The Unicorn Theme and its ninth note

[Quintus 6,372]

Did it at first seem weirdly too high for you guys, or was it just me? I kept expecting a lower octave but John be damned he took another route and risked his wizardry with my cynical ear and... won. Instead of a blandly obvious 'theme', we have a hook. It took a little while, but we definitely have a hook.

That ladies and gentleman is how you know you're dealing with John Williams, I guess. It must be tough for The Others, but I'm just thankful they have that lineage to consider at all.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 12,255]

Thank you from starting a Tintin thread in General Discussion!

[Quintus 6,372]

I never forget my roots!

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 12,255]

Someone needs to make a list with all the themes and give examples were they appear on the CD.

[crocodile 9,660]

Why don't just read Jason's review on the main page?

Karol

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 12,255]

Because he does not give time indications in his review.

[crocodile 9,660]

The great thing about John Williams and his themes is that you hear them once and you know immediately what they are. Even if brief. That's amazing.

Karol

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 12,255]

Not for me.

[Jay 45,928]

Someone needs to make a list with all the themes and give examples were they appear on the CD.

I will be doing exactly that after I see the movie - my normal complete score analysis with a complete cue list, and full list of themes and where they appear.

After all, until seeing the movie, everyone is just guessing at what a theme represents anyway. Incanus already had different ideas about some of the themes than I did.

For now, everyone should just enjoy listening to the great new CD!

[Rachael Foley 10,064]

Someone needs to make a list with all the themes and give examples were they appear on the CD.

He pretty much has in multiple posts.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 12,255]

We need a single thematic identification thread. Not right now of course. I mean Sony executives might be suspicious....

[Incanus 5,890]

I have a ready analysis of the soundtrack album waiting for Friday when the burning gaze of Sony's Eye has moved on and we can come out of hiding to discuss the album in its entirety.

[Brónach 1,328]

Just post it at 00:01 of your local hour. I want to read it.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 12,255]

Would that not be 10 hours or so to soon? What time zone are we using?

[Brónach 1,328]

Incanus' time zone, obviously.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 12,255]

Will Sony execs fall for that?

[Jay 45,928]

We can discuss the entire CD when I start a thread to do so, which will be when I see that the mp3s are officially on sale at Amazon UK. I have no idea what time on Friday they will go on sale. Anyone know?

As for the topic of the thread, Quint is right, the ninth note of the Unicorn Theme is AWESOME, totally grips you, pulls you right into the theme.

[Jay 45,928]

Was thinking about the two Unicorn Themes tonight. Maybe the main one that's in most tracks is the main theme for The Unicorn, while the secondary one only in a few tracks is a theme for the scrolls.... just a possibility.

Also I like the 3 different "B Sections" the theme has.... the first one's in 07 Sir Francis and the Unicorn from 1:14-1:25, the second's in the same track from 1:44-1:55, and the third's in 17 Return to Marlinspike Hall and Finale from 4:31-4:37

[Quintus 6,372]

My theory is that the secondary theme is Rackham's.

[Sandor 910]

Is it comparable to The Ark/The Medallion Themes from Raiders?

[Incanus 5,890]

Is it comparable to The Ark/The Medallion Themes from Raiders?

Yes the Secondary Mystery theme flows very well from the Unicorn theme, the Secret of the Scrolls a good example of this. As Jason speculated it could represent the scrolls themselves

which of course are a clue to the Unicorn's whereabouts.

[Quintus 6,372]

Am I on about a different thing here? The short little mystical motif which wouldn't sound out of place in Hook? Played on what sounds like a pipe, with a "sparkly" accompaniment. It's very piratey, hence my idea that it might be Rackham's own motif.

[Incanus 5,890]

Am I on about a different thing here? The short little mystical motif which wouldn't sound out of place in Hook? Played on what sounds like a pipe, with a "sparkly" accompaniment. It's very piratey, hence my idea that it might be Rackham's own motif.

Ah what you mean might be the Bagghar/Rackham's Curse theme (I call it that at this point). A sort of eerie motif on flute and mark tree shimmer often over it?

[Quintus 6,372]

Yes, that's the one!

So what's this secondary unicorn theme then? I'd appreciate timings

I probably know it, but I'm not making the connection right now.

[Incanus 5,890]

That particular theme is rather crafty in that it becomes also a music for the location of Bagghar as Williams gives us the glorious permutation of the idea at the end of Red Rackham's Curse and the Treasure where the exotic theme gets a full blown transitional version, probably underscoring a change in location and also changing the hue of the idea so to speak.

I find it rather brilliant that even though we have Jason's extrapolations on the score and know a bit about the plot of the film Williams' themes are so evocative that we can easily give them a sort of general category immediately. His thematic ideas tend to have this well thought out dramaturgy to them, capturing a mood or abstraction or character so in indelibly you can connect the theme very easily to these plot elements.

[Quintus 6,372]

Absolutely. Put it this way: I've shook my head in disbelief a number of times during this ost. Williams' ability to score an image awes me to this day.

Of course, it helps a little that I have a vague memory of this story. I've enjoyed envisioning how things might play out in the film whilst listening to this thing.

[Jay 45,928]

OK, what are the timings for the theme that you two are talking about? I'm having a hard time following you.

Cause what I called the "Eye of Bagghar Theme" plays in 06 Escape From The Karaboudjan from 2:45-2:51 and Red Rackham's Curse and the Treasure from 5:47-5:55

But I think you guys are talking about something else.

[Incanus 5,890]

OK, what are the timings for the theme that you two are talking about? I'm having a hard time following you.

Cause what I called the "Eye of Bagghar Theme" plays in 06 Escape From The Karaboudjan from 2:45-2:51 and Red Rackham's Curse and the Treasure from 5:47-5:55

But I think you guys are talking about something else.

It is the same theme we are talking about but I count the eerie cold flute reading of the exotic Middle Eastern motif as the basic version of the Eye of Bagghar theme which you note to be only the grandiose rendition. The ending of the Red Rackham's Curse and the Treasure from 5:47-5:55 is clearly the same motif but only in much larger and opulent orchestration. Listen to the flute in the 5:47 and compare it to the motif starting at 0:47 in the same track, this motif is reprised in The Return to the Marlinspike Hall and Finale 4:08.

[Jay 45,928]

OK Gotcha. It should be noted that in both places you mentioned (0:47 of track 9 and 4:08 of track 17), that performance of the theme is a rescore/insert, replacing Williams original intention (which in both cases was a variation similar to the ones in track 6 and track 9 I pointed out)

I definitely don't think it's a theme for Red Rackham - I think Red Rackham's Theme is the at 0:58 of The Clash Of The Cranes

[Incanus 5,890]

OK Gotcha. It should be noted that in both places you mentioned (0:47 of track 9 and 4:08 of track 17), that performance of the theme is a rescore/insert, replacing Williams original intention (which in both cases was a variation similar to the ones in track 6 and track 9 I pointed out)

I definitely don't think it's a theme for Red Rackham - I think Red Rackham's Theme is the at 0:58 of The Clash Of The Cranes

Yes the Rackham theme is the rhythmic one heard on track 7 and the opening of 9 and the in Clash of the Cranes. But the theme you call the Eye of Bagghar is something I just called Bagghar/Curse theme as I have no clear idea what it represents. I also think the renditions I mention are the Eye of Bagghar theme but as I said in a much colder and eerier form and the rescores are something demanded by the film, something more ghostly and not welcoming or warm.

[MattyO 72]

The Unicorn theme sounds like a theme I've known and whistled all my life - it has an ageless quality, like the Ark theme. I'm not saying it's self-plagiarizing on Williams' part, more that it's a theme straight out of his oeuvre and I love it!

[Jay 45,928]

I know exactly what you mean! Well said.

[Incanus 5,890]

The Unicorn theme sounds like a theme I've known and whistled all my life - it has an ageless quality, like the Ark theme. I'm not saying it's self-plagiarizing on Williams' part, more that it's a theme straight out of his oeuvre and I love it!

I know exactly what you mean! Well said.

My thoughts as well! That is an excellent way to put it!

[Quintus 6,372]

Heh, I was playing a bit of the newly released Batman: Arkham City last night and whilst I was exploring the alleyways and rooftops the ambient underscore suddenly played a tune which was really very similar to the Unicorn theme.

Sort of took the shine of it if I'm honest.