Voldemort's Theme

[Muad'Dib 1,802]

What do you think? Should Williams theme return? This doesn't affect is Williams returns to the series, as Desplat could use it too.

I think the three parts of it (I think they were three) are great, but I also think that the theme should be a little reworked to sound more tridimensional, if you know what I mean.

So, what do you think?

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

It's an effective theme, but JW has done this kind of thing long before HP. It's not a classic IMO. I do not need it to return.

[Jonesy 55]

Yes, I don't know if Voldemort's Theme appears in last three films.

Also I think Desplat will use Williams' themes.

[Jeff 10]

The three-note Voldemore theme is like an underdeveloped Emperor's theme. It was fine, but not my favorite. I am aware of one other, longer melody line for Voldemort in SS that was slightly better, but still registers as a "meh" on my scale of effectiveness. Is the third theme you're referring to from CoS or POA? Or is it in SS?

[Muad'Dib 1,802]

The three-note Voldemore theme is like an underdeveloped Emperor's theme. It was fine, but not my favorite. I am aware of one other, longer melody line for Voldemort in SS that was slightly better, but still registers as a "meh" on my scale of effectiveness. Is the third theme you're referring to from CoS or POA? Or is it in SS?

Actually, I don't know which is the third one. All I know about it is that I've read about but I can't seem to identify it properly. However, it must be from SS or CoS, as in POA he didn't have a theme if I'm not mistaken.

[King Mark 3,631]

It's the least interesting of all the JW Potter themes

[Datameister 2,056]

HP:SS's "The Blue Forest" features a statement of one of Voldemort's themes that makes it bone-chillingly clear how appropriate it would be in the final installments of the saga. Not the three-note sorcerer's stone theme, not the slithery theme...the other one. Sooooooooo good.

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,489]

Wasn't the 'stone theme' (AKA the dark magic theme) ripped off from some Herrmann score? I like it by the way.

[MrJosh 892]

HP:SS's "The Blue Forest" features a statement of one of Voldemort's themes that makes it bone-chillingly clear how appropriate it would be in the final installments of the saga. Not the three-note sorcerer's stone theme, not the slithery theme...the other one. Sooooooooo good.

I was originally going to say that I think it would need to be redressed in a darker, scarier way to fit in with how dark the films have become but then Datameister reminded me of that statement...very true.

I can also hear it working effectively when played angrily by trombones in low register. That's just me though.

I know this is off topic, but I really hope that the original "family/ memories" theme is used by Desplat. I loved that and was sad to see it go.

[Datameister 2,056]

The original family theme is quite good, too. Obviously, it would have become less and less appropriate as the films grew more "mature", but it wouldn't hurt for it to make a few appearances - and I still think it NEEDS to be in the final scene of DH part 2.

[Muad'Dib 1,802]

The original family theme is quite good, too. Obviously, it would have become less and less appropriate as the films grew more "mature", but it wouldn't hurt for it to make a few appearances - and I still think it NEEDS to be in the final scene of DH part 2.

I agree! It should be "Reunion of Friends" with "A Window to the Past" added in between.

[Henry B 50]

The original family theme is quite good, too. Obviously, it would have become less and less appropriate as the films grew more "mature", but it wouldn't hurt for it to make a few appearances - and I still think it NEEDS to be in the final scene of DH part 2.

I agree! It should be "Reunion of Friends" with "A Window to the Past" added in between.

Yeah, I think a rather straight reprise of "Leaving Hogwarts" would be so touching. No need for the added fanfares from "Reunion of Friends," things should end on a subtle note.

[Jeff 10]

HP:SS's "The Blue Forest" features a statement of one of Voldemort's themes that makes it bone-chillingly clear how appropriate it would be in the final installments of the saga. Not the three-note sorcerer's stone theme, not the slithery theme...the other one. Sooooooooo good.

Is "The Blue Forest" a track you can get on an official release? Or is it one of those you have to rip off the DVD? And where is this statement of the theme in the film so I can go listen?

[Datameister 2,056]

Yeah, I think a rather straight reprise of "Leaving Hogwarts" would be so touching. No need for the added fanfares from "Reunion of Friends," things should end on a subtle note.

I could go for the "Reunion of Friends" ending...that'd be okay, too. Either way, amazing music that really ought to be reprised in some form for the end of the saga.

Is "The Blue Forest" a track you can get on an official release? Or is it one of those you have to rip off the DVD? And where is this statement of the theme in the film so I can go listen?

Sadly, it's not officially available - part of it was re-recorded and included on the COS OST, but the part I'm talking about is only in SS. It plays right as Voldemort/Quirrel is approaching Harry in the Forbidden Forest. It's awesome.

[MrJosh 892]

Hey Datameister,

was going to pm you but it's full. Quick question that is only slightly related to this topic.

I have this memory of you mentioning a cool book on film scoring. I remember that it has the complete cue list for HP: COS in it, among other cool stuff. What was the title of the book? I'd much like to read it.

And back on topic:

'Leaving Hogwarts' is among my top favorite cues in the world. The ending is just beautiful, magical and I think I may have gotten chills when I heard it along with the end of the film in the cinemas. I agree it would be amazing to hear it in the end.

[Datameister 2,056]

Whoop, sorry, yeah, it keeps filling up. The book is called On the Track, and I highly recommend it!

And...yes, "Leaving Hogwarts" is one of my top favorites, too. So. Freaking. Good. And I really like the last shot of the film, too.

[publicist 4,643]

The VOLDEMORT concert piece samples all three motifs related to him (that for the stone, and a related motivic idea splitted into a general 'evil' theme which, which is prominently used in the wand shop, and a more slithery variation thereof, acting as a bridge to the other one).

But it's written in children movie style and not really fitting for an apocalyptic showdown.

[Jay 37,439]

Hey Datameister,

was going to pm you but it's full. Quick question that is only slightly related to this topic.

I have this memory of you mentioning a cool book on film scoring. I remember that it has the complete cue list for HP: COS in it, among other cool stuff. What was the title of the book? I'd much like to read it.

That was me, and the thread is right here: http://jwfan.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=18808

[Romão 2,274]

I think this theme (in all its 3 components), is much more effective and menacing that some of you are giving it credit for. The children' suite is a unfair sampling of this theme in order to judge its use in the final HP movie, as it was already said, it was written for a single section of the orchestra and very much in the vein of a children's suite. The theme can sound incredibly menacing like in the BLue Forest or even in the Face of the Voldemort, more in a Ark-like theme kind of aproach. In the case of this theme, orchestration and tempo can make all the difference. The potential is all there.

[Incanus 5,722]

I think this theme (in all its 3 components), is much more effective and menacing that some of you are giving it credit for. The children' suite is a unfair sampling of this theme in order to judge its use in the final HP movie, as it was already said, it was written for a single section of the orchestra and very much in the vein of a children's suite. The theme can sound incredibly menacing like in the BLue Forest or even in the Face of the Voldemort, more in a Ark-like theme kind of aproach. In the case of this theme, orchestration and tempo can make all the difference. The potential is all there.

I agree. I see no reason Williams' Voldemort's themes could not be darkened or developed to fit the more mature finale of the film series. The Children's Suite movement Voldemort is really only showcasing the bassoons and the contrabassoon so it is not a full development of the theme. Face of Voldemort on the other hand shows how dramatic and versatile these themes can be.

And what is this Blue Forest people are talking about? Even I who am not a huge Potter fan know that it is The Forbidden Forest or the Dark Forest.

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,489]

It is Williams' music that defines Harry Potter. Nobody remembers the later scores in general. I completely disagree with the postulation that Williams' music wouldn't fit the later movies because the tone is different or whatever. Maybe we've been watching different movies, but all that's darker in the later movies is Harry's stubble and the lighting/colors. All the movies have dealt with death and evil. In the first movie, Harry kills a guy with his bare hands.

[Jay 37,439]

I've never considered the three 3 themes in question to be 3 "components" of Voldemort's Theme.... I've always thought of them as three different themes

1. The Sorceror's Stone's Theme is used in scenes featuring the stone, or where characters talking about the stone, etc. I don't think I need to point out any specific examples.

It can be heard in the OST tracks The Gringott's Vault (2:54-3:20, 3:28-4:00), The Moving Stairs (2:24-2:44), and The Face Of Voldemort (0:16-0:44, 1:12-1:24, 2:23-2:50, 3:57-4:07, 5:44-5:59).

It was re-used in COS as kind of general "something mysterious is going on" theme, mostly concerning the Chamber of Secrets. A portion of the mostly unused in SS cue "Three Note Loop" plays when the Chamber entrance is revealed in the bathroom.

2. The "You Know Who" Theme is Introduced in the film in Ollivander's wand shop (cue: "Harry Gets His Wand") as Ollivander is telling Harry that the phoenix whose feather is in his new wand had another feather in the wand that gave him his scar. When Harry asks who owned that wand, Ollivander says "we do not speak his name" The theme plays again as Ollivander says "He Who Must Not Be Named did great things... terrible, yes, but great". In the next scene (cue: "Hagrid's Flashback") Hagrid tells Harry the wizard's name is Voldemort so his main theme is used, but then the You Know Who theme plays as Harry says "What happened to You Know Who?" and Hagrid tells Harry he thinks he's still alive, out there hiding. It's next used during the Dark Forest sequence (cue: "The Blue Forest") after Draco and Harry find Voldemort's weakened form feeding on a unicorn. Draco runs away, and as the cloaked Voldemort spirit thingy floats towards Harry, the You Know Who theme plays (when he gets up and begins walking, Voldemort's main theme is used). Its final two appearances are during the showdown with Quirril/Voldemort at the end (cue: The Mirror Scene). It first plays as Voldemort begins speaking to Quirril, and says "Let me speak to him", continuing to play as Quirril unwraps the bandages on his head. When Voldemort's face is shown in the mirror, a new slower variation of the You Know Who Theme plays, before morphing into Voldemort's theme for a while. The second and final appearance of the theme is this cue is a brief reprise right after Quirril's body has disintegrated and Harry looks down at his empty clothes.

It can only be heard on the OST in the track "The Face Of Voldemort" (1:24-1:54, 4:48-4:52).

The You Know Who Theme makes one appearance in COS: Tom Riddle uses his wand to write the words "Tom Marvolo Riddle" in front of Harry, and when they rearrange to say "I Am Lord Voldemort", the You Know Who theme plays briefly, before Voldemort's main theme follows it.

3. Voldemort's Theme is introduced during the flashback of Voldemort killing Harry's parents (cue: "Hagrid's Flashback"). It is next used during the bathroom fight with the troll (cue: "Fighting The Dragon") in a really cool action variation (I guess just because it sounded good lol). It plays during the Quidditch match (cue: Slytherin Scores) as Hermione spots Snape casting an enchantment (which she thinks is making Harry's broom go crazy). It is next used 4 times during the dark forest sequence (cue: "The Blue Forest"). First, right after Hagrid finds unicorn blood and says "I found one dead a few weeks ago. This one's been hurt bad by someone...", and he looks around the forest as a wind blows (and a cloaked figure is seen in the distance), but this instance was dialed out of the final film. The second time it plays is after Harry and Draco find Voldemort feeding off a unicorn. The You Know Who Theme plays as he floats towards Harry, but Voldemort's Theme takes over as he lands on his feed and starts walking towards Harry. Harry is saved by the Centaurs, and Voldemort's Theme plays twice in succession, first during Harry's line "Do you mean to say, that thing that killed the unicorn, that was drinking his blood, that was Voldemort?", then as Harry realizes he's after The Sorceror's Stone which is inside Hogwarts. It also makes its next and final appearances during the Quirril/Voldemort showdown (cue: "The Mirror Scene"). It first plays as Voldemort is revealed on the back of Quirril's head, morphing out of the You Know Who Theme. It then plays as he talks to Harry and says he knows the stone is in his pocket. Its then intertwined with the Stones theme as he tells Harry he should join him and live forever. Its final appearance is when Voldemort's spirit form assembles and flies through Harry, but this was replaced by tracked music in the final film.

Voldemort's Theme appears on the OST in The Quidditch Match (5:12-5:20, 5:28-5:44) and The Face Of Voldemort (1:54-2:15, 2:31-2:50, 3:09-3:22, 5:20-5:25)

Voldemort's Theme also appears only once in COS: After Riddle reveals himself to be Lord Voldemort to Harry, it plays under the lines "You're the heir of Slytherin, you're Voldemort."

Williams wrote a concert arrangement called "Voldemort", part of the Children's Suite, that incorporates all 3 themes. But this is a scaled down version written specifically for bassoons.

He also published a concert arrangement called "The Sorceror's Stone" based around the Stone's theme, but this was actually just the mostly unused cue "Three Note Loop" from SS.

I hope that was helpful!

[Marian Schedenig 8,229]

The two themes directly associated with Voldemort (not counting the Stone motif) are brilliant. I rank them as some of Williams' most effective ominous/dark themes. They would have been perfect for the GOF finale and obviously for the rest of the series, but I think to really make sense they would need to have been developed throughout the episodes.

[Jay 37,439]

I agree that they would have been perfect for the GOF finale.

I think they also could have been used in 5 and 6, though perhaps a new theme would be appropriate too, as he is in fact in a new form from the GOF finale onward that he was never in up until that point

[Muad'Dib 1,802]

You know what would be great? If Voldemort's theme(s) was re-arranged in a full The Fury Main Title mode. Just listen to this and tell me if wouldn't fit like a glove for You Know Who:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HNPidX0NKdk

[MrJosh 892]

Whoop, sorry, yeah, it keeps filling up. The book is called On the Track, and I highly recommend it!

Thanks a ton! Ordered!

That was me, and the thread is right here: http://jwfan.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=18808

Ah, thank you. Yes, it's all coming back to me now.

[Muad'Dib 1,802]

I just discovered something extremly interesting. I was listening to POA (awesome by the way), and I discovered what I think could be a quote to one of Voldemort's themes. More exactly, the one they call the Slytherin theme.

Listen to "Lupin's Transformation" (I have the version that lasts for 6:11 minutes approx) and pay attention at 4:10.

Is it right what I'm hearing? It doesn't seem to be a direct quote, but the first notes are very similar, if not the same. What do you think?

[Datameister 2,056]

Not sure what you're referring to..."Lupin's Transformation and Chasing Scabbers" is 3:02 long.

[Muad'Dib 1,802]

It's the one from the complete score. Of course, it's a bootleg version. Do you want me to send you the track so you can listen to it and compare?

[Datameister 2,056]

That's okay...I'm just trying to figure out why that track would be so long.

[Muad'Dib 1,802]

I've been comparing it with complete score analysis from the main page and it seems the "Lupin's Transformation" version I have is also called "Lupin's Transformation/The Werewolf Scene" (5:08). The description says:

This extended cue starts out tenderly with Harry talking to Black (there is an unreleased quote of the memory theme), then turns ugly for Lupin?s Transformation and the werewolf fight. The cue continues right up to?

Anyone can compare?

[Datameister 2,056]

Oh, I see - John Takis used the name of a different track for that cue. I separated out the first unreleased cue, too. So let's see...

Ah, yeah, I found the passage you're talking about. I definitely wouldn't consider that a statement of any of Voldy's themes, though. It's just got the same rhythm.

[Jay 37,439]

Yea Voldemorts theme would also have no reason to be there he has nothing to do with the plot

[Charlie Brigden 7]

Yea Voldemorts theme would also have no reason to be there he has nothing to do with the plot

That's never really stopped Williams before.