Jurassic Park Analysis on FSM Online

[indy4 155]

Hi everyone,

I wrote an analysis of the score for JP that can now be viewed at FSM Online. Hope you enjoy!

Also a Lincoln analysis in the February edition

[Incanus 5,716]

Great news indy4!

Sadly I am not a subscribers and therefore cannot read it.

[TownerFan 4,983]

Hi indy4,

I've just read your JP analysis. I appreciate your effort in diving into a thorough dissection of this score and I enjoyed several of your observations.

However, in my very humble opinion (please, take this as constructive criticism), I think you missed a few key elements that make this score a real masterwork of applied music to film and another example of Williams' consummate musicianship. I'll try to illustrate a bit further my points:

Williams' approach at the film is very much a prosecution of the one used for Jaws. Overall, the music is used mainly to support and enhance the sense of high adventure at the core of the story, while at the same time addressing both the sense of wonder and the thrills and chills that make the film entertaining. And as in Jaws, Williams is completely aware when it's best to stay silent, maximizing the impact of the musical accompaniment. The orchestra may have a much larger role in JP than in Jaws--the overall orchestral texture of the latter is quite spare and economical save for the occasional "swashbuckling" moment, while JP is a much bigger and "noisy" score. That's also because of 20 years of evolution of the whole sound track (i.e. music, dialogue and effects) texture, in which there's a much more elaborated sound fx track to deal with. Nevertheless, the synergy between the elements is very much at balance here (esp. in comparison to more recent films, even the ones scored by JW, look at the Star Wars prequels).

What I like about this score among the other things is Williams' choice to address the musical past on which his score stands upon: for the film music aspect, Williams models the score after the seminal King Kong by Max Steiner ("the one who started it all", as JW once said). Like the movie itself nods to the Cooper & Schoedsack masterpiece, the score homages Steiner's music, especially in the way the action is accompanied by an orchestral frenzy of high energy without giving up the lighter side--It's interesting to note how cleverly Williams "mickeymouses" the actions on screen in a way not too dissimilar from Steiner's, enhancing the biggest moments as well as the tiniest details (not far from how he scored the Indiana Jones films as well).

Williams is also ready to acknowledge another important musical reference (even though overall smaller): Stravinsky's Le sacre du printemps (The Rite of Spring). Aside from being the ultimate piece in terms of "brutal" and "fierce" action music, the work was used to a great effect by Walt Disney in 1940's Fantasia in a sequence which depicts the prehistoric age with dinosaurs. Spielberg is a professed Disney fan and he spoke several times about the impact Fantasia had in his childhood--one wonders if he thought about that film while making Jurassic Park. Williams doesn't rip off blatantly Stravinsky's piece, but there are several moments in which he seems to make a wink at it (especially during the big climatic scene at the end, aka "T-Rex Rescue and Finale"), using constantly changing odd-metered patterns, woodwind shrills, spiky brass licks and a fierce percussion section. This makes sense also because, for better or worse, Le sacre has inspired and influenced a lot of film scores for monster/horror movies of the past, like the works of Hans J. Salter, Paul Sawtell and Frank Skinner.

Also, there's a Disney-esque aspect all over the score (and the film as well) which suggested to Williams a particular "cartoon" gesture in the writing: the music depicts the various dinosaur species (once brutal and deadly, once noble and majestic, once mysterious and awe-inspiring) in a kind of "Carnival of the animals" way. Also, the above-mentioned mickeymousing tone seems to suggest a particular awareness in this sense: that's why I always found very inspired the choice to use a Carl Stalling-like style for the "Mr DNA" sequence--it's the ultimate mickeymousing reference. However, Williams doesn't just mimick or ape what is happening on screen (i.e. what is already obvious to the audience, or, what film music does most of the time), but he goes to the upper level and transforms what we're seeing into something much more adventurous and exciting than it probably is. And he does all this with a strong musical backbone, using all the right tools for the right reasons (as Ludwig pointed out brilliantly in his own analysis of the main theme). It's what Hollywood film music does best when done right.

One more thing about a couple observations in your analysis:

I think the usage of what you called the "Dies Irae" theme is likely not a direct reference to this much-abused musical figure and probably you went a tad too far with your speculation. Yes, there's undoubtedly a slight nod to it, but I tend to think that the use of of certain intervals and harmonies is probably a quite natural consequence when you want to convey a sense of imminent danger and threat, so I'd go for the "unconscious" reference. I think this is something so basic and "inevitable" as a musical figure that probably composers over the history used it a lot without being that aware (maybe only in hindsight). The clever usage Williams does of this figure in the score (as you pointed out well) is imho more an example at how good he is at treating his own musical devices in an extremely flexible way. Sure, we can apply a broader aesthetic idea to it (i.e. the "man vs. God" theme), but I generally prefer to observe how the composer "solves problems" of cinematic nature in musical terms.

Also, I found the explanation of the usage of synthesized choir as a representation of the artificial side of Hammond's idea a tad too stretched. Again, there's nothing wrong to stick our own interpretations to choices like this (it's the basis of aesthetic dissertation and art critics). The doubling of synth choir with a real one is an orchestration device Williams used quite a lot (and quite deliberately) in many film scores. In Jurassic Park, it surely helps to convey the idea of something detached and artificial, but it mostly accompany the sense of mystery and the more kind of sci-fi, otherworldly aspect of the story.

In the end, you wrote that the score "conveys important messages about technology, human nature and human priorities while advancing important aspects of Williams' compositional style". Well, even if I would agree in a very broad sense, I prefer to see Jurassic Park as a tremendous example of Williams' craft at writing excellent music for a great entertainment movie--the music is fun, rich of colors, themes and ideas. It supports the film splendidly without remaining only on the surface of the spectacle, but also addressing several points (even the meta-textual ones, consciously or not, i.e. Fantasia and King Kong and classic monster movie music in general) that go beyond the mere film accompaniment. Much like the film itself, which is an aware piece of pop entertainment full of references and nods to all that came before: like Alan Grant says in the film "You'll never look at The Birds the same way again" (bold is mine )

Gosh, I wrote too much

[indy4 155]

Thanks Incanus!

Mazurio, all valid interpretations--in the end, I only have ~3000 words, and not every observation about the score is going to make it into the final draft. I did include some of the things you mentioned in earlier drafts, I just deemed them not important enough to make the final version (for instance, JW's style has always incorporated aspects of Stravinsky or Steiner, and even if JP took it a little farther that's ultimately not what I'm most interested in or what I think is the most important aspect of the score). I'm also not sure I agree with all of your interpretations, particularly the Carnival of the Animals/mickey-mousing one. There are certainly broad similarities between the works, but I'm not sure how much of that is a direct reference to Saint-Saen's work or Disney scores. I'll be honest, I'm not familiar enough with Steiner's King Kong, but I think it takes a little more than having intense action music + lighthearted stuff to call something an homage...

I would like to respond to a few of your disagreements with the analysis. On the Dies Irae, I think again your interpretation is a valid one, but so is mine. I would submit that it was an intentional use--he had pretty clearly referenced it in Star Wars and Home Alone (which was only a few years before JP), and since the raptor opening the doorknob is such an important symbol in the film I don't think its placement here is a coincidence. That said, I don't think every aspect of a work of art needs to be consciously or intentionally placed for it to be a valid interpretation. As I said in the article, it may be unintentional, but that doesn't it's not there. As you said in your last paragraph, unconscious references can still be valid.

On the synth choir, we also disagree. I think the fact that it literally ONLY shows up in scenes that deal with raptors indicates some sort of significance, especially since the raptors are the symbols used to take us through this man vs God/chaos/nature development. I haven't studied the written scores for all of JW's uses of synth choir, so I'm making the following statement based on what I hear rather than what I have actually confirmed, but most of JW's synth choir usage seems to have analytical signifcance, as opposed to merely exisiting because it intuitively sounds better (although it also serves that function). For instance, in AI it represents the quasi-human nature of the robots and in KotCS represents the quasi-human aliens.

[Incanus 5,716]

For instance, in AI it represents the quasi-human nature of the robots and in KotCS represents the quasi-human aliens.

This is not perhaps relevant to JP discussion but in KotCS the choir is a live one, Hollywood Film Chorale, as it is credited on the CD sleeve. Williams' use of the choir in KotCS is closer to WotW, where the human voice is both humane and indicative of suffering and also otherwordly, frightening and alien.

[indy4 155]

He rarely only uses synth choir--do we know for sure that he didn't mix synth with real choir? Like I said, I don't know for sure, but that's what it sounds like to me.

[TownerFan 4,983]

Mazurio, all valid interpretations--in the end, I only have ~3000 words, and not every observation about the score is going to make it into the final draft. I did include some of the things you mentioned in earlier drafts, I just deemed them not important enough to make the final version (for instance, JW's style has always incorporated aspects of Stravinsky or Steiner, and even if JP took it a little farther that's ultimately not what I'm most interested in or what I think is the most important aspect of the score). I'm also not sure I agree with all of your interpretations, particularly the Carnival of the Animals/mickey-mousing one. There are certainly broad similarities between the works, but I'm not sure how much of that is a direct reference to Saint-Saen's work or Disney scores. I'll be honest, I'm not familiar enough with Steiner's King Kong, but I think it takes a little more than having intense action music + lighthearted stuff to call something an homage...

I know you have limits dictated by word count--having written myself articles for magazines and websites I can totally understand.

Back to the points, when I said "Carnival of the Animals" I wasn't thinking about specific quotes of Saint-Saens' work, as of course there's nothing in JP that could even remotely remind of that piece. It was a more general, broader idea to underline how Williams treated musically the different "beasts" that stars in the film. He uses specific ideas (compositional at one time or just coloristic) to depict the collection of dinosaur we're seeing throughout the film.

As for the Disney reference, again it was not intended in a direct way, but more as the broad idea at the core. Of course Williams doesn't quote intentionally anything from any classic Disney's film scores, but the way he moves around deftly with the orchestra could remind the specifics and peculiarities of cartoon scoring. In my opinion, the mickeymousing (in a good sense) gestures found in Jurassic Park are something that cannot be overlooked (I think it's one of the most musically exciting aspects of the score, but that's just me).

Same goes for the Steiner/King Kong reference--JW doesn't quote anything from Steiner's score (maybe only the cue "Jurassic Park Gate" has the most obvious nod), but the overall spirit of that score lurks in the background. This speaks volumes about Williams' (and Spielberg's) awareness when making movies, in a purely post-modern way of thinking. We could see JP as a remake of sorts of King Kong and the score follows suit (this becomes even more evident in The Lost World). I heartily suggest you to pick up Steiner's score and give it a few listen (and also watch the original film if you haven't already, it's a blast), you'll see what I mean.

I would like to respond to a few of your disagreements with the analysis. On the Dies Irae, I think again your interpretation is a valid one, but so is mine. I would submit that it was an intentional use--he had pretty clearly referenced it in Star Wars and Home Alone (which was only a few years before JP), and since the raptor opening the doorknob is such an important symbol in the film I don't think its placement here is a coincidence. That said, I don't think every aspect of a work of art needs to be consciously or intentionally placed for it to be a valid interpretation. As I said in the article, it may be unintentional, but that doesn't it's not there. As you said in your last paragraph, unconscious references can still be valid.

Sure, anything's valid in this department, in fact I'm not dismissing your observations. I only found this aspect probably more marginal and not as influential as you think. In fact, most of Dies Irae quotations in film music in general are imho more in the department of the musical joke than anything else. It's part of the bag of tricks of any composer and I guess when they find a spot, they probably use it mainly for the fun of it (especially if we talk of horror/thriller films).

On the synth choir, we also disagree. I think the fact that it literally ONLY shows up in scenes that deal with raptors indicates some sort of significance, especially since the raptors are the symbols used to take us through this man vs God/chaos/nature development. I haven't studied the written scores for all of JW's uses of synth choir, so I'm making the following statement based on what I hear rather than what I have actually confirmed, but most of JW's synth choir usage seems to have analytical signifcance, as opposed to merely exisiting because it intuitively sounds better (although it also serves that function). For instance, in AI it represents the quasi-human nature of the robots and in KotCS represents the quasi-human aliens.

I overall agree with your interpretations about usage of synth choir in general in Williams' scores. I too noticed several times the way he uses it mostly to represent something artificial and/or detached from humanity. Although, in the case of Jurassic Park, I wouldn't stick a too strong characterization (man vs. God or whatever) to it.

In my opinion, a film composer like Williams reacts and then writes more emotionally than we could think. He doesn't intellectualize the process too much. He's aware of course of the film's subthemes and he catches nuances and details that are hidden in it. As we said in another thread, it's the film that dictates the approach and the subsequent musical result. Williams, like many other film composers, reacts to all the film is suggesting to him and then tries to translate all those stimulations into real music, weaving them into the fabric of the score. However, it's the emotional aspects that he has to accompany first and foremost (and sometimes he has to carry them all on his shoulders).

[Incanus 5,716]

In my opinion, a film composer like Williams reacts and then writes more emotionally than we could think. He doesn't intellectualize the process too much. He's aware of course of the film's subthemes and he catches nuances and details that are hidden in it. As we said in another thread, it's the film that dictates the approach and the subsequent musical result. Williams, like many other film composers, reacts to all the film is suggesting to him and then tries to translate all those stimulations into real music, weaving them into the fabric of the score. However, it's the emotional aspects that he has to accompany first and foremost (and sometimes he has to carry them all on his shoulders).

Well put Maurizio. My sentiments and experience exactly. Williams is very much a composer concerned with the emotion of the film or a scene. He can be intellectual about it but his working aesthetic and method nearly always begins on emotional and pacing levels. His approach, which is similar as the one used by his peers like Goldsmith, is to translate the hidden element of the scene visible (or audible) and react to the pure film without any other influences in a very visceral way and he comes back to this gut feeling when he starts to work on any given scene. This is not to trivialize Williams' intellectual input into his music but rather to repeat what the Maestro himself has said. It is always a mystery to us the audience and I wager to the composer himself what actually goes into composing a piece of music, whether the process is emotional or intellectual in origin, but probably both.

[TownerFan 4,983]

Yes, that was what I was trying to explain. Williams comes from a generation of film composers that still approaches the job as sort of "problem solver" (excuse the trivialization) of the film's emotional/narrative needs. He brings his own musical instincts (as well as his highly-trained knowledge) to the table and tries to find a way for music to express something right (and good) for the film. What's great is that he seems to be able to keep intact the musical integrity every time (i.e. the music has sense and substance in itself away from the film, otherwise none of us would be here )

About Jurassic Park and its "cartoon" aspect, I just found this brief JW quote from a 1997 interview (printed in Total Film magazine) that seems to support my point:

"Jurassic Park has a 95-minute score. It pumps away all the time. It's a rugged, noisy effort--a massive job of symphonic cartooning. You have to match the rhythmic gyrations of the dinosaurs and create these kind of funny ballets."

[Jay 37,374]

95 minutes???? More like 85.

[Incanus 5,716]

Even Homeros nods sometimes Jason.

[Jay 37,374]

What?

[Incanus 5,716]

Even Homer(os) nods (off) sometimes =Even great men make mistakes/are in error sometimes.

And Williams is really a composer, who moves on really quickly after a project and the minute details sometimes seem a bit hazy in JWs interviews. He is not like his fans, who seem to know the minutiae of his work better than he does.

[Jay 37,374]

Ah

[indy4 155]

Mazurio, all valid interpretations--in the end, I only have ~3000 words, and not every observation about the score is going to make it into the final draft. I did include some of the things you mentioned in earlier drafts, I just deemed them not important enough to make the final version (for instance, JW's style has always incorporated aspects of Stravinsky or Steiner, and even if JP took it a little farther that's ultimately not what I'm most interested in or what I think is the most important aspect of the score). I'm also not sure I agree with all of your interpretations, particularly the Carnival of the Animals/mickey-mousing one. There are certainly broad similarities between the works, but I'm not sure how much of that is a direct reference to Saint-Saen's work or Disney scores. I'll be honest, I'm not familiar enough with Steiner's King Kong, but I think it takes a little more than having intense action music + lighthearted stuff to call something an homage...

I know you have limits dictated by word count--having written myself articles for magazines and websites I can totally understand.

Back to the points, when I said "Carnival of the Animals" I wasn't thinking about specific quotes of Saint-Saens' work, as of course there's nothing in JP that could even remotely remind of that piece. It was a more general, broader idea to underline how Williams treated musically the different "beasts" that stars in the film. He uses specific ideas (compositional at one time or just coloristic) to depict the collection of dinosaur we're seeing throughout the film.

As for the Disney reference, again it was not intended in a direct way, but more as the broad idea at the core. Of course Williams doesn't quote intentionally anything from any classic Disney's film scores, but the way he moves around deftly with the orchestra could remind the specifics and peculiarities of cartoon scoring. In my opinion, the mickeymousing (in a good sense) gestures found in Jurassic Park are something that cannot be overlooked (I think it's one of the most musically exciting aspects of the score, but that's just me).

Yeah, I understood the similarities between JP and Carnival, I just think it's too broad to claim obvious inspiration. Yes, there are different emotional pallettes used for the different types of dinosaurs, but I'm not really sure how else to approach it. You can't have the scary stuff playing during the triceratops scene, and you can't have the pretty stuff playing during the raptor attack. To me this just seems like JW fitting the emotion/narrative requirements of the scene. For the Disney stuff, JW has always mickey-moused in his entertainment action works (ie Airplane Fight from Raiders). I'm not sure the mickey-mousing is unique enough to JP to warrant inclusion in an analysis (much like the point I made about Stravinsky earlier).

Same goes for the Steiner/King Kong reference--JW doesn't quote anything from Steiner's score (maybe only the cue "Jurassic Park Gate" has the most obvious nod), but the overall spirit of that score lurks in the background. This speaks volumes about Williams' (and Spielberg's) awareness when making movies, in a purely post-modern way of thinking. We could see JP as a remake of sorts of King Kong and the score follows suit (this becomes even more evident in The Lost World). I heartily suggest you to pick up Steiner's score and give it a few listen (and also watch the original film if you haven't already, it's a blast), you'll see what I mean.

I'm listeing to a suite from KK right now. It sounds like the similarities you draw between the two are very broad, like the Carnival comparison. Things like "the overall spirit of the score lurks in the background" and your comment earlier about how there's both light and dark music...I think one needs a little more than that to claim a reference. KK sounds more like Tchaikovsky to me than anything else.

I would like to respond to a few of your disagreements with the analysis. On the Dies Irae, I think again your interpretation is a valid one, but so is mine. I would submit that it was an intentional use--he had pretty clearly referenced it in Star Wars and Home Alone (which was only a few years before JP), and since the raptor opening the doorknob is such an important symbol in the film I don't think its placement here is a coincidence. That said, I don't think every aspect of a work of art needs to be consciously or intentionally placed for it to be a valid interpretation. As I said in the article, it may be unintentional, but that doesn't it's not there. As you said in your last paragraph, unconscious references can still be valid.

Sure, anything's valid in this department, in fact I'm not dismissing your observations. I only found this aspect probably more marginal and not as influential as you think. In fact, most of Dies Irae quotations in film music in general are imho more in the department of the musical joke than anything else. It's part of the bag of tricks of any composer and I guess when they find a spot, they probably use it mainly for the fun of it (especially if we talk of horror/thriller films).

To me, this is the kind of stuff is what makes analyzing music so interesting--the little details (intentional or not) that can be used to glean some deeper meaning. As for the joke part, I don't see why they are mutually exclusive. One can quote the Dies Irae for intellectual purposes and also enjoy its presence for the jokes. Stephen Sondheim has dismissed his usage of the Dies Irae in Sweeney Todd as just referencing the menacing quality of film music, but if you've heard the score I think you'd agree the theme is integral to the scores structure and message.

In my opinion, a film composer like Williams reacts and then writes more emotionally than we could think. He doesn't intellectualize the process too much. He's aware of course of the film's subthemes and he catches nuances and details that are hidden in it. As we said in another thread, it's the film that dictates the approach and the subsequent musical result. Williams, like many other film composers, reacts to all the film is suggesting to him and then tries to translate all those stimulations into real music, weaving them into the fabric of the score. However, it's the emotional aspects that he has to accompany first and foremost (and sometimes he has to carry them all on his shoulders).

Well put Maurizio. My sentiments and experience exactly. Williams is very much a composer concerned with the emotion of the film or a scene. He can be intellectual about it but his working aesthetic and method nearly always begins on emotional and pacing levels. His approach, which is similar as the one used by his peers like Goldsmith, is to translate the hidden element of the scene visible (or audible) and react to the pure film without any other influences in a very visceral way and he comes back to this gut feeling when he starts to work on any given scene. This is not to trivialize Williams' intellectual input into his music but rather to repeat what the Maestro himself has said. It is always a mystery to us the audience and I wager to the composer himself what actually goes into composing a piece of music, whether the process is emotional or intellectual in origin, but probably both.

I think JW puts more of an emphasis on the intellectual side of composition than you guys would suggest. Of course Spielberg and the producers are probably more interested in his emotional approach, but I think a considerable amount of time and effort is spent on working out the intellectual aspects. I think that's why JW's scores are so interesting to analyze--there's the emotional stuff that makes it fun to listen to, and there's an intellectual side that means there's always more things to discover.

Interestingly, Maurizio, it seems that rather than disagreeing on the extent to which JW focuses on the intellectual side (although we probably slightly differ there as well), we disagree more on the way he spends his intellectual energy. You seem to think he spends more energy referencing pre-established forms of music to emphasize similarities between the the film and other relevant works. I think he spends more time creating his own musical universe, and developing that universe to parallel/enhance the film's messages.

[TownerFan 4,983]

The great thing about the work of a true artist like Williams is that it is open to different views and interpretations and all of these are valid.

Yeah, I understood the similarities between JP and Carnival, I just think it's too broad to claim obvious inspiration. Yes, there are different emotional pallettes used for the different types of dinosaurs, but I'm not really sure how else to approach it. You can't have the scary stuff playing during the triceratops scene, and you can't have the pretty stuff playing during the raptor attack. To me this just seems like JW fitting the emotion/narrative requirements of the scene.

Well, yes, of course, as he always does. But again, I think you read my comment too literally. It's not like Williams said, "Let's do my version of Carnival of the Animals!". It's interesting (imho) to note how he chose to treat this aspect of the story. There are different ways to score a film, so it's interesting to see how the composer's chosen approach works and how it influences/enhances/augments what we're seeing. Same goes for the King Kong or the Disney references I spoke about before.

About your last sentence, I don't think it could be simplified in one way or another. I believe that it always depends on the work we're talking about. Some scores require a more intense intellectual effort, while others are more the result of a gut reaction from the composer. It's something called by the film's needs and it's not mutually exclusive. I can see your point about Williams paralleling in music the film's "messages", but in the specific case of Jurassic Park, I tend to buy more the idea that Williams wanted first and foremost to create a piece of work truly fitting the inner spirit of the film, i.e. enhancing the adventure and the fun of it, to make the filmic experience all the more vibrant and exciting.

Only one more thing about the reference models (be it Kong, Stravinsky or cartoon scoring): as I said, I fear you're reading something too literal in what I'm trying to say. It's not a matter of direct quotes from that score or obvious wink to that other one. It's something about the spirit and the overall tone, much like in the 1977 Star Wars, where Williams seems to acknowledge most of the Golden Age film music, esp. the swashbuckling scores of Korngold. Acknowledging the models of inspiration (especially in such a classy way) isn't something dismissive of the work's qualities and even of its own originality.

[indy4 155]

The great thing about the work of a true artist like Williams is that it is open to different views and interpretations and all of these are valid.

About your last sentence, I don't think it could be simplified in one way or another. I believe that it always depends on the work we're talking about. Some scores require a more intense intellectual effort, while others are more the result of a gut reaction from the composer. It's something called by the film's needs and it's not mutually exclusive. I can see your point about Williams paralleling in music the film's "messages", but in the specific case of Jurassic Park, I tend to buy more the idea that Williams wanted first and foremost to create a piece of work truly fitting the inner spirit of the film, i.e. enhancing the adventure and the fun of it, to make the filmic experience all the more vibrant and exciting.

I think we'll just have to agree to disagree here. I think JW focuses on both equally in JP, but I could see why someone would think otherwise.

Only one more thing about the reference models (be it Kong, Stravinsky or cartoon scoring): I fear you're reading something too literal in what I'm trying to say. It's not a matter of literal quotes from that score or obvious wink to that other one. It's something about the spirit and the overall tone, much like in the 1977 Star Wars, where Williams seems to acknowledge most of the Golden Age film music, esp. the swashbuckling scores of Korngold. Acknowledging the models of inspiration (especially in such a classy way) isn't something dismissive of the work's qualities and even of its own originality.

The "overall mood" of a score is just the sum of its parts, plus any chemistry that is found in the interaction or context of these parts. If you hear similarities between KK and JP score, that is because Steiner and Williams are doing at least one specific thing the same, just as there are specific reasons why the "overall mood" of Star Wars is so clearly an allusion to Golden Age scores (some of which I can point out, some of which require more music theory training to fully identify). The only similarities I hear between JP and KK (based on the KK suite I listened to) are so broad that almost any JW score would share them with KK. I don't see how JP is uniquely more in the vain of KK than other JW scores, or at least not enough to warrant inclusion in an analysis. Same goes fro Stravinsky and Disney.

[TownerFan 4,983]

I hope I didn't give the impression I wanted to dismiss your observations, indy4. I really appreciate your analysis. It's just made me think several things about this score. This is the kind of discussion I prefer doing here and the one that makes me step out from my lurking mode.

It's been a nice chat!

[indy4 155]

Oh absolutely not!--I agree, this is the kind of stuff that I wish we had more of on JWFan. It's been fun indeed.

[Incanus 5,716]

Terrific discussion indeed.

I just hope I would have time to participate more.

[KK 3,307]

Likewise. There's a lot of fascinating discussion here, but I wish I had more time to participate.

[Hlao-roo 389]

I just wish there were more snide digs and ad hominem attacks.

[Incanus 5,716]

I just wish there were more snide digs and ad hominem attacks.

Yeah because relatively civil and stimulating discussion on the subject itself can't be interesting. We need a bit of blood on the floor to get the ball rolling.

Both indy4 and Maurizio bring to the fore some interesting analytical points but I can't comment on indy4's analysis itself as I can't read it (I know, I know you could spend few dollars to worse things than FSM subscription) but the commentary in this thread shows how differently we can approach the analysis and view a piece of art and find often quite unexpected and surprising facets in a familiar work when we look at the different point of view. I know it sounds blase but even if we do not agree partly or wholly with the suggested interpretation it at least shows us some before unconsidered aspect of the work and can enrich our perception of it.

[MSM 126]

JW doesn't quote anything from Steiner's score (maybe only the cue "Jurassic Park Gate" has the most obvious nod),

Maurizio, could you specify to which track of KK you refer?

[TownerFan 4,983]

The use of "jungle" percussion always made me think of "A Boat in the Fog" from King Kong. But probably is less of a nod than it seems to me. On the other part, "Malcolm's Journey" from The Lost World looks like a clear homage to that piece.

Again, the King Kong reference in both Jurassic Park scores is imho in the vein of taking a "role model" and morph it into something new. It's not something like "let's quote Steiner here and there", but more of a post-modern reflection of recognizing what it came before and hinting at the audience that what we're seeing (and listening) stands on the shoulders of the great cinematic past.

[crocodile 8,020]

Well, not to be too obvious but this track (from 2:06):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W061ncGjDec

is a clear homage to this (from 1:21)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gXWf44Xd1A

The cue is even called "Steiner in the Grass", isn't it?

I think the usage of what you called the "Dies Irae" theme is likely not a direct reference to this much-abused musical figure and probably you went a tad too far with your speculation. Yes, there's undoubtedly a slight nod to it, but I tend to think that the use of of certain intervals and harmonies is probably a quite natural consequence when you want to convey a sense of imminent danger and threat, so I'd go for the "unconscious" reference.

Yes, it's the same with Silvestri's Predator or Williams' own Close Encounters, or Elfman's Mars Attacks!. Similar lines, but not a direct quotes.

Intersting read, indy4!

King Kong

Karol

[Incanus 5,716]

Well, not to be too obvious but this track (from 2:06):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W061ncGjDec

is a clear homage to this (from 1:21)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gXWf44Xd1A

The cue is even called "Steiner in the Grass", isn't it?

Yes that is a very clear homage, Williams' nod to the grand father of film music.

I seem to remember reading that he does this again e.g. in the source music in KotCS on the track Journey to Akator, where the diegetic piece is modelled after Steiner's work in the Treasure of Sierra Madre.

[MSM 126]

As it is known, there have been temp tracks used in the scoring of JP.

I have a specific question as to Journey to the Island. Is it known if there was a temp track used for the first 1:30 min of this track (originally named 'To the Island')?