10 Years of Pure Hell

[Morlock 11]

Political correctness. Han Solo is a hero, thus it would be uneducational to have him shoot Greedo in cold blood.

[robthehand 3]

Oh, but remember, Greedo always shot first. It was just edited strangely, so you couldn't hear the shot.

The biggest controversy of all in Star Wars was that it had always been that Han Solo simply shot first, but the way it was cut you couldn't tell that. So people sort of said, 'He murdered him!!' But it wasn't meant to be that way, so I added another shot to make it a little clearer. Obviously a lot of fans that wanted him to be a full-blown murderer got very upset about it, but I think they were misinterpreting the original film. They didn't hear the first shot because it was so close. It's always been that he wasn't a murderer. He's a rogue and everything, but he doesn't gun people down without them also firing. Ultimately it's a crucial point in his character, but not a crucial point in the overall story. - George Lucas

[Red 75]

But Han is a scoundrel. He shoots first, and asks questions later.

[robthehand 3]

Indeed!

And to be fair, it was hardly cold-blooded. He was at gunpoint, about to be killed, with no way of escaping alive.

[Ollie 1,059]

It ruined Solo's character. He's supposed to be a rogue who only cares about himself and trying to portray him as a sympethetic figure early on ruins his character's change of heart at the end.

I can't remember if they both fire in the original book. It could be Lucas covering his tracks.

Another problem I have is that it looks half ass on screen and Greedo is apparently a very poor shot sitting 2 feet in front of Solo when he's supposed to be the henchman of a ruthless crimelord/smuggler. And it doesn't look any better with both firing at the same time.

[Morlock 11]

Georgie boy disagrees with you.

[Red 75]

I'd imagine that he disagrees with alot of what is said about Star Wars (as a whole).

[Romão 2,274]

I just realized...the first JW I ever bought was the SE of ROTJ. So it´s my 10th anniversary as a true Williams fan.

[Danielle 0]

The biggest controversy of all in Star Wars was ...... but he doesn't gun people down without them also firing. Ultimately it's a crucial point in his character, but not a crucial point in the overall story. - George Lucas

Please tell me Lucas didn't really say that bull.

[Red 75]

If a criminal had a gun pointed at me and I couldn't get away, I would shoot them.

But thats just me.

[Morlock 11]

Umm...Han was also a criminal. And plus, Han owed money. Greedo would have been far more justified in killing Han.

[JoeinAR 1,949]

he would have been far more justified in killing Lucas

[Red 75]

I'm not so sure about that.

[Guest macrea]

I realize Harrison Ford became a star and all and that Han got the girl at the end of the OT, but "Star Wars" was not about Han Solo. He didn't even really need to be in the sequel and a lot of people were surprised he was. That character did his turn in the story and completed his arc by not being selfish. I remember reading "Splinter of the Mind's Eye" before TESB came out and it didn't even occur to me that Han and Chewbacca weren't in it and I didn't miss them. It was about the characters that "Star Wars" is about - Luke, Leia, Vader and the droids. The point is that the stuff about Han's "character" in "Star Wars" is all bull. The purpose of the Greedo scene/Jabba plot is to show how Luke's and Ben's predicament has become more complicated. It's a "mmm...the plot thickens" thing, nothing more. It's there to point up the irony about how a farmboy, a smuggler, an old man, and a couple of robots end up rescuing a princess and saving the galaxy. Nobody focused that much on Han when the original film came out... it was all about Luke and Leia. Han only became interesting in "Empire" when Lucas decided that Jedi were boring, and he was lucky that Ford agreed to do it, because originally he didn't want to.

[JoeinAR 1,949]

splinter in the minds eye was such an awful book, absolute garbage.

[Red 75]

Han and Chewie were integral to the trilogy. It just wouldn't have been the same without them.

[Chris ChrusherComix 46]

So, just watch the original versions. Having 2-3 versions of the same movie bothers me absolutely zero. I'm an artist too, and I'll do whatever I want to do with my art (though I'd take suggestions, for sure), as pretty much artist in the world will agree with me.

[JoeinAR 1,949]

Star Wars became more than art, it became part of Americana, and its considered a national treasure, that is STAR WARS, not Star Wars episode 4 a new hope, its just a cheap facimile.

[Chris ChrusherComix 46]

Star Wars became more than art, it became part of Americana, and its considered a national treasure, that is STAR WARS, not Star Wars episode 4 a new hope, its just a cheap facimile.

It's the same movie. Only us old timers can tell the difference. People either love it or don't. Adding a subtitle to the movie is only to put it in the correct context of the overall series, otherwise people will not follow the series. I don't know how many people I've met that didn't know that. Not via online conversations, I mean people that never saw any of them before I showed them to them.

I should add that when I show the entire saga to new people who either never saw it before or only saw one, (in particular, women - my wife and my brother's girlfriend(s) for example), they often like STAR WARS and Phantom Menace as the two least interesting. Most tend to like Sith and Jedi best because they tie all the loose ends. Also, when I show them differences between the original cuts and the 1997 or 2004 editions, they have no idea what I'm talking about, and see no differences other than saying the newer cuts look and sound better. They are the same movies, and us internet nerds are the only ones who complain.

Also, it is fine that you like the 1977 Star Wars the best. I am fond of it too. But I have never understood why people feel the need to just bash the movies like they were blasphemous to their personal religious beliefs or mocking their mommas or something. Calm down people! May I quote Will Ferrell and say, "REMAIN CALM!!!!!!"

-Chris

PS- I also should say that I've been showing people the order like this:

SW

ESB

ROTJ

TPM

AOTC

ROTS

And an alternate way of showing the saga is this:

SW

ESB - leaving the question of Luke's relationship to Vader open, then going back in time and...

TPM

AOTC

ROTS - Settles the answer of Luke's relationship to Vader, then...

ROTJ - Settles the saga.

I kept my brother's GF extremely interested via that order.

[Guest macrea]

Just because a movie doesn't age well is no reason to change it. But with a success as great as the original "Star Wars" it is a piece of history and a cultural phenomenon that should be preserved in its original form. The topic is about the 10th anniversary of the "Special Edition," which I think never should have happened.

[BurgaFlippinMan 7]

I can't remember if they both fire in the original book. It could be Lucas covering his tracks.

I think it was a flash of light and Greedo dropped dead. Nothing precise.

he would have been far more justified in killing Lucas

Then we wouldnt have Star Wars!

[Chris ChrusherComix 46]

"Star Wars" it is a piece of history and a cultural phenomenon that should be preserved in its original form.

We have it on VHS, Laserdisc, laserdisc boot DVDs, and the 2006 DVD. Then people complained that it wasn't remastered enough. We may get it again with the 30th Anniversary set. If they "remaster" it, someone will complain about the colors being sweetened or "it looks too crisp now! It's not grainy enough!" Just relax people. The fate of the universe doesn't depend on Greedo and Han's scene being mauled. Quite frankly, that and replacing Lapti Nek with Jedi Rocks in jedi are the only changes that I find absolutely horrid. The rest are either good or meaningless either way.

[JoeinAR 1,949]

and lucas has ruined the wonderful surprise in Empire, for those that don't know Luke and vader are son & father, its told in the film before the wonderful reveal. Lucas' suffering in hell will be glorious.

[BurgaFlippinMan 7]

on the other hand, who on earth doesnt know vader is luke's daddy? its even been parodied in hokkien (a chinese dialect) on radio here! lol

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

and lucas has ruined the wonderful surprise in Empire, for those that don't know Luke and vader are son & father, its told in the film before the wonderful reveal. Lucas' suffering in hell will be glorious.

You must have been living in a hole in a cave on the moon of Pluto for the past 27 years if you don't know Darth Vader is Luke Skywalker's father.

Although if you're referring to the added dialogue in the 2004 version of ESB, remind me what it was. I've only seen that scene once (and feel no urgent need to repeat it).

[Ollie 1,059]

I can't believe there are people that find the sequence in TESB where Vader travels to his ship in the middle of Luke's Rescue & Hyperspace sequence an improvement.

Sometimes I think Lucas was just looking for crap to throw in there. When he got to Jedi he realized there was really nothing to change so he decided to make an already embarrassing moment worse. He should have just went ahead and had John Williams make a cameo as an alien conducter with the Tatooine Symphony Orchestra.

[Red 75]

and lucas has ruined the wonderful surprise in Empire, for those that don't know Luke and vader are son & father, its told in the film before the wonderful reveal. Lucas' suffering in hell will be glorious.

Thats just silly. The man doesn't deserve to burn in hell for changing his own films.

[Luke Skywalker 1,796]

He should have just went ahead and had John Williams make a cameo as an alien conducter with the Tatooine Symphony Orchestra.

I hoped to see a JW cameo in the ballet scene in ROTS.

missed opportunity, mr Lucas

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Thats just silly. The man doesn't deserve to burn in hell for changing his own films.

Nonsense, Lucas has joined O.J. and Wacko Jacko as the the most criminal, sick and disgusting celeb to ever have excisted.

Actually he's worse then Jackson, who's never tried to tamper with Moonwalker.

[Red 75]

Lucas never broke the law (to my knowledge). OJ and MJ (allegedly) did.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Feeling up a 12 year old boy did not hurt as much people as the added scream when Luke makes his jump in TESB.

And for all we know Nicole Brown-Simpson got what she deserved!

[Red 75]

I'll just pretend that you didn't say that.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Unlike you, I choose not to live in fantasy land!

[Luke Skywalker 1,796]

stefan is right...

How many threads bashing SW do we have here?

And how many about Jackson? I can only remember one

Sad but true

[Chris ChrusherComix 46]

and lucas has ruined the wonderful surprise in Empire, for those that don't know Luke and vader are son & father, its told in the film before the wonderful reveal. Lucas' suffering in hell will be glorious.

Joe, did you ever see the 2004 version? Palpatine said absolutely nothing to ruin the surprise. They slightly altered the dialog, but no surprise is ruined. It sounds like you've been listening to online whiners. Since 1983, I have always preferred to see and hear Ian McDiarmid re-doing the scene exactly the same way it was done in 1980, and in 2004 Lucas decided to do that. But the massive size of his skull was just too much, and changing the dialog was not needed (it ruined no surprise, it just wasn't needed). The ape-faced woman in the 1980 version sucked. A middle ground of the two cuts would be nice.

Also... since when did making multiple edits of films be a sin worthy of hell? This statement is just absolutely nonsensical. You have a choice of watching 3 different cuts of the same film, but you say throw the man in hell because he made 3 different edits? This statement discredits your judgement skills on even the simplest of matters.

I can't believe there are people that find the sequence in TESB where Vader travels to his ship in the middle of Luke's Rescue & Hyperspace sequence an improvement.

I agree... that part ruins the flow. If Hyperspace was skillfully looped during the scene, it wouldn't have been so bad. Either way, it wasn't needed at all.

You must have been living in a hole in a cave on the moon of Pluto for the past 27 years if you don't know Darth Vader is Luke Skywalker's father.

My wife is 29. She didn't know until I showed her 4, 5, 6 then 1, 2, and 3 (on opening night). She's also from Thailand.

My brother's last two girlfriends didn't know. They were 18 and 21 respectively.

Don't be so narrow-minded guys... I mean... some people have never watched or heard Star Wars movies, and some think they are nerd-city because of fan-boy whiners that either dress up in outfits and/or spend all their time online crying because 3 versions of the same film were made available.

"Nonsense, Lucas has joined O.J. and Wacko Jacko as the the most criminal, sick and disgusting celeb to ever have excisted."

"Feeling up a 12 year old boy did not hurt as much people as the added scream when Luke makes his jump in TESB.

And for all we know Nicole Brown-Simpson got what she deserved!"

You guys just keep discrediting your own opinions with this wacky stuff. How can anything you say be taken seriously with comparisons like these? Are you even aware how asinine that statement is? In one fell swoop, you posted some of the most insensitive and reckless things I have ever witnessed on this board. For God's sakes, I hope that no molested child or families of murder victims ever reads that comment, Stefan. It's just sick.

[Kendal_Ozzel 36]

Say what you will about the SEs. That poor dead horse was beaten into nothingness many years ago. I still love Star Wars because I enjoy the greatness of it instead of focusing on the negative.

If my memory serves me right, it was February 22nd of 1997 (the day after Empire was re-released) that I first saw A New Hope. And, like most people seeing it for the first time, it blew my mind. I remember begging my parents to take me back the very next day to see Empire. They were reluctant, because it would be Sunday night and I would have school the next day. But, thankfully, they gave in, and I went and saw what would eventually become my favorite film of all time. But the first time I saw it, I actually disliked it. I mean, Luke lost his hand! And Vader's his dad? And Han Solo is frozen? What if he doesn't make it out alive?

Ah, the memories. And look how far I've come. I'm sitting here wearing a Star Wars t-shirt, with Star Wars magazines, books, and games all stacked around my computer (the screen of which features a Luke Skywalker wallpaper). And here I am, posting under the name of my favorite Star Wars character on a message board dedicated to John Williams, a guy I had never even heard of before I saw Star Wars.

So say what you will about CGI effects and Greedo shooting first. I, for one, shudder to think about what last ten years of my life would have been like if I hadn't seen Star Wars when I did. It has given so much joy, something I share with my three closest friends, all of whom I might have never gotten to know as well if not for our common love of Star Wars. Seeing the Special Editions ten years ago changed my life for the better, and for that, I thank you, George Lucas.

[Chris ChrusherComix 46]

I couldn't have said it better myself. By the way... were you living under a rock for the last 27 years like my wife and my brother's last two ex-gfs?

The lesson is: Each Star Was movie has multiple edits. But they are all the very same movies! Lighten up, people. This bickering is pointless!

[Guest macrea]

Has anybody read the synopsis on the back of the most recent DVDs? The one for "Star Wars" starts something like: "Nineteen years after Anakin Skywalker turns to the Dark Side of the Force and becomes Darth Vader, his offspring Luke Skywalker and Princess Leia Organa..." etc.

[Kendal_Ozzel 36]

I couldn't have said it better myself. By the way... were you living under a rock for the last 27 years like my wife and my brother's last two ex-gfs?

Not nearly that long. I was young enough at the time not to have known.

[Chris ChrusherComix 46]

Has anybody read the synopsis on the back of the most recent DVDs? The one for "Star Wars" starts something like: "Nineteen years after Anakin Skywalker turns to the Dark Side of the Force and becomes Darth Vader, his offspring Luke Skywalker and Princess Leia Organa..." etc.

Are you serious? Now that is a horrid marketing blunder. They should have put, "Nineteen years after the events of Revenge of the Sith, a new hope emerges" and just plain leave off the offspring crap.

Not nearly that long. I was young enough at the time not to have known.

Same with some of the people I have shown them to, too. And I LOVE showing them all to people who have never seen them nor know of the huge plot twists within them. And my wife wasn't too young, she was born the same year as the original Star Wars. It just wasn't the huge cultural phenomenon there as it was in the States, Europe, and other places. If she heard that somebody equated her home country to living under a rock, I'd shudder to think of their fate at her hands, knees, forearms and elbows. (Be careful, Mr. Breathmask! )

[Neimoidian 14]

Thats just silly. The man doesn't deserve to burn in hell for changing his own films.

Nonsense, Lucas has joined O.J. and Wacko Jacko as the the most criminal, sick and disgusting celeb to ever have excisted.

Actually he's worse then Jackson, who's never tried to tamper with Moonwalker.

He tampered with his own face far too many times

The only thing I would charge GL for is giving up his perfectionism. He used to do perfect movies. Lately, however, he even agreed on releasing the movies that weren't in fact completed (temp music, blatant CGI in some places). It wasn't my childhood he had raped. On the contrary - he made it even better with his movies. No matter how dissappointing were the sequels (AotC for the most part), they playied a great part in my life and I will always be thankful to GL for it.

[Chris ChrusherComix 46]

He tampered with his own face far too many times

The only thing I would charge GL for is giving up his perfectionism. He used to do perfect movies. Lately, however, he even agreed on releasing the movies that weren't in fact completed (temp music, blatant CGI in some places). It wasn't my childhood he had raped. On the contrary - he made it even better with his movies. No matter how dissappointing were the sequels (AotC for the most part), they playied a great part in my life and I will always be thankful to GL for it.

I blame that on Lucas taking on too much, and demanding to direct too. I've long said if someone like Spielberg directed any of the prequels, they would have flowed better and probably would not have mutilated the music as much. Still, all in all, Sith was still the best prequel both flow and music-wise, just like I always suspected that it would be back when he announced he was making them. I've always felt that the two movies that weren't directed by Lucas were the two that had the best pacing of the six.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

If [my wife] heard that somebody equated her home country to living under a rock, I'd shudder to think of their fate at her hands, knees, forearms and elbows. (Be careful, Mr. Breathmask! )

I never made that comparison. It's a figure of speech.

Can't believe I have to explain that.

[Luke Skywalker 1,796]

I think the ( ) declares that he was joking...

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Watch out for Chrusher's legendary ability to twist your words!

[Ollie 1,059]

Say what you will about the SEs. That poor dead horse was beaten into nothingness many years ago. I still love Star Wars because I enjoy the greatness of it instead of focusing on the negative.

If my memory serves me right, it was February 22nd of 1997 (the day after Empire was re-released) that I first saw A New Hope. And, like most people seeing it for the first time, it blew my mind. I remember begging my parents to take me back the very next day to see Empire. They were reluctant, because it would be Sunday night and I would have school the next day. But, thankfully, they gave in, and I went and saw what would eventually become my favorite film of all time. But the first time I saw it, I actually disliked it. I mean, Luke lost his hand! And Vader's his dad? And Han Solo is frozen? What if he doesn't make it out alive?

Ah, the memories. And look how far I've come. I'm sitting here wearing a Star Wars t-shirt, with Star Wars magazines, books, and games all stacked around my computer (the screen of which features a Luke Skywalker wallpaper). And here I am, posting under the name of my favorite Star Wars character on a message board dedicated to John Williams, a guy I had never even heard of before I saw Star Wars.

So say what you will about CGI effects and Greedo shooting first. I, for one, shudder to think about what last ten years of my life would have been like if I hadn't seen Star Wars when I did. It has given so much joy, something I share with my three closest friends, all of whom I might have never gotten to know as well if not for our common love of Star Wars. Seeing the Special Editions ten years ago changed my life for the better, and for that, I thank you, George Lucas.

Now apply what you said to 1977 and you might see were alot of us are coming from.

[robthehand 3]

I'd prefer to thank Gary Kurtz, for keeping Luca$ under control - resulting in the two good films in the series.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Three good films!

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

Kurtz was only involved in Star Wars and The Empire Strikes Back, Steef.

Unless the third you are referring to is American Graffiti, which is indeed an excellent film, but not part of the Star Wars series.

[Luke Skywalker 1,796]

Say what you will about the SEs. That poor dead horse was beaten into nothingness many years ago. I still love Star Wars because I enjoy the greatness of it instead of focusing on the negative.

If my memory serves me right, it was February 22nd of 1997 (the day after Empire was re-released) that I first saw A New Hope. And, like most people seeing it for the first time, it blew my mind. I remember begging my parents to take me back the very next day to see Empire. They were reluctant, because it would be Sunday night and I would have school the next day. But, thankfully, they gave in, and I went and saw what would eventually become my favorite film of all time. But the first time I saw it, I actually disliked it. I mean, Luke lost his hand! And Vader's his dad? And Han Solo is frozen? What if he doesn't make it out alive?

Ah, the memories. And look how far I've come. I'm sitting here wearing a Star Wars t-shirt, with Star Wars magazines, books, and games all stacked around my computer (the screen of which features a Luke Skywalker wallpaper). And here I am, posting under the name of my favorite Star Wars character on a message board dedicated to John Williams, a guy I had never even heard of before I saw Star Wars.

So say what you will about CGI effects and Greedo shooting first. I, for one, shudder to think about what last ten years of my life would have been like if I hadn't seen Star Wars when I did. It has given so much joy, something I share with my three closest friends, all of whom I might have never gotten to know as well if not for our common love of Star Wars. Seeing the Special Editions ten years ago changed my life for the better, and for that, I thank you, George Lucas.

Now apply what you said to 1977 and you might see were alot of us are coming from.

But did the SEs changed your lives for the worse?