WHAT?!

[Sandor 459]

Maybe this has already been discussed or perhaps it's a rumor, but I just found out that it's very likely that on the DVD version of Star Wars A New Hope A PORTION OF FANTASTIC MUSIC HAS BEEN OMITTED!!!

I'm refering to the scene where the X-Wing Fighters start to "dive" towards the death star (force theme music playing, mainly on brass).

A great musical moment, but appearenlty Ben Burrt thought it took away too much of his sound effects.

Is this true?

Please tell me it's just a rumor...

Bye,

Roald

[Chris ChrusherComix 27]

Nope. No rumor, unfortunately, Roald.

Check Neil's post tacked to the top of the forum. It's shameful, I agree, but it still won't stop me from getting the set.

[Mr. Breathmask 480]

I guess Neil posting this as an announcement wasn't that bad after all. I stand corrected...

[Lurker 5]

Roald, go here. In this thread I even provide audio samples. And now I'm curious as to where you heard this.

Neil

[ChrisAfonso 159]

Neil, I still can't open your audio sample... I've tried winamp, iTunes, RealOne and Quicktime...

[Lurker 5]

I have no idea, Chris. This board is the only place where anyone seems to be having issues playing the files.

I've downloaded them from these links and they work in Quicktime, iTunes and VLC just fine for me.

Neil

[Danielle 0]

And now I'm curious as to where you heard this.

I noticed that someone had copied your announcement into one of the OT DVD threads on the TF.N forums... That's a pretty quick way to spread news around.

[Lurker 5]

Was it some jerk named "Neil S. Bulk" or some other jerk?

Neil

[Danielle 0]

Found it -

http://boards.theforce.net/Classic_Trilogy...2/16704315/p158

About a third of the way down the page.

[Lurker 5]

I've been Hornered!!!

Some of my favorite quotes from that thread....

"take everything "Neil" says regarding the SE's/Prequels with a grain of salt.

He hates ROTJ, he hates the SE's, he hates the PT and he hates the new DVD editions.

The poor lad only likes ANH & ESB O-OT editions.

I guess that says enough.

The music segment only is muted by the sound effects for 4 seconds, that's all. He made it look like ANH was completely destroyed by it. "

"John Williams fans are *scary* They really seem to think he's some sort of Mozart and that the various films he is *employed* to provide background music for exist only to showcase his 'brilliance'."

Neil

[KarmBee 0]

"John Williams fans are *scary* They really seem to think he's some sort of Mozart and that the various films he is *employed* to provide background music for exist only to showcase his 'brilliance'."  

They aren't?!?!?!?!?!

[Jeshopk 8]

The music is not completely dialed out, you can barely just hear it still. BARELY. Listen for the trumpet overtones on a wide dynamic range headphone set.

[SeekUYoda 0]

My favorite bit of that thread:

"John Williams fans are *scary* They really seem to think he's some sort of Mozart and that the various films he is *employed* to provide background music for exist only to showcase his 'brilliance'."

Obviously they've never heard Lucas or Spielberg praising Williams' work or they wouldn't say such things. And of course he's employed to write music. That's the way it's always worked, back past Mozart - composers used to spent a lot of time searching for a patron who would pay them to write music for their court musicians. Composers in general, it seems, write music for free in order to learn more about music and to find someone who will pay them to write more music. Some were fortunate enough to be independently wealthy but probably sought out commissions anyway!

[Jim Ware 428]

I'll be the first to say that as a contemporary composer of film music Mr. Williams has distinguished himself with some very fine and memorable work. However, it is just background music! Especially for the action scenes.  

Kubrick chopped up *real* composers, Scorsese cuts and pastes the work of great pop songs - as much as I'd prefer an immaculate soundtrack, it doesn't lessen my viewing pleasure for a few bits and pieces of music to be put in the background...that's what it's for, anyway.

Real composers? As opposed to what? Unreal composers? LOL

At least they linked to my post at the Home Theater Forum instead of Hornering it.

[Jim Ware 428]

And about the music missing. I love that part, and I highly doubt Lucas would simply delete it. That sound clip from that forum could be EASILY faked. It's not hard to make a file like that, and the way it just fades back in, reeks of amateurishness.  

[Magnus 0]

And about the music missing. I love that part, and I highly doubt Lucas would simply delete it. That sound clip from that forum could be EASILY faked. It's not hard to make a file like that, and the way it just fades back in, reeks of amateurishness.  

well that is Ben Burtt for you

[Luke Skywalker 1,285]

Maybe this has already been discussed or perhaps it's a rumor, but I just found out that it's very likely that on the DVD version of Star Wars A New Hope A PORTION OF FANTASTIC MUSIC HAS BEEN OMITTED!!!

I'm refering to the scene where the X-Wing Fighters start to "dive" towards the death star (force theme music playing, mainly on brass).

A great musical moment, but appearenlty Ben Burrt thought it took away too much of his sound effects.

Is this true?

Please tell me it's just a rumor...

Bye,

Roald

Thats how one does not take Neil Seriously LOL

Man, didnt you visited the forum?

[Lurker 5]

And about the music missing. I love that part, and I highly doubt Lucas would simply delete it. That sound clip from that forum could be EASILY faked. It's not hard to make a file like that, and the way it just fades back in, reeks of amateurishness.  

well that is Ben Burtt for you

Magnus, Jim made that music only audio sample after hearing the actual 2004 re-mix. Hence his laughter. He made it to demonstrate how the music is cut in the movie. It was only later that I made the comparison that uses the actual mixes that shows the music that is dialed out.

Neil

[Danielle 0]

I'll be the first to say that as a contemporary composer of film music Mr. Williams has distinguished himself with some very fine and memorable work. However, it is just background music! Especially for the action scenes.  

Kubrick chopped up *real* composers, Scorsese cuts and pastes the work of great pop songs - as much as I'd prefer an immaculate soundtrack, it doesn't lessen my viewing pleasure for a few bits and pieces of music to be put in the background...that's what it's for, anyway.

Real composers? As opposed to what? Unreal composers? LOL

Hehe, that was my favourite bit too. I'd like to know what defines someone as a "real" composer, opposed to a "fake" one. Maybe the fake ones are animatronic dummies standing on a podium (well... that would account for Media Ventures, but what about all the others? ).

[Justin 2]

How does Darth_China know Neil?

Justin - Who's gonna go listen to some background music for Star Wars...

[Lurker 5]

How does Darth_China know Neil?

I was wondering that, too. And why is my name in quotes?

Neil

[KarmBee 0]

I'll be the first to say that as a contemporary composer of film music Mr. Williams has distinguished himself with some very fine and memorable work. However, it is just background music! Especially for the action scenes.  

Who ever said this should try listening to a great action sequence without the music then. I can only think of a few where an action sequence wasn't benefited by music. One of which is the Omaha Beach invasion in Saving Private Ryan.

[John Crichton 4]

The bar fight in Raiders is score free and works pretty well without it. And of course the light saber deul between Vader and Obi-Wan in ANH.

[Chris ChrusherComix 27]

"John Williams fans are *scary* They really seem to think he's some sort of Mozart and that the various films he is *employed* to provide background music for exist only to showcase his 'brilliance'."

Yes, I do think that. And, although I first balked at that, in hindsight I realize that I'm VERY, VERY scary to Star Wars nerds. I've seen their kind in comic book shops, collectible conventions, and Star Wars movie openings. They are all extremely acne-covered and wimpy looking with coke-bottle glasses, or extremely fat, hairy, with extremely bad body odor. None could get a girlfriend, and if they did... whatch out what they look like. I have been found beating on them all over the planet! They are good jobbers.

I've read some of their threads before. They are utterly clueless folk. Now I go back to read what they say and make comments:

1. People who use George Lucas as their avatars HAVE to be EXTREMELY weird people.

2. And yes, it does seem like that person who is haterating Neil does seem to act like he knows him. Hmm.... maybe we have a double agent here? Or could he know Neil from another forum?

3. The "Clear Water" jabronie has Hayden/Anakin as his avatar! LOL!!! I mean... putting down Williams' music and talent is one very mockable thing, like he's a snooty high-class guy or something... but having that as an avatar just negates that premise... the dude or dudette's just a joke! ! Maybe it's Ford Thaxton, wishing he was a slim, handsome man like Hayden! LOL!!! (OK... now that's mean... I take that part back, )

4. Damn... I have to admit... they have some nice lookin' banners on their sites, though.

[Chris ChrusherComix 27]

*UPDATE*!!!!

I listened to Neil's file again after what has been reported as to music still being there! They are right! THE MUSIC IS THERE! It's just SO SO SO SO SOOO quiet that only the loudest brass can be heard!!! I heard it... just muted to almost inaudible levels.

-Chris, Who wanted to post a "You suck!" to that ClearWaterRevival nerd, but then I'd have to become a member. I won't lower myself. LOL

[Lurker 5]

So when "Standing By" ends you can hear the Force Theme? I must be deaf. And my friends who alerted me to this must be deaf. And we must all have substandard equipment. Or the mix could be fucked up. Which seems more likely?

Neil

[King Mark 2,924]

I have never considered this perticular brass fanfare to be one of Williams all time best screen moments.I might have noticed if,for example,they dialed out the brass fanfare at the end of Yoda Lifts the X-Wing.And I can think of a hundred more examples that I would have found more shocking than this and be personnaly outraged.See ,when I play a JW c.d.,I usually play my favourite 10-15 seconds parts over and over and over again,this is just not one of them for me.

With that in mind,I guess if you consider this a "Williams all time best score moments",then I understand why you would be upset.

Don't get me started on the soundmix for the main theme to Jurassic Park when they arrive on the island and look at the first Braschiosaurus.

K.M.

[Chris ChrusherComix 27]

Neil, I just listened to the very clip that you put online. I don't have an agenda or anything, I'm just stating what I heard.

My setup is this:

1. File played on Quicktime.

2. Played through PC Stereo Speakers.

(split with, and...)

3. Played on a Dolby Surround Pro-Logic surround reciever.

Through the setup I have, I played that clip repeatedly a few times with the volume extremely loud (I have no close neighbors and can play as loud as my speakers can tolerate, as KM can verify).

I can distinctly hear the trumpets blaring, albeit EXTREMELY muted and softly... over this section. It's there, just muted to near nothingness. I'm not the only one who hears it, obviously. But I can see how anyone can miss it, because I played it two times before and didn't catch it. It's basically muted so much, with the sound effects blasting... that it is essentially deleted... but... it's just BARELY there.

Try it again. Who can hear it and who can't?

Still, your anger is warranted. Even silenced to near-deletion, it's still an outrage for most Williams fans and all OT purists. However, like KM, it's not my favorite-ever piece of Williams music either. I mean, it's certainly great, as the whole score is top-notch, but like he said, if other parts were deleted, some really important moment kind of stuff... like the music before the Death Star explosion or something really tense and climatic like that THEN I'd be completely outraged.

Just give me every version on DVD or DVD-R and I'll be happy. Star Wars is so re-watchable, you could get bored of just the same version. Watch a different one every tiem. Be happy! Enjoy added scenes and little extras in each. That's a fun thing for me. And no, I don't want all things with a Star Wars tag on it, but every version that exists... I'd like a copy of, legit if available.

-Chris, sick of constantly editing his typos... LOL (I don't know if it's my keyboards or what... I've gone through 4 of them in a year and a half... different keypads setting my balance all off....

[Luke Skywalker 1,285]

Phew!

I'm happy that your description of Star Wars nerd does not suit me. Being a JW fan must be good for the Health

[Chris ChrusherComix 27]

Yes. Star Wars nerds are immediatly brought out of nerd-dom by being a big John Williams fan.

A Star wars fan that does not love or deeply respect the music of John Williams is the equivelent of a Trekkie, or (for the ever so chummy lad named Stefancos...) a Nerys Trekker.

Alas, the mighty Chrusher has demolished many a Trekker, Trekkie and Star Wars nerd. It is quite fun. It's especially gleeful when the Lucas worshipper raises his hand and attempts force lightning or force push. I then blow up their craniums by focusing my immense brain-powers into their skull, with death their only release. Only the smartest SW nerds can survive this. Those usually run, but of those who don't, these poor fools pull out their lightsabers and are forced to learn the hard way on that round, hollow-plastic cannot harm an opponent in combat, but when I wrench them from their weak, sweaty little palms and proceed to force the wrong end where the sun don't shine, they are left realizing that all their dreams are shattered... and of their pathetic little belief that they are all "chosen ones" is utterly defeated. At that very moment, I let them know my alias, Darth Akuma. Their few women, (and I mean few) seeng their de-evolved boyfriends utterly dominated, ache to be with me. However, they are hideous beasts who I sick my padawan, Darth Rungnapha upon. Her skills of the ancient art of Thai kickboxing are quite deadly, and she is as jealous as she is beautiful, and lethal to all but the one she loves. (That would be me. )

Trekkies? Bah. Utter jokes. For them, one must be armed with deoderant cans, soaps, and anti-perspirant bars. When they start balking in Klingon and raising their phasers, I proceed to reign blows upon them, until the beeps and whistles that their toy guns soon fade into the beeps and whistles of hospital respirators and EKG monitors. They also are usually being prepped for immediate surgical removal of their communicators, which somehow found their way deep into their bowels, and that they last saw when they were attempting to ask Scottie to beam them up. Yet they barely had the time to realize that their souls were nearly beamed up into the afterlife.

Yes Luke, you are safe. John Williams fans know the true spirit of Star Wars and are granted a pass from certain destruction, not the little twerps that run around in black cloaks and devil-face paint head-banging to the Backstreet Boys, who are clearly in need of painful lessons being taught to them by their peers. The John Williams "Towner Knights".

-Darth Akuma

PS- Steef was once a member of the Phantom Trio of Towner Knights, alias "Darth Nerys: the cross-dresser", until he was banned from membership after being found nude trekking to his message board posts.

[Mr. Breathmask 480]

I used to hang out at StarWars.com. Until I found it I love the Star Wars mainly for the music. I got the SE albums, and I found this place. It has been my salvation.

- Marc, hallelujah!

[Chris ChrusherComix 27]

You have been saved, Marc! Just stay away from Steef's guidance and you will do well.