nightscape94 965 Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 Ever see Primer? Great time travel flick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,364 Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 Not yet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,364 Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 That was pretty funny. The movie is even stupider than I thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hurmm 91 Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Very much agreed on the points about Emilia Clarke and Jai Courtney. And all the other points too basically, it's just that I never bothered thinking that deep to arrive at those questions because the "oh look at how smart I am" timeline jumping in this movie was so rubbish that I really couldn't care less. The original the travel stuff were totally loony and loopy but yet simple. It was never very central to the story in the sense that you just accepted it, smiled at how crazy it was, and just went back to enjoying the action/story happening in the present day. That's why they were so much fun. This new one jumps on the recent timeline jumping/splitting/resetting bandwagon and it ends up being so central to the story and yet so boring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,364 Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Well said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giftheck 916 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Just so long as nobody here thinks that anybody who enjoyed the movie is wrong (I've seen that on other forums regarding this movie - I don't think it's as bad a movie as it is divisive - there are clearly some errors in it, but I still personally think this is 7/10 and would have been higher had they taken more time to explain things - I get the feeling that certain things were cut for the sake of the runtime. And for me, this replaces T3.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Skywalker 1,795 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Er...the film was not as bad as the previews made it.Are there complain about the CGI? Ok there are some really bad shots.But the Young Arnold must be the most perfect CGI human yet. He is not very expressive though...so that helps.... (Did they use a real body like in T4 or not?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 I essentially agree with Jason's review of the film. It starts of rather promising, but after a while it descends into a stew of paradoxes, sudden plot twists and some very poorly explained or thought out plotting.Say what you want about Cameron's films on a story level, but they were lean and effective. You knew what was going on, what the stakes are, and where the characters stood.This film spends too much time trying to put the viewer on the wrong foot, even though the trailers give away all the big surprises!I love time travel stories, I love time paradox stories, but they are very easy to get wrong, and things end up in a barely understandable plot that doesnt make sense if you think about it.X-Men Days Of Future Past last year is an example of a time paradox story done right. With this Terminator film I too often got a JJ Abrams/Orci/Kurtzman vibe. The script was being clever just for the sake of being clever, sacrificing plot clarity and emotional depth.As for the casting. Clarke does a reasonable job with Sarah Conner. Playing her as a mix of the sane one from The Terminator, and the haggard one from Judgement Day. It helps that she has genuine screen chemistry. I likes Sarah, and cared about her. So all in all an effective performance even though there really is only one Sarah Conner...Linda Hamilton.As for the rest of the new cast, I dont really know why they were cast.Courtney doesnt resemble Michael Biehn at all, which would be fine. But he doesnt really bring anything new to the role. Also it bothered me that when he stepped into the time machine he was ripped. Washboard stomach and huge abs. Is that really how a person looks who's been living in a post apocalyptic nightmare?Same for the guy playing John Conner. A role that has now been played by many actors, and still Furlong is the only one who made the role stand out.J.K. Simmons is in this, and he's great to watch because he's J.K Simmons. But the role doesnt go anywhere. (I'm not sure the film needed the character)Arnold!It's strangely good to see Arnold again in his signature role. Even though he's pushing 70 he still has loads of charisma, something most of the casts lacks.He IS The Terminator. At no point in the film did I have any doubt about that. He plays this role with an effortless authority, and just the right amount of self-knowledge. It's a lean performance, but a good one.The direction is fairly workman-like, which always surprises me on a film that cost 150 million bucks to make.Alan Taylor dutifully replicates many shots from Cameron's two films in the early parts of the film. But when left to his own devices he doesnt add much new to the table.This isnt a bad film. It's entertaining even when it becomes confusing. The effects look good, and some of the 1984 stuff is genuinely clever and well done.But for many years now there are the two Terminator films that Cameron directed, and everything else.This film doesnt change that.[EDIT]The film didnt always managed to hide the fact that Emilia Clark is tiny. 1.57 meters. A full 11 cm shorter then Linda Hamilton, who has a very different build. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Plus Hamilton was never really a babe. Clark actually looks miscast to me, because of how beautiful she is, although I'm sure she's fine in this. But she's hardly 'gritty' looking is she. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Lena Headey was actually a far closer watch to Hamilton's Sarah Conner looks wise.Clarke is beautiful, has real screen presence and can act, which makes up for the fact that she is far from the perfect actress to play Sarah Conner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Yeah Headey would have been the PERFECT pick, in a Cameron directed Terminator sequel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Sadly she already played the role once in a TV show that flopped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 She did? Oh right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Yeah the Sarah Conner Chronicles, not often remembered now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giftheck 916 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Nobody's ever going to ask Edward Furlong back for John Connor. I though Jason Clarke did a good job, though he did seem a little more hokey when it came to him being the T-3000. I did get the feeling the T-3000 was aware of who sent Pops, though.The biggest problem this film suffers from is the fact it doesn't explain two crucial things: Matt Smith Skynet's origins, or the whole 'nexus point' and how it affects the timeflow (such as how the T-3000, being from a future that ceased to exist after Kyle went back, could go to the new 2014). If they make another film, they definitely need to explain these. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 The time travel mechanics in these Terminator films never made sense though.They prevent Skynet from ever excisting in the second film, yet Arnold still excists after they do so.It really doesn't make any sense, but because they didn't focus soo much on the time travel stuff it didn't really matter. In the latest film it does, and none of it adds up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giftheck 916 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 I think this actually slips an explanation in quite well for time travel in the previous films.As John said: "We're exiles in time." It means that once you time travel you are unaffected by events that could otherwise have affected you. IE the destruction of Cyberdyne and the T-800 materials in Terminator 2, yet Uncle Bob still existed.It's more or less how John could be there even though the 2029 he came from didn't exist, as he went back after Kyle did (and Kyle and Sarah altered the past). Of course, there is the distinct possibility that John dimension-hopped as well, if Skynet could do it.And that brings me to another thing. If Skynet could come from another dimension, then it's possible Pops was sent back by somebody else from another dimension. I mean, I'd assume after Skynet compromised John, John went about destroying what was left of the Resistance. It wouldn't surprise me if it turned out to be another John that sent Pops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,364 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 So the current rights holders want to turn The Terminator franchise into basically Sliders on the big screen. great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Blech! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,364 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 The problem with time travel movies where where you are essentially a double as soon as you travel back is that it should make the owners of the time machine to instantly supremely powerful as soon as you invent it.IE, you could build only one Terminator and wait a few days, then send him back in time 5 seconds to grab another copy of himself; then back in time another 5 seconds to grab another, etc. Pretty soon you will have 100,000 Terminators.You could do the same with gold bars or something to instantly be the wealthiest person on earth in any time frame Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 I'm not sure that with actually work. We should ask Sir Stephen Hawking.The main flaw with most time travel stories is that if you go back in time with the purpose to, let say, kill Hilter before he rises to power...After you done that, you remove the reason for going back in time in the first place.... So its not possible to go back in time to kill Hitler, even though you just did so... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giftheck 916 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 There are different theories on how time travel would work, but what you describe is a never-ending loop. Event A happens and it takes Event B out of existence. However, Event A is dependant on Event B happening, so Event A doesn't happen. And because Event A doesn't happen, Event B happens. Because Event B happens, Event A happens and it takes Event B out of existence...Does time travel make other people's heads hurt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 You would spend eternity killing and not killing Hitler! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giftheck 916 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 I didn't say Pops came from another dimension, I said the person who sent Pops may have.We need a set of rules for dimension travel too, though, and I hope those are explained in the next film. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Boooring! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wycket 36 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 I don't see it as much alternate dimensions as alternate realities (think Back to the Future 2). Hell, at the end of Terminator 2 John should have disappeared as well as Uncle Bob. The fact that both continued to exist after the supposed destruction of Cyberdyne and supposedly stopping Judgement Day established a multiple worlds theory in of itself, whether Cameron intended to or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,364 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Back To The Future is the only film series really where you can "disappear" on screen as a result of changing things.In most stories you are just a double now that gets to keep living in the new world you've changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wycket 36 Posted July 13, 2015 Share Posted July 13, 2015 Back To The Future is the only film series really where you can "disappear" on screen as a result of changing things.In most stories you are just a double now that gets to keep living in the new world you've changed.Exactly, multiple worlds theory. Terminator has been doing that since T2, its only now that they are being more overt and using it to their advantage rather than simply, "Well, Judgement Day was always going to happen, so here's a bunch of Terminators. Run!" Ever since the time machine was used to send Reese and the Terminator back in time they been creating splinter timelines/universes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 What? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,364 Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 What don't you understand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 I just don't agree with Wycket Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giftheck 916 Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 It's the truth. Each film, tv series, book etc has its own splinter from the first two films. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,364 Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 Yep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 They just ignore the end of the second film because if they didn't they wouldn't be any sequels or spin-offs.I doubt they intentionally went with any type of temporal theory to justify this.Except a monotary one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,364 Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 The second film doesn't actually end the way you seem to remember it does Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,528 Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 So, is the film worse than Salvation then?KarolGeez, no!!!I liked it, in a completely mindless way. Just one question: was the JK Simmonds character seen in "The Terminator"? I can't remember him.Actually, I've just had a thought: if Pops destroyed the T-101 in 1984, then the station-fight would not happen, and JK Simmonds would have no knowledge of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,364 Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 You clearly weren't paying attention.JK Simmons' character (O'Neil) is a brand new one invented for this movie. Well, they want you to believe he was one of the (previously unnamed) officers in the department store with Kyle Reese in the original (and new) timeline, now aged 33 years from 1984 to 2017.And the police station shootout from the original film never happens in the new timeline. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Skywalker 1,795 Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 As for the rest of the new cast, I dont really know why they were cast.Courtney doesnt resemble Michael Biehn at all, which would be fine. But he doesnt really bring anything new to the role. Also it bothered me that when he stepped into the time machine he was ripped. Washboard stomach and huge abs. Is that really how a person looks who's been living in a post apocalyptic nightmare?Um... with that line of thought, stefan, T-800 are really lousy infiltrators, aren't they?I dont think the resistance are just persons living in a post-apocalyptic world. They are soldiers fighting. They must be fit, dont they?That said, i really dont know why this series keeps changing the main characters (except arnold) in every film. And that they dont try to choose lookalikes. I mean, how many john connors are we going to have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 The only actor playing John Connor who I found believable appearance wise was the guy who had no lines in T2. He didn't do anything but he looked like an authority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,364 Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 30 Years Later, People Are Still Trying To Figure Out The Time Signature Of The Terminator Theme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 It really is an excellent theme, isn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,364 Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 Yep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 Watching Terminator 2: Judgement Day on Blu.Aaaahhhh the real deal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,364 Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 Genisys sequels likely canceledhttp://www.avclub.com/article/terminator-franchise-might-be-trouble-222802 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,364 Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 Right. Probably not! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted July 24, 2015 Share Posted July 24, 2015 Very likely!Not even Ah'nuld could save this franchise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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