Wojo 2,453 Posted April 9, 2017 Share Posted April 9, 2017 You don't have 700 hours? I would ask a different doctor for a second opinion, before it's too late. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 Just ignore the old stuff. Before 2005 Who was a very different show. It wasnt very good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pieter Boelen 740 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 8 hours ago, Selina Kyle said: There are too many fucking episodes of this show to catch up. Is there like an abridged "best of" collection? I don't have 700 hours to kill. If you're really pressed for time, starting with season 5 of the new series is also not the worst option. That is the most recent "introductory" episode. Myself, I watched the entire new series and started back at the beginning of the old afterwards. Taking me forever to get through the old stuff though; still on the First Doctor and those missing episodes are a bit annoying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 But Justin already watched season 1 to 4! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naïve Old Fart 9,550 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 2 hours ago, Stefancos said: Just ignore the old stuff. Before 2005 Who was a very different show. It wasnt very good You are on thin fucking ice, my Pedigree Chum! I know you're out there, I can feel the popcorn! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 Ok let me put it this way. It's a significantly different show then the 2005 revived version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 Basically yes. Though TOD ran for three seasons and Dr. Who for something like 26. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 In the United Kingdom? Sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 I don't know. Trek aired here for years in the 90's. I think only a season or so of nuWho aired here. No idea about classic Who in ye olden days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BloodBoal 7,538 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 Star Trek, by about a factor of 100! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 Agreed. I love both, but Doctor Who is silly, frivolous fun and Star Trek is more serious, not just in its science fiction ideas, but in its characterizations, especially with TNG and DS9. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 Not everything is solved with a sonic screwdriver in the world of Star Trek! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pieter Boelen 740 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 Doctor Who definitely proves food for thought and can be really, REALLY clever at times. But it is a completely different approach from Star Trek and way, WAY less serious. I like them both. But probably have to give a slight edge to Doctor Who for sheer entertainment value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 Doctor Who is often a very clever show, but nowadays it isnt as smart as maybe it once was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 I loved the Moffat seasons with the Ponds, and I really enjoyed the last Clara season (2015) but I always enjoyed it despite the companion problem. Can't wait to see what he can do with his final season, free of the mistake that was Clara. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pieter Boelen 740 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 1 hour ago, Stefancos said: Doctor Who is often a very clever show, but nowadays it isnt as smart as maybe it once was. Maybe not. Still, I'll take what I can. Next week will be the first season I ever see WHILE it is being aired. So that'll be a new experience for sure! 39 minutes ago, Disco Stu said: I loved the Moffat seasons with the Ponds, and I really enjoyed the last Clara season (2015) but I always enjoyed it despite the companion problem. Can't wait to see what he can do with his final season, free of the mistake that was Clara. Companion problem? I liked Clara; she's cute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 Just now, Pieter_Boelen said: Companion problem? I liked Clara; she's cute. Yeah I like Jenna Coleman as an actress, but the character of Clara just never clicked. Moffat never seemed to decide who she was and what motivated her. Pieter Boelen 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wojo 2,453 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 Once her purpose as The Impossible Girl to connect with the Doctor in each regeneration was fulfilled, she lost direction. I realize she would continue to anchor the Doctor through his future, but I still think her arc should have ended there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 10, 2017 Share Posted April 10, 2017 Moffat had an outstanding first series, but never quite matched it. His tenure is incredibly inconsistent. And his companion farewells arent as strong as Davies'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightscape94 965 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 I think he made up for the completely lame Amy and Rory exit with the rather sweet, emotional, and heartfelt goodbye for Clara. I didn't mind the deus ex machine aspect of her resurrection, and much preferred her sendoff in the finale, although I know some will disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 "Angels Take Manhattan" lame? It's one of my favorite episodes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 It's ok. But I maintain that it's a really really bad idea to separate your companions from The Doctor forever by trapping them in another time period, when you run a show about a man with a time machine. River Song was good though. Pieter Boelen 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Doctor Who is a show I'm able to watch without caring at all about continuity or canon or whatever. I guess that just means I'm kind of a casual fan? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 I'm not usually a sticker for that kinda thing either. Especially on a show that is far more fantasy then sci-fi. But this was a bit too sloppy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Doctor Who is great camp that occasionally hits powerful emotional beats or offers food for thought. But u must admit, as much as I love Capaldi's Doctor, I have grown weary of the show, especially at the last season. And I blame Moffat for that. He had a great run in the early Pond days, but started circling around himself soon after. And the show has never really topped the tear-jerking Doomsday finale. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Journey's End is actually more moving for me. Because we have seen Donna Noble grow from a self-obsessed, shallow, abrasive, annoying bint to someone who literally becomes The Doctors equal, only for that to be taken away. Naïve Old Fart 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 The ending of Donna's arc is what convinced me it was right for RTD to leave the show. He fucked that up completely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Davies was more interested in the big emotions while telling more straight forward stories. Moffat just got far too bogged down in timey-whimey stuff for a lot of the time. Just now, Disco Stu said: The ending of Donna's arc is what convinced me it was right for RTD to leave the show. He fucked that up completely. What? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Seriously? Donna being robbed of the memories of her time with the Doctor was satisfying to you? God that was awful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Just now, Disco Stu said: Seriously? Donna being robbed of the memories of her time with the Doctor was satisfying to you? God that was awful. Heartbreaking! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Agreed, but not in a good way! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Oh yes, and that was Tennant's own farewell too right? Moving stuff indeed. But still, Piper's exit had me welling up a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 5 minutes ago, KK said: Oh yes, and that was Tennant's own farewell too right? Moving stuff indeed. No, that was a year later. The End Of Time, the last 10 t0 15 minutes of which I can't watch without sobbing like a little girl. None of Moffat's Doctor/Companion farewells were as good as Davies, IMO. Not even close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Ah you're right. Tennant is still my favourite Doctor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Smith in his first season is my favourite. But Tennant had a much stronger reign. Music was better in his tenure too. DarthDementous 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 I'm one of what appears to be a small camp of people who think Moffat was better (or at least more consistent) than Davies. I think I've said before that Moffat's seasons were so much funnier than Davies'. RTD was never good at humor, more often than not it was eyerolling and corny. Moffat is such a good comedy writer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Perhaps you are right that Moffat is more consistent, but his average is lower that Davies, as were his ratings. I've always felt Moffat was trying to be too clever with a show that doesnt necessarily benefit from it. And he's far far too much of a Who fanboy. I think everyone in that writers room must be. Davies had to make the show understandable for an audience that didnt grew up with Doctor Who. Moffat too often seems to be catering only to those who have seen every singe episode 7 times and knows every line from memory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Do you agree that the show has been funnier under his reign though? Especially with Capaldi's expert comic timing imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Sure. But I never felt that was ever the shows strongest selling point anyway. With Moffat I think we can see now that if he is left to run a show long enough he keeps telling stories that are about the show itself. A lot of his later Doctor Who seasons are about putting the character and indeed the franchise under a microscope and dissecting in into it's component parts. Carefully adding loads of psychoanalytical subtext so it becomes a show that's so self aware of it's own history and tropes that thats really all it's about. He did the exact same thing with Sherlock. It's annoying actually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Yeah, I like his writing a lot but he's definitely got a "too smart for his own good" thing going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 I think he's a better writer than a showrunner. He's got some great ideas but needs someone to reign him in a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KK 3,307 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Moffat helped polish the rougher edges of the show, amping up the production values and broader appeal of the premise. But his bag of tricks can be pretty exhausting when he becomes over-reliant on them. Before he became showrunner, the Moffat episodes used to be really special. He's good at telling individual stories, and struggles more with broad season arcs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marian Schedenig 8,206 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 On 10.4.2017 at 11:24 AM, Stefancos said: In the United Kingdom? Sure. My impression is that Doctor Who's popularity in England is second only to that of the Beatles. Slightly. On 10.4.2017 at 7:27 PM, I Need About Tree Fiddy said: Once her purpose as The Impossible Girl to connect with the Doctor in each regeneration was fulfilled, she lost direction. I realize she would continue to anchor the Doctor through his future, but I still think her arc should have ended there. There definitely was a problem in Capaldi's first season, but I always thought that the problem wasn't so much Clara but rather that Moffat didn't make up his mind what the new Doctor was supposed to do with her. He kept antagonising her, which ruined the whole Doctor/companion dynamic, and it seems Clara took the blame for that, popularity wise. She worked much better again in her last season though. In her better moments, she's one of my favourite companions. 5 hours ago, Disco Stu said: I'm one of what appears to be a small camp of people who think Moffat was better (or at least more consistent) than Davies. Continuity wise, RTD often was a mess. It seems that people (certainly Steef) keep complaining about Moffat often keeping a way out to bring back characters that were supposed to be gone, but that in itself isn't a continuity problem if done well, and I also don't see it as an emotional problem since his farewells, even those that turn out to be non-final, always ring true from the characters' point of view. Do they ever reach the height of Tennant's demise? No, but that's also partly due to Tennant's Doctor (both acting and character wise), I think. And continuity was indeed a thing that sometimes slightly (emphasis on slightly) bothered me in the RTD era. It started out with nobody but a few conspiracy nuts knowing about the Doctor, then kept getting bigger and bigger with the Doctor saving the Earth multiple times, becoming an international hero, the Daleks (once nearly extinct) destroying the Earth and everything else, until it got so big that they had to reset it, and start expanding everything again. It reached great heights that way, but I couldn't say that the show under RTD was a more grounded or consistent thing than it is under Moffat. It is notable though that Moffat's greatest moments were mostly under RTD, although I do admire his character arcs and the way he, despite all the timey wimey stuff, leaves it to his characters and their personal experiences to make the stories epic. Anyway, after the latest Sherlock season I'm rather relieved to see Moffat ending his turn while he's still, in my view, having a good run (that will hopefully last for his final series). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disco Stu 15,495 Posted April 11, 2017 Share Posted April 11, 2017 Yes I can't wait to see what he has in store for his final series and Xmas special. Would love to see go out with a bang! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unlucky Bastard 7,782 Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 9 hours ago, Disco Stu said: I'm one of what appears to be a small camp of people who think Moffat was better (or at least more consistent) than Davies. I think I've said before that Moffat's seasons were so much funnier than Davies'. RTD was never good at humor, more often than not it was eyerolling and corny. Moffat is such a good comedy writer. I liked the farting aliens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 I liked his Tennant episodes a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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