Sharkissimo 1,973 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/film/10767345/10-most-overrated-films-of-all-time.htmlDisagree with some of the choices (VIDEODROME, IKIRU, AMACORD and SKYFALL) but the rest are spot-on. INCEPTION in particular.On release, Inception was a must-see that dwarfed reservations. Expressions of disappointment seemed irrelevant – “See it anyway” was the general chorus. It was a monster hit that got more credit as brainy spectacle than it deserved, by quite a huge factor, but at least it prompted discussion – reams and reams of it, from already-obsessive fans to scathing refuseniks, and everyone in between. It’s pretty clear by now that the edifice of the film was awe-inspiring but essentially hollow. Put another way, the script fixated on internal logic at the expense of, well, the external kind – why should any of this matter? What’s it really about?It’s a criminal failing of the movie that it purports to be about people’s dreams being invaded, but demonstrates no instinct at all for what a dream has ever felt like, and no flair for making us feel like we’re in one, at any point. The stern, poker-faced sexlessness of Nolan’s universe has never been more of a hindrance. What we get is more like a series of computer games being invaded, or set pieces from Bond movies. The layering is virtuosic and often thunderously impressive – like playing three or four such games in perfect tandem – but there’s a vital core missing. Nolan conceived of a brilliant central idea, but then got so carried away with trying to explore it in an architecturally clever way, he lost his grip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I agree about Inception Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hlao-roo 389 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Whatever its merits as satire or social commentary, I find Network flat-out entertaining. For me its unmodulated, overwritten quality works. Just behind 12 Angry Men as my favorite Lumet film. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkissimo 1,973 Posted April 23, 2014 Author Share Posted April 23, 2014 The most serious failing of INCEPTION is how Nolan sidelines the film's most compelling aspect (Cobb's relationship with Mal) in favour of videogamey set-pieces and MC Escher wankery. It doesn't know whether it wants to be a dark romance (a la VERTIGO), a heist caper or a Bond flick. It tries to be all of those but never really pulls it off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I find The Dark Knight trilogy very overrated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkissimo 1,973 Posted April 23, 2014 Author Share Posted April 23, 2014 Yep, same here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I find basically everything Nolan has done overrated.I agree that Skyfall is overrated. I mean, it seemed like everyone was going crazy about that flick. Was it that great? Not really. I found it to be a fairly ordinary Bond flick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 me too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I saw it 6 times in the cinema! Gruesome Son of a Bitch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightscape94 965 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 So 5 of the 10 just happened to be in the last 10 years? Short attention span? Gruesome Son of a Bitch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 It's the Telegraph!Fairly arbitrary list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I saw it 6 times in the cinema!And wrote a good review on JWFan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 The most overrated film last year was American Hustle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,234 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 In this article/thread: hipsters trying to appear clever by telling us what's not clever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 It's the Telegraph!Fairly arbitrary list.This is what you say about every paper, though. Anyway, I get to feel all smug now for having my thoughts regarding Inception in official print. Because if anyone can remember I pretty much said back then exactly what this guy is only saying now.Movie is a jazzy load of tosh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,234 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 You and he just need to try harder! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Most of these criticisms were uttered in one form or another years before and by a lot of known and totally unknown individuals (Oscartm movies, really?) - or they refer to films the public at large never wanted to see anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 This is what you say about every paper, though.Every English newspaper...I chose to see Inception only after the hype died down. It's an entertaining, technically well made film with some good acting and a nice too-clever-for-it's-own-good plot. But it completely fails on the deeply philosophical level that it's fans say it operates on. And crucially, it's dream worlds never resemble any dream I had. Or any dream I heard anyone else talk about.Most of these criticisms were uttered in one form or another years before and by a lot of known and totally unknown individuals (Oscartm movies, really?) - or they refer to films the public at large never wanted to see anyway. Yes, all very obvious choices, though I was startled to not see Juno included on this list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,234 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 But is the fact that it fails to live up to the philosophical mumbo-jumbo spread by teenage fanboys a fault of the film itself?And I actually thought the dream portrayal was not bad at all. Sure it didn't delve into truly bizarre stuff, but for the most part, it's what I've experienced at night. Something fairly normal, with just enough oddness about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Because you read English newspapers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 But is the fact that it fails to live up to the philosophical mumbo-jumbo spread by teenage fanboys a fault of the film itself?Not just teenagers. Also otherwise intelligent well educated adults. i was told by a woman of my age, a teacher no less that the film was "food for thought".I still have no idea what on earth she meant by that.As for not blaming the film. I think it's documented that it's director intended much of the mumbo-jumbo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,234 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Show me this documentation, Cosman.I swear, the Nolan pitchfork squad is as bad as the Nolan fanboy squad! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Because you read English newspapers.I occasionally skim articles.Your newspapers are the one thing about England, or Great Britain that I can look down to and say that we are better! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Nolan is your man if you need dreary portrayals of earnest man facing earnest moral choices in earnest weighty surroundings. He sure should get a prize for sucking the fun out of movies and making the easily impressionable ponder earnest thoughts: who doesn't want to make people think about surveillance states etc. while watching their gaudy expensive man-in-batsuit junk movies? Sharkissimo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Show me this documentation, Cosman.I swear, the Nolan pitchfork squad is as bad as the Nolan fanboy squad!A quick Google search gave me nothing. and the matter isnt important enough for me to actually hunt for anything.Inception is a perfectly fine heist film that follows some of the mechanics of The Matrix, but draws a philosophical blank for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I reckon the vast majority of its fanbase loved it because it flattered them, made them feel smart for 'getting it'. Ooo, it's sooo deep. The spinning metaphor at the end, Ooo, it reeeally profound. Every one of them immediately took to their iPhone's chat app to share the momentus occasion. Anyway we've been over this countless times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,234 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Indeed. And you're as wrong as you've ever been! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 And yet you keep coming back for more, Lee.Still regretting your decision? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 My decision that Inception is a bad movie? No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Inception is a perfectly fine heist film that follows some of the mechanics of The Matrix, but draws a philosophical blank for me.Considering what passes for movies these days, INCEPTION was an absolutely ok 2 hours at the cinema. Considering you accept that all those blockbusters must have men with machine guns and expensive car chases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Your decision to "leave now, and never come back"I thought you might actually stick to your guns this time. But Jason predicted this and just labeled you a drama queen.Pity he was right.Inception is a perfectly fine heist film that follows some of the mechanics of The Matrix, but draws a philosophical blank for me.Considering what passes for movies these days, INCEPTION was an absolutely ok 2 hours at the cinema. Considering you accept that all those blockbusters must have men with machine guns and expensive car chases.So Inception is good because everything else made these days is worse then it is? that's a rather cynical point of view?I agree that Inception is solid entertainment. But I didnt take away anything from it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Because you read English newspapers. I occasionally skim articles. Lol of course you do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I never bought the whole philosophical angle that both fanboys and haters of the film seem to rage on about.To me, Inception is a really entertaining heist film, nothing more, nothing less. There is no incredible profundity to it, no large philosophical statements that Nolan is trying to make, all of that is just a product of over-hype by its fan-base. But it is an entertaining film, and a great summer blockbuster flick, to me at least. Joni Wiljami 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Lol of course you do.It's actually true. I get most of my info about your country from the Beeb, or lengthy diatribel discussions with people who inhabit your great Island nation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Your decision to "leave now, and never come back"I thought you might actually stick to your guns this time. But Jason predicted this and just labeled you a drama queen.Pity he was right.Between lurking here and posting in 'the other place' I was never really far away. Which I'm sure brought much comfort to you. I quite like the guest2 moniker, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Can we mention "the other place" here?Is it secret? Is it safe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 So Inception is good because everything else made these days is worse then it is? that's a rather cynical point of view?It's just the pragmatic realization that i can't expect anything better in summer cinema (the spectacle variety). So why fight it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dixon Hill 4,234 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I never bought the whole philosophical angle that both fanboys and haters of the film seem to rage on about.To me, Inception is a really entertaining heist film, nothing more, nothing less. There is no incredible profundity to it, no large philosophical statements that Nolan is trying to make, all of that is just a product of over-hype by its fan-base. But it is an entertaining film, and a great summer blockbuster flick, to me at least.As far as I know, the only deeper intention Nolan had was to suggest a connection between the act of inception as performed in the film, and the act of making a movie and showing it to an audience. Which is interesting.Its profundity in my experience doesn't come from anything like that though. It's a very emotional film to me. I guess maybe it's hard to sniff out if you're not inclined to see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I never bought the whole philosophical angle that both fanboys and haters of the film seem to rage on about.To me, Inception is a really entertaining heist film, nothing more, nothing less. There is no incredible profundity to it, no large philosophical statements that Nolan is trying to make, all of that is just a product of over-hype by its fan-base. But it is an entertaining film, and a great summer blockbuster flick, to me at least.I'd rather just watch Die Hard instead. A film which doesn't wallow in its own stylistic magnificence and smarts. Effortlessly more sophisticated movie as a result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 So how long do you exactly plan to re-re-re-watch DIE HARD as point of reference for good action movies? It's from fucking 1988. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 A great movie is a great movie. Regardless of when it was made. It hold up great BTW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Having watched Die Hard for the first time just last year, I can't help but agree. A fine film that holds up very well indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I agree with Roger Ebert though that the character of the Deputy Mayor harms the film. Why did they think they needed an obvious fucking idiot in this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 That's beside the point. I like FIRST BLOOD but why should i throw it against a very different breed of current zeitgeist movies? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 First Blood isnt on the level of Die Hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Stop feeding on your childhood crap. It's a lean and taut action thriller not an exercise in redefining cinema or anything like that. Sharkissimo 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 So how long do you exactly plan to re-re-re-watch DIE HARD as point of reference for good action movies? It's from fucking 1988.Yeah and Raiders is from 1981. What's your point? Don't tell me your coming at this from a cool modernist's perspective. Ugh. But if it helps your noble progressive outlook on life and art I'll drop in the more recent The Matrix, Kill Bill Vol.1 and The Bourne Identify. Hope that restored balance for you a little. That's beside the point. I like FIRST BLOOD but why should i throw it against a very different breed of current zeitgeist movies? Oh god. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 The more I watch Tarantino, the less convinced I am with him. Isn't he basically a hipper, more articulate, slightly demented version of JJ Abrahams? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I HATED Kill Bill Vol. 2, and haven't seen Django, but no, I don't agree with you that he's perhaps an "unconvincing" film maker. One of his films is in my top 10.However I do think he can be hit and miss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 I'm waiting for him to make a film that is more then just a hip reworking of a sub genre thats no longer fashionable. Like JJ most of QT's films are about other films, not about the actual real world. Though JJ only confines himself to Hollywood, not obscure asian sub genre's.Jackie Brown is a stunningly good film though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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