The Hobbit Film Trilogy Thread

[Incanus 5,801]

The biggest problem I have with the design is the hook. Remove that, and he would be a half-decent orc.

And yeah, it's cool to have him bare chest and all to distinguish him from other orcs, but that just participates in making his design feel a bit bland. I'm sure there would have been other ways to make him memorable without having to resort to such a "cheap trick", so to speak.

PJ has never been above cheap tricks when it comes to designs. Witch-King's mace/flail, Gothmog, Shelob etc. Always something a bit over the top. I still remember one of the designers describing how PJ took a chunk of plasticine and slapped that on the original Gothmog design to make him look more like the Elephant man.

[BloodBoal 7,541]

True, but cheap tricks work better when they're practical effects and not CG!

And what's wrong with Shelob? We barely see her face during the sequence, anyway, if that's what you're referring to.

[Incanus 5,801]

True, but cheap tricks work better when they're practical effects and not CG!

And what's wrong with Shelob? We barely see her face during the sequence, anyway, if that's what you're referring to.

Yes I too preferred the masks and prosthetics over the entirely CGI orcs. I thought the masks and make up were particularly impressive in LotR for those monsters.

With Shelob I just didn't like the whole Tunnel Web design on the creature. I would have preferred something more demonic and supernatural. But PJ loves his boils, pustules and scar tissue, scabs and gangrene.

[Doo_liss 6,423]

My Goodness...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1vwsOsI5Cw

[Barnald 402]

Well there are major music changes alright...guess this is what Doug meant by 'wait and see'.

[Incanus 5,801]

That was an abomination!

[Doo_liss 6,423]

That was an abomination!

What do you mean by that?

Do you mean "I am shocked and very disappointed"?

Or "That is a exaggerated way of highlighting the difference between the music of Dwarves (Misty Mountains Song, Man In The Moon, Blunt The Knives) and Orcs"?

[Incanus 5,801]

That was an abomination!

What do you mean by that?

Do you mean "I am shocked and very disappointed"?

Or "That is a exaggerated way of highlighting the difference between the music of Dwarves (Misty Mountains Song, Man In The Moon, Blunt The Knives) and Orcs"?

I guess I wasn't expecting them to waste and extend the film's running time with such pointless trite as that song.

Oh and yes the song is very Orcish, which means bad but they obviously wanted to give the Great Goblin his place in the musical spotlight. Doesn't change the fact that I felt rather pained to watch that contrivance.

[Doo_liss 6,423]

I guess I wasn't expecting them to waste and extend the film's running time with such pointless trite as that song.

Technically they didn't

[Incanus 5,801]

I guess I wasn't expecting them to waste and extend the film's running time with such pointless trite as that song.

Technically they didn't

Come again? Perhaps I am being a bit obtuse today but isn't that extra minute or two going to be in the EE? Not only does it add to the running time but wastes those extra minutes on rather pointless details as a ungainly song number. The Dwarven bits after were relatively good though.

[Doo_liss 6,423]

I mean it was only in the EE, so technically its not in the film.

[Incanus 5,801]

Some things should be left on the cutting room floor. The dandy show host Great Goblin is one of PJs less succesful creations. Nori's little pilferings from Rivendell were quite a funny bit. I am all for adding depth to the dwarven characters. Hopefully Bombur has a line or two in there.

[Doo_liss 6,423]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F96ojmLYcZQ#t=22

[Incanus 5,801]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F96ojmLYcZQ#t=22

The dwarves have now added depth. They are even more ill-mannered and boorish oafs than in the TE. So much for the proud heritage of Durin's line.

[Doo_liss 6,423]

Seems like alot of the stuff cut is the more lighthearted stuff and character moments.

[Incanus 5,801]

Seems like alot of the stuff cut is the more lighthearted stuff and character moments.

Yes. My advice would have been to keep the character moments and leave out the awkward humour. Gimli seems like the height of decorum compared to Thorin's company now.

[Doo_liss 6,423]

Well, we know that Jackson puts things back in that he finds "fun"

[Incanus 5,801]

Well, we know that Jackson puts things back in that he finds "fun"

Indeed. Though his "fun" was better back in the days of FotR EE I have to admit.

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[Incanus 5,801]

So I'm guessing those are clips from the EE? It's probably out in Australia now? My question is for those tempted enough to watch them, any new Shore music we haven't heard before?

Nope. No new music outiside the songs.

The Bilbo and the shards of Narsil scene unfolds with the material from the SE version of the White Council as suspected.

[Doo_liss 6,423]

So I'm guessing those are clips from the EE? It's probably out in Australia now? My question is for those tempted enough to watch them, any new Shore music we haven't heard before?

Only a few extra bits of the Rivendell source music.

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[Doo_liss 6,423]

Ah just seen in anther thread, bilbos theme!!!!!!!

its tracked!!!!!!!!

[Incanus 5,801]

Ah just seen in anther thread, bilbos theme!!!!!!!

its tracked!!!!!!!!

So it is!!!!

[Barnald 402]

SafeUnderhill - it's just the Took part, and it's tracked from Axe or Sword (it's definitely not from White Council anyway). And it plays over Elrond and Lindir moaning about the bathing Dwarves for some reason. But nonetheless it was kind of nice and somewhat reassuring to hear it. Gives me hope we'll hear the full theme in future.

[Doo_liss 6,423]

Probably because the first bit of it plays over Bilbo and Elrond, and they did not want an obvious sounding edit....

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[Doo_liss 6,423]

Its tracked from the film version of The Invention of Golf.

It is indeed the same music copied from in the film elsewhere.

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[Doo_liss 6,423]

No.

Its Edoras/Evenstar all over again.

[Code 000. Destruct. 0. 4,260]

You know, I'm sure people have mixed feelings about that golf scene... but the way Gandalf says, "Yes, well he could!" is just one of the most Gandalfy things in all the films. Made me grin.

[Doo_liss 6,423]

Sneaky edit there TGP

[Code 000. Destruct. 0. 4,260]

Damn! Someone noticed my quote-memory deficiencies!

[Barnald 402]

Probably because the first bit of it plays over Bilbo and Elrond, and they did not want an obvious sounding edit....

That makes sense, because whenever I tried to cue Bilbo's theme from The White Council to the scene, I always had to start earlier than when the Shire theme comes in.

I love the Golf scene. Wonderful acting from McKellen. I'd love it even more if it had Bilbo's full theme playing over it.

[Incanus 5,801]

No.

Its Edoras/Evenstar all over again.

Explain! Explain!

Probably because the first bit of it plays over Bilbo and Elrond, and they did not want an obvious sounding edit....

That makes sense, because whenever I tried to cue Bilbo's theme from The White Council to that, I always had to start earlier than when the Shire theme comes in.

I love the Golf scene. Wonderful acting from McKellen. I'd love it even more if it had Bilbo's full theme playing over it.

I just played the SE version of the opening of the White Council over the Bilbo at Rivendell scene and it works perfectly, Bilbo's themes and all.

And yes the invention of golf scene itself has wonderful acting from McKellen. A charming part of the film with good writing incorporating material from the novel into the dialogue and being loyal to the character of the book.

[Doo_liss 6,423]

Evenstar was tracked over Elrond discouraging Arwen and convincing her to leave.

part of Edoras was tracked into the burning of the Westfold.


I meant that they probably just played the full (tracked) recording over the scene, because if they cut off the music once the scene cut to Elry and Lindy it would have sounded a bit awkward.

[Incanus 5,801]

Evenstar was tracked over Elrond discouraging Arwen and convincing her to leave.

part of Edoras was tracked into the burning of the Westfold.

I meant that they probably just played the full (tracked) recording over the scene, because if they cut off the music once the scene cut to Elry and Lindy it would have sounded a bit awkward.

Indeed it might have when they tracked material in like that. Naughty, naughty PJ! A director should know better! And this shows Howard Shore knows better! If PJ had kept Bilbo's themes in the film, audience would be familiar with them by now.

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[Doo_liss 6,423]

Duh. I watched it the minute I could!

Oh, you mean, the poem? whole entire extended edition? I have not.

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[Doo_liss 6,423]

No, but I do not think anything in it was changed... I could be wrong though! (I hope it)

BTW I like Bofur's bit about going to meet relatives, somewhat like in the book

[Luke Skywalker 1,939]

i'm bewildered.

So it seems shore did not work on the EE at all?

I cannot blame him anyway. I think the little good there is in the extensions is not worth the awful humour shown there.

PD: are the dwarves in the fountain CGI?

[Incanus 5,801]

BTW I like Bofur's bit about going to meet relatives, somewhat like in the book

Yeah that was taken from Thorin's original subterfuge when brought before the Great Goblin.

[Doo_liss 6,423]

So it seems shore did not work on the EE at all?

Well, Shore definitely score MOST of the scenes before they were cut form the film, so technically, there is not anything for him to work on.

PJ just has little faith in the material Shore wrote for these scenes, so he replaced them, sadly.

[Incanus 5,801]

So it seems shore did not work on the EE at all?

Well, Shore definitely score MOST of the scenes before they were cut form the film, so technically, there is not anything for him to work on.

PJ just has little faith in the material Shore wrote for these scenes, so he replaced them, sadly.

And the policy of "remove all Bilbo's Themes and replace them with the Shire Theme" did the rest.

[Doo_liss 6,423]

awful humour shown there.

And what do you mean by Awful humor?

The bathing? yes thats awful.

The Song? thats a song from FOTR.

The Elf Maiden thing? I thought it was hilarious.

same with Nori's pilfering ways (I remember a TORn chat where someone thought that Ori looked like a thief.)

[BloodBoal 7,541]

[SafeUnderHill 205]

[Doo_liss 6,423]

Duh, so he couldn't say "Oh Yeah, Shore's cue for the Arrival at Goblintown is partially replaced by the GK's song." or reveal what music on the CD corresponded to what EE scene etc.

Oh and BB, this post was slightly edited in ways of expression.

[BloodBoal 7,541]

Well at least we can find out why Doug had to sign so many NDAs soon.

Well, so far it seems there was nothing that justified them (apart from the reason Faleel mentioned). I don't know how much footage of the additional 13 minutes are available in these videos (I haven't watched them), but I'm sure it must be about a third of it. And still no new music! I doubt they would have bothered recording less than 10 minutes of music for the EE.