igger6

The extended HOOK soundtrack has given me my first real appreciation for Granny Wendy's theme, and lo and behold, I just discovered the old gal was more of an intergalactic traveler than we thought. Granny Wendy's Theme http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n7aezfIaJuE Granny Wendy's Wide World of Sports Happy Monday!

ACROSS THE FREAKING STARS. I can't believe this hasn't come up yet. It's one of the greatest themes Williams has ever written (especially since he wrote it in 1977 and called it "Main Title," then inverted and fiddled with it 25 years later to form the defining theme of the prequel trilogy...hat tip to Clemmenson at Filmtracks for that observation), but every single scene that it underscores, almost without exception if I recall, is so laughably bad that it makes me want to disavow Star Wars and enlist in the Starfleet Academy. Every time I hear it apart from Episodes II and III, I like it a little more. In fact, it's actually getting to the point where those movies are losing their power to ruin it for me. (UPDATE--And, apparently, hat tip to half the posters on this forum, who apparently noticed the Luke's Theme/Across the Stars connection years ago...)

Has anyone mentioned "The Land Race"? I fell in love with this track, of all places, when it was temped on the trailer for Treasure Planet. <object style="height: 390px; width: 640px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxaJY8UZxn4?version=3&feature=player_detailpage"><param'>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxaJY8UZxn4?version=3&feature=player_detailpage"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yxaJY8UZxn4?version=3&feature=player_detailpage" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="640" height="360"></object><br><br> And I think someone already threw out "The Flying Car" from Chamber of Secrets, but let me add "The Spiders," which I'm convinced he wrote as a series of descending four-note phrases to represent all those eight-legged creatures. (The track is certainly more impressive than the spider effects in the movie...)<br> <object style="height: 390px; width: 640px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kj_dh_bOj0M?version=3&feature=player_detailpage"><param'>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kj_dh_bOj0M?version=3&feature=player_detailpage"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kj_dh_bOj0M?version=3&feature=player_detailpage" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="640" height="360"></object><br> And in my book, the action highlight of the prequel trilogy<br><br> <object style="height: 390px; width: 640px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMpd39-JPo4?version=3&feature=player_detailpage"><param'>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMpd39-JPo4?version=3&feature=player_detailpage"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMpd39-JPo4?version=3&feature=player_detailpage" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="640" height="360"></object>

Giacchino's Dubai theme from M:I:GP probably gets credit for the biggest goofy grin I experienced in a movie theater this year. It kicks in at the 20-second mark and then goes crazy at 1:48. This is what Zimmer ought to be doing: <object style="height: 390px; width: 640px"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lhc-2HQzqqU?version=3&feature=player_detailpage"><param'>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lhc-2HQzqqU?version=3&feature=player_detailpage"><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always"><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lhc-2HQzqqU?version=3&feature=player_detailpage" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" width="640" height="360"></object><br><br> Oh, and my second-goofiest grin was every single performance of Atom's theme in Real Steel. Christian Clemmenson at Filmtracks.com mused that it could become a staple in stadiums. May it be! Its single best moment is at 3:11 in "Final Round," but you need a few seconds of contextual tension to fully appreciate it, so start at about 3:04: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iemOZsEM-U4&feature=player_detailpage#t=183s

I actually think that moment of similarity between "Pursuit of Dejah" and "Pursuit of the Falcon" shows exactly why Giacchino is our last, best hope. Tintin's release is recent enough, and the passage fleeting enough, that it's plainly not plagiarism, and anyone who plays by the Maestro's rules as dutifully as Giacchino does is bound to hit upon a few sequences of notes that JW has used at some point in the last 45 years. Plus, there are just certain musical intervals and tricks that match certain emotions (e.g. all those major-sixth love themes from JW's golden age). The "up high, down low, up slightly higher" pattern that overlaps in the two cues has been wowing 'em since Star Wars and probably well before. What's remarkable in comparing the two is the vast difference even an inversion of two notes and a slight change in timing can produce. Tintin's heroic theme sounds heroic but also quirky, offbeat, and even a little childish, while the Giacchino riff sounds noble and militaristic—each suited (presumably) to its context. But my point is that we can't bemoan contemporary film music's general lack of intelligence, thematic complexity, and orchestral prominence out of one side of our mouths and then tar anyone who attempts it as a JW-cloning hack. (I exaggerate the charge, obviously, and I don't know anyone's tastes well enough to say who's accusing whom of what. I just want to point out that anyone who can be accused of sounding like John Williams has already earned my rapt attention, if not my outright devotion.) And Blumenkohl's dead-on about "Dejah's Theme." I'm not thrilled by the melody, but the construction and the orchestration are classic.

Not to get too deep into heady musical theory territory, but has anyone else noticed that you can sing the name "Captain America" to the first six notes of this theme? If you needed more proof it's a keeper, there it is.

I actually didn't pick out the main theme (i.e., the first clip that plays on the website) as I watched the movie on Friday, but hearing it now, I like it. It's full of wonder and energy and perfectly suits the Spielbergian vibe of the film. At the same time, though, it seems to suffer from a common Giacchino limitation--namely, he devises a catchy motif of about a half-dozen notes and repeats it in assorted orchestrations, tempi, and volumes without much development or variation. At their core, the most famous Williams themes resemble pop standards in their progression, cohesiveness, and sense of inevitability. Heck, love it or hate it, even Zimmer/Badelt's "He's a Pirate" theme has a comparatively extensive B section. Don't get me wrong; I love Star Trek, The Incredibles, "Married Life" from Up, much of LOST, and especially the main "Parisian" theme from Ratatouille (which I consider the most gorgeous melody written for a film in the past decade). I also love his matchless ability to faithfully modernize the themes and styles of eras past (a skill that was in evidence, if not quite often enough, in Super 8). But in most of the above cases, the memorable material consists of a few hummable measures linked by serviceable and well-orchestrated filler. Rarely if ever has he devised a "scene-specific" theme the way John Williams often did in his greatest periods, and his leitmotif references (as in LOST) frequently amount to little more than quotations of previous statements without much variation. (LOST was long and complex enough to provide a few counter-examples, but that score is the exception.) Unless Giacchino kicks it up a notch in the next stage of his career (which, judging from the Amazon previews, will definitely not begin with Cars 2), he's not the next Maestro. The best of what's around, almost certainly, but that's all for now.

I guess The Social Network's win for its three-note theme is the Academy's apology for snubbing Zimmer and Howard for their two-note Batman theme... And on the song side, I'm pretty sure now that even if Terpsichore, St. Cecilia, and George Gershwin all got together and ghostwrote the most gorgeous song in the history of the universe, but they submitted it under Alan Menken's name, the Academy would refuse to give it a Best Song Oscar. There's no upper bound on nominations, as the Maestro can attest, but my Lord, Menken sure seems to have hit one for victories. The Swell Season's angsty whining beat out three worthy entries from Enchanted in '08, and now Randy Newman's paper-thin "We Belong Together" bests a song whose melody alone should have put the award in the bag. (In fact, that's not a bad idea. Those lyrics were as bad as every other nominee's in the category.) I don't think there can be much debate that the credits song was one of Toy Story 3's only weaknesses. Oh well. At least they didn't give it to Country Strong or...whatever that was from 127 Hours.

Everyone on this board needs to watch this now. At least twice.

My name is igger6, and I am a recovering Shyamalanaholic. I used to praise this guy to high heaven. I loved (still love) Sixth Sense, I forgave Unbreakable, I loved (still like) Signs, and I found bits and pieces of The Village to be decent. (As someone noted, you've got to hang your disbelief from a bungee cord on that one.) But I sensed the downward trend, and as soon as I saw the laughable hagiography that accompanied Lady in the Water's release, I saw Shyamalan for what he is: a talented writer and filmmaker with a few good ideas (and perhaps many more) who is so drunk on his own Messiah complex that he gets in his own way. As far back as Signs, he lobbed thinly-veiled insults at audiences who didn't "get" (read: "like") Unbreakable. He found himself a pointlessly prominent, distracting role in The Village. He apparently cast himself as the literary savior of the world in Lady, which I admittedly haven't seen and won't criticize. Now, he's showing his, um, trademark humility in discussing The Last Airbender: M. Night Shyamalan has finished his script for The Last Airbender, the live action movie based on Nickelodeon's epic cartoon, Avatar — and he's told Paramount and Nickelodeon that he thought they had a new Star Wars on their hands....Shyamalan wants to create, as he called it, religion around this movie similar to the religion that inspired him from other films. "Star Wars had religion and I mean that," explained Night. "Something that connects us with these stories which is what they had in the Star Wars and the first Matrix. Those movies caused religions to happen." Fantastic. Now he's not just Jesus Christ; he's St. Paul as well. Somebody give this guy a wedgie.

This could go either way. I'm not terribly well-versed in Arnold's work--although I've heard suites from Stargate and ID4--and I'm just starting to get attached to the unique musical voice Harry Gregson-Williams has been giving the Narnia films. The reappearance of certain themes in Prince Caspian made me appreciate them more, and I would have liked to see him return for Dawn Treader. Here's hoping Arnold doesn't pull a Patrick Doyle and forget the series' musical heritage. (At the very least, I would expect HGW's "heroic" theme to return--arguably the least interesting of his themes, but surely the most recognizable.)

I'm considering picking up that collection when I buy KOTCS (to qualify me for free shipping at Amazon), but I don't want to waste my time with a lot of filler. Can anybody offer a quick personal list of their favorites from the set? I like pieces of Howard's "Peter Pan" score, and I've heard good things about "Magorium" and a few others on there, but I don't want to take the plunge based on two or three tracks, even if the price is amazing.

At the risk of reopening closed conversational wounds, a couple of thoughts on this phenomenally gifted composer/tunesmith's career: 1. The Enchanted score has some entertaining moments (see the latter section of "Into the Well," as Giselle discovers her human form the first time...good on CD, PERFECT in the film). Even in its more mundane cues, you must appreciate that no one puts leitmotifs (or song melodies, which often function as leitmotifs in Menken scores) through their paces like Menken. (On an unrelated note, one of my favorite examples of this comes from the little-seen, much-maligned Home on the Range, which grafted solid songs onto a truly awful film. The first score cue on that soundtrack ingeniously translates the melody of the mournful Bonnie Raitt ballad into a jaunty Western clip-clop riff.) But as I was saying, Enchanted's songs were one of its greatest strengths--the film left me wanting more of them. And the score does a decent job translating them into underscore, albeit with almost zero original material. (One exception is the villain's rather simplistic motif, which dominates "Narissa Arrives" with soulless faux-Hunchback choralizing.) 2. Goldsmith's Mulan score is brilliant, but so different from the Menken style that I almost can't see comparing the two. To be honest, the Menken style probably would not have been as fitting for that film as for his others. But I don't know. Beyond that, their career trajectories have been so different that you might as well spend your time and keystrokes comparing Raphael and Rockwell. 3. I don't understand all the Hercules hate, especially from the Menken fans. It's no masterpiece, but it's got some witty screenwriting, the songs are decent, and the visual style is brilliant (watch some of the effects animation frame-by-frame to see what I mean). In fact, I would argue that the real letdown with Hercules wasn't Menken; it was David Zippel and his lyrics. After Stephen Schwartz's unbridled brilliance on Pocahontas and Hunchback, lines like "WHOOOOAAA! There goes my ulcer!" were a heck of a cold shower. "Zero to Hero" is cleverly written, but other songs are full of filler. Even the soaring, melodic "Go the Distance" has styrofoam like "a great, warm welcome" and "I would go most anywhere to feel like I belong." Musically, the songs are excellent--listen to the chords on "A Star is Born," and try not to tap your reluctant masculine foot on "I Won't Say I'm in Love." It's the lyrics that disappoint. 4. I'd be curious to hear your takes on the songs in Home on the Range. Recall: I don't defend the film. But taken on their own, these are well worth your time. Glenn Slater is a lyricist to watch. In short, Menken is unbeatable at his game. Whether you subordinate that game to film score composing as an art form is up to you. But show me another musical theatre composer, living or dead, who has as many catchy or touching melodies to his credit as Menken.

"Sinbad" certainly has its moments. "Sirens" is an interesting take on the idea, although ultimately too quirky, I think, to quite capture the considerable musical potential of the original myth. Eris's theme is quirky, too, but it's appropriate to her character and it works well enough. The real prize in this score (which I haven't listened to in its entirety in several years) is "Into the Sunset," a flawless piece of adventure scoring that, in my book, ranks right up there with the Raiders March and the theme from "The Magnificent Seven." If only "Sinbad" the movie were one tenth as good as its score... That might be part of the reason I ultimately chose "Treasure Planet" over "Sinbad" (full disclosure: "TP" is one of my all-time favorite Disney films, and a soundtrack I listen to all the time) but I think I can justify it based strictly on the music, too. James Newton Howard's main theme for "Treasure Planet" might be a shade below "Into the Sunset" in terms of sheer swashbuckling brilliance, but it has a way of triumphantly exploding in the midst of the score that provides an emotional punch the Sinbad theme can't quite match. That, combined with the gorgeous secondary theme from "Silver Leaves" (Jim's theme? I think so...), the spot-on Celtic stuff for Silver, Morph's little flute motif, and the goofy theremon bit for B.E.N. combine to give this one the crown. "Sinbad"'s action music is a notch above "TP," but all of JNH's action cues sound pretty similar, so that's to be expected. All in all, despite my potentially disqualifying biases, I'm going "Treasure Planet."

JNH all the way. Nobody can compose, arrange, and deploy a bombastic, Maestro-esque theme like that guy, and he's hard to match in the quiet moments as well. To be honest, I felt a little traitorous not voting for Alan Menken, but he's not a film composer in the same sense as the others. He's a melodic genius and a brilliant pastiche writer--and in my opinion, the most culturally influential composer of the last twenty years, second only to JW in the past thirty--but he's a songwriter first and a score composer second. He doesn't belong in this poll (although his score for ENCHANTED has reminded me of just how well he can manipulate instrumental themes and sub-themes to fit various emotional purposes). I've still got to go with Newton Howard, simply on the strength of how much he reminds me of JW when he's at his best.