Michael Giacchino's Star Trek

[Charlie Brigden 7]

If any of us knew anything like that, it'd be in the main post of this thread

I thought so, I just wanted to make sure I hadn't missed anything. It's incredible how sometimes you can go away for an hour and come page and there's two extra pages.

[Chris.Tilton 0]

The music that plays during Bones' introduction, and them flying off in the shuttle is what Michael recorded for the STAR TREK logo, which was replaced with Enterprising Young Men, as J.J. states. Though, I think the beginning of it is still the original cue he wrote, since the original opening (which in fact was the 2nd version) didn't have any of the underlying rhythmic elements, and then they just transitioned into the Star Trek logo cue. The very first version of the Star Trek logo actually had the main theme rhythm and then a quick loud statement of the main theme, but it wasn't as drawn out as the Enterprising Young Men version. I know, it's very confusing.

The horn theme intro was recorded much later, because they had edited the film down (which made it better) in such a way that several moments of the main theme were removed, so Michael felt like there weren't enough statements early on to, what I presume, earn the moment they arrive at the Enterprise. The opening of the film is still the same, he just changed the music. The build towards the end of the opening contains elements from the original, which actually continued on over the ship and the arrival of Nero, which had a more creepy tone to it, than the big Nero theme that they tracked in later (which I think ended up working quite well).

[Jay 37,467]

The music that plays during Bones' introduction, and them flying off inthe shuttle is what Michael recorded for the STAR TREK logo, which wasreplaced with Enterprising Young Men, as J.J. states.

The horn theme intro was recorded much later, because they had editedthe film down (which made it better) in such a way that several momentsof the main theme were removed, so Michael felt like there weren'tenough statements early on to, what I presume, earn the moment theyarrive at the Enterprise. The opening of the film is still the same, hejust changed the music. The build towards the end of the openingcontains elements from the original, which actually continued on overthe ship and the arrival of Nero, which had a more creepy tone to it,than the big Nero theme that they tracked in later (which I think endedup working quite well).

Thank you again Chris, that is good stuff to know

So that begs the question.... did moving the original Main Title music over to the Bones introduction scene replace a cue that had already been written and recorded for that scene, or had Giacchino not yet written an original cue for that scene (and then never had to because the tracked music worked so well there)?

[Datameister 2,073]

I was wondering the same thing. (And thank you for yet another valuable contribution, Chris!)

[Jay 37,467]

Now who's going to be the first person to make an youtube video of the main titles (hopefully with a few minutes of the scene leading into it) with that music instead of the EYM edit?

[Chris.Tilton 0]

Thank you again Chris, that is good stuff to know

So that begs the question.... did moving the original Main Title music over to the Bones introduction scene replace a cue that had already been written and recorded for that scene, or had Giacchino not yet written an original cue for that scene (and then never had to because the tracked music worked so well there)?

I answered that in my original post, but I think I may have said it in a confusing manner. After watching the film last night, the first half of the Bones cue is what he originally wrote, then it segues into the latter part of the Star Trek logo cue for the second half.

[Jay 37,467]

OK, gotcha. So the second half of his original Bones cue has never been heard, and the first half of his original Main Titles has never been heard.

Hopefully both will show up on the "Volume 2" CD that Varese is rumored to be putting out!

[Charlie Brigden 7]

It's certainly awesome having Chris here to give proper actual information from the horse's mouth, so to speak. What was the original cue for the Paramount/Bad Robot logos like?

[OneBuckFilms 325]

Charlie, you are not wrong

Chris, you are a minefield of good data.

I can see why they tracked so much of the score in the film.

I suspect the Vol. 2 release will be a bit of a revelation.

[Jay 37,467]

The music that plays during Bones' introduction, and them flying off in the shuttle is what Michael recorded for the STAR TREK logo, which was replaced with Enterprising Young Men, as J.J. states. Though, I think the beginning of it is still the original cue he wrote, since the original opening (which in fact was the 2nd version) didn't have any of the underlying rhythmic elements, and then they just transitioned into the Star Trek logo cue. The very first version of the Star Trek logo actually had the main theme rhythm and then a quick loud statement of the main theme, but it wasn't as drawn out as the Enterprising Young Men version. I know, it's very confusing.

Chris went back and edited his first post, so I just wanted to make sure people caught this information he revealed.

So let's see if I have this right:

THE OPENING PARAMOUNT / BAD ROBOT logos:

VERSION 1: A 2-3 minute cue that covered all the logos and kept playing through the initial shots of the Kelvin and Nero's arrival... the last 20 seconds of this is still heard in the film

VERSION 2: The 1 minute cue "Star Trek" which is on the OST replaced the opening logo music... there is no music in the final film over the initial Kelvin shots, Nero's arrival is now music tracked from "Nero Sighted", and then finally the last 20 seconds of the original cue is heard

THE MAIN TITLE (Star Trek logo):

VERSION 1: "the main theme rhythm and then a quick loud statement of the main theme" - We have never heard this at all

VERSION 2: "didn't have any of the underlying rhythmic elements" - the second half this this is used in the final film after the Jim / Bones scene as the shuttle flies away, but we have not heard the first half

VERSION 3: An edit of Enterprising Young Men is heard in the final film

[OneBuckFilms 325]

Thanks Jason.

[Chris.Tilton 0]

So let's see if I have this right:

THE OPENING PARAMOUNT / BAD ROBOT logos:

VERSION 1: A 2-3 minute cue that covered all the logos and kept playing through the initial shots of the Kelvin and Nero's arrival... the last 20 seconds of this is still heard in the film

VERSION 2: The 1 minute cue "Star Trek" which is on the OST replaced the opening logo music... there is no music in the final film over the initial Kelvin shots, Nero's arrival is now music tracked from "Nero Sighted", and then finally the last 20 seconds of the original cue is heard

The opening cue was completely replaced with the new opening, silence, and then the tracked music for Nero's arrival. That was the first cue (Narada Bing). Then it jumps into Narada Boom, the second cue, which, as far as I can tell, is in the film as it was written. It's an action cue and starts when Nero fires on the Kelvin and goes all the way until the Kelvin's captain is onboard the Narada. There may have been some slight edits since it was recorded, but I can't tell.

THE MAIN TITLE (Star Trek logo):

VERSION 1: "the main theme rhythm and then a quick loud statement of the main theme" - We have never heard this at all

VERSION 2: "didn't have any of the underlying rhythmic elements" - the second half this this is used in the final film after the Jim / Bones scene as the shuttle flies away, but we have not heard the first half

VERSION 3: An edit of Enterprising Young Men is heard in the final film

Yep. But aren't missing much from the 2nd half of the Bones cue and the 1st half of the V2 Star Trek logo. The bones cue I think is just a build up of the main theme rhythm stuff which you hear many times in the film anyway, including the end credits. The logo is just some chords that build into that choir bit with the TOS fanfare notes.

[Datameister 2,073]

"Narada Bing" and "Narada Boom"? Priceless! I mean, I still like "Narada Nowhere" and "Bye, George", but there's a reason they don't pay me to do this for them...

Anyway, does this mean you still have a complete list of cue titles, Chris, or were those just two that you happened to remember?

[Jay 37,467]

I was wondering the same thing

[OneBuckFilms 325]

Narada Bing and Narada Boom. Funny !!

[Datameister 2,073]

I think it's funny that even the original cue titles tend to be puns when it comes to Giacchino. Consider, for instance, the original cue titles for Lost's "Ji Yeon", from the DVD extras:

Frank Below Deck

Baby Names

Labor Day

Jin's Rush In

Panda Express

Spy Games

Dan's Not the Man

Another Locke Is Opened

Raider of the Lost Stash

Beach Blanket Blabbermouth

Late Sun-fession

Karma Jin-itiative

Bombshells Away

Moby Prick

Little Black Box

Death and the Lost Maiden

Mole Man

Reconcilia-Sun

Ji Yeon

I don't know if that's representative of his cue titles for ALL his work, but there's certainly a similar proportion of puns, allusions, and other wordplay as in the album track titles. I mean, while I've never been the HUGEST fan of all the puns, I think these are much better as cue titles than what Williams comes up with!

[John Crichton 4]

What, "Ben Creeps Around" and "Moving Things Along" not punny enough for you?

[Datameister 2,073]

"The Snow Battle"..."Vader Shows Up"..."Indie's [sic] Feats"..."E.T.'s Magic"..."Kazim and the Rats!"...I mean, even I wouldn't go that uninspired with my track titles!

Then again, there are gems like "Pffist Fight" and "Once in a Vial"...

[Docteur Qui 1,544]

What about these gems from Hoopers HBP score: "School", "The Killing of Dumbledore" and "The Friends".

"The Killing"? Really? "Murder" wasn't good enough?

[Datameister 2,073]

Haha, yeah...

Okay, so, I just finished watching the remaining special features. Definitely a fair amount of unreleased music in there to work with. I was really hoping for that omitted statement of Nero's theme and some of that unused material for the logos, but I think I only heard a little of that at most. Anyway, I'll do what I can and let y'all know how it turns out. This'll be fun!

And I wish I knew who decided to do the features in 5.1 instead of stereo...I mean, that itty-bitty decision singlehandedly increased the amount of clean music available from almost none to...well, significantly more than that. Pretty darn cool.

[Jay 37,467]

Indeed.

What music plays under the deleted scenes? Music tracked from other cues, or where they all fully scored before being dropped?

I don't have the set yet because I am waffling over whether I should go blu or not...

[Datameister 2,073]

The deleted scenes seem to just used tracked music that can be heard on the album, with the possible exception of the Klingon prison scene. Unfortunately, the deleted scenes seem to be in stereo, not 5.1, which makes extracting any music virtually impossible. =/

[Jay 37,467]

BTW, do any of the MENUS on the DVDs contain music? Sometimes you can find good stuff on menus (though, I'm not sure how to directly rip menu music)

[Datameister 2,073]

Nope, it's all just sound effects, I checked. Although that's saddening in terms of obtaining music, I think it's a big improvement in terms of DVD design...no matter how great a piece of music is, it gets annoying hearing bits and pieces of it looping over and over again.

[Jay 37,467]

Bummer. I think we got some good KOCS stuff from menus, right?

[Charlie Brigden 7]

BTW, do any of the MENUS on the DVDs contain music? Sometimes you can find good stuff on menus (though, I'm not sure how to directly rip menu music)

No, they're all computery with bridge sounds.

I decided I didn't like my previous cover and did a new one, with Joe's track titles.

[Datameister 2,073]

I like it! Very much in line with the look of the DVD interface.

[Jay 37,467]

At first I was expecting the highlighted numbers on the bottom to be the LOST numbers

[OneBuckFilms 325]

Very nice.

If you're emulating the UI on the Enterprise computer screens, I was under the impression that the graphics were a little more Blue.

But I like it.

Datameister, Would it be possible to include the "Distress Call" in your edit without it mixing into Enterprising Young Men? I love it edited in, but I'm putting together a playlist of only unreleased material so I can get an idea of how it would work on CD.

[Datameister 2,073]

Datameister, Would it be possible to include the "Distress Call" in your edit without it mixing into Enterprising Young Men? I love it edited in, but I'm putting together a playlist of only unreleased material so I can get an idea of how it would work on CD.

That's a possibility. Although...if I send out the WAV for the combined file, you can just use Audacity to overlay your own clean copy of "Enterprising Young Men" on top of the one in my edit, but with the waveform inverted, and if you adjust the volume right, they'll cancel out, leaving just the clean ending of "Distress Call"...

[OneBuckFilms 325]

Datameister, Would it be possible to include the "Distress Call" in your edit without it mixing into Enterprising Young Men? I love it edited in, but I'm putting together a playlist of only unreleased material so I can get an idea of how it would work on CD.

That's a possibility. Although...if I send out the WAV for the combined file, you can just use Audacity to overlay your own clean copy of "Enterprising Young Men" on top of the one in my edit, but with the waveform inverted, and if you adjust the volume right, they'll cancel out, leaving just the clean ending of "Distress Call"...

With my editing skills?

[Datameister 2,073]

Hey, we all have to start somewhere! Four years ago, I'd never done any of this whatsoever...

EDIT: By the way, Mr. Tilton, if you were also responsible for the heavy percussion overdub over the first shot of the Starfleet hangar, when all the cadets are getting their assignments...you have my thanks. The original version can be heard cleanly in the special features, and I must say, it's quite underwhelming by comparison. Since it's the same type of drum as in "Hella Bar Talk", I figure this was probably you, too.

EDIT AGAIN: Also, we can finally listen to that oft-mentioned but ne'er-heard material in which Giacchino uses electronically altered erhu for the Romulans! Or, part of it, at least. It's in the cue I call "Romulinterrogation", as Chris said, although I haven't heard Nero's actual theme in it yet. I'll definitely include this in my edit...the DVD rip of that scene is very heavy on SFX, anyway.

[Jay 37,467]

Where did you find the clean version of that?

[Datameister 2,073]

I don't remember, but it was one of the special features on disc 2, probably buried beneath a lot of interviews and production footage audio if you just watch it, but the front channels are totally clean. I'm telling you...short of an iso score DVD, this is about as good as it gets for ripping unreleased music from DVDs. I mean, last night I managed to get almost the entire second half of "Distress Call" completely clean, in what sounds to me like CD quality. There's even more from earlier in the cue available clean, but as I mentioned, it lacks the percussion overdubs and actually sounds quite anemic, so I'm just gonna throw that in with the bonus tracks rather than try to replace the SFX-heavy but oh-so-amazing first statement of the cadets' theme.

[Jay 37,467]

I love that statement of the Cadet's Theme!

[Datameister 2,073]

Me too! It's soooo good! But I'm telling you, without the percussion overdub, it's really rather weak.

[Jay 37,467]

Chris Tilton FTW

[Datameister 2,073]

Hahahahaha...I feel so privileged. I was looking at the song titles in the credits, and a little searching quickly revealed that "Awasoruk Jam" is the source music for the start of the bar scene - it was written for the film. If you do a search, you'll find a lot of people wondering where to find it. Well...I've found it. Buried in the front channels of one of the special features. I wasn't originally going to include source cues, but...heck, why not? Not like this song would go in any other album.

[Jay 37,467]

I assume I don't have to point out that Awasoruk is Kurosawa backwards?

[Charlie Brigden 7]

If you watch the shot of Robau when he first gets in his chair, he has no Starfleet badge, when he has it in the before and after shots.

[Jay 37,467]

Wrong thread

[Datameister 2,073]

I assume I don't have to point out that Awasoruk is Kurosawa backwards?

If I hadn't read all those other posts that mentioned it...yeah, you might, I'm afraid. I know who Kurosawa is, but I don't think I would have made the connection on my own.

[Charlie Brigden 7]

No, I meant this thread. It just seems like the catchall at the moment.

[Jay 37,467]

Not at all. This is the thread for discussing the movie itself.

[Datameister 2,073]

Bah...the film version is edited differently than the clean version! Oy! They start out the same, and they certainly both have the same feel throughout, but there are parts that are unique to each. Now I have to figure out how to combine them in a way that provides a good listening experience and seems reasonably close to the original. Always a new challenge!

[Jay 37,467]

I would just include both versions separately and not try to combine them.

[Datameister 2,073]

Maybe...I guess I could throw the clean version - which is somewhat shorter - into the album itself, and then tack on the film version in the bonus tracks. I think I'll do that.

[Jay 37,467]

Both should be in the bonus tracks. It's source music AND it's not composed by Giacchino

[Datameister 2,073]

I usually put source cues right into their chronological place in the score proper - when I include source cues, that is, which is somewhat rare. I figure I can always skip the track if I'm in a non-sourcey mood, which does happen sometimes. And if y'all don't like that, there's nothing to stop you from changing the order of the playlist.

I think I'm not going to bother with the film version, though. You wouldn't even notice the differences unless you were comparing them measure-by-measure like I am, and the film version has background noise in it, of course, not to mention the fact that it lacks an ending. The clean version has a start, a middle, and an end, with a variety of stuff in the middle, and it doesn't go on for TOO long. I think it's enough.

[Wojo 2,453]

Are you putting the Beastie Boys song into the source music section?