Wow, This Is Interesting...

[Saxbabe 28]

I think I have opened up Pandora's Box.... 8O Hehe..

But, those avoiding it thus far....FieryAngel's and Jesse's very well-informed, comprehensive posts and narratives over there are MORE than worth the price of admission!

Greta

[JoeinAR 1,949]

Excellent job, Firey Angle and Jeshopk!

My favorite was JoeinAr's post though.  Didn't even try to be civilized.  

I joined over there too.  Maybe I'll post.

They truly are blind.  Last night while I was reading some of that I can truly say it was the first time I had actually felt anger like a weight inside myself.  I almost broke my compuer.

~Sturgis

I am not competent to argue the points musically. But I am able to argue for arguments sake, as most anyone can attest to here.

I made a 2nd post, and will answer the little bitch named Karl again, assuming I am not banned at this point, but I will push the envelope, until such banning does occur.

By the way I imagine Karl is a failed musician, whose either short, or short in the pants, and is likely an ugly drag queen, who frequents piano bars until wee hours of the morning lip synching to grandiose broadway hits, and pop standard hoping to get noticed by someone who will take him home and screw his brains out.

[Luke Skywalker 1,813]

I am not competent to argue the points musically.  But I am able to argue for arguments sake, as most anyone can attest to here.

I made a 2nd post, and will answer the little bitch named Karl again, assuming I am not banned at this point, but I will push the envelope, until such banning does occur.

Just when you thought it was safe to go back to the.....

YES, JOE! SHOW THEM!

*shark motif*

[RomanticStrings 10]

I was into Webber before I was into Williams....

~Sturgis

Hey, Sturgy, it was the same for me! Phantom was the first music I was introduced to, then it was Jurassic Park. I credit both of them for getting me into music. I credit Webber with getting me into singing, specifically, though I credit Williams for bringing me to this board. I suppose I've got a lot to live up to, as my two musical "mentors" also happen to be, if I'm not mistaken, the only two billionaire composers of today (right?). I guess I wouldn't complain if I reached even a percentage of their talent (or lack thereof as some people would argue, Steef and Karl).

~Conor

[SturgisPodmore 0]

300.

I joined over there, too and posted once in that thread.

I made my avatar over there especially for that censored , Karl.

~Sturgis

[David Coscina 4]

By the way I imagine Karl is a failed musician, whose either short, or short in the pants, and is likely an ugly drag queen, who  frequents piano bars until wee hours of the morning lip synching to grandiose broadway hits, and pop standard hoping to get noticed by someone who will take him home and screw his brains out.

JoeinAr, man you crack me up. Funny as hell actually. I'm glad you're on my side, at least as far as Williams is concerned.

The website in question does seem to be populated by faux academics who hate anyone who's had any success in composition over the past 20 years. I posted a poll on John Adams and the only person who responded was an asshole who said he hated all of Adams' work. My question to him was "the why the f**k did you bother to look at this thread?" Obviously, for the sake of congeniality, I chose a slightly less spicey response. But honestly, why a screwed up site that is!

My feeling is that if someone like Bartok or Mahler were composing today, they'd hate them too!

[David Coscina 4]

Oh, I don't think these prententious twits have heard Williams' Jazz Autographs either because who could they cite as Williams ripping off? I think most of these morons probably hate jazz too.

[JoeinAR 1,949]

well Fiery Angel, you've got the intellectual arguement down, I cannot begin to match that, I admire your knowledge.

[David Coscina 4]

Actually, I ought to route my friend Doug Adams to this site in question. Without a doubt, his knowledge of music dwarfs anyone that I know. He'd really put this fella in his place and with technical terminology that would leave the guy's head spinning!

[King Mark 3,631]

Wow,those guys must feel like when we had that Imalaraja invasion a little while back.

K.M.

[John Crichton 4]

We didn't start it by dumping on Illaijamajaira though. We just did that after.

[Composer_Fan 2]

If only JW knew how passionate we are, that our members would register at some site for the sole purpose of defending him! How noble!

On a side note, I'm really getting sick of reading that loser's sig: "Cheers, ~Karl" That sounds so sarcastic in this thread.... (grrrr)

P.S. Nice avatar, Sturgis!

[David Coscina 4]

I did a little looking into Karl. From what I can tell, he's got a PhD in Music Composition from a university in Buffulo NY. Most of his compositions are for choir. He signs his name with his PhD so we all know he's insecure and feels he must show off his acomplishments with titles.

I'm actually surprised I even bothered to attempt to educate the people on that forum about Williams and film scoring. They obviously know it all about music and thus are too "enlightened" to hear other perspectives, even when they are fortified by facts.

I also checked out another "composer" who cited Williams as using a team of people to write his scores for him. This guy's music is terrible. I find it ironic that a person who criticizes Williams for originality has nothing of any interest in his own compositions and merely sounds like he's throwing in a non-harmonic passing tone on top of standard classical modulations. Fool.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,267]

Just be sure to mention this in the thread on that other MB.

[Docteur Qui 1,544]

Meh, everyone's got their opinion. I can barely listen to a classical CD. I love playing classical - well actually, music from the Romantic period - but rarely can listen to it.

Oh well, at least the Illyria fan hasn't turned up yet...

[Jeshopk 8]

I think I may be exhausting Dr. Karl, PhD. He's harmless, but very prejudiced. I have a lot of pent up frustration with the other high minded Bostonians of the chamber music scene here. He's part of that, so I guess this is my chance to finally do local battle.

[Ren 77]

Well, it sounds to me like these people just have no clue that anything else exists. maybe they'll read here for a bit and become enlightened.

[SturgisPodmore 0]

Doubtful.

I don't have all that musical knowledge and education, like Karl, whose "Cheers" certainly gets to me too. I just posted over there again. Kind of just playing the devil's advocate, but oh it's fun!

I'm glad you like my evil JW avatar Composer Fan!

(Of course if you're a composer fan, why are you here? John Williams isn't a composer.) :roll:

Cheers!

~Sturgis

[SturgisPodmore 0]

Wow, it does seem horrifyingly sarcastic, doesn't it?

~Sturgis

[JoeinAR 1,949]

I'm still checking this out, and may or may not be able to confirm this, but there is a possibility that Karl, was a rejected musician from the Boston Pops, back when John Williams was conductor, seems that maybe Mr Clarinette player wasn't up to snuff, and blames John for his shortcomings. Still I don't know how much power John as conductor of the Pops had with selecting players.

[SturgisPodmore 0]

I'm still checking this out, and may or may not be able to confirm this, but there is a possibility that Karl, was a rejected musician from the Boston Pops, back when John Williams was conductor, seems that maybe Mr Clarinette player wasn't up to snuff, and blames John for his shortcomings.

Oooooooh, some good dirt!

Where did you find that info?

~Sturgis

[SturgisPodmore 0]

Oh, gosh, FireyAngel, now Karl is referring to you as his "esteemed colleague."

I'm so sorry.

~Sturgis

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

I don't know what all the controversy is about.  John Williiams is a fantastic guitarist.

LOL (I'm assuming this poster's kidding )

Actually, I know Firey, your esteemed "colleague," from another, far less baised and blind, much more friendly message board full of people who actually acknowledge classical music and film scores on the same level.

~Sturgis

Be careful, Sturgis. This being the biggest MB dedicated to Williams on the net, I would hardly call this MB (near) unbiased. The fact that several of our members have registered at this forum and started defending Williams shows a certain preference in music at least.

- Marc, who will not actively participate in this battle.

[SturgisPodmore 0]

I know we certainly aren't unbaised, it was just fun to make it sound way better than that other board.

~Sturgis, who is kind of just trying to annoy Karl, having not-so-much technical musical knowledge myself

[Bowie 45]

Well, I tried my best:

http://www.good-music-guide.com/forum/inde...g35795#msg35795

I can't decide whether I'm unbiased or not (that would be biased of me), but I certainly hold classical and film music to the same level (because I am jealous of and can appreciate the skill that goes into both genres equally), and I tried to convey that in my message that, while I don't think John Williams is a hack, I don't think any of the greats they're championing are hacks either. Their skills are all remarkable.

I prefer Williams' hummable themes and hauntingly beauty film scores. Schmeh.

[David Coscina 4]

Absolutely Bowie. I don't believe one has to criticize one composer to lift another composer up.

[Composer_Fan 2]

Bowie, I love that alphabetical list you posted! I could identify most of those musical references you gave. Very detailed and intuitive.

[Saxbabe 28]

That thread was at 5 or 6 pages when I found it! Now my link is on the FSM board too...it's spreading

Great argument Bowie! I've learned and been reminded of a lot in the analyses/defenses posted there by our members. Here we don't get into bringing up a lot of that, because we're all believers over here. But it's nice to read those, reminds me of just how ingenious JW is.

And Bowie, THANKS for slamming that ludicrous link someone actually posted there called "How to Murder John Williams" (no lie! it got off into talking more about classic film scores, etc though) They really have no shame... :?

Wouldn't it be funny if that just became the thread that never died...the madness would spread to other score boards, and people would want to throw their hat in the ring...and it would go on and on...mwahaha.. But I think we're already about to outnumber them there.

I wish there was a thread over there that had to do with film scores "in general". Because there is much interesting to discuss in that arena in the parallels to the classical masters.

They should consider: there are many that became in classical music because of film scores. Many friends started like that, then they heard some classical things, and said, "Gee that reminds me of the soundtrack to (insert name), I think I like that." (Reverse thinking, but the average person does think this way!)

So film scores have done MUCH in promoting classical music to people who otherwise would not give it a chance. They should actually thank film composers.

Greta

EDITED: For typos, and there's an interesting thread there about Philip Glass and one about Miklos Rozsa that would be neat to bump there, and FireyAngel's taking over with starting new composer threads. Cool to see the Goldenthal one.

This Dr. Karl's whole view towards the film music genre just has a bad color. Too bad, as he's probably actually nice. He writes liturgical stuff from what I gather (the man has a whole thread devoted to him there). But he thinks in general that film scores, once the theme has been stated, are just repetitive and hold no interest. (To a man who I understand listens to chants quite a lot...) His latest was a dig to Signs indirectly, and directly, showing that it ruffles his feathers to see people invading the board that are praising lowly film composers...He called us "acolytes" I believe.

[David Coscina 4]

That is very true Greta!

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,267]

We need to send Dan Hobgood to that MB.

[SturgisPodmore 0]

What we need is to send Steef over there to make them all cry!

And, Bowie, I was very pleased with what you wrote, too!

Anyone who digs into Signs must not be right in the head.

~Sturgis