Jump to content

Guest

Recommended Posts

I have the ability to read a full score and hear it exactly how it will sound fully orchestrated. I can't judge what emotion the players will put in, or if Williams will do something totally not in the score (occasionally) but I have indeed experienced the whole score and how it will sound.

I also have this jedi-like ability. Send me the scores and I will confirm if this score is less great that War Horse.

With experience and years of training, its quite common to be able to play the music in your head after having analyzed the score. It isn't ridiculous to suggest that one can compare the two works on a technical level based on the scores alone.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wow, the reactions to FilmComposer's posts are a little shocking to me. He never said his opinions are absolute, he just said he personally didn't like the score as much as JW's previous efforts, and he was sorry that the first news we hear of it is negative.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have the ability to read a full score and hear it exactly how it will sound fully orchestrated. I can't judge what emotion the players will put in, or if Williams will do something totally not in the score (occasionally) but I have indeed experienced the whole score and how it will sound.

I also have this jedi-like ability. Send me the scores and I will confirm if this score is less great that War Horse.

With experience and years of training, its quite common to be able to play the music in your head after having analyzed the score. It isn't ridiculous to suggest that one can compare the two works on a technical level based on the scores alone.

Well said! and I was just being goofy suggesting that Jedi like powers are needed. :)

I know that works can be compared very well with just the scores, like you said. I do quite a bit of score reading regularly so I've been improving at this skill myself.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wow, the reactions to FilmComposer's posts are a little shocking to me. He never said his opinions are absolute, he just said he personally didn't like the score as much as JW's previous efforts, and he was sorry that the first news we hear of it is negative.

I'm sorry, but his hateful, mean-spirited attacks on John Williams have no place here.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi gang

A little later this autumn, and I'll give more details nearer the time, look out for a piece I'm writing that relates to 'Lincoln'. It will be published in one of the film magazines that some of you may know.

Thanks!

James

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I already had to laugh at "Lincoln gets 6 out of 10 - sorry for the bad news"

BAD NEWS?! REALLY!?! YOU didn't like it that much and that's bad news?!?! The trained ability to read musical scores and hear them in your head is one thing (a great thing!) but thinking that it is YOU and who can decide if something is good or bad for others.

To be fair, I think he means it as his opinion, and not one set in stone at that.

he clearly ment to say (in my opinion)

"Hey, I can read music, I read it - it's mediocre, that's how it is - I know you people were expecting more, but hey I - the ONE who can.. I who can make paper sing in my head, do know it is not that good.. so that's how it is.. end of luck - baaad news"

But the bad news has nothing to do with being able to read an orchestral score after much practice (which I don't question, after all, he better be able to do so!) I think he simply said bad news because he personaly thought it isn't as good as some people were expecting.We may be overthiking this.

The strange part of his message is the "because there's sarcastic people on this forum, I won't share fun info", which, given that we're rarely mean spirited and the ones who would enjoy and appreciate such a thing, is weird. I would still like to hear that, if it was big enough to mention it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I already had to laugh at "Lincoln gets 6 out of 10 - sorry for the bad news"

BAD NEWS?! REALLY!?! YOU didn't like it that much and that's bad news?!?! The trained ability to read musical scores and hear them in your head is one thing (a great thing!) but thinking that it is YOU and who can decide if something is good or bad for others.

To be fair, I think he means it as his opinion, and not one set in stone at that.

he clearly ment to say (in my opinion)

"Hey, I can read music, I read it - it's mediocre, that's how it is - I know you people were expecting more, but hey I - the ONE who can.. I who can make paper sing in my head, do know it is not that good.. so that's how it is.. end of luck - baaad news"

But the bad news has nothing to do with being able to read an orchestral score after much practice (which I don't question, after all, he better be able to do so!) I think he simply said bad news because he personaly thought it isn't as good as some people were expecting.We may be overthiking this.

The strange part of his message is the "because there's sarcastic people on this forum, I won't share fun info", which, given that we're rarely mean spirited and the ones who would enjoy and appreciate such a thing, is weird. I would still like to hear that, if it was big enough to mention it.

Yes ,I guess you're right.. I don't understand what one wants to achieve with such actions and sayings, it seems he really needs his reaction to show off, which is perfectly fine if that makes one happy - it doesn't make him very sympathetic, but then again it doesn't have to..

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Actually, I don't really blame him. Someone who doesn't post here too often and is not used to the humor of the forum could certainly come away thinking a lot of things are mean spirited and too sarcastic. We're accustomed to how the regulars act, but someone who is more of an "outsider" on the forum can interpret things quite differently. Just look at the opinions of us from people on FSM, for example - though I think in reality we're the more sensible group!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We're the center of the universe after all, the single beacon of light in the darkness of internet, we're the thing they refer to in religion as "second coming", we're the Ones.

And we are also arseholes. ;)

Thanks for the info, FilmComposer518. I'm atually looking forward to listening to the whole score. Restrained Williams doesn't mean bad Williams in my book and I'm pretty sure it will end up being Koray Savas' favourite score very soon.

Karol

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'll probably enjoy this one. I'm curious.

Actually, I don't really blame him. Someone who doesn't post here too often and is not used to the humor of the forum could certainly come away thinking a lot of things are mean spirited and too sarcastic. We're accustomed to how the regulars act, but someone who is more of an "outsider" on the forum can interpret things quite differently. Just look at the opinions of us from people on FSM, for example - though I think in reality we're the more sensible group!

Yes, I think this is it. Plus this forum goes in joke after in joke after in joke....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm completely confident "Lincoln" will prove a beautiful score. The little snippet in the teaser seems very fitting, and wonderfully tender, "fatherly" even...

As to reading music and getting a complete internal "aural view", it is a fairly normal ability

one acquires after a good deal of time and effort. I will stress, however, that it is a very "personal" ability, and as such, rather fallible.

Pitch, rhythm, harmony and orchestration are easy enough, although it gets tougher the more dense the music is. But phrasing, pacing, energy and expression -where so much of the music lies!- are then contingent on our own

interpretation, and this is where we might err and falter...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, I was certainly being a bit sarcastic, but I wasn't really questioning that a trained musician is going to be able to read a written score and understand to a certain extent what it is going to sound like (give us snots SOME credit. ;) )

I was responding more to that, as Roald pointed out, he was here months before TinTin was released, dubbing it "Williams on autopilot", and now is making similar judgements about Lincoln.

I, at least, find that Williams' scores (especially these more low-key drama scores) tend to take time to grow on me; I merely suggest that Mr 518 may find it the same.

I do agree with Joe that if you don't read here much, we could certainly seem like a bunch of jerks, but I didn't intend to come across as such. (This is part of why my postcount is low, I usually put a lid on my pithy, sarcastic comments before actually posting)

I do think that if he works in the industry he should have thicker skin though; I'm sure there are much worse types than myself, Wojo and Bloodboy wandering about Hollywood.;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As to reading music and getting a complete internal "aural view", it is a fairly normal ability

one acquires after a good deal of time and effort. I will stress, however, that it is a very "personal" ability, and as such, rather fallible.

Pitch, rhythm, harmony and orchestration are easy enough, although it gets tougher the more dense the music is. But phrasing, pacing, energy and expression -where so much of the music lies!- are then contingent on our own

interpretation, and this is where we might err and falter...

I would add it's very difficult to get a complete view of the score...so you really just hear bits of it and tune in and out of the rest in an unexplainable sequence. Especially if it's a John Williams' score.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Actually I did almost say "Tin Tin" just to see if I could get the usual Leblanc reaction, but thought better of it. And then I messed it up anyway.

I'm disappointed that I didn't get the full "Capital T, lowercase i..." etc.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well Joey does it to annoy me, but when a new/occasional poster does it its because they don't know any better.

Joe enjoys the fact that it annoys you. Tintin...TinTin, it still sounds the same. hell even John Williams used TinTin, and he's never incorrect.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

John Williams did not use TinTin. Anywhere he references the character in his original handwritten sketches, he just writes "Tin"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wow, there are even more sarcastic snots on this board than the last time I posted here! Thought I'd update you all with some fun behind the scenes info with this score, as I did for War Horse and Tintin, but so far the majority of the posts in response to mine have been the above piddling little wastes of time. Forget it.

And by the way, being able to read an orchestral score and hear it aren't superpowers - they are musical powers. Judging from your avatar, let me put this in terms you can understand:

Thank you for your behind the scene infos. They are certainly appreciated but you should grow a thicker skin on the internet. This board is one of the best forums on filmmusic which is your and our shared interest and joy. It would be great to see you participate a bit more in serious discussion about scores etc like you did on the Harry Potter DHpart1 score.

Sarcasm, jokes etc all await you but usually there is no need to be too concerned with that. If you really want to talk more about the Lincoln score just do it for those who are interested (like me) and ignore the others.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wow, there are even more sarcastic snots on this board than the last time I posted here! Thought I'd update you all with some fun behind the scenes info with this score, as I did for War Horse and Tintin, but so far the majority of the posts in response to mine have been the above piddling little wastes of time. Forget it.

And by the way, being able to read an orchestral score and hear it aren't superpowers - they are musical powers. Judging from your avatar, let me put this in terms you can understand:

Thank you for your behind the scene infos. They are certainly appreciated but you should grow a thicker skin on the internet. This board is one of the best forums on filmmusic which is your and our shared interest and joy. It would be great to see you participate a bit more in serious discussion about scores etc like you did on the Harry Potter DHpart1 score.

Sarcasm, jokes etc all await you but usually there is no need to be too concerned with that. If you really want to talk more about the Lincoln score just do it for those who are interested (like me) and ignore the others.

This.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have the ability to read a full score and hear it exactly how it will sound fully orchestrated. I can't judge what emotion the players will put in, or if Williams will do something totally not in the score (occasionally) but I have indeed experienced the whole score and how it will sound.

I also have this jedi-like ability. Send me the scores and I will confirm if this score is less great that War Horse.

With experience and years of training, its quite common to be able to play the music in your head after having analyzed the score. It isn't ridiculous to suggest that one can compare the two works on a technical level based on the scores alone.

Well said! and I was just being goofy suggesting that Jedi like powers are needed. :)

Then apologies on my part. I thought that was a sarcastic attack on filmcomposer here.

I know that works can be compared very well with just the scores, like you said. I do quite a bit of score reading regularly so I've been improving at this skill myself.

Indeed, I myself spend time studying scores to develop this skill as well. Having said that, Marcus brought up a good point when he mentioned that you miss out on a lot of the musicality when it comes to just reading the scores. And often musicality can end up being the work's greatest asset.

Oh well, I look forward to hearing more from filmcomposer about this score.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mahler often changed a lot of things after listening to the first performances, and so did Brahms with his symphonies, who only after having listened to them several times (and rewrite what he wasn't satisfied with) did he publish the scores.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have the ability to read a full score and hear it exactly how it will sound fully orchestrated. I can't judge what emotion the players will put in, or if Williams will do something totally not in the score (occasionally) but I have indeed experienced the whole score and how it will sound.

I also have this jedi-like ability. Send me the scores and I will confirm if this score is less great that War Horse.

With experience and years of training, its quite common to be able to play the music in your head after having analyzed the score. It isn't ridiculous to suggest that one can compare the two works on a technical level based on the scores alone.

Well said! and I was just being goofy suggesting that Jedi like powers are needed. :)

Then apologies on my part. I thought that was a sarcastic attack on filmcomposer here.

I know that works can be compared very well with just the scores, like you said. I do quite a bit of score reading regularly so I've been improving at this skill myself.

Indeed, I myself spend time studying scores to develop this skill as well. Having said that, Marcus brought up a good point when he mentioned that you miss out on a lot of the musicality when it comes to just reading the scores. And often musicality can end up being the work's greatest asset.

Oh well, I look forward to hearing more from filmcomposer about this score.

No need for apologies, k.k. I realize I came across sounding sarcasticly jerk-ish. LOL...good old internet.

But yes...the musicality: we humans can really add a lot to the music. No way any robot orchestras are replacing us any time soon :) .....I hope!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

But yes...the musicality: we humans can really add a lot to the music. No way any robot orchestras are replacing us any time soon :) .....I hope!!

I'm sure Emily Howell would beg to differ ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Mahler often changed a lot of things after listening to the first performances, and so did Brahms with his symphonies, who only after having listened to them several times (and rewrite what he wasn't satisfied with) did he publish the scores.

Good points about Mahler and Brahms. Brahms was so insecure about those symphonies. As a side note, from most favorite to least Brahms Symphonies are No. 2, No. 4, No. 3, No.1 :)

But yes...the musicality: we humans can really add a lot to the music. No way any robot orchestras are replacing us any time soon :) .....I hope!!

I'm sure Emily Howell would beg to differ ;)

I shall watch her career with great interest!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well Joey does it to annoy me, but when a new/occasional poster does it its because they don't know any better.

Joe enjoys the fact that it annoys you. Tintin...TinTin, it still sounds the same. hell even John Williams used TinTin, and he's never incorrect.

He did write "Darth Vadar" above cues in his ESB manuscript

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Full trailer to be released in a Spielberg moment of glory later this afternoon. Can't wait to watch.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 weeks later...

So apparently there was a test screening of the film and there have been some reactions reported from the audiance. A very negative one has been quoted by most blogs (obviously!) but this article shows some other opinions saying the film was good;

http://www.ropeofsil...post-and-scorn/

Link to comment
Share on other sites

"NOw to tally the score, James on this board liked it alot. A girl on twitter who supposedly saw it recently liked it quite a bit. A guy (who may or may not have seen it) on the MOvie Awards page said he really like it. And another twitter guy said it was good, the whole cast was great especially Tommy Lee Jones.."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi gang

Just a note to say please do look out for Moviescope magazine, the next issue of which should be out in late October. It will include an interview I've done with a filmmaker which relates to 'Lincoln'. I'll post more details here soon.

Thanks so much.

James

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Guidelines.