Seth 67 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 So...I've never been a great fan of Jerry Goldsmith, but I think it's more out of a lack of familiarity than any perceived defect in his work. I'm also interested in experiencing for myself how his technique and approach differs from Williams. I think my lack of familiarity probably stems from the fact that he scored so many bad movies, or at least has that stigma. So I want to know--what are some of the best films that he worked on? Or films that would have been mediocre without his score? For a frame of reference, I've seen Patton and Planet of the Apes and liked them both (films and scores). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkissimo 1,974 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 See: CHINATOWN PAPILLON ALIEN UNDER FIRE CAPRICORN ONE THE ILLUSTRATED MAN A PATCH OF BLUE THE SAND PEBBLES THE BLUE MAX ISLANDS IN THE STREAM LONELY ARE THE BRAVE THE OMEN TWILIGHT'S LAST GLEAMING FIRST BLOOD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ollie 1,108 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 Prometheus gave you a good start, so without repeating his I'd recommend these next.HoosiersPoltergeistBasic InstinctGremlinsBoys From BrazilCapricorn OneThe EdgeThe MummyTotal RecallThe Wind And The Lion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indy4 155 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 My favorites are Poltergeist, The Omen and Twilight Zone: The Movie (some parts are better than others). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkissimo 1,974 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 BOYS FROM BRAZIL was pretty awful, from what I remember. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeinAR 1,953 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 See:CHINATOWNPAPILLONALIENUNDER FIRECAPRICORN ONETHE ILLUSTRATED MANA PATCH OF BLUETHE SAND PEBBLESTHE BLUE MAXISLANDS IN THE STREAMLONELY ARE THE BRAVETHE OMENTWILIGHT'S LAST GLEAMINGFIRST BLOODHe said best filmsBOYS FROM BRAZIL was pretty awful, from what I remember.It was better than some of the films you mentioned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuck 155 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 I think it's better if we post some clips of best films with great scores by JG here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-FUEvtYg0ucHere's a film that's mediocre made great by JG: This has one of the best endings ever: And another mediocre movie but a decent JG score: See:CHINATOWNPAPILLONALIENUNDER FIRECAPRICORN ONETHE ILLUSTRATED MANA PATCH OF BLUETHE SAND PEBBLESTHE BLUE MAXISLANDS IN THE STREAMLONELY ARE THE BRAVETHE OMENTWILIGHT'S LAST GLEAMINGFIRST BLOODHe said best filmsHe also said "films that would have been mediocre without his score" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt C 461 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 The ones I really enjoy watching are The Wind And the Lion and Rudy. Alien is a good movie, but Ridley Scott did a HUGE disservice to Goldsmith's score... and let's not forget the Legend debacle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuck 155 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 First Knight is another mediocre film but damn if JG didn't go all out in that: And of course, his sole Oscar winning score:http://youtu.be/nmOHzeTsBUM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romão 2,313 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 LA Confidential Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seth 67 Posted July 27, 2013 Author Share Posted July 27, 2013 Wow. That's quite a list. I've never been quite clear on what happened with Alien. I know a lot of what he wrote was dropped/rearranged, etc.,, but are there any notable portions that survived and are in the final cut? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marian Schedenig 8,834 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 One of my favourite movies and scores: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arnaud 6 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 Wow. That's quite a list. I've never been quite clear on what happened with Alien. I know a lot of what he wrote was dropped/rearranged, etc.,, but are there any notable portions that survived and are in the final cut?Everything you hear in the film is Goldsmith except the end credits (to my eternal dismay). Two or three cues were taken from an older Goldsmith score (Freud). Goldsmith also had to rewrite several cues but they are all his. Many times the music was edited and moments omitted but it's a natural process of filmmaking. Mixing wasn't too kind either as the music is sometimes (apparently) deliberately obscured by loud noises.I strongly recommend the complete two cd set of the Alien score. The music is exceptional and the liner notes very comprehensive.Who says Under Fire isn't a great film??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marian Schedenig 8,834 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 There's also a bit of Mozart's Eine kleine Nachtmusik in Alien, but that's clearly source music. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A24 4,525 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 There's also a bit of Mozart's Eine kleine Nachtmusik in Alien, but that's clearly source music.Which, IMHO, is a nod to 2001: ASO (one of several).I count 2 movies that are probably considered to be amongst the 100 best movies ever, namely, Alien and Chinatown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkissimo 1,974 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 See: CHINATOWN PAPILLON ALIEN UNDER FIRE CAPRICORN ONE THE ILLUSTRATED MAN A PATCH OF BLUE THE SAND PEBBLES THE BLUE MAX ISLANDS IN THE STREAM LONELY ARE THE BRAVE THE OMEN TWILIGHT'S LAST GLEAMING FIRST BLOODHe said best films LONELY ARE THE BRAVE is one of the greatest Westerns ever made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
karelm 2,976 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 Wow. That's quite a list. I've never been quite clear on what happened with Alien. I know a lot of what he wrote was dropped/rearranged, etc.,, but are there any notable portions that survived and are in the final cut?Basically, what happened to JG on Alien is that they preferred the temp in many places (The Howard Hanson, his own "Sigmund Freud") and he was treated really badly by the young inexperienced director, Ridley Scott, and the sound editor - who came from an advertisement background where directors frequently "drop in" pre existing cues rather than working with skilled composers. Some of this seems harmless but will piss of composers of repute. For example, Ridley might reuse a cue intended for one scene in another place. The composer would have preferred to have the cues part of an overall arch rather than reused and secondly, the placement, the silence, the phrasing, all are very deliberate (or should be, Zimmer) so when the same cue is used in a different scene, the end result is it looks like the composer was sloppy and I find directors frequently don't understand this point and one has to discuss and dialog with them about it. I also believe he, like Alex North in 2001, didn't know about this until the film premiere. Watch the special edition documentary to fill you in...you can tell JG was still hurt decades later. I also think he had a love/hate relationship with sweeping melodies. Based on the Star Trek Motion Picture that had just come out, it seemed like there was a bit of eureka moment between Robert Wise and JG on old school melodic themes. JG tried to get fired from that film feeling he couldn't deliver but finally, he delivered big time on the Star Trek themes. In Alien, the main title originally planned was thematic in a typical theatrical way, but ultimately Ridley Scott preferred a moody, textural piece that took JG a few minutes to compose...story is in the video link above at 8:45.In my humble opinion, Ridley had a better sense of style for his unconventional film and his opening is great (better than the theme style would have been), but he didn't show the respect to his composer to communicate and get what he needed out of him. With this said, JG could be stubborn and cantankerous which didn't help his cause. Also, the sound editor has too much ego thinking his sound design and temp score surpassed the composers original score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melange 448 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 Mulan was a fun ride, and his score for it doesn't get enough recognition (imo).http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5SBWRw6QU8Omen movies have already been mentioned. Dated looking but great movies and scores.Showing my age here, below are two clever films that I still I love now, and Jerry scored.Capricorn One Logan's Runhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLviMEG_xZc Marian Schedenig 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marian Schedenig 8,834 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 Logan's Run doesn't get enough love, neither film nor score. You posted some films I'd have added myself, though from Mulan I'd have gone with the avalanche music: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vn8lwKVmvyo (It's in Greek, but we're just here for the music after all) Also, this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXifJSiiGKE (Couldn't find an actual movie scene with Goldsmith music on YouTube. I guess the film is too obscure these days, and the way it's spotted doesn't help) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not Mr. Big 4,722 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 Link. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuck 155 Posted July 27, 2013 Share Posted July 27, 2013 jerrygoldsmithonline.com listed some recommended titles for your start in the Jerry Goldsmith experience:http://www.jerrygoldsmithonline.com/essential_goldsmith_soundtracks.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Train Station 8,499 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 SupergirlKing Solomon's MinesWarlockRunawayLinkThe HauntingStar Trek V: The Final FrontierCongoRent-A-CopBaby: Secret of the Lost LegendInchonPlayersThe Swarm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,364 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Funny! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filmmusic 2,140 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 according to imdb, here's his best films with rating from 8 and up: (8.50) - Alien (1979) (8.40) - Chinatown (1974) (8.40) - L.A. Confidential (1997) (8.17) - "The Waltons: The Homecoming: A Christmas Story (#1.0)" (1971) (8.00) - Planet of the Apes (1968) (8.00) - Patton (1970) (8.00) - Papillon (1973)still haven't seen Patton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,364 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 The Waltons???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filmmusic 2,140 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Yeah. It's the pilot movie for a series.I really loved it, and want it to be a Christmas tradition to watch.it's very warm.If you like classic Disney family films you'll love this too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,364 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Its not a true film! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filmmusic 2,140 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Its not a true film!well, ok. delete it then from the list above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuck 155 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 According to Rotten Tomatoes, JG's highest rated films are: 1990 68% Gremlins 2: The New Batch1965 40% In Harm's Way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,364 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 LOL"Did she say there were rats? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marian Schedenig 8,834 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuck 155 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Come to think of it, those two films contain cameos by JG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marian Schedenig 8,834 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Interestingly, the first Gremlins does too, but you didn't list that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chuck 155 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 I just copied that from rottentomatoes.comAnyway, @GWU08, if you're interested in how JG approach film composing here's a good clip: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arnaud 6 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Did anybody mention Innerspace?Great fun film and marvelous score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
russds 8 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 I like Rudy, the twilight zone, air force, and gremlins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melange 448 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 Logan's Run doesn't get enough love, neither film nor score.Agreed, but I can understand why the young would be turned off due to how profoundly dated it is both in visuals and sound.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXifJSiiGKEI nearly put Coma on my post yesterday, but was doubtfull if younger folks on the board will even have heard of the movie.Its minimalism certainly worked very effectively in the film to compliment the stark, clinical creepiness of its atmosphere.Coma tends to make me think of Magic, a similar score that worked equally well for the subtle creepiness in the movie..........Not many clips left on YouTube anymore, but some sections from this available track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marian Schedenig 8,834 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 I nearly put Coma on my post yesterday, but was doubtfull if younger folks on the board will even have heard of the movie. Apparently there's been a brand new 2 part TV adaptation of the novel just a few years ago. Cast looks cool, but the IMDb ratings are mediocre. I have to pick up the 78 version on Blu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MSM 126 Posted July 28, 2013 Share Posted July 28, 2013 1) Congo2) The Mummy3) The Ghost and the Darkness4) The 13th Warrior5) Supergirlalthough some might have been pretty cool even without a JW score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharkissimo 1,974 Posted July 29, 2013 Share Posted July 29, 2013 ^ Real masterpieces there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arnaud 6 Posted July 29, 2013 Share Posted July 29, 2013 I will dare add Star Trek - The Motion Picture to the list of great films scored by JG or made better by JG's score.I remember seeing this on a big screen and that was a total light and music show. Beautiful to look at and to listen to. It had its flaws but many of them have been smoothed in the Director's cut and it is still a special movie to this day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeinAR 1,953 Posted July 29, 2013 Share Posted July 29, 2013 See:CHINATOWNPAPILLONALIENUNDER FIRECAPRICORN ONETHE ILLUSTRATED MANA PATCH OF BLUETHE SAND PEBBLESTHE BLUE MAXISLANDS IN THE STREAMLONELY ARE THE BRAVETHE OMENTWILIGHT'S LAST GLEAMINGFIRST BLOODHe said best filmsLONELY ARE THE BRAVE is one of the greatest Westerns ever made.no, i beg to differ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ollie 1,108 Posted July 29, 2013 Share Posted July 29, 2013 The Wild Rovers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melange 448 Posted July 29, 2013 Share Posted July 29, 2013 Apparently there's been a brand new 2 part TV adaptation of the novel just a few years ago. ......Is this it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 38,933 Posted July 29, 2013 Share Posted July 29, 2013 Alien, LDO.Then Total Recall for me.Of course I haven't seen many many many of the films he's scored..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeinAR 1,953 Posted July 29, 2013 Share Posted July 29, 2013 I think his best film regardless of score, although it's a 5 star score, is Patton. It's just so fantastic.But I am enamored with The Blue Max, both film and score. It's when I discovered Jerry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marian Schedenig 8,834 Posted July 29, 2013 Share Posted July 29, 2013 Apparently there's been a brand new 2 part TV adaptation of the novel just a few years ago. ...... Is this it? Yes. Dreyfuss and Woods make me want to see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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