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I remember reading something when the Rhino Superman CD came out that JW tended to be very much involved in the performance of the score and the editing of the album and outside of that he didn't seem to care as much, say, about fidelity or archiving of every single take. I mean, the conductor's scores from Superman The Movie can't be found anywhere! The Debney cd had to be reorchestrated from the sketches! I think another factor is that to him this is all just his job and he's written so much music in his life that I don't think he believes every single note he's written is at all precious. I think he has the albums and the concert versions and to him those are the landmark things, everything else is sort of nuts-and-bolts workmanship that regular people wouldn't be interested in. Goldsmith was the same way, he actively prevented scores from being released in their entirety, preferring instead a tastefully edited album to a head-to-toe archival presentation (i.e. the 1995 ST:TMP cd) Look at how JW wanted the LLL CE3K album to be assembled vs. how we JWFAN's like to have things done. I think that says a lot.... Also, I don't think they had any idea they'd ever want to go back and revisit this stuff, especially SW and ESB. I don't think they imagined 7.1 surround and 192/24 audio files. I think they thought "There's the movie and there's the LP" and that's it. The music of the Beatles has a similar thing - the early albums had things committed to tape in a way that makes any real remixing kind of impossible, because they thought, who would ever want to go back and remix these things in stereo or have separation for a "Rock Band" video game? They didn't have video games in 1962! You're crazy, it's terrific (i mean that kindly, not troll-ish-ly)

Obviously all of this is subjective. For example, I really dislike both the sound and the playing on TFA, which was LA and SONY, compared to the LSO and Abbey Road. That said, there are some definite highlights of these new mixes, but like any project where they rebuild something fundamentally new from something old, it's going to sound different, and that difference is jarring, wether it's better or worse. A big challenge for SW and ESB, especially, is that they were originally recorded in an old fashioned way for movies, and in the case of SW, the orchestra was comparatively smaller. But there is probably a mandate from somewhere (either Disney, or JW himself) to try and make the 6 scores all sound as consistent to one another as possible. In 1977 and 1980, movies were still being shown in big movie palaces where the theater itself added reverb to the sound, so the music was recorded dry and tight. Home video didn't really exist, certainly not home theaters. If you listen to the 2-disc JAWS set, the movie versions all sound more like the SW/ESB sound and the album versions all sound more like the Asteroid Field on this new mix. The original JAWS LP was all rerecorded, if I understand correctly, at a different studio with a different engineer, than the film versions. I think a deceptive element to the 2005 bonus DVD is that (A) it's in surround sound, and (B) it's got DIA/SFX over it. The surround sound can really bring flatter, dryer mixes to life by enveloping you in subtle spacial effects, as well as using compression in a more aggressive way without it being as obvious. In addition, once you put dia and sfx on top, it puts the music in a context that makes it's trickier to judge on its own. On top of all that, I can tell you from direct evidence that Lucasfilm is a mess when it comes to the archiving of the scores. No one took the time, especially with SW and ESB, to properly catalog everything and retain the elements. Lucasfilm had to buy a multi-track reel of SW music from Ebay just to get it back a few years ago! Their "official" archive of TPM, for example, was distressingly patchwork, with elements from the OST and UE being the only things they had for certain cues, and other cues, like "Up The Wires", missing entirely. ROTS was the only score of the original 6 to be seemingly properly archived. My guess is that Disney would have preferred to release proper complete versions of the scores, but that JW insisted on the original albums. Disney and Lucasfilm seem to be going to great lengths to comply with his wishes after the music issues on Rogue One. I wouldn't be surprised if, much like the original 3 films coming out after GL shuffles off this mortal coil, we'll see complete scores come out once JW has joined the choir eternal. I also would not be surprised if, as a result of all the live concerts being done of the original 3 movies, new recordings might be made of the scores, at least as they appear in the films...

Someone on FilmScore Monthly said FAKE NEWS. Also, interesting that the tweet has since been deleted. Maybe there IS a plot I took very good notes at the ASMAC event. Kraemer mentioned that the motorcycle chase had to be totally rewritten the day before the recording session to be faster and more action-packed.

There's no plot and there's no fake news. At the ASMAC screening, Kraemer shared his process scoring the film. There was a test screening in the spring of 2015 for MI5 that had a temp score that reflected McQuarrie's vision for the music (no action music, very little thematic material). The film scored well but Cruise was not happy with the musical direction. He described the temp music as "funereal". The order came down to score the movie more aggressively. Kraemer said "Cruise had three directives: action, pace, and location." He also played some demos of cues he'd written before the test screening and how they were rewritten after the test screening to follow Cruise's direction. So unless Kraemer went to the trouble to make fake demos, it's not fake news. My guess is McQuarrie will claim he changed composers because he was the first director to make a second MI movie and he wanted it to feel different. Which is why he brought back the editor, the sound recordist and the stunt supervisor.

At the ASMAC seminar he gave in LA last year, Joe Kraemer explained that the director kept taking all the notes out of Solomon Lane's theme in the actual movie (he cited that scene in Amadeus where Emperor Josef told Mozart there were "too many notes, just remove a few"). So the concert version was his chance to show the theme the way he actually wanted it to sound. Also, while he does write stuff out in pencil and paper, he does the actual composing and orchestrating on computer....

JJ and Bad Robot pushed for MG on MI5, the director and Cruise pushed for Kraemer. The opera sequence was the deciding factor - Kraemer was available to come to London for 5 weeks to supervise the shoot, so that was his "fire-test" to prove to Bad Robot he was up to the task to score the movie. Based on things Kraemer has said at various events in LA (SCL screening, ASMAC masterclass), it sounds like during postproduction the director and Cruise disagreed about what the music for MI5 needed to be. The director lost, and since he couldn't replace Cruise on MI6 he replaced the composer instead.

Lorne Balfe is currently scoring the movie. He wrote the music in the trailer and also in some EPK about the stunt.

Sorry, I wasn't clear in the above post. JK was talking about Rogue Nation, not Fallout.

JK has done a lot of talks in LA about working on Rogue Nation and according to him, the director wanted almost no score in the movie and definitely no action music. The director even refers to this in the liner notes of the cd. JK got a laugh when he said the director wanted to make "Stanley Kubrik's Mission Impossible". Cruise overruled the director and told JK to write the score the movie really needed. Sounds like the director didn't like that....

This score more than typical Wiliams seems to have a lot of short cues.

Absolutely - I was just commenting on how challenging I think it will be to create any one presentation of the score that is "definitive" as so many cues will have alts for little sections of them....

Based on what I've been able to get from interviews with JW, JJ and others, as well as face-to-face conversations with people who would know, the process on TFA for JW was a departure from his usual way of scoring films, the result being there was never one DEFINITIVE version of the score written. For one thing, he scored the movie one reel at a time, starting with reel 1 and progressing linearly through the film, which he never would otherwise do. Secondly, he rewrote cues to fit picture changes instead of having the music editor cut them to fit the film, at least until there simply wasn't time to write and record any more revisions. So if JJ added fifteen seconds to a sequence, JW would look at the addition and perhaps completely rewrite the cue, or instead fashion an insert to cover the new material. So, as he was doing reel 2 he'd also pick up any bits that needed to be revised for Reel 1. As reel 3 was being recorded, he'd go back and revise r1 and r2. etc. Now, since there was recording being done right up to the last minute, my guess is that a lot of the OST would favor music recorded earlier in the process. Something like the OST version of "Snoke" might be a cue written for an earlier version of the film that no longer really relates to the final Snoke scenes in the film. Much like the conveyor belt cue from AOTC, which I believe was written, at best, to an animatic, and not to anything resembling a cut of the actual scene, there may be music on the OST that is impossible to reconcile with any scene shot-for-shot in the final film. Now, the FYC, if JW has followed the Academy rules, must contain the film versions of cues, with no concert versions, suites or such. It does not have to be COMPLETE, but it must match the movie with what it does contain, similiar to an isolated score track. I have not been able to verify that it does, but as I said, it SHOULD. (UPDATE: Since the making of this film and it's score was so fluid, it's possible JW wrote "Rey Meets BB8" for that scene, then as the editors were cutting the later reels, they were using music they had from earlier reels as temp. So perhaps they partly tracked "Rey Meets BB8" into the R2 waking scene and Williams made a new cue using the same material for a number of bars or pages before taking it off in a different direction. We see examples of this in his conductors score and sketches for AOTC and ROTS, where he literally cut-and-pasted Hal Leonard "Throne Room and End Titles" pages into the score, or instructed the orchestrator to copy measures from another cue or ver of a cue.) In my opinion, if one is going to try to build a definitive, comprehensive cd of the score, it's going to be challenging because of the way the music was created for this film....

Basically the FYC31s are like the Ultimate Edition Phantom Menace cds

I think the confusion has been due to Academy rules that FYC materials match the cue sheet titles...the FYC56 titles seem like cue sheet titles (sometimes silly, sometimes spoiler-y) while the FYC31v1 titles seem more like the OST titles (kind of like the titles on the AOTC or Crystal Skull sessions/scores/cue sheet vs the OST). The latest FYC31v2 uses all the same titles as the 56...I think the reason the 56/53 was put up is because the track titles matched the cue sheet, but the cues themselves had stuff that was dialed out in the film. The FYC31s match the movie much more closely (checking them against the iTunes ver of the movie) like having tracks fade out where the music was faded out in the film.

Why must there be no artwork? I assume it's to level the playing field and do as much as possible to get the Academy members to actually vote on the music and not just for who is in the film or who spent more on flashy album art...

Tracks 28 and 36 of the first MI:RN 56-track FYC (FYC56) were duplicates because the director tracked the later scene There were all sorts of errors in the 56-track version. It's nice to have for completeness, but the new 31-track ver (FYC31) is more accurate to the film. If disney decides to pursue an Oscar for SW:TFA, they will have to create a cd with the score in film order, no concert versions, no suites, and NO ARTWORK (!) to mail to academy members. It doesn't have to be the complete score, but what is included must be the film version.

The second Logos is for the scene where Ethan calls Brandt from the red phone booth in London. Not sure why it's called Logos.....

Yeah, Suite from Jack Reacher is on the iTunes and Amazon digital download albums. Apparently LaLa Land did the cd and Paramount did the digital and each entity wanted its own exclusive bonus track. The good news is the Suite is really just an edit of tracks already on the album, whereas the cd bonus is actually new material. So you can make a lossless version of the digital-only bonus yourself by editing it yourself if you wanted. Re: cue titles, let me see: -You say that OST track 4 ends with 2m8B then 1m8A, however in the complete cue list neither of those cues are listed, just a 1m8. Does that mean that 1m8 was recorded in 2 parts, and the OST contains the second half of the cue, and then the first half? Yes - 1m8 actually ended up being split across a reel change when the film was rebalanced after spotting. So 1m8 became 1m8a and 2m8b. For whatever reason, JK inverted the two halves for the album. -You say OST track 9 starts with 4m27b, which is also not in the complete cue list above. But you did say that OST track 6 already contains all of 4m27? 4m27b was omitted from the film. It was a soft cue that helped play up potential romance between Reacher and Helen. When the romance was downplayed in the final cut, they also dropped this cue. OST track 6 contains of all of 4m27 (a separate cue from 4m27b). -You say that for OST track 13, 1M2 is in the middle somewhere but you already said OST track 3 contains all of 1m2? No, OST track 3 is actually 1m2c and 1m2d. OST track 13 uses 1m2a and 1m2b. 1m2 was recorded in 4 parts due to the fact it was spotted before the pic locked and there were lots of tiny changes in this sequence. Sorry. The notes I had from the cd assembly were not fully detailed. -What's the title of 7m46? 7m46 is titled End Credits. It was written explicity for the credits, instead of using an edit of cues from the film. For the suite, JK basically cut the opening of the score (and cd) to the bulk of the end credits. The cue list was made to the version of the film JK spotted too, while the cd assembly notes were made using the final cue numbers. Also, when JK spotted the movie, 3m16 was in reel 3 (obviously), but in the final movie, it was in reel 2. (before 2m14)

Here's a cue sheet for the score to Jack Reacher, including which cues make up the album. FILM CUES: 1m0 Opening Logos 1m1 Six Shots 1m2 The Investigation (recorded in 4 parts 1,2a, 1m2b, 1m2c, 1m2d) 1m3 Who The Hell Is Jack Reacher? 1m4 Don’t Bleed On Me, Bitch! (very short, sound-effecty cue) 1m5 I Came Here To Bury Him 1m7 That Puff Of Pink Mist 1m8 My Lead Investigator (split into two parts for the final recording - 1m8a, 2m8b - 2m8b starts with the french horn solo) 2m9a Look At Him Objectively 2m9b Reacher At The Waterfront 2m10 The Gazette Did A Nice Piece On Her 2m13 So Was I, Last Week (very similiary to 1m4, sound effecty) 2m14 Who Hired You (moved to reel 3) 2m15 Always The Bullet (moved to reel 3) 3m16 What Did You Learn (moved to reel 2) 3m17 You Buy Them On The Way Home (a la 1m4, sound effecty - moved to reel 2) 3m18 It Must Stay Clean (omitted, never even written) 3m19 Eyewitness Testimony (a la 1m4, sound effecty) 3m21 Get Out Of Town Sandy 4m22 Wipe That Phone 4m23 Am I Stealing Your Car? 4m24 Barr is Innocent 4m25 Get Some Of That Freedom 4m26 To Hide One Specific Target 4m27 Do It Here 4m27b Are You Smart? (ommited from the final film but included on the cd) 4m28 Three Rivers Motel (omitted from the film, never recorded, sketched but never orchestrated or copied out) 5m29 I Stole Your Car 5m31 Down Range 5m32 You’re A Little Rusty Mr. Reacher 5m33 I Always Liked Him 5m34 Protective Custody 5m35 Don’t Taze Me Emerson 6m38 Drink Your Blood From A Boot 6m39 I See Defiance In Your Eyes 6m40 Wrong Trailer 6m41 The Fight 6m42 The One Piece That Just Didn’t Fit 7m43 Prisoner Human Being 7m44 Get Her Number Let’s Go 7m45 Jack Reacher 7m46 End Credits CD CONTENTS: 1. 1m0 - 1m1 Main Title 2. 1m3-5m31-5m32-5m33 Who's Jack Reacher 3. 1m5-2m14-1m2c-1m2d The Investigation 4. 1m7-3m21-2m8b-1m8a Barr and Helen 5. 2m10-2m15 Farrier and the Zec 6. 2m9-4m22-4m27 The Riverwalk 7. 3m16 Helen's Story 8. 4m24-4m25-4m26 Evidence 9. 4m27b-5m29-5m34-5m35 Helen In Jeopardy 10. 6m39-6m38-6m40 The Quarry Sequence 11. 6m42-6m41-7m44 Showdown 12. 7m45-7m46 Finale & End Credits 13. 7m43-1m2a-1m2b-3m17-4m23 Prisoner Human Being 14 1m0-1m1-7m46 Suite From Jack Reacher EDIT: I've updated these notes to reflect Jason's questions and fix typos from the original sheets In the final movie, reel 2 and 3 had scenes moved around. the final order of cues would actually be: 2m8b My Lead Investigator (pt 2) 2m9a Look At Him Objectively 2m9b Reacher At The Waterfront 2m10 The Gazette Did A Nice Piece On Her 2m13 So Was I, Last Week 3m16 What Did You Learn 3m17 You Buy Them On The Way Home 2m14 Who Hired You 2m15 Always The Bullet 3m19 Eyewitness Testimony 3m21 Get Out Of Town Sandy

I might be able to get a cue sheet for the movie if anyone is that interested? Also, rumor has it the dvd/blu-ray will have an isolated score with composer commentary, just like he did on THE WAY OF THE GUN.

The trailers are nothing like the film, tonally. There is no "MI:2"-style electric guitar. It's an orchestral score, through-and-through. I'd even say the trailers play up Cruise's "Cruise-iness" in a way that the film almost goes out of it's way to avoid...

I think the thing I liked best about Cruise as Reacher is the sort of world-weary POV he brings to the character, which seems to be right in line with the books (which I haven't read). So when Cruise's Reacher ends up in a street fight, he's almost disappointed that it's come to this, "Remember, you wanted this..." he says, and then he takes 5 guys out, as LA WEEKLY says, "convincingly". Reacher isn't having fun, as opposed to, say, Ethan Hunt. Cruise the actor IS having fun playing Reacher though, you can tell. Even his very last scene, he's very much the reluctant hero, which I enjoyed seeing. It's the sort of part Newman or Eastwood would have played when they were 50 and would have been lauded for, but Cruise at 50 gets slammed for...who knows, maybe in 10 years it'll be looked on a turning point in his career. As for the score, it definitely seems like they were going for the 70's in terms of spotting and execution, even if it did have some modern sounds in it (synthy waterphone-type sound, techno-y bass drum). Reminded me of David Shire and Howard Shore when I listened to it on it's own...

That's only because LLL refused to release the full 15-cd score to Jack Reacher....

Samples from all the tracks except the cd bonus exclusive are on itunes

Where did I apologise? I never said anything was anybody's fault. I was just wondering if just because something is different, is it inherently worse? Sometimes the newer versions of things ARE better,or rather, sometimes people actually like the newer versions of things (Blade Runner Final Cut, Star Trek:The Motion Picture, the RCA Star Wars soundtracks).Honestly, if I want to watch the ORIGINAL version of Star Wars, my favorite choice is Puggo's DVD of the 16mm print of the film he bought of Ebay and mastered himself. It looks like the Star Wars I saw in the theater as a kid and it has the mono soundtrack. Otherwise, the bluray. I never said I didn't want to have a copy of the original versions of the original trilogy in the best possible quality. I'd LOVE for the GL to remaster the original versions of the films and put them out on bluray. But the difference is, I don't hate GL for tinkering with his movies. It's the creator's prerogative to revisit his own work. And I don't HATE GL for not releasing the originals in hd on blu ray. I know that at some point in my lifetime they will be. I notice your profile is a pic of Gandalf. Should Tolkien have stopped fiddling with his published books once they were published? He went back and rewrote parts of The Hobbit after the LOTR trilogy was published to make it more in line with the newer work. He revised the LOTR over his last years as well, as the preface in the book, and his son in about a dozens other books, goes into in great detail. Did those books become a dead carcass once they were released and Tolkien a vulture? What about Lawrence of Arabia? The director preferred the shorter version which is the one that was released wide and the one most people saw when it won Best Picture. And which version of Metropolis are you talking about? No one outside of Berlin ever saw the original full length version, if I recall correctly. Certainly by the time the film came to America in the late 20's, it had been chopped up by Paramount - and for a lot of people, the Moroder version was the one that made an impact and became relevant. Which version of SW would you release? Ep 4 or no Ep 4? Mono soundtrack or surround mix? And which version of Empire? The 70mm version which was released first or the 35mm version which had two shots added in at the end? What about Fantasia? Which version had the impact there? The roadshow version or the wide-release version? And who says the orginals are the best versions? You? Ok, cool. I say the originals are awesome and the tinkered ones are better in spots and worse in spots. Honestly, in my opinion, ROTJ needs all the help it can get and I don't have a problem with any of the changes - Lapti Nek is just as creaky and bad as Jedi Rocks, in my opinion. Same with Yub Nub/Victory Celebration. Sebastian Shaw looks nothing like a grown up version of HC. As I said in a previous post, I'd LOVE to have the original unaltered trilogy remastered in HD on bluray, for historical purposes. Even though I am apparently a Lucas apologist and supposedly a fanboy, I actually PREFER the original versions of Star Wars (no episode 4) and Empire (no clunky inserts of Vader's shuttle ruining one of the best cues in the film). But parts of the Star Wars SE are better in my opinion, like the ending dogfight over the Death Star and the desert search, and the Jabba scene works for me. And in Empire, the falcon landing on Cloud City is an improvement and the new wampa is more effective, again, in my opinion. And as I said, I like the Emperor matching Jedi and the Prequels.