JacksonElmore 69 Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 Was listening to the tintin score, more specifically "introducing the thompsons and snowy chase" and heard a little string theme that is used in "the falcon" from the force awakens. In case the time-stamp link doesn't work, the motif is heard at 2:32 in the tintin track and at 1:48 in the star wars track. here are the links. Tintin Star Wars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay 37,364 Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 Turned your links into embeds for you. In the future, just press Enter after pasting in each link and it should auto-embed - including to the specific timestamp. JacksonElmore 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loert 2,511 Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 Yeah, there are these little fragments of melody which Williams sometimes recycles over his scores. They're always a little different but have similar "roots". Here are just a few more "self-plagiarisation" examples in The Falcon: -> 1:11 & 1:29 in The Falcon Compare this track from 1:01, with 1:56 in The Falcon (pay special attention to the modulation at 1:08 in the KOTCS track and 1:59 in The Falcon) -> 1:37 in The Falcon Now... ...compare this, with 2:39 from Zam The Assassin, with 0:48 in The Whirl Through Academe, with 1:16 in The Falcon, as well as the clarinet flourish at 2:52 in The Falcon And finally, compare the ending of 1941's "Kelsow in Barstow" (from 3:23): Your browser does not support the audio element. with the ending of The Falcon (from 3:23). Ricard 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke Skywalker 1,795 Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 It's one of the modern Williams action music phrases. Ricard 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdwardHall 30 Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 I noted the similarity too. I have been a champion of "The Falcon" since day one. Williams' expertise at composing scherzos is only increasing with time. Loert 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Loert 2,511 Posted April 12, 2016 Popular Post Share Posted April 12, 2016 It always upsets me when I read people saying that tracks like this are "just noise". It takes a tremendous amount of skill, effort, and above all confidence, to write music like this; to achieve balance within the orchestra, to make all the different ideas flow together. Besides, I love the energy and excitement Williams' action tracks convey. It's the kind of music I can play over and over again, discovering something new with each listening. DarthDementous, Brónach, The Psycho Pianist and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265 Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 But there are no themes! Not like in The Asteroid Field, or Adventure On Earth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loert 2,511 Posted April 12, 2016 Share Posted April 12, 2016 Yes, there are, and even if there weren't, who cares? Music doesn't need "themes" to be good! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JacksonElmore 69 Posted April 13, 2016 Author Share Posted April 13, 2016 yeah i agree, there are themes man. Theres the rebel fanfare theme literally throughout the whole track, and theres finn's theme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricard 2,245 Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 2 hours ago, loert said: Yes, there are, and even if there weren't, who cares? Music doesn't need "themes" to be good! Exactly. But I wonder if the score's most devoted fans are willing to accept the possibility that many people don't like it so much regardless of the apparent lack of memorable themes (other than Rey's). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JacksonElmore 69 Posted April 13, 2016 Author Share Posted April 13, 2016 i accept the possibility, sure. But I think that there are at least two very memorable themes from this movie, rey's, and kylo ren's. Plus the march of the resistance, which besides rey's is by far the most popular from this soundtrack, i mean it has close to 1.3 million listens on spotify alone, and for a theme that's used only twice in the movie thats a lot. Although i agree this is not nearly the most exciting star wars score that has been released, i think it is very underrated. Whether I like it or not i can understand a casual listener not liking "the falcon" or "the rathars!" but "rey's theme" "march of the resistance" and kylo ren's main theme is enough for me to consider this a great score Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muad'Dib 1,802 Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 There's also a bit in the Falcon chase from Tintin that shows up in TFA's Falcon cue, maybe it was even done as an intentional joke on Williams' part. 2:21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrbellamy 6,287 Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 While we're at it, I still laugh whenever I hear the little "Duel of the Fates"-sounding figures at both 2:28 and 2:38. You gotta wonder about some of these things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominicCobb 194 Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 1 hour ago, mrbellamy said: While we're at it, I still laugh whenever I hear the little "Duel of the Fates"-sounding figures at both 2:28 and 2:38. You gotta wonder about some of these things. What about at 1:12 here? This track also features a "The Droid Battle" quote at :34 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crumbs 14,317 Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 It's amazing how on first listen to my ears, TFA didn't seem to cut the mustard as a Star Wars score. Yet having lived with it for 4 months, it feels just as at home with the other 6 films as any other SW score. The only reason I probably still rate ROTS above TFA is because Williams' wrote Abrams a sublime supporting score, whereas his score for ROTS does basically all the heavy lifting (because Lucas sure as hell couldn't convey much with his direction). The total lack of subtlety is part of what makes the prequel scores so enjoyable, but I probably appreciate his writing for TFA more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrbellamy 6,287 Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 I've definitely grown to appreciate the whole vibe of TFA's music. I always basically expected something like Phantom Menace, another attempt to really bring back the Star Wars franchise in high style with fanfares and rousing action and emotional sweep, but the effect of this is more muted than the other six. It's Star Wars at its most sensitive, it seems like Williams was responding to the sense of hesitation and conflict and mixed feelings of the story and characters, as well as the restraint in the action and the sense of scope, at least relative to the prequels, and felt like he couldn't justify bringing out as many of the bells and whistles as before. Our buddy Cantus in the other thread I think mentioned that this score sounds like a "tamed" Williams. In a sense, maybe it's true. I adore its softer and magical qualities, but honestly there are moments that I do struggle with, like the big statement of Rey's Theme in The Abduction: Maybe it's the mix, the brass sounding so far away, but it's like the orchestration of Rey's Theme doesn't really live up to the power and volume of that build. The strings sound beautiful playing the melody but it's like the whole thing sort of backs off, the accompaniment sounds low energy to me and lacks the sort of rhythmic drive that tends to come with those big Williams statements. It's one of those bits where I sympathize with the criticism that the score sounds weaker than the others....am I missing something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Psycho Pianist 216 Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 25 minutes ago, mrbellamy said: I've definitely grown to appreciate the whole vibe of TFA's music. I always basically expected something like Phantom Menace, another attempt to really bring back the Star Wars franchise in high style with fanfares and rousing action and emotional sweep, but the effect of this is more muted than the other six. It's Star Wars at its most sensitive, it seems like Williams was responding to the sense of hesitation and conflict and mixed feelings of the story and characters, as well as the restraint in the action and the sense of scope, at least relative to the prequels, and felt like he couldn't justify bringing out as many of the bells and whistles as before. Our buddy Cantus in the other thread I think mentioned that this score sounds like a "tamed" Williams. In a sense, maybe it's true. I adore its softer and magical qualities, but honestly there are moments that I do struggle with, like the big statement of Rey's Theme in The Abduction: Maybe it's the mix, the brass sounding so far away, but it's like the orchestration of Rey's Theme doesn't really live up to the power and volume of that build. The strings sound beautiful playing the melody but it's like the whole thing sort of backs off, the accompaniment sounds low energy to me and lacks the sort of rhythmic drive that tends to come with those big Williams statements. It's one of those bits where I sympathize with the criticism that the score sounds weaker than the others....am I missing something? I think it was more for effect - if you compare the orchestration of the string instatement of Rey's Theme in the actual Rey's Theme track (1:40); there is much more overt rhythm and energy, and indeed pleasing harmony. In The Abduction for example, the horns play very deliberate accented dissonant chords whereas in Rey's Theme horns 1+2 double the melody whereas 3+4 play supporting, rhythmic harmony. Also there's a lack of a sense of movement as the semiquaver trumpet and viola accompaniments found in Rey's Theme aren't present either. It reflects more the mood of the film at that moment in my eyes, it's quite clever. Loert 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not Mr. Big 4,639 Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 2 hours ago, mrbellamy said: I adore its softer and magical qualities, but honestly there are moments that I do struggle with, like the big statement of Rey's Theme in The Abduction: Maybe it's the mix, the brass sounding so far away, but it's like the orchestration of Rey's Theme doesn't really live up to the power and volume of that build. The strings sound beautiful playing the melody but it's like the whole thing sort of backs off, the accompaniment sounds low energy to me and lacks the sort of rhythmic drive that tends to come with those big Williams statements. It's one of those bits where I sympathize with the criticism that the score sounds weaker than the others....am I missing something? Really? That's one of my favorite moments of the score! The bits where I tend to sympathize with the detractors are with some of the more boring underscore sections like "Maz's Counsel" and the relatively nondescript action music of "On the Inside" and "The Rathtars". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrbellamy 6,287 Posted April 13, 2016 Share Posted April 13, 2016 I think it's great in the film, the melody really soars over the battlefield, love the rhythmic alteration too. Just something about the supporting material holds it back for me when I listen, I always feel like I want more from it. There's a lack of urgency or something, like in the descending line at 1:47. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheUlyssesian 2,478 Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 Also this just reminds me that Tintin is probably a superior score to TFA. The themes are a bit more difficult to grasp but the work as a whole is more complex and denser and more spirited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrbellamy 6,287 Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 I think I do enjoy the action/adventure stuff a little more in Tintin than TFA, but the latter's emotional highlights make it no contest for me. There's nothing in Tintin as fabulous as The Scavenger, Rey's Theme, Farewell & The Trip, or The Jedi Steps & Finale. Not Mr. Big and JacksonElmore 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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