8,341]

6 minutes ago, Chen G. said:

Ultimately, the most memorable piece of music from An Unexpected Journey? By Plan 9 and David Long

 

No love for the vocal stylings of Barry Humphries?

[Chen G. 6,149]

...by Gallagher, as it happens.

 

[Edmilson 12,393]

 Uh... Am I the only one whose favorite LOTR song is Enya's May It Be? 

 

Also... I don't really like Gollum's Song.

 

[Chen G. 6,149]

Lots of people favour "May it be" (and "Aniron"). Curiously, that's one of the pieces (the other is Plan 9's "Elvish Lament" and to some extent "I See Fire") that doesn't really fit into the score all that well.

 

I tend to prefer the songs that are somehow adumbrated in the score, because that gives them a kind of residue that makes them more powerful: "Into The West" and "In Dreams" are the biggest beneficiaries from this. But I'm also partial to "The Last Goodbye."

[Rachael Foley 10,174]

1 hour ago, Edmilson said:

 Uh... Am I the only one whose favorite LOTR song is Enya's May It Be? 

 

Also... I don't really like Gollum's Song.

 

It's time to take away your musical enlightenment card.

[Edmilson 12,393]

Some people may see May it Be as LOTR's equivalent to My Heart will go On, as in the pop song by a pop artist created exclusively for marketing purposes. I mean, the cover to the original OST to FOTR had written "Includes new song by Enya".

 

And given she didn't return for the other two movies, I wonder if neither Shore nor Jackson were happy with her presence there, and only obliged as a necessary evil to help the marketing.

 

But... I love that song! It's beautiful! And the videoclip with scenes from the movie makes it even better. I get emotional watching that clip just like I did when I was a kid, watching my dad skimming through the bonus section of the original 2 disc DVD.

 

It's infinitely better than that horrible Titanic song, and actually pretty much every Horner corny end titles song he was obsessed with (though I love Balto's Reach for the Light and Beautiful Mind's All Love can Be).

[Richard P 5,314]

The only song from the trilogy I'm not overly keen on is Into the West. It's too modern and I've never been a fan of Lennox' voice.

 

But I love Aniron, May It Be and Gollum's Song - they stylistically fit and the vocals on Gollum feel chosen for suitability to the song, and not marketing purposes.

 

Maybe they could be next in line to try MVSepping for instrumentals....

[Chen G. 6,149]

1 hour ago, Edmilson said:

I mean, the cover to the original OST to FOTR had written "Includes new song by Enya".

 

And given she didn't return for the other two movies, I wonder if neither Shore nor Jackson were happy with her presence there, and only obliged as a necessary evil to help the marketing.

 

Howard was the one to suggest Enya, so I doubt that was it.

 

I mean, did they hold on to any one vocalist across the span of these films? I guess Grace Davidson did The Desolation of Smaug, The Battle of the Five Armies AND The War of the Rohirrim but that's it.

[Nick1Ø66 8,341]

May it Be is fine, it's a pretty song (Anárion is better), but Loreena McKennitt, who they first approached (she sadly declined), would have been better, and much more suitable for the material.

1. Into the West 🌅 😭
2. Gollum's Song 
3. May it Be

4. The Last* Goodbye 😢 💔

5. Song of the Lonely Mountain 🥱 😴
6. I See Fire 🙄 🤮

 

*Now not so much

[Rachael Foley 10,174]

1 hour ago, Nick1Ø66 said:

May it Be is fine, it's a pretty song (Anárion is better), but Loreena McKennitt, who they first approached (and sadly declined), would have been better, and much more suitable for the material.

1. Into the West 🌅😭
2. The Last Goodbye 😢 💔
3. Gollum's Song
4. May it Be
5. Song of the Lonely Mountain 
6. I See Fire 🥱 🤮

 

 

What about In Dreams? Use Well the Days?

1 hour ago, Nick1Ø66 said:

Anárion is better

You mean Aniron?

[Nick1Ø66 8,341]

1 hour ago, Rachael Foley said:

What about In Dreams? Use Well the Days?

 

Both beautiful, but I was just looking at the six main closing credits songs. But if I were to rank them against, the others, they'd probably site between The Last Goodbye and May it Be.

 

1 hour ago, Rachael Foley said:

You mean Aniron?

 

Her too.  

 

It's easy to get Anárion and his long-forgotten twin sister Aniron mixed up.

[Chen G. 6,149]

7 hours ago, Nick1Ø66 said:

The Last* Goodbye 😢 💔

 

That was such a thing in the theatre. The song does three-and-a-half things:

 

For those watching in order through to The Return of the King, it further bridges the work: It's effectively a Pippin cameo, plus forecasting dialogue Bilbo says in the farewell party, not to mention Edge of Night.

 

For those watching in the theatre who had seen The Lord of the Rings it was the final goodbye to the series (or to the series in its Jackson-directed, Lesnie-lensed iteration: the "main programme" as it were).

 

For those who were just along for The Hobbit it closes both the film and the trilogy very nicely: They're lines Bilbo might have wished to say to the Dwarves.

 

And ontop of all of that, it's one of the songs that works better with Howard's score. It has the right celtic feel (instrumentation-wise, too) and even has the plagal cadences we will get with Into the West.

[Nick1Ø66 8,341]

17 minutes ago, Chen G. said:

That was such a thing in the theatre.

 

Indeed. I initially rated the song #2, because when seen in the ways you describe, either in the cinema or as a marathon at home, over those closing credits illustrations, it packs a big emotional punch.

 

But taken on its own as a song, it's not really as good as May it Be or Gollum's Song, and loses a bit of its power when you simply listen on the soundtrack. It's still a good song, but Boyd just can't compete with Enya or Torrini in terms of vocal performance.

 

That's what makes Into the West so special, IMO. It has that emotional catharsis when watching the films, but also stands on its own as a song.

 

[Chen G. 6,149]

1 minute ago, Nick1Ø66 said:

That's what makes Into the West #1, IMO. It has that emotional catharsis when watching the films, but also stands on its own as a song.

 

Yeah. It's also integrated into the score. I mean, its the theme of two or three of the most powerful passages in the whole work!

[Nick1Ø66 8,341]

1 hour ago, Chen G. said:

It has the right celtic feel (instrumentation-wise, too) and even has the plagal cadences we will get with Into the West.

 

I don't know if you're familiar with her work, but this "Celtic feel" is why McKennitt would have been a better choice, and it's a pity she had to turn it down.

 

 

[Quintus 6,516]

They should bring in Slipknot for the end credits on this one.

[Nick1Ø66 8,341]

It would be cool (and appropriate) if they brought back Torrini for THFG.

 

And Shadow of the Past could give them another shot at McKennitt, given that they wanted her for FOTR anyway.

[Chen G. 6,149]

I'd like some more operatic pedigree. We had Renee Fleming as the pre-eminent representative of the lyric-coloratura branch. But what about the hoch-dramatisch side of things? Granted, some dramatic singers often find it hard to sing softly and without the backing of a big orchestra.

[Quintus 6,516]

What about Il Divo?

[Nick1Ø66 8,341]

1 hour ago, Chen G. said:

I'd like some more operatic pedigree.

 

One "Ring" saga in opera not enough for you Chen?

[Tallguy 7,387]

3 hours ago, Chen G. said:

 

That was such a thing in the theatre. The song does three-and-a-half things:

 

For those watching in order through to The Return of the King, it further bridges the work: It's effectively a Pippin cameo, plus forecasting dialogue Bilbo says in the farewell party, not to mention Edge of Night.

 

For those watching in the theatre who had seen The Lord of the Rings it was the final goodbye to the series (or to the series in its Jackson-directed, Lesnie-lensed iteration: the "main programme" as it were).

 

For those who were just along for The Hobbit it closes both the film and the trilogy very nicely: They're lines Bilbo might have wished to say to the Dwarves.

 

And ontop of all of that, it's one of the songs that works better with Howard's score. It has the right celtic feel (instrumentation-wise, too) and even has the plagal cadences we will get with Into the West.

 

I LOVE the song. But it further cements The Hobbit as "aftermath" to Lord of the Rings. I mean, what are you gonna do?

 

3 hours ago, Nick1Ø66 said:

 

Indeed. I initially rated the song #2, because when seen in the ways you describe, either in the cinema or as a marathon at home, over those closing credits illustrations, it packs a big emotional punch.

 

But taken on its own as a song, it's not really as good as May it Be or Gollum's Song, and loses a bit of its power when you simply listen on the soundtrack. It's still a good song, but Boyd just can't compete with Enya or Torrini in terms of vocal performance.

 

That's what makes Into the West so special, IMO. It has that emotional catharsis when watching the films, but also stands on its own as a song.

 

 

Into the West is such a home run. People who haven't seen the film love the song. People (me) who didn't like the movies very much leave the theater weeping after hearing the song over the gorgeous portraits of the cast. One of the best curtain calls in cinema history. (I could argue that in some ways Endgame topped it, but as an isolated work it didn't.)

[Chen G. 6,149]

58 minutes ago, Tallguy said:

I could argue that in some ways Endgame toppe

 

I always find that the comparisons of Endgame to The Return of the King (also to Deathly Hallows and Return of the JedI) make me kinda wince. Even putting aside my dislike for the Marvel "style" and how unimaginative I find the staging of the last hour of the movie to be...it's a very, very different kind of concluding entry.

 

When you watch Iron Man...the conflict isn't yet "Thanos and his crew as against The Avengers." It sets-up things FOR the conflict with Thanos, but it - and many other entries besides - are not about that conflict. Whereas, in The Lord of the Rings - including in The Hobbit, though not The War of the Rohirrim - the underlying conflict is always that of "Sauron as against the Free People." In Star Wars, the underlying conflict is (almost) always "The Sith as against the Jedi." In Harry Potter, the conflict is always "Voldemort and the Death Eaters as against Harry and the Wizarding World."

 

Endgame, therefore, is not the resolution of all of the previous Marvel films: it's essentially just the resolution of Infinity War. From that standpoint, Marvel is perched somewhere between the above, and something more like the vintage Bonds where each film was a vignette unto itself (which is the case with Marvel: few of their films end with outright clifhangers) but Bond's ongoing tribulations with SPECTRE were kind of threaded through. Another example would be the way M: I tried (and failed) to have the Syndicate perform a similar function in their latter-day films.

 

Another difference is that although Endgame does feel like a conclusion, it actively sets-up sequels. Return of the Jedi may have ended up having sequels (as will, in a different way, The Return of the King, vis-a-vis this film) but it didn't set them up nor had any scheduled before it ever screened.

[Tallguy 7,387]

1 hour ago, Chen G. said:

 

I always find that the comparisons of Endgame to The Return of the King (also to Deathly Hallows and Return of the JedI) make me kinda wince. Even putting aside my dislike for the Marvel "style" and how unimaginative I find the staging of the last hour of the movie to be...it's a very, very different kind of concluding entry.

 

When you watch Iron Man...the conflict isn't yet "Thanos and his crew as against The Avengers." It sets-up things FOR the conflict with Thanos, but it - and many other entries besides - are not about that conflict. Whereas, in The Lord of the Rings - including in The Hobbit, though not The War of the Rohirrim - the underlying conflict is always that of "Sauron as against the Free People." In Star Wars, the underlying conflict is (almost) always "The Sith as against the Jedi." In Harry Potter, the conflict is always "Voldemort and the Death Eaters as against Harry and the Wizarding World."

 

Endgame, therefore, is not the resolution of all of the previous Marvel films: it's essentially just the resolution of Infinity War. From that standpoint, Marvel is perched somewhere between the above, and something more like the vintage Bonds where each film was a vignette unto itself (which is the case with Marvel: few of their films end with outright clifhangers) but Bond's ongoing tribulations with SPECTRE were kind of threaded through. Another example would be the way M: I tried (and failed) to have the Syndicate perform a similar function in their latter-day films.

 

Another difference is that although Endgame does feel like a conclusion, it actively sets-up sequels. Return of the Jedi may have ended up having sequels (as will, in a different way, The Return of the King, vis-a-vis this film) but it didn't set them up nor had any scheduled before it ever screened.

 

To be clear, I'm only comparing the wrap up. Even just the end credits specifically. I don't think Jedi or even Potter bowed out this way. Both LotR and Endgame wrap up with all of the performers taking their bows. (With Endgame taking inspiration from Star Trek VI.) It's been a long time since I've seen the last Potter film but the closest it comes to looking back to the first movie is that it quotes Williams in the score.

 

In the Wider World: Obviously Lord of the Rings is a single story.

 

People for some reason have come to see the MCU up to Endgame as this story that built to a conclusion and then also wonder "Why is this continuing past the end of the story"? They didn't build a coherent story, they built a collection of characters that we were interested in and they wove them all into this two part movie that also "ended" the time in the MCU for a few of the performers.

 

Jedi: I have never felt that Jedi wound up the Star Wars story. Lucas didn't want to make it anymore and it wrapped up the immediate aftermath of The Empire Strikes Back. It defeated the Empire in a not especially believable fashion and it tied up the Darth Vader / Luke Skywalker story which started out as more of a side quest.

[Nick1Ø66 8,341]

Yeah, look. I enjoyed the Infinity Saga and thought Endgame was a fitting conclusion. That said, like Chen I'm not a huge MCU fan, but at the same time I don't share Chen's contempt for it. Obviously, I'd never compare Endgame to ROTK. My casual enjoyment of Endgame can't hold a candle to the deep love I have for ROTK, both the book and film.

But..neither Chen nor I are MCU fanboys, and neither of us is really in a position to judge the payoff of Endgame the way an MCU fan is. We can talk all we want about whether it's a proper "resolution" of all the Marvel films, and how much it's really tied into what came before. But you know what? So what.

 

MCU fans can also point out how disjointed and sometimes tenuous the connection between Jackson's LOTR and The Hobbit, and how forced a lot of those connections were in the latter. ROTK is not a conclusion to the "Middle-Earth Saga". It's the conclusion to LOTR. Just as AUJ is not the first chapter in that saga, it's the first film in the Hobbit trilogy. Just as BOTFA is not a "bridge" between the trilogies, no matter how much they tried to force that, it's merely the end of one. 

 

My point is, if Endgame is just satisfying an end to most MCU fans as ROTK is to LOTR fans, that's good enough for me. Like DS9's phenomenal What You Leave Behind, Endgame didn't need to specifically resolve every little plot thread. As it is, I thought Endgame was a pretty damn good finale, and in fact exceeded exceptions where most finales disappoint.

[Chen G. 6,149]

28 minutes ago, Nick1Ø66 said:

MCU fans can also point out how disjointed and sometimes tenuous the connection between Jackson's LOTR and The Hobbit, and how forced a lot of those connections were in the latter. ROTK is not a conclusion to the "Middle-Earth Saga". It's the conclusion to LOTR.

 

What I'm saying is, I don't watch Endgame and get the sense of the grand culmination that one feels having watched even just Lord of the Rings, or the eight Potters, or the classic Star Wars trilogy.

[Rachael Foley 10,174]

58 minutes ago, Tallguy said:

 

People for some reason have come to see the MCU up to Endgame as this story that built to a conclusion and then also wonder "Why is this continuing past the end of the story"? They didn't build a coherent story, they built a collection of characters that we were interested in and they wove them all into this two part movie that also "ended" the time in the MCU for a few of the performers.

 

 

Nah man, they had Phases man.

[Chen G. 6,149]

I mean, Endgame is the natural ending point in that its clearly the big crescendo at the end of the...lets call it suite in this regard. An audience knows that feeling when things come to an end, and having been fired-up, you can't unfire it.

 

Final entries come in many varieties: they can be a big crescendo (Endgame), a farewell to the main character (The Last Crusade) or the terminus of the overriding plot (Return of the King). But in all cases, an audience knows it when they see it.

[Nick1Ø66 8,341]

33 minutes ago, Chen G. said:

 

What I'm saying is, I don't watch Endgame and get the sense of the grand culmination that one feels having watched even just Lord of the Rings, or the eight Potters, or the classic Star Wars trilogy.

I don’t disagree with this. 

[Rachael Foley 10,174]

I believe, if I were human, my response would be: "go to hell".

 

If I were human.

[Chen G. 6,149]

On 22/04/2026 at 5:19 PM, Tallguy said:

Jedi: I have never felt that Jedi wound up the Star Wars story. Lucas didn't want to make it anymore and it wrapped up the immediate aftermath of The Empire Strikes Back

 

That's the Gary Kurtz story and it's probably one Lucas is comfortable with us thinking, but I don't buy it. If at any point, Return of the Jedi was not a resolution but merely Episode Six out of nine, there'd probably be a paper trail to it somewhere. Lucas liked putting down notes, almost stream of consciousness, and apparently Rinzler dug into those pages with fervour. Generally speaking, if something during the development of those films was ever a thing, we have the evidence to back it up.

 

That there's nothing of the kind pointing towards this suggests that's not the case. Return of the Jedi - certainly from the earliest available sketches of it, but probably from before - was always intended to be THE end. Do we know for a fact that was already the case in, say, late 1979? No, but I would guess yes.

 

I do agree the scope of this would-be final confrontation is a disappointing one: apparently the entire Imperial machine is defeated in the literal backwaters of the Galaxy. But plot-wise it's absolutely and completely an ending, and was in every iteration we know of.

[Nick1Ø66 8,341]

 

13 hours ago, Chen G. said:

Return of the Jedi - certainly from the earliest available sketches of it - was always intended to be THE end.

 

I'm not so sure about this. Certainly it was AN end, but I'm not sure Lucas was thinking of it as necessarily THE end. Even dismissing a lot of what he's said as historical revisionism, there's still a lot of evidence that he was thinking of Star Wars in terms of a larger story, albeit on and off and to vary degrees and versions, over the years. Was he tired of Star Wars after ROTJ? Sure. I think that's apparent enough on the screen. 

 

In any event, whatever Lucas and Kurtz were planning, I never felt like ROTJ was the "end" of Star Wars. I can't say I was thinking with any degree of specificity...I wasn’t thinking of things like Prequel and Sequel trilogies. But I always had the feeling there were more untold stories from that world out there. In fact, I was probably of a mind that they wouldn't necessarily involve the central conflict of the Rebellion vs. The Empire, the Skywalkers, etc.

 

[Tallguy 7,387]

3 hours ago, Chen G. said:

That's the Gary Kurtz story and it's probably one Lucas is comfortable with us thinking, but I don't buy it. If at any point, Return of the Jedi was not a resolution but merely Episode Six out of nine, there'd probably be a paper trail to it somewhere. Lucas liked putting down notes, almost stream of consciousness, and apparently Rinzler dug into those pages with fervour. Generally speaking, if something during the development of those films was ever a thing, we have the evidence to back it up.

 

That's kind of my point. By the time they were making it Lucas was saying "That's enough. Wrap it up." But when they were making Empire? At one point Lucas was saying these would be like Bond films. They would go on forever. Maybe Lucas decided he didn't have as many ideas as all that after all.

 

Is this becoming a Star Wars thread because I said the end credits of Return of the King are amazing? Hey! I didn't compare it to Jedi! I compared it to ENDGAME.

 

THIS ISN'T MY FAULT!

 

[Nick1Ø66 8,341]

 

[Chen G. 6,149]

7 hours ago, Tallguy said:

But when they were making Empire? At one point Lucas was saying these would be like Bond films. They would go on forever.

 

I think all of this was pre-"Oh, so Vader is now Luke's daddy" (circa late March 1978).

 

After that point, as far as I can tell, everything was geared towards a resolution in Return of the Jedi.

[Tallguy 7,387]

2 hours ago, Chen G. said:

 

I think all of this was pre-"Oh, so Vader is now Luke's daddy" (circa late March 1978).

 

After that point, as far as I can tell, everything was geared towards a resolution in Return of the Jedi.

 

I'd have to dig up the Time article from 1980, but while it does talk about resolving the Vader plot it also talks about more movies. And not just the prequels. 

 

8 hours ago, Nick1Ø66 said:

 

 

Except Star Wars threads. It's very weird.

[oierem 248]

11 hours ago, Tallguy said:

 

That's kind of my point. By the time they were making it Lucas was saying "That's enough. Wrap it up." But when they were making Empire? At one point Lucas was saying these would be like Bond films. They would go on forever.

 

 

At first it was "the movies will go on forever" (1977-78).

Then it was "it's a three-act trilogy, and then there will be more more" (1979-80)

Then it was "it's a three-act trilogy and that's it for me" (1981-83).

 

Once Empire Strikes Back had a defined structure and plot (early 1978) Jedi was always concieved as an ending of the trilogy.

[Chen G. 6,149]

The official line at that point in time was three trilogies. You gather - certainly in the disseminated Kurtz story - the Emperor wouldn't be overthrown before the last entry. And then - the story goes - Lucas grew weary and moved the Emperor's death up to Return of the Jedi.

 

But we have no paper trail to any such version. There's no sketch, no notes no anything for Return of the Jedi where it didn't end with the Emperor stone-cold dead.

[Nick1Ø66 8,341]

Lucas's primary contribution to the Raiders screenplay.

 

 

[Chen G. 6,149]

10 minutes ago, Nick1Ø66 said:

 

 

Not to derail the thread further, but I only just recently uncovered "story conferences" for Splinter of the Mind's Eye - at the time the intended sequel story to Star Wars for all intents and purposes - where Lucas is like "Yeah, why don't we have Luke fall in-love with Leia and then have her die at the end?"