publicist 4,643 Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Have you noticed that this kind if repetition is only looked down on in music world. Doesn't seem to be a problem with other artforms. KarolI have noticed you confuse the issues at hand. First, filmmusic is never and never will be the same as a self-contained piece of art or cycle of art, second if you honestly can't tell the difference between artistic exploration and curiosity and hackwork, what are we talking about here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crocodile 8,018 Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 I have noticed you confuse the issues at hand.I agree with you here, we are definitely not seeing eye-to-eye. First, filmmusic is never and never will be the same as a self-contained piece of art or cycle of artI don't think you believe that. After all, we are here discussing it, people (not many, but still) are buying it, it can be heard on the radio with classical music, concert halls are full, live to projection performances become really popular. In fact more of them are likely to attend this sort of even, rather than classical one.If you're comparing it to concert music, than you need to consider some things:1. All classical music, including pretty much every single masterpiece, has been commissioned as some dinner music, something to commemorate opening of some venue, mark someone's birthday, whatever. Reasons no more glamorous than writing things for film.2. Concert composer of the 20th Century like Walton, Vaughan-Williams, Prokofiev, Shostakovich and others, were willing to experiment with the medium, with some interesting results.3. Film music is not a genre. It doesn't need to relate to concert world in any way. It does use some techniques and idoms, but tt can be anything, really.4. Concert music has lost touch with the audience. It seems only to appeal to a narrow group of composers and music theorists. Not sure how that relates to this art form's original purpose.5. If you're comparing the orchestral mastery of a concert composer to that of film composer, there is no contest. But, then again, in concert music form and content are one. Not so in film. Besides, the complex techniques wouldn't necessarily serve the film all that well.6. Film music could present a drastically different challenges to their composers. I wonder if any of them could produces as much in so little time. Somehow, I doubt it. second if you honestly can't tell the difference between artistic exploration and curiosity and hackwork, what are we talking about here?I'm just bored with the old "Horner the classical hack" angle already and try to see things from slightly different perspective.Besides, you're presenting only your opinion, not exactly flat facts.Karol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Besides, you're presenting only your opinion, not exactly flat facts.KarolKarol, that is all good and well - but basically some quote by Horner appeared that thinly rationalizes his idiosyncrasies and suddenly people here go 'ah, yes well, that actually makes wonderful sense and it's totally OK by me'. Last time i checked there was by and large a rightful agreement that the kind of composer Horner became in the last 20 years isn't someone we would actually endorse wholeheartedly and even defend him on the grounds that he actually is the poster boy for modern film music.I mean, seriously.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crocodile 8,018 Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 I've gone through my Horner disappointment ages ago and it is now behind me. Lot of medication, brief hospitalisation helped a great deal. Now I actually enjoy his works for what they are. This quote is a new thing to me and it's more of a curiosity.Let me be clear - I'm not going to defend him to death (hence the description above my avatar), but it's just fun to play devil's advocate sometimes. See where it takes us. Karol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Yeah, i know, of course. The whole debate was finished decades ago, and i never would review a new Horner score to such scrutinizing degree. But there is a difference between wily pragmatism in daily life and quasi-academic generalisations about JH's way of working. It just isn't true that Horner is a misunderstood scholar and as much as i like his musicianship on occasion, there's more cynical hackwork in his scores than genuine inspiration by classical sources or even his own body of work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crocodile 8,018 Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 But I still think we should change this thread's title to: The Ultimate James Horner's Elevated Quotations ListKarol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
publicist 4,643 Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Include a 'bullshit' there and i'm game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkissimo 1,973 Posted April 11, 2014 Share Posted April 11, 2014 ALIENS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitch 57 Posted April 15, 2014 Share Posted April 15, 2014 After John T. Williams, there will be a new king on the block..........James R. Horner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted July 28, 2017 Share Posted July 28, 2017 I'm going to go ahead and admit I haven't read through this thread to see if this one came up but.. "Main Title" from Unlawful Entry: 0:55 - 1:05 Princess Leia's Theme much? Muad'Dib and James 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James 119 Posted July 28, 2017 Share Posted July 28, 2017 1:30 Schindler's list But I think I've heard this one on another previous Horner's score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crocodile 8,018 Posted July 28, 2017 Share Posted July 28, 2017 Karol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Score 770 Posted July 28, 2017 Share Posted July 28, 2017 5:28 James 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tydirium 1,167 Posted November 24, 2023 Share Posted November 24, 2023 I don’t think I’ve ever seen this particular Shostakovich 5 quote mentioned. 2:21-2:35: 0:31-0:48: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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