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WIlliams will never win another Oscar


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It's in this fan's humble opinion that maestro Williams will never win another Oscar in light of his loss tonight and over the past few years. He could compose something as complex and innovative as Mahler's Song of the Earth and would still lose. I fear that Williams' loss signifies what I concluded a few years back: that the Academy Awards are a symbol of mediocrity, not excellent achievement in film. The fact that Goldsmith ever won a single Oscar fortifies this claim (oh yes, I must bring out the big guns). Scorsese's snub last year was the final straw for this viewer until I learned of Williams' double nomination this year. I only watched the ceremony up until Best Score where my hopes were once again dashed.

The fact that Geisha did win several other categories is actually even more infuriating. Sorry Johnny but you'll have to rest comfortably with your 5 Oscars. Just wait until dittie-writing Oscar favorite Alan Menken begins writing for Disney again. He'll probably rack up several more Oscars before he's done which confirms that most people on this planet have ears of goats.

I'll be listening to some rather aggressive music now. . Where to start? Perhaps The Crusaders in Pskov from Prokofiev's seminal Alexander Nevsky (Previn reading with LSO, EMI Angel recording). Yup, that'll do.

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You can chalk this one up there with the following should have won oscars:

Superman

Raiders

TESB

Born On The 4th Of July

Saving Private Ryan

I would throw in A.I. but LOTR deserved to win too.

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He may not ever win again. Unless he does the right movie. If Geisha and Munich got better reviews, he might have won. It really has nothing to do with the music, or Goldsmith would have won a few more times before he died.

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. It really has nothing to do with the music, or Goldsmith would have won a few more times before he died.

for what?I find the comparison irrelevant.Goldsmith didn't compose great music in his last 10 years.

K.M.

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Mulan was outstanding. I'm still flabbergassed as how Goldsmith lost on that one. LA Confidential was also pretty great. It's nice that the Oscar's didn't award Jerry the statuette that year but used his music during the Film Noir montage. I can hear Jerry up in Heaven looking down and saying:

"How dare you f***ers use my music when you didn't think it was good enough to win an award. Stop playing it right now!!! Got it????? [play music from Alien, Planet of the Apes, "New Friend" from Papillon or anything else by Goldsmith with harsh sonorities to underscore his anger at the hypocracy]

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I will say this- if Williams would have won best score, but Brokeback Mountain win for best picture, I would have been happier, but would have had much less faith in the acedamy. Brokeback Mountain will not go down in history. That Crash won is a rare case where the academy gets it right. Best film of 2005, and infinately more deserving of a place in history than the gay cowboy movie, which is good, but not much more.

Mulan was outstanding.  I'm still flabbergassed as how Goldsmith lost on that one.

The animation scores were all strong that year, I think they all split the vote. Goldsmith's was the best, yes, but not by enough to overcome the split.

LA Confidential was also pretty great.  It's nice that the Oscar's didn't award Jerry the statuette that year but used his music during the Film Noir montage.

That's not fair. L.A. Confidential is a great score, but Titanic desrved to win. Both fantastic scores in the film, but L.A. Confidential was helped almost as much by the songs as by the score. Using it in the montage is saying that it's fantastic music, the quintessential Film Nopir score.

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I will say this- if Williams would have won best score, but Brokeback Mountain win for best picture, I would have been happier, but would have had much less faith in the acedamy. Brokeback Mountain will not go down in history. That Crash won is a rare case where the academy gets it right. Best film of 2005, and infinately more deserving of a place in history than the gay cowboy movie, which is good, but not much more.

Yes, most definitely. I was also very happy to see that. Surprised but happy.

If we could say we got anything of quality out of this, I would consider all of the great interviews and new audio stuff that took place as a result of his "campaigning"

Tim

Great way to look at it Tim. Very "glass is half full" POV. :)

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Hey, at least we kept hearing Memoirs being played, heard E.T. during the "epic" montage, and heard Memoirs and Munich performed by John's friend Itzhak. Whether they realized it or not, the academy honored Johnny throughout the entire evening. I guarantee you won't hear segments from Brokeback Mountain and Finding Neverland during clip montages in the years to come. John's music is iconic and will live long after he dies...and that's worth a heck of a lot more than a little golden paperweight.

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for what?I find the comparison irrelevant.Goldsmith didn't compose great music in his last 10 years.

K.M.

I didn't mean to imply the last 10 years, but even then, he did better stuff than "Shakespeare in Love" "Full Monty" "Titanic" "Il Postino" etc.

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I might have liked the Edge more if I cared more about the film, but, aside from his magnificent nature theme, I dont really care for the score. I think he's written better albums, better music, but I haven't seen him give as much to a film as Horner gave to that film. Most of that is pure cirumstance, but I am in awe of what Horner did for that film. I feel he did as much as any composer has ever done for a film.

First Knight was in the last 10 years, and that was far better than Titanic. "A-do--ra-te  Mei!"

Better album- perhaps- I personally think it's highlights on CD were better than anything in Titanic, but, again, not so when in the film.

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Better album- perhaps- I personally think it's highlights on CD were better than anything in Titanic, but, again, not so when in the film.

You sound like you're judging the effect the film had on you, and not the effect the music had on the film.

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Than either I was not clear, or you mistook what I said. I say that Forever Night was a lousy film with a glorious score. Actually, not quite true- I did like it a bit. I think that Titanic is an excellent film not with a score that I would call glorious, but a score that I think enhanced the film so much, that made for a transcendent film experience. How often does a score like that come along (irrelevent if you agree in this instance- when a score works, and I mean really works, it's a special thing, and this score worked like that the entire way for me).

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Could it be that the only reason Titanic seemed like it enhanced the film better was because the scenes were more emotional? Since you think First Knight is a lousy-ish film with a great score, then I think that proves my point. Why should your reaction to a film's overall impact on you impact the judgement of the score? That is exactly the problem with the Academy Awards for best score. Great scores for mediocre films should win hands-down over mediocre scores for great films.

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Well, the quality of the film does have something to do with it, but I don't think in the way you mean. If a film is lousy, than the most fitting score, I think, would be a not great one. Forever Knight did not not have the most fitting score it could have. It had a score most fitting the concept of it, and music of a much higher standard than the film was. But the music, by being so good, didn't mesh with the film on that transcendent level, as the film was lousy. On Titanic, once the film was good, the music was allowed to be good in the best possible way- good music that is best for the film. That's why, I think so many of our favorite scortes are to our favorite movies. Because a good movie allows the score to be good and most fitting simoultaneously, not trading one for the other. Our favorite scores to the lousy movies are by necessity almost exculisvely because of the music, not the music in the film, becuase if the film is lousy, we want to associate it as little as possible with the film.

Brokeback Mountain is a great score for Brokeback Mountain. Both exist on a similar level. Memoirs is a great score for Memoirs, both exist on a similar level. This 'similar' level I talk about is the same for both films- both films are not bad. There are two levels- not bad, and not good. A composer writing a not bad score (musically) for a not good film doesn't mesh well enough. Over here, both are not bad score for not bad films. I choose Memoirs for something realtively aesthetic when it comes to film score- it's being great music and there being lot's of it. Brokeback Mountain is an excellent film score for it's film, but it's 13 minutes and it's melodies are little more than pleasant. Memoirs win because of technicality, but it's a major technicality, and when both scores are right, that's all we've got.

Morlock- who thinks the majority of discussion about quality of film scores has nothing to do with film scoring

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The Honorary Oscar only goes to those people who have been nominated so many times but never actually won an Oscar. Wasn't the Lily Tomlin / Meryl Streep banter before Robert Altman's acceptance speech a delight? Good job, girls!

Hitch

P.S. Stop this Goldsmith bashing already.

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Who gives a flying monkey in the end of the day?

I'm sure he felt bad but you know what?

He will write some more great stuff in the near future,

I'm sure it's not about the awards anymore but the music it self for John.

I just wish the guy health and happiness. The rest are small scale stuff

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