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Harry Potter and The Prisoner of Azkaban has Been Nominated


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See here the film's fault. It also suffers from repetitiviness, in content and emotion.

I agree. I remember in the cinema thinking "If i see one more shot of Jesus falling over in slow motion carrying the crucifix, and with the low camera angle looking up , i'm gonna scream". That was the problem with Mel's film (imo). He was trying to rub it in your face every 30 seconds -"Oh look at the suffering...isn't it terrible". The audience had no freedom. He was trying to "impose" emotion.

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But, honestly, even with it's extreme portayal of human suffering I still thought the film was very good. There were so many moments I was genuinely moved by the experience.

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Honestly, I wasn't moved by it at all. I found it to be pure voyeurism. Showing beautifully photographed violent torture (mostly based on the visions of a 18th century nun) was all it was.

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Alex Cremers

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I thoroughly enjoyed the film. I didn't feel the emotion was an imposition. Gibson just told the story at its supposedly "accurate" level of gruesomeness. And it shocked and moved me, imagining myself in Jesus' position. I mean, what would Jesus drive, er, feel?

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Everyone will always disagree on whether the emotions generated by a film are honest and authentic, or just artificially synthesized. I happen to think that the end of E.T. was manipulative (particularly with Williams's music going into heart-tugging and bombastic overdrive), or "imposing," if you like; most people here don't. Similarly, plenty of folks thought Finding Neverland (both film and score) was bereft of sentimentality while others thought it wallowed in it shamelessly. And that's fine.

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mostly based on the visions of a 18th century nun

I don't want to turn this thread into some kind of religious flame-war (against the rules right?), but the Bible is never as detailed about the tortures as Gibson's film is. Gibson obviousley HAD to base a lot of his material on those visions because, for instance, the Bible states in only one of the Gospels that Jesus was scourged, but it never describes how severe, how long or with what kind of whips; just that they scourged him. Also when they pull Jesus' arm out on the cross; that's also not in the Bible.

So for me as a film I find it powerful and stunning, but as an accurate retelling of the last days of Jesus based on the accounts of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John it is in parts highly speculative.

Ok, let's end The Passion discussion guys. Please. For some of us religion is very personal and already stirred up some controversy on this board in the past. I guess people come to the general discussion area to discuss John Williams, film music and such. And to be honest so do I.

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Well, the Passion had some of the most stunning cinematography I've ever seen, and was a beautifully directed film. It sure looks like it costed much more than it actually did to make.

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I chose not to view The Passion.

I generally go to the cinema to enjoy myself and to be entertained.

The depection of horrific torture only for the sake of just showing a lot of blood and violence is not something that drives me to visit the cinema, even if it is done to Christ.

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The depection of horrific torture only for the sake of just showing a lot of blood and violence...

Considering Gibson's background I sincerely believe that he made this film with the best of intentions and that his heart was definately in the right place. Therefore I don't agree with your ...only for the sake of.... statement.

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The depection of horrific torture only for the sake of just showing a lot of blood and violence...

Considering Gibson's background I sincerely believe that he made this film with the best of intentions and that his heart was definately in the right place. Therefore I don't agree with your ...only for the sake of.... statement even though the end result may be very offending to some people.

I know, but since Gibson's viewpoints and beliefs regarding this matter are definatly not shared by me, it would not be possible for me to watch The Passion and be moved or inspired by it.

So if the films central message (depecting the suffing of Christ, and how that for some reason means the human race is in debt to him) is lost on me, only the violence remains.

And i'm utterly uninterested in violence alone.

Don't get me wrong, I consider Gibson to be a good film maker, I liked The Man with No Face, I love Braveheart, but i'll pass on the Passion.

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So if the films central message (depecting the suffing of Christ, and how that for some reason means the human race is in debt to him) is lost on me, only the violence remains.

That's true. If you don't understand the meaning of his death than the suffering and violence seem so meaningless and the whole film functions more or less as an exploitation film. Then you made a wise decision. Without some background knowledge concerning God's purpose behind it all the film almost seems unneedfully evil and pointless.

This was my last comment on The Passion. Promise!

Does anyone think that the deaths of Goldsmith and Bernstein has had an affect on the voting for the best score category? I mean these giants of film music have been overlooked severly during their careers and although the Academy has been kind to Williams in the past, the years since Schindler's List have been somewhat cold. So many nominations - more than most composers would recieve during their lifetimes! - but no award... What do you think?

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Without some background knowledge concerning God's purpose behind it all the film almost seems unneedfully evil and pointless.

Are you calling me ignorrant?

I have the background knowledge and insight, but not the believe.

This was my last comment on The Passion. Promise!

Does anyone think that the deaths of Goldsmith and Bernstein has had an affect on the voting for the best score category? I mean these giants of film music have been overlooked severly during their careers and although the Academy has been kind to Williams in the past, the years since Schindler's List have been somewhat cold. So many nominations - more than most composers would recieve during their lifetimes! - but no award... What do you think?

Williams just beat Alfred Newman in the number of nominations recieved, the academy have nothing to apologize for to Williams in that regard.

Compared to Goldsmith, who was robbed of his rightfully deserved Oscar time and again (TMP lost out to A Little Romance WTF!!!), Williams is very lucky indeed.

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The Academy will look pretty stupid if JW did not win again this year. If there is one thing the Academy hates, it is to look stupid. After all, everybody knows the music from Harry Potter. Who can hum the music from Passion or the Village? Not me. If JW has won in the past few years, he might not win this year, but it has been over ten years. Its high time for him to win again, and the Academy knows it. Also, like I said earlier, Shore got two for LOTR-trilogy. If Williams got none for the HP music, which is just as popular (if not more so), the Academy will have all the HP fans out there (and there are quite a few) against it. So JW will win this year, in all likelihood.

:thumbup:

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The Academy will look pretty stupid if JW did not win again this year.If there is one thing the Academy hates, it is to look stupid. After all, everybody knows the music from Harry Potter. Who can hum the music from Passion or the Village?

Correct me if i'm wrong, but since when hummebility a deciding factor in deciding if a score is Oscar worthy?

I can hum AND whistle Axel F. from Bevely Hills Cop, does that make it a viable Oscar winner?

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After all, everybody knows the music from Harry Potter. Who can hum the music from Passion or the Village?

Isn't that a little like saying: "Hey everyone knows Eminem! So Eminem will win an Academy Award!"

Oops! Wait a minute...

Eminem DID win an Academy Award, right?

Isn't it than like saying: "Hey everyone liked Titanic! Let's give that one the award!"

Wait another GDM! Titanic also won, right?

Josh you are a GENIUS! I hope you're right ofcourse!

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The Academy will look pretty stupid if JW did not win again this year.If there is one thing the Academy hates, it is to look stupid. After all, everybody knows the music from Harry Potter. Who can hum the music from Passion or the Village?

Correct me if i'm wrong, but since when hummebility a deciding factor in deciding if a score is Oscar worthy?

I can hum AND whistle Axel F. from Bevely Hills Cop, does that make it a viable Oscar winner?

I am not talking about "hummability". I am just saying that the HP music is recognized by everyone, and that the general public has come to love and accept it. If all the kids and adults out there who might or might not be HP fans saw that the music from PoA is nominated and is up against such "generally unknown" music as Passion or Village (as good as they might be), they will certainly root for HP. And if HP should not win, the Academy will look pretty stupid. Dont you think???

(Sorry my computer has lost the apostrophes.)

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And Stefan,

Ofcourse I don't think you're ignorrant. It's just that a few posts back you really gave the impression that the ...... (keeping my promise!) with remarks like ".....and how that for some reason means...." isn't really your cup of tea.

I know the sentence above is among the weirdest constructed in the English language I hope you know what I mean.

In no way did I mean to insult you man!

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Of course the theme that everybody can hum, Hedwigs Theme, is hardly a part of the POA score.....

Like I also said earlier, if PoA won the Oscar, it would be in recognition of all three Potter scores, most likely. But believe, most people out there who are HP fans ARE capable of humming Buckbeaks Flight, A Window to the Past, and of course DOUBLE TROUBLE!!!!

I know I can!!! :)

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If all the kids and adults out there who might or might not be HP fans saw that the music from PoA is nominated and is up against such "generally unknown" music as Passion or Village (as good as they might be), they will certainly root for HP. And if HP should not win, the Academy will look pretty stupid. Dont you think???

If that is so then why were TPM and AOTC not even nominated?

Star Wars music is a LOT more well known then Harry Potter music will ever be.

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Star Wars music is a LOT more well known then Harry Potter music will ever be.

I think Josh is refering to today's audience. I notice it with the kids in my school; they really ALL know Hedwig's Theme! Whenever I play in on the piano in my class children from all over the school run into my classroom because they want to listen to "Harry Potter muziek".

Star Wars nowadays, on youngsters, doesn't have that affect anymore.

Just an observation.

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If all the kids and adults out there who might or might not be HP fans saw that the music from PoA is nominated and is up against such "generally unknown" music as Passion or Village (as good as they might be), they will certainly root for HP. And if HP should not win, the Academy will look pretty stupid. Dont you think???

If that is so then why were TPM and AOTC not even nominated?

Star Wars music is a LOT more well known then Harry Potter music will ever be.

Believe me, if I had been given free choice, I would have.

But part of the reason for that might be because the Star Wars saga already has an Oscar for Best Score. And, like it or not, the Star Wars movies arent simply nominated anymore, as good as they might be. Dont ask me why, but Williams still got recognized for Angelas Ashes and CMIYC, didnt he???

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And Stefan,

Ofcourse I don't think you're ignorrant. It's just that a few posts back you really gave the impression that the ...... (keeping my promise!) with remarks like ".....and how that for some reason means...." isn't really your cup of tea.

I'm not a Christian, Catholic, Protestant or whatever you wanna call it.

But that is out of a personal choice, not ignorrance.

Religion is always an interesting subject, and it can result in great films.

But the passion is about the suffering of Christ, not about his teachings.

I kinda think Gibsons film may be preaching to the choir, and I can't sing. :)

I know the sentence above is among the weirdest constructed in the English language I hope you know what I mean.

And you call yourself a teacher? ;)

In no way did I mean to insult you man!

I kinda figured that, don't worry.

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Fame-logo.gif

Says it all, really. The academy hasn't changed.

From what I've heard of 2004 scores, POA is by far my favourite. I wouldn't mind too much if JNH picked one up though, The Village was a great score too. I haven't heard Neverland or Lemony Snicket so I can't comment, but Passion was just about the most overrated and underwhelming score I've heard in a long time and did not deserve the nomination. Debney's done way better before, and to finally gain recognition from such a dud somehow seems backwards.

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I wish you gyus would stop talking about religion!!!

But one concern I might have is that, if PoA got an Oscar for Best Visuals Effects, THEN JW might not win for Best Score. The Academy might think, "Oh well, one Oscar for the latest Potter movie is enough already, lets give one to The Passion, as well, so we satisfy the religious people out there."

But that is, I guess, just my paranoia speaking. In truth, I still believe JW wins.

Regarding, best visual effects, I think PoA HAS also the best shot at winning. Ive seen all three movies and Spiderman 2 is pretty great, but that Gryffindor is the most amazingly lifelike creature Ive ever seen thats come out of a computer. And those dementors look pretty cool too. So, yeah, I think the Academy will recognize PoA with two Oscars this year. :)

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but Passion was just about the most overrated and underwhelming score

Yeah I know. And sometimes so inappropriate. Still I am afraid this score will win based on arguments given earlier in this thread. Here's my list of Williams' scores that really should have won:

1978 Superman.

Midnight Express? Come on! That score is so forgotten already!

1980 The Empire Strikes Back

Fame? What an upset! The greatest sequel score in history and it loses to....Michael Gore's Fame....

1981 Raiders of the Lost Ark

Chariots of Fire has an AMAZING main theme, as good as anything in Williams' Raiders score, but Vangelis' score as a whole is shallow and quite lame.

1989 Born On The Fourth Of July

The SONGS from The Little Mermaid made the music shine, but the score is just nice. I like the Main Title music, the fanfare, the jig, but most of it doesn't really stick (Beauty and the Beast being far superior). The score from BOT4OJ however is one of the strongest scores of the '80's; highly underrated.

That's it really. The rest of Williams' losses, in all fairness, I can live with. Maybe Empire Of The Sun should have won.

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The Passion has a very good chance of winning, if the oscars wanna play the political angle.

The film was highly controversial and even considered to be anti-semetic by some.

The Academy does not like controversy, so it was always unlikely that The Passion was gonna win or even be nominated for a BIG Oscar like best picture or best director.

But the music is a different matter, in itself fairly inoffensive, and the album is I think the top selling soundtrack of 2004.

So Debney may get his Oscar, but more as a sort of conciliation price for the film then for the actual score

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1981 Raiders of the Lost Ark  

Chariots of Fire has an AMAZING main theme, as good as anything in Williams' Raiders score

UH, Roald, no........, no, no, no, no, no.

The Passion has a very good chance of winning, if the oscars wanna play the political angle.  

The film was highly controversial and even considered to be anti-semetic by some.

and Hollywood being very semetic, means Passion isn't likely to win.

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The Passion has a very good chance of winning, if the oscars wanna play the political angle.  

The film was highly controversial and even considered to be anti-semetic by some.

and Hollywood being very semetic, means Passion isn't likely to win.

It's already begun:

http://www.passionforfairness.com/

I could see Passion winning its three noms just to shut these guys up.

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Yes, but the music was very popular.

Also, it is very possible to separate the music fron the film it was composed for, in a way that it's not possible to do with an acting performance, or direction.

The Passion may be a controversial film, therefore Caveziel would be a controversial choice for best actor, or Gibson for best director.

But with the score it's just different, it can be judged on it's own terms (though personally I think it's a wrong for any award giving organisation to judge a score).

The Passion was also one of the years biggest hits, the academy may wanna acknowledge that.

Giving Debney an Oscar for best score would be a safe way to do that.

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I could see Passion winning its three noms just to shut these guys up.

Also, aren't these the same kinda people who consider Harry Potter to be satanic?

They might start a campaign against the POA score winning an Oscar?

If that is so then I wonder what side Chrushercomix will choose? :)

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The Passion has a very good chance of winning, if the oscars wanna play the political angle.  

The film was highly controversial and even considered to be anti-semetic by some.

and Hollywood being very semetic, means Passion isn't likely to win.

It's already begun:

http://www.passionforfairness.com/

Oh, for the love of Christ. Someone please tell these people to take a damn chill pill. :)

- Marc

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So if the films central message (depecting the suffing of Christ, and how that for some reason means the human race is in debt to him) is lost on me, only the violence remains.

And i'm utterly uninterested in violence alone.

I agree. Halfway the film I lost interest in watching "gore after gore".

Don't get me wrong, I consider Gibson to be a good film maker

I disagree. I don't like any of his films.

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I agree. Halfway the film I lost interest in watching "gore after gore".

That might be another problem.

Usually more is less.

This especially aplies to violence in films.

See a man get whipped 5 times and it is shocking.

See a man whipped 50 times and you start checking your watch.

I disagree. I don't like any of his films.

Of course you don't, you are Alexcremers. :)

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Well, to complete change the subject here, but ...

I finally saw "The Village." Good movie. I can see, though, why people would be against it.

I didn't know that Hilary Hahn performed the solos until two days ago, but that sorta influenced its nomination, to be sure. Another reason I believe it was nominated is because it's such a lyrical score to what is, on the surface, a horror movie, out to scare and frighten you.

But the score didn't really have its moments until the final third, so if I were to vote, I would say right now that its the least significant of the five.

I enjoyed all five scores this year, and I think all of them make a strong argument for winning. I won't go into all of them now.

It's unfortunate that the entire membership votes on the music award. As we all know, the average person won't sit down and listen to "Harry Potter" all the way through. And if they do get a CD containing Peter Pettigrew's theme, I WANT IT!!

Anyway, most Academy voters vote for the Best Score award based on a feeling. "Oh, yeah, I think the music was all right, from what I remember." Of course, there are exceptions to this ("Star Wars," "Schindler's List," "The Omen," "Chariots of Fire," "ET"), but on the whole the vote goes to the score that is attached to a movie that requires something interesting in its music ("The Red Violin," "Frida," "Crouching Tiger").

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That might be another problem.

Usually more is less.

This especially aplies to violence in films.

See a man get whipped 5 times and it is shocking.

See a man whipped 50 times and you start checking your watch.

For the Romans 39 whip lashes was considered to be the maximum any man could take. Gibson decided to double that amount. This was only for starters.

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I agree. Halfway the film I lost interest in watching "gore after gore".  

Alex is was all a set up for Gibson next picture, The Zombies of the Christ, takes place 3 days later when he suddenly rises from the dead, to eat the brains of the living.

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"I really hope that James Newton Howard wins over John Williams for Harry Potter cuz he already got an oscar for a harry potter score!!!"

Quoi? Well, at least he admits PoA is good as well.

Otherwise, I don't see the big deal. They're JNH fans. Of course they want him to win. Just like everyone here wants Williams to win this.

- Marc

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"I really hope that James Newton Howard wins over John Williams for Harry Potter cuz he already got an oscar for a harry potter score!!!"

Quoi? Well, at least he admits PoA is good as well.

Someone corrected them, thank God. But they're thinking politics there; they're saying Williams already has enough Oscars.

And the PotC people really need to lay off, they have bad reviews of PotC and are calling them close-minded and written by bigots...of course, that website certainly isn't being close minded at all. The whole message seemed very intense and angry. Send these people some Tylenol PM!

They have JWFan.net number 1 on their list of referers.

~Sturgis, who, although absolutely loves The Village score, thinks it might be fun to ruffle some feathers in that JNH forum that was linked a few posts ago, but won't do it :)

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I agree. Halfway the film I lost interest in watching "gore after gore".  

Alex is was all a set up for Gibson next picture, The Zombies of the Christ, takes place 3 days later when he suddenly rises from the dead, to eat the brains of the living.

Roald will love it!

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IMDB forums notoriously have many who don't know jack about what they're talking about. That reminds me of talk I've seen at Harry Potter boards before!

But still....I'm very happy about The Village, and the poor people should have somewhere where they are safe to freely discuss lol. Sigh, they can't help if they don't know much. :)

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