Jay 37,378 Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 The question marks weren't in regards to the title, it was to the fact that the cue should only be 44 seconds long but your laserdisc track is 3:53 long. I'm at work, not at home, so can't listen to your rip, and won't get to until late tomorrow either because I'm not going home tonight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 27, 2011 Author Share Posted April 27, 2011 Really? I'll check tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Skywalker 1,796 Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 it's mixed with et and elliot get drunk, i think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,378 Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 But he has a separate track for that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Skywalker 1,796 Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 maybe the film version with some edit-tracking and the unedited version are provided in the ISO score? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 27, 2011 Author Share Posted April 27, 2011 Could be an error Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Skywalker 1,796 Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 from yours truly?unvelievable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 The 1996 CD is mixed better than the 2002. There's actually some stuff buried and inaudible in the 20th remix that bugs me.Anyway, the 1996 CD contains some alternates that were replaced with film versions on the 20th CD. These are Searching for E.T. and the end credits. Oddly, the 20th CD didn't correct E.T. is Dying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quintus 5,399 Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 Good non-essential shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488 Posted April 27, 2011 Share Posted April 27, 2011 Invading Elliott's House film version sounds different. Never noticed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodMusician 56 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 I had been hoping these would finally get ripped in HQ so I could rectify my own edit, the last "film" edit I ever made :shakes head: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbo 54 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 I was wondering this morning when I saw just a tracklist and nothing more. When I got home from work there was quite a discussion going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 Recorded, not ripped! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TownerFan 4,984 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 Here's my own advices to create a good 2-CD set.What you need:-1982 OST Album disc-1996 CD-2002 Anniversary CD-Isolated Score from LaserdiscThe most ideal way to go is, imho, to present the complete film score on Disc 1 and the 1982 OST Album plus alternates and outtakes on Disc 2--this way you'll have two full platters of great listening pleasure.Disc 1 . It's preferable to use the 1996 CD as a basis--it sounds a tad better than the 2002 remastering. However, you have to put several 2002 tracks onto the program ("Main Titles", "Meeting E.T.", "E.T.'s New Home", "Searching for E.T." and "End Credits"). . Pay some attention at the sequencing of "E.T.'s New Home" - "Beginning of a Friendship" - "Toys", because the 2002 edition screwed the separation of these tracks, hence you'll have to cut out the last 15 seconds of "E.T.'s New Home", or you'll find them repeated at the beginning of 1996 "Beginning of a Friendship" (hope it's clear! ). Use the laserdisc cues to fill the missing gaps ("Elliot Explores the Cornfield", "Elliott's First Kiss", "Mary Searches the Closet", "E.T. is Dying" film version).. As for "Escape/Chase/Saying Goodbye", my own advice is to edit the "ouch" revised insert back into the 1996 "Saying Goodbye" portion. Be careful also to the very end of the 1996 "Saying Goodbye" because the last second of reverb is cut off to the beginning of the subsequent track ("End Credits").Disc 2. Use all 8 tracks from the 1982 album and put it in the same order. It just flows beautiful this way, like Williams intended.. For the Alternates and Outtakes section I suggest you this program: "Searching for E.T." and "E.T. is Dying" from the 1996 album. Then put the whole "Saying Goodbye" portion as found on the 1996 album (with the original "ouch" segment retained). Then sequence the alternate "End Credits" from the 1996 album--however, my own suggestion is to make an edit with the film version because there's a huge performance mistake around 00:57 (the trumpets miss a beat and enter at the wrong spot) and it sounds quite bad.. As the final touch, put the audio from the 2003 DVD featurette "The Music of E.T.: A Discussion with John Williams" as the bonus track.Follow these simple rules and you'll have your own E.T. ultimate edition at your disposal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 Hmm...i slightly prefer the sound on the 2002 release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TownerFan 4,984 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 There's not a great difference between the two, imho, but the 1996 seems to have a bit more dynamic range all throughout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 For some reason the 2002 version of E.T. Is Alive corresponds almost exactly to the version from the iso score. I wonder why they felt the need to replicate that edit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TownerFan 4,984 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 For some reason the 2002 version of E.T. Is Alive corresponds almost exactly to the version from the iso score. I wonder why they felt the need to replicate that edit?Maybe they used the film stems as an editing guide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 Only for that cue then. Escape/Chase/Saying Goodbye has several edits in the film not present in the 2002 version Jason, in what way did they use a different/wrong take for Adventures On Earth on the OST compared to the other 2 releases? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fommes 153 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 Post in the chrono score thread updated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 Listening to the OST version and the 2002 version of Escape/Chase lined up in a wav editor now.They don't match all the way, but I'm only finding slight editing difference, not performance differences you would find in a different take.4:30 till 7:59 of both tracks run absolutely identical Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fommes 153 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 Which one is edited better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 The judgement is still out on that. For some reason I mistrust the 2002 version. 0.00 till aprox 1.14 run the same (definatly the same recording because you can hear some ochestra noise in both at around 0:23) Then the tracks start the separate minutely, but if you line the wave forma up that that point it once again becomes absolutely identical.at 2:10 the 2 tracks start to run differently, but if I line them up again at that point they continue to run in perfect sync.As far as I can determine Escape/Chase has the same take used for both the 1982 OST and the 2002 release.Now for the Saying Goodbye portion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fommes 153 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 Thanks for that. And at the editing points, which is edited better? Or is it only unhearable milliseconds of difference? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 These are different on maybe a tenth of a second, if not less.Saying Goodbye!Comparison between the film version from the isolated score and the 1992 OST version.It's the same take all the way through. There are some minute micro edits in either the film version or the OST version meaning they don't run in perfect synch throughout the entire piece. But it is certainly the same take. The only difference is the horn insert on the OST just before E.T. says " I'll be right here!".Next up. the film version versus the 2002 version. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,378 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 Here's the notes I had on how the OST version of "Adventures On Earth" differed from the film version (Note: I was comparing to the actual film - not the laserdisc iso score. Its POSSIBLE the laserdisc iso score differs from what is heard in the actual film)1. On the OST, there's a sustained triangle hit starting at 6:53 that isn't present in the film, 1996, or 2002 versions2. The transition from "Chase" into "Saying Goodbye" : overlapped in the actual film and the 2002 release; separated by 4 seconds of silence on the OST; separated by 2 seconds of silence on the 1996 release.3. The "Ouch" scene: the Insert is added in the actual film and the OST; The original cue plays unaltered in the 1996 and 2002 releases.4. At 12:42, there are extra horns in the OST not present in the film itself, the 1996 release, or the 2002 release5. At 13:45, there is a really bad edit on the OST version not present in the actual film, 1996, or 2002 versions.Since I found no differences in the 1996/2002 versions as compared to the film, except the amount of time between "Chase' and "Saying Goodbye" and the added Insert, I concluded that those version utilized the correct film takes, and the OST used alternate takes. An added horn or triangle is something added on the podium while refining the cue, not a true alternate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 Interesting. I will find out if the iso score uses the same take as the normal sound mixJason, what version of the movie did you use for the comparison?Remember, there are 2 different cuts of E.T. out there. I personally have no idea if the 2002 extended cut uses the same takes as the original. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incanus 5,716 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 This is all very fascinating but the real question here is who will edit us the bestest ultimatest original intended (with inserts) version of the final cues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,378 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 I was using my dvd of the 1982 theatrical cut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 Ok let me compare the laserdiscs iso score and normal soundtrack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TownerFan 4,984 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 This is all very fascinating but the real question here is who will edit us the bestest ultimatest original intended (with inserts) version of the final cues. I plan start working on it as soon as possible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 1. On the OST, there's a triangle hit at 6:53 that isn't present in the film, 1996, or 2002 versionsYes at 6:53 there is a single triangle hit on the 1982 OST. But it's ALSO in the laserdisc film mix, the iso score and the 1996 and 2002 versions.The 1982 OST also has a sustained triangle hits starting at 6:53 til 07:00. Audible in the left channel.This triangle is NOT present in the 1996 and 2002 version NOR can it be hear in the iso score. But it CAN be heard in the laserdiscs film mix.Interesting. I just checked the DVD of the original cut, and the triangle hits that ARE in the laserdisc version are not in heard in this one.I wonder if they were an overlay that has gotten lost, since they appear only in the pre 2002 original cut of the film and the OST. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,378 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 The 1982 OST also has a sustained triangle hits starting at 6:53 til 07:00. Audible in the left channel.This triangle is NOT present in the 1996 and 2002 version NOR can it be hear in the iso score. But it CAN be heard in the laserdiscs film mix.So the laserdisc iso score IS different from the actual music in the film then! Aha!Interesting. I just checked the DVD of the original cut, and the triangle hits that ARE in the laserdisc version are not in heard in this one.I wonder if they were an overlay that has gotten lost, since they appear only in the pre 2002 original cut of the film and the OST.Woah. Shit just got complicated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ollie 1,059 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 You guys do way too much work just to listen to film scores. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 Woah. Shit just got complicated.Isn't that part of the fun? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,378 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 So I guess the extra triangle was indeed an overlay added to the both the theatrical film and the OST.... and then they neglected to add this overlay to the 1996 CD, 2002 theatrical re-release and subsequent DVD, and 2002 CD? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 2. The transition from "Chase" into "Saying Goodbye" : overlapped in the actual film and the 2002 release; separated by 4 seconds of silence on the OST; separated by 2 seconds of silence on the 1996 release.Yes, but what does that proof? Since Escape/Chase and Saying Goodbye were never recorded as a single piece. The 4 second silence on the OST probably signifies a creative descision made by JW.The 2002 transition is very close to the film edit, but not 100%.So I guess the extra triangle was indeed an overlay added to the both the theatrical film and the OST.... and then they neglected to add this overlay to the 1996 CD, 2002 theatrical re-release and subsequent DVD, and 2002 CD?And the Laserdisc isolated score track! The triangle is even more audible in the film then it is on the OST CD. It really must be an overlay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,378 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 What about the extra horns at 12:42? And the bad edit at 13:45? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miguel Andrade 1,264 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 5m6 The Quiet Man (Victor Young) - 0:25 - [laserdisc only - Steef track "Elliot's First Kiss"]I wonder if your source is the actual sheet music... because the snippet taken from The Quiet Man wasn't composed by Young, but rather a song he adapted into the score called “The Isle Of Innisfree”, composed by Richard Farrelly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 There is a bad edit on the OST version at 13:50, not 13:45.The Laserdisc track has the edit at exactly that point in the normal track, but on the iso score it is much smoother. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,378 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 Wow. So it seems as though the 1982 OST version exactly matches the original film version down to bad edits and added overlays..... and it seemed different to the "theatrical cut" to me because I was going by the 202 DVD which fixed the bad edited and removed an overlay.Strange!How about the "I'll be right here" horn blast? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 Those horn blasts seems to be the only real difference I can detect.The OST seems definatly to be the closest to the film original 1982 version.If you want I can upload the laser discs sound effects and dialogue track for "Adventures On Earth" so you can compare with the 2002 DVD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,378 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 Right - those horn blasts appear ONLY on the OST, not in ANY version of the film, the iso score track, or any future CD release. Strange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 Yeah it's really weird. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 Wow. So it seems as though the 1982 OST version exactly matches the original film version down to bad edits and added overlays.....Yes, I could be wrong but it's also the part there E.T. says "Come...Stay" is played slower with more magnificent strings on the OST + 1982 film version than the 1996 and 2002 version .Edit: never mind,I think it's the same thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 3. The "Ouch" scene: the Insert is added in the actual film and the OST; The original cue plays unaltered in the 1996 and 2002 releases.So you are sure the insert was used in the film and the OST? I always figured the OST was the original version williams recorded and the overlay was added either by mistake or as a deliberate creative decision in the 1996 and 2002 releases? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Mark 3,631 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 I thought that too...It's a very similar case to the original strings in the ending of Close Encounters vs the later "thematic" insert Williams used in concert Versions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 28, 2011 Author Share Posted April 28, 2011 Ok, apart from the missing triangle overlay at 6:56 I cannot hear any difference between the iso score track and the standard laser disc track with dialogue and sound effects (I can't vouch for 100 % accuracy there, because sometimes the sound effects drown out the music)I am however now convinced that the version used in the original film, the 1992 OST and the iso score are basically the same takes. The 1982 OST is actually the closest to the film version. It only has the horn overlay that was not used in the film.And people, if all of this may seem a little bit anal. Remember, this is the finest single 15 minutes John Williams has ever done!It's important! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,378 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 3. The "Ouch" scene: the Insert is added in the actual film and the OST; The original cue plays unaltered in the 1996 and 2002 releases.So you are sure the insert was used in the film and the OST? I always figured the OST was the original version williams recorded and the overlay was added either by mistake or as a deliberate creative decision in the 1996 and 2002 releases?100% positive. The sheet music doesn't lie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fommes 153 Posted April 28, 2011 Share Posted April 28, 2011 So... if I've read all of this correctly, there doesn't need to be any editing done right?-the OST can be used as the film version-the 2002 version can be used as the alternate (original version)But if you want to be 100% precise:-you'd need to edit out the horn overlay from the OST track and into the 2002 track-and clear up the silence between Chase & Saying Goodbye on the OST track(I may do the latter, but I don't mind the former.)Nothing else, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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