Potter fans on John Williams/GOF score

[Incanus 5,723]

This is a list of quotations from various Harry Potter messageboards. It's not my intention to bash these remarks, but this gives you an indication on how people are reacting outside the Williams camp. Ofcourse I selected the most controversial ones, but just visit some Potter sites and you'll see that the general consensus seems to be: "Doyle's score is the best Potter score yet" or "Doyle has provided the music Williams couldn't".  

John Williams brings in the sights and the sounds, but Doyle finally brought in the EMOTION. A much more mature, and frankly, better constructed score than the last installments. Fresh blood is just what the musical composition needed, and Doyle comes in on his very best game.

Williams did not have emotion in his score? What the hell are they talking about? Williams has written music with so much emotion that it is furiating to read comment like that one above. His scores contain the very heart of the feelings and emotions of the film. That makes Williams a great film composer. He captures the emotion as well as athmosphere of the film. From the short oboe solo in Secrets of the Castle to the different variations of Window to the Past theme and Harry's Family theme Williams' scores are full of emotion. He captures the miracle and exhilaration of flight better than any composer. His themes are simply the most emotinal music I have heard. And then some kiddies bash him for not writing emotional music. For shame!!

[SturgisPodmore 0]

That last remark Roald posted in particular was ridiculous. This new score depends the most on brass by far, and the same key all the time? Try listening to "The Story Continues" for a constant key. :roll:

~Sturgis

[Sandor 798]

That last remark Roald posted in particular was ridiculous. This new score depends the most on brass by far, and the same key all the time? Try listening to "The Story Continues" for a constant key. Rolling Eyes

Hey! You make it sound like I wrote that sh*t!

[SturgisPodmore 0]

Sorry, I meant "That last quote posted by Roald . . . "

~Sturgis

[gkgyver 1,646]

"I thought that the new score was significantly better. There was a much better feel to the music. In the song Voldemort, it had a huge amount of heart to the theme. John WIlliams created a base, Patrick Doyle has managed to compose something really Oscar Worthy. Much different than the first three.But it was on of the best scores I have heard. The Yule Ball songs were great, as well, something new and cool.I can't believe that some people don't like this score. I thought Hedwigs theme was way overly used in the first three, this new one is the moving of the Harry Potter film to whole new definition of GRAND"

[Romão 2,274]

:roll:

[gkgyver 1,646]

From the short oboe solo in Secrets of the Castle to the different variations of ...

Ah! You love that bit too, don't you? If I had to pick just one favourite snippet of PoA, it would be this one!

things that are hard to do like modulating to a totally non-related key, is something Williams does with ease and makes it sound fluid and natural.

Would you mind giving an example because I'd really like to know what you're talking about here (although I do have a faint idea)?

[Unlucky Bastard 7,782]

Williams is presently the god of film scoring.  Bar none.  No competition.  Sorry, nothing to see here folks.  All that stuff.

I love this board.

[BurgaFlippinMan 7]

The two Yule Ball songs made me want to puke, especially that Hippogriff one.

[Sandor 798]

One more. The UBER-comment:

Oh, and by the way, I DO like John Williams. I just think he's overrated because he writes really memorable themes.

Can you believe this one?

[Mythos 0]

One more. The UBER-comment:

Oh' date=' and by the way, I DO like John Williams. [b']I just think he's overrated because he writes really memorable themes.

That is so ... ridiculous!!!

[Docteur Qui 1,544]

With all of these comments about how "fresh and original" JW scores were I'm starting to wonder if our generation listens to any music that MTV doesn't force-feed us... then they'd know how little JW brought fresh to HP...

He's overrated because he uses nothing BUT themes. They are great on their own but they don't make for a good complete movie score (anyone notice how most JW arrangements for band instruments aren't all that great?). Variation for JW is play this theme louder/quieter or faster/slower but don't touch the notes. His stuff is highly repetitive and has almost no transition music. That doesn't help the action on the screen, that fights it.

Personally, I think that JW is a bit overrated. All that I could think about while watching Star wars Episode III is how I kept hearing snatches from his other works (Harry Potter, E.T., Hook, etc) in there. And a lot of his work in Star Wars and Harry Potter sound like the work of the composer Gustav Holst. Listen to Holst's "Mars, Bringer of War" and then the Imperial March from Star Wars. Or Holst's "Uranus, the magician" and then Journey to Hogwarts from Sorcerer's Stone. The similarities are eerie.

This is nice. Much more pastoral, although in some place I miss the magical sound of bells and flutes...it misses some depth and texture there. But it's nice. I love John Williams, and I think that the themes and magical sounds of soundtracks one and two were great, but I really, REALLY disliked the soundtrack for POA, and that's bad, because I wanted to like it. It wasn't cohesive, it was kind of flat and deflated sounding, and obnoxious in the area of the Knight Bus. But then, baroque is my least favorite music. JW just seemed to be running out of steam and doing wierd stuff totally out there...I think the fans of John Williams would have been just as disappointed if he'd done the GoF music as they are with PD's. There's a reason JW decided to work on the other project instead of HP. The music is really not bad, you know.

But to contrast:

Geez, it's either Doyle lovers and Williams haters or the exact opposite here!

I'm a Williams fan, and the first HP score made me so. Interestingly, the people who dislike the HP scores do so because they dislike Williams in general - not because the music is particularly bad. "Too much like his other stuff" etc. Anyone who has heard his more intimate scores would disagree - including PoA.

Further more, the "fluffy", "sappy" music Williams wrote was a direct result of the director of the first two films, who, if you recall, jammed the films with fluffy, soppy scenes. It's hardly the composer's fault for following the director's orders.

Doyle's music was great, and I'm sure it will work well in the film, but it's not as memorable as Williams' music, and is much less accesible. Will anyone leave the theatre with "Harry's Love" in their head? Doubtfully.

Atreides, did you HEAR PoA? Every single mention of "subtlety" and lessened use of Hedwig's Theme was entirely present in that score. The "Past Theme" appears three times of the CD - twice the same recording and a concert arrangement at that which only appears in the end credits, and a handful of times in the film. Yes, it's dramatic in its reprise in "Finale" but despite that it's memorable and it stays with you. Not because Williams "shoved it into every scene", but because it was excellent music. That's what Doyle's music was lacking. And I base my discussion on PoA because that gives us the most accurate depiction of where Williams was taking the series. And it certainly wasn't into familiar territory or reprises of "Hedwig's Theme" every five minutes.

You said it yourself, he writes memorable themes. How does that make him overrated?

[Incanus 5,723]

:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

[Luke Skywalker 1,799]

This thread is alot of fun!

[Sandor 798]

This thread is alot of fun!    

Don't take it too serious Luke. Neither do I.

[Luke Skywalker 1,799]

I just wanted t express how i feel.

Its fun to see idiot people.

It its angering the things they say...

[Jeshopk 8]

He's overrated because he uses nothing BUT themes. They are great on their own but they don't make for a good complete movie score (anyone notice how most JW arrangements for band instruments aren't all that great?). Variation for JW is play this theme louder/quieter or faster/slower but don't touch the notes. His stuff is highly repetitive and has almost no transition music. That doesn't help the action on the screen, that fights it.

This one has to be my absolute favorite. Oh the stupidity.

[Marian Schedenig 8,234]

Oh, and by the way, I DO like John Williams. I just think he's overrated because he writes really memorable themes.

Actually, I don't find this that stupid. I disagree with him being overrated, but basically it goes in the same direction as my opinion that, contrary to rather popular belief, themes are by far not everything (luckily, Williams knows that).

Marian -

[HPFAN_2 0]

:roll:

[nightscape94 965]

Why is everyone getting so worked up about these comments? These people aren't film score aficionados, and few of them know anything about other Williams' scores, at least on the same level we do.

Tim