stewdog1 50 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 I don't think this has been discussed, or at least recently that I recall.What do you think are JW's best and worst end credits?Best:1. ESB (ost) - The way that he merges four (5?) themes and the way they all flow together is just genious.2. Jurassic Park - Sums up the awe of seeing dinos quite well.Worst:1. The Lost World - same as Jurassic Park but does not belong w/ the rest of the film.2. The Last Crusade - To me it seems that the different themes were just spliced together and not much thought went into the order of the themes presented.Dave - Toad the Wet Sprocket Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker 5 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Empire Strikes Back is probably the best, but honorable mention should be made for Superman - The Movie. The credits were running long, so the "Love Theme" was tacked on.Attack of the Clones will get my vote for the worst, since Williams' end title music wasn't even used. It was completely replaced with "Across the Stars".Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewdog1 50 Posted October 21, 2003 Author Share Posted October 21, 2003 but honorable mention should be made for Superman - The Movie. The credits were running long, so the "Love Theme" was tacked on.That is why I didn't include it. Too.... Long.....Attack of the Clones will get my vote for the worst, since Williams' end title music wasn't even used. It was completely replaced with "Across the Stars".NeilWhat I wouldn't give to hear those original end credits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Breathmask 555 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Huh? Aren't the original credits on the OST album?And yes, ESB has one of the best End Credits cues.- Marc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker 5 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Yeah, AOTC's original end titles are on the CD.Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trumpeteer 302 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 I think we're all going to agree that ESB is the best. The worst is probably AOTC, but I'm not too thrilled with the end credits on TPM. Goes from extremely loud to extremely quiet. I remember leaving the theater before the credits were done (a rarity for me in a JW-scored film) because the transition didn't work and I couldn't fully embrace Anakin's theme. I still can't take the transition that well.Jeff -- who would like to hear the original music BEFORE the start of the credits in AOTC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewdog1 50 Posted October 21, 2003 Author Share Posted October 21, 2003 Yeah, AOTC's original end titles are on the CD.NeilI was thinking about the portion right before the end, when the Imperial theme is played. I wish we could get that original version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim Ware 526 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Williams' original music for The Phantom Menace end titles was not used in the film either. The original rendition of Duel of the Fates was more percussive and closely resembled the unused duel cues from reel 6 of the film. It isn't on either of the released CDs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,626 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 The best is when the End Credits suite feature completely different orchestrations of themes than any other recordings:StarWars,CE3K,Raiders,ESB,E.T.,ToD,Return of the Jedi are my favourite.TPM is most disappointing because 1)it's exactly the same as Anakins Theme and Duel of the Fate and 2) it was included on the O.S.T.in Harry Potter,I wish Williams had done something to differenciate the End Credits from the concert versions of the themes.That's exactly the kind of detail that differenciates his recent scores from the 75-85 period.K.M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,626 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 Williams' original music for The Phantom Menace end titles was not used in the film either. uuhh?how do you know this?We know there's alternates DotF cues that weren't used in the movie,but the whole End Credits?why would Williams slap on a edited/pasted version on his O.S.T.album ,doesn't he at least control what cues go on there?K.M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UCFKevin 0 Posted October 21, 2003 Share Posted October 21, 2003 I LIKED AOTC's end credits for the ending of them, just simply amazing. The WORST of all of them is TPM's, there's nothing different in the music at all, it's all totally cut and pasted, no variety or anything at all. But my favorite.....hmm......probably Empire's or Superman's. Or Last Crusades. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin McCallister 0 Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 Indiana Jones and the Temple Of Doom (the COMPLETE version), with Empire as a close second for the best.As for the worst, Hook always bothers me. Don't get me wrong. I LOVE it. But it appears as though cues from the movie were tracked after the initial reprise of the Neverland theme. Couldn't JW have done something a little more original? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hector J. Guzman 1 Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 SUPERMAN!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Barnsbury 8 Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 I agree with KM, it's so much better when the End Credits feature different versions of the themes from the concert arrangements.Best:The Empire Strikes Back - Yoda's Theme, The Imperial March, Han Solo and the Princess . . . ahh, great music, and wonderful segues. Plus the ending with the first 4 notes of the Imperial March is pure brilliance. You can just tell Williams was having fun with this one.E.T. - awesome opening with the piano, and good versions of the main themes. The ending is pretty neat too.Far and Away - absolutely spectacular. This piece takes my breath away each and every time I listen to it. The main theme is one of Williams' best ever.Jurassic Park - beautiful piano playingHarry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone (Harry's Wondrous World) - really great combination of themes from the filmWorst - TPM . . . what more can I say that hasn't been mentioned already?TLW - same as what Dave saidRay Barnsbury Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeinAR 1,949 Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 Close Encounters of the Third KindHarry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone,SupermanStar WarsESBTODET.Hard to chose among them but I did put Close Encounters first for a reason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker 5 Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 Hard to chose among them but I did put Close Encounters first for a reasonBecause you arranged them alphabetically? Which Close Encounters though. The butchered version that appeared in 1977 and 1998 or the original "When You Wish Upon A Star" end titles first heard in 1980?Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,626 Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone (Harry's Wondrous World) - really great combination of themes from the filmentionned this too,but this version of coursehmm,i still say that if he composed that 20 years ago,there would have been a different and separate concert version of Harry's Theme.Jurassic Park - beautiful piano playing well,it's good untill the island fanfare,which is an exact reprise of Journey to the Island for the worst, Hook always bothers me. Don't get me wrong. I LOVE it. But it appears as though cues from the movie were tracked after the initial reprise of the Neverland theme. Couldn't JW have done something a little more original?you know,that is the FIRST time I remember beeing disappointed in Williams,though I really digged that version of the Neverland Theme that was unreleased on the c.d.K.M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogue_Leader 2 Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 The Best would be The Empire Strikes Back. The worst is much harder to answer because there are many choices for it. Simply put it would go to one of the many "REHASH" end credits. You ALL KNOW what the hell I am talking about. The End Credits where John just uses the SAME MUSIC he already used throughtout the score re-spliced (and you know its just re-spliced because it sounds EXACTLY the same). This became a BIG thing with John in the late 90's. I was PISSED AS HELL when he did this with the SW PRequel scores. You think Williams could have AT LEAST shown some friggin creativity with those and created some original music for the end credits like he did with the Classic SW films, but NO he HAD to rehash. Arrrghhh! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoda Longbottom 0 Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 Best:Sabrina's -- I love the extended piano part(TESB's music will for always grab its votes in any thinkable category because there's so much beautiful in it that it's easier to build up on it, but Sabrina's thematically thinner material turned into surprisingly fresh closure, hence my vote)Worst:TPM's -- I agree with all of the said, simply truly unimaginative; any DJ in play with film music could have done a better job... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin 2 Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 I was PISSED AS HELL when he did this with the SW PRequel scores. You think Williams could have AT LEAST shown some friggin creativity with those and created some original music for the end credits like he did with the Classic SW films, but NO he HAD to rehash. Arrrghhh!The AOTC OST has a great end credits track on there. It's not Williams fault Lucas decided not to use it.Justin -Who think the end credits on AOTC is one of the best tracks on the score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stewdog1 50 Posted October 22, 2003 Author Share Posted October 22, 2003 I'm assuming that the rehash of concert themes during the end credits is possibly due to being cheaper for the studio rather than laziness.But then I get to thinking, why do the concert themes have to be there in the first place? Why did The Patriot ost begin w/ a concert suite and end w/ the same. TPM, why the two concert themes and stick them into the end credits?So what is it? Laziness or Studio execs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elmo Lewis 6 Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 honorable mention should be made for Superman - The Movie. The credits were running long, so the "Love Theme" was tacked on.I can see why the mention, but I don't understand why "honorable". They just added a track after the inteded end credits music. Pretty much what Spielberg did at the end of Saving Private Ryan.My favorite end credits will forever be, after ESB of course, Schindler's List, with that powerful rendition of the theme on the piano. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lurker 5 Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 Honorable mention becasue it uses music that wasn't inteded to be used for the end titles, and it wasn't sloppily edited to fit. There are some cuts, but nothing to drastic.Neil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeinAR 1,949 Posted October 22, 2003 Share Posted October 22, 2003 The butchered version that appeared in 1977 The original version as heard on the "album" from the film. I like to think of the 1980's version as the butchered one. I love the interpelation, rather than hearing the actually when you wish upon a star. And figure this into the mix, for me its hard to seperate the music in CE3K from the visuals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,626 Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 Honorable mention becasue it uses music that wasn't inteded to be used for the end titles, and it wasn't sloppily edited to fit. There are some cuts, but nothing to drastic.Neilyou take this very literally.As long as I have Williams unaltered "End Credits" cue on the c.d.,I'm happy,i don't give a hoot how they make it fit in the film.That's why i didn't mention AotC.K.M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trumpeteer 302 Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 I'll go on record as saying that I don't mind these so-called "rehashings" of themes in the end credits. They act as nice reprises, reminding us of some of our favorite scenes that we just saw. Take Minority Report, for example. After my first viewing, my favorite scene in the film was the Spyders. And was I happy to hear the theme reprised in the credits! And it sounded just like the version in the film with slightly different orchestrations and cuts. But I didn't mind.My only problem comes when the music is badly cut (as in AOTC and TPM) or uses dull themes. Which is rare for JW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,626 Posted October 23, 2003 Share Posted October 23, 2003 And it sounded just like the version in the film with slightly different orchestrations. It's not re-hash then,just like Yoda's Theme in the End credits of ESB is NOT re-hash from Yoda's theme concert version.K.M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogue_Leader 2 Posted October 24, 2003 Share Posted October 24, 2003 Is Williams going to once again do a rehash "End Credits" for Episode III?HE FRIGGIN BETTER NOT! Come on man! At the very least make the last PRequel film end on a positive musical note. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray Barnsbury 8 Posted October 24, 2003 Share Posted October 24, 2003 His AOTC End Credits were not a rehash (the track on the album). Well, perhaps the love theme was performed the same, but the Anakin's Theme/Across the Stars/Imperial March ending is brilliant.Ray Barnsbury Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogue_Leader 2 Posted October 24, 2003 Share Posted October 24, 2003 His AOTC End Credits were not a rehash (the track on the album). Well, perhaps the love theme was performed the same, but the Anakin's Theme/Across the Stars/Imperial March ending is brilliant.Ray BarnsburyThe Love Theme was performed the same. OK yeah that last bit wasn't, but the first part was. Th 2nd part was too brief too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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