Hans Zimmer: Crimson Tide

[Damo 0]

Not sure if this already been discuss or mention here but my mistake if it has. Anyway has anyone heard Hans Zimmer score for Crimson Tide? Is it any good?

[hagman1983 0]

I don't know really (and I'm a Zimmer fan), haven't listened to it for a long time, but it works. It fits the movie, but it's only the main theme and the choir I really like. A slowed-down version of The Rock, but with less action-ques. The tracks are a little long, one is 23 something minutes, they could've cut it down to shorter tracks.

Filmtracks.com like it (and they're Zimmer-bashers)

http://www.filmtracks.com/titles/crimson_tide.html

[Neimoidian 14]

It is somehow Zimmer's classic, but I don't really like it. Zimmers approach to blockbuster sound is not my cup of tea. I much more prefer his lesser scores.

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

It's an awesome score.  Parts of it seem to drag when you listen to it on album, if you haven't seen the movie.  But it's a problem that can be remedied by watching the movie and going back to listen.  

[Morlock 11]

It's great in the film. It's generally one of Zimmer's more popular scores, but I'm actually not crazy about it (and I'm one of the bigger Zimmer fans 'round these parts).

[Romão 2,274]

It probably sounded much fresher in 1995 than it does now. It´s basically full of Zimmer'isms.

[Ollie 1,059]

It sucks.

Typical Zimmer synth dribble with his usual poor power anthem.

[Panthera 0]

I think the music is good but I'm not crazy about it like most people. But like someone said, I haven't seen the movie and I might like it more after I see it.

[Red 75]

I liked it better when it was called Pirates of the Carribean.

[ChuckM 1]

The Crimson Tide score is amazing. One Zimmer's best without a doubt. My only complaint is that the tracks are a little long.

[Ollie 1,059]

I liked it better when it was called Pirates of the Carribean.

You do know CT came before POTC?

[Damo 0]

Yes just as I thought. CT is totally a different Zimmer score compared to the scores for POTC.

[Ollie 1,059]

Not really, they both suck.

[Damo 0]

Yes it because you don't like Zimmer's style of music since Zimmer music is based on rhythmic beats and rhythm on synths and whatever others things he does to his music..

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

It's not bad if you haven't heard many other Zimmer scores. I personally prefer Black Hawk Down.

[Damo 0]

I have heard a few other Zimmer's score such as Broken Arrow which I do like even though I don't have the OST album but I have the DVD. . , Gladiator, (examples from) Thunderbirds, The main theme from The Rock and probably others that I may of heard but forgotten. I have not heard Black Hawk Down. I'm not really a big fan of Hans Zimmer but I do like some of his music.

[ChuckM 1]

It's not bad if you haven't heard many other Zimmer scores. I personally prefer Black Hawk Down.

Really? That's about the only Zimmer score I don't like. It's pretty much all rock.

[BigMacGyver 0]

It sucks in the film. I have seen the movie some time ago and these undramatic synth-loops and sound carpets for some really dramatic moments terribly steal the impact of some really great scenes full of tension between Washington and Hackman. It's one of those scores that is so terribly obvious in every way that it really takes you out of an otherwise great cinematic experience. The only thing that kind of works, despite being completely into-your-face is the power anthem for the boarding-the-sub beginning.

I can't really see why people always claim that this stuff works so well or fits so well when the score is as dramatically manipulative as a large sledge hammer beating a metal rod... for a intelligent film that requires subtle tension and dramatic development through well thought-out and careful constructed detail.

However, I can understand why some people like it that much outside of the movie. Nothing wrong if one loves to listen to this stuff but please don't pretend that this is something that actually works in the film's context when it clearly doesn't work.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Steven Spielberg disagrees with you.

[BigMacGyver 0]

Well, it's his right do disagree even though he is wrong.

Hardly any sub score of the 90's can beat Hunt for Red October in terms of effectivity. In fact, I would say that Crimson Tide is the weakest sub-score of the 90's.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

Other than being music for a film that takes place mostly aboard a submarine, how exactly does one define a "sub-score"?

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

Other than being music for a film that takes place mostly aboard a submarine, how exactly does one define a "sub-score"?

Claustrophobic, rhythmic (think sonar), suspenseful (think being submerged under water).

Crimson Tide = Check, Check, and Check.

[Romão 2,274]

Yes just as I thought. CT is totally a different Zimmer score compared to the scores for POTC.

Actually, several sections of both scores sound the same.

[BigMacGyver 0]

Other than being music for a film that takes place mostly aboard a submarine, how exactly does one define a "sub-score"?

You basically answered you question yourself. A good submarine-score, other than just re-creating atmosphere, also has to support the story which is mostly very detailed and intelligent and also involving political issues. Especially in crimson tide this aspect is very important since there is never really an enemy contact but all hostility is found among the crew members themselves. Hans Zimmer does not acknowledge any of the many plot points but instead scores the entire movie with exchangeable synth-carpets that might create a basic atmosphere but fail to achieve anything else and they are doing so in such an intrusive way that even some other good aspects of the film are sunk by it.

Claustrophobic, rhythmic (think sonar), suspenseful (think being submerged under water).

That's just one side of a two-sided coin. A good sub-score has to achieve much more than just plain atmospheric re-interpretation through music. See above for the explanation.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

That sounds like what every good film score should do. Support the story and the action on screen.

[Morlock 11]

It's not bad if you haven't heard many other Zimmer scores. I personally prefer Black Hawk Down.

I think Black Hawk Down is superb in the film, and makes for a good album as well.

Steven Spielberg disagrees with you.

And he has a point. Crimson Tide is excellent in the film.

Hardly any sub score of the 90's can beat Hunt for Red October in terms of effectivity. In fact, I would say that Crimson Tide is the weakest sub-score of the 90's.

I honestly can't think of a single other submaribne score in the 90's. There must be one or two, but I can't think of any. Hunt for Red October was in 89', U571 came in 00', K-19 in 02'. The latter two's score are hardly worth mentioning. The Hunt for Red October has brilliant parts, to be sure. But watching the film recently, I was struck by how much of the score was terrible, meandering electronics. It's a very uneven scores. It balances of two of the best cues Poledouris has written (The main titles and 'Nuclear Scam') with crap elecrtonics.

[Red 75]

I liked it better when it was called Pirates of the Carribean.

You do know CT came before POTC?

Yes, I do.

[Ollie 1,059]

Believe it or not I actually had the score to CT, there was a time when I bought almost every soundtrack I could get my hands on. But as I matured in my listening I realized what was crap to me and what wasn't.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

You're on a roll, aren't you?

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Mark is always on a roll!

[Ollie 1,059]

Indeed.

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

It's not too hard to get on a roll of sentences built on monosyllabic bashing.

It sucks.

It reeks.  

It's crap.

It's all the same.

I grew and found it sucked.  

B)

mostly very detailed and intelligent and also involving political issues.

Because...you know...that's what Bruckheimer's Crimson Tide was about.

Especially in crimson tide this aspect is very important since there is never really an enemy contact but all hostility is found among the crew members themselves.

Does every score need a tortured bond between the characters theme?

[Ollie 1,059]

Precisely.

But if you like it, more power to you.

[BigMacGyver 0]

Congrats to Blumenkohl for completely missing my point.

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

Congrats to Blumenkohl for completely missing my point.

I must admit, it was extremely difficult to even corroborate its existence.  

[BigMacGyver 0]

Well, here is my point in a nutshell:

Crimson Tide is one of the most rewarding movies bruckheimer and scott ever managed to accomplish, tackling many different issues and raising a lot of questions and working on many different levels. Yet, it received a score that is barely functioning on one level and is furthermore plain simple, not only in terms of composition but also in terms of dramaturgy since its ongoing synth-carpet is bare of any form of development. It does not even make an effort to go into any direction which does even hurt the movie in some crucial moments. It's thus merely a background atmo than a real filmscore.

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

Precisely.

But if you like it, more power to you.

Cue the power anthem!

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

The music is constantly reminding you and hitting you over the head with a very tense "things are getting worse"/"it's about to blow." Zimmer's approach is that of conveying the raw emotions of the film, not how the depth the submarine has climed to in the water is affecting the dreams of the crew.

If people don't think that by the climax of the movie, that the building tension of the score has gotten anywhere...well I guess that's what they choose to bring to the score and movie, because otherwise the direction is clearly there.

[Damo 0]

I need to see the actual film to able make a good judgement about the score. Some parts do sound a bit like Pirates of the Caribbean style.

[Delorean90 42]

The Hunt for Red October has brilliant parts, to be sure. But watching the film recently, I was struck by how much of the score was terrible, meandering electronics. It's a very uneven scores. It balances of two of the best cues Poledouris has written (The main titles and 'Nuclear Scam') with crap elecrtonics.

Really? I am usually fairly against electronics, but I did enjoy their usage in The Hunt for Red October. For instance, the cue were Ryan first goes after the saboteur in the innards of Red October, I thought was pretty cool. What are some parts specifically that you didn't like?

[Ollie 1,059]

Poledouris is a composer who knows how to use electronics with an orchestra and his score to Red October is much more interesting and has a better effect on the film than Zimmer's effort for CT.

[Morlock 11]

At times yes. But in the film, there was meandering, boring, ineffective electronics as well. Electronics were not exactly Poledouris' forte. Like Anyone else, he used them brilliantly at times, and at other times, rather unimpressively.

[Delorean90 42]

But where particularly, so I can check it out? I could see perhaps the "Montana" scene, but elsewhere it worked fine for me.

[Morlock 11]

The electronics, as I said, were harmful and unmemorable. I do not recall where exactly in the film they were, and I do not own the CD to be able to tell you. Please, feel free to take my opinion with a bushel of salt. Although, keep in mind, there are a couple of sworn anti-Zimmer-ites proweling about here, I'd take care when listening to their rantings.

[Delorean90 42]

I mean, even just which scenes stood out to you (I don't own the CD either, unfortunately, which I believe has an alternate of the Montana scene). I had already enjoyed the whole score in the movie, and I was just wanting to see if I can hear what you're hearing. Not saying it'll change my mind, but just out of curiosity and for discussion's sake.

[Romão 2,274]

Elfman´s use of electronics in Hulk was quite well done and very coherent.

[Red 75]

As was John Williams' in Empire Strikes Back.

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

I don't recall Jerry Goldsmith ever being off with the synths. He was a genius at instrument integration.

The few times Williams has utilised them, he's done pretty well as well.  

[Morlock 11]

I don't recall Jerry Goldsmith ever being off with the synths. He was a genius at instrument integration.

Oh, he's gone overboard with them. And I still think that is synth work in Timeline is one of the most horrendous sounding synths I've ever heard.

[BLUMENKOHL 1,068]

I don't recall Jerry Goldsmith ever being off with the synths. He was a genius at instrument integration.

Oh, he's gone overboard with them. And I still think that is synth work in Timeline is one of the most horrendous sounding synths I've ever heard.

It was perfect! The horn was just on the brink of exotically overboard, but it just managed to be exotic enough to come close to the edge, without being horrendous.  

His only overly synthy score I'd say would be "Hoosiers" and it fits the movie too much to be called overdone.