The Doctor Who Thread.....

[John Crichton 4]

Probably not, Gold doesn't write the music for Sarah Jane.

Speaking of, I really hope we get a CD release for the final specials, especially as it's probably going to be Gold's last Who scores. What a job he's done.

[Docteur Qui 1,544]

Absolutely, I can't wait to hear what he comes up with for what's shaping up to be an incredibly epic finale. Something loud and bombastic no doubt, and let's hope Melanie Pappenheim gets in for some action too!

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Well, Gold's music is usually loud and bombastic.

Is he doing season 5?

[John Crichton 4]

Not according to last reports, which admittedly were a while ago. There's been no word about who might replace him either.

[Greg1138 3]

I'm a little troubled by the announcement of the airdate for Waters of Mars......the powers that be mucked around with Who's broadcast night back in th 80's, and arguably all the mucking around helped kill off Who.....I know this is only a one-off, but I hope it is not a sign of things to come......

Settling down to watch The Wedding of Sarah Jane tonight.....looking forward to it!!

I don't think Murray Gold's departure from the series has been officially announced (though I may be wrong....I remember something somewhere......), but my understanding is that the Xmas 2-parter is his swansong too.....here's hoping for a classic!

[Wycket 36]

Probably not, Gold doesn't write the music for Sarah Jane.

Speaking of, I really hope we get a CD release for the final specials, especially as it's probably going to be Gold's last Who scores. What a job he's done.

I was just hypothesizing that perhaps he wrote a specific piece to fit just with his journey to the end. Mere speculation and most likely false, but as Stefan said, it did fit his style.

[John Crichton 4]

It's possible, we'll see. And I had forgotten that Sarah Jane was actually recorded after all the specials were done, so in one way we've already seen Tennant's last performance as the Doctor. At least until his return in the 7/8/9/10/whatever Doctors to celebrate the 50th anniversary in 2013.

In some classic series news- nothing has been said officially, but comments have been made at multiple conventions that, following the success of a new colorization technique to restore episode 3 of Planet of the Daleks to color, the entire Pertwee story The Mind of Evil has been successfully recolorized for DVD release.

[Greg1138 3]

In some classic series news- nothing has been said officially, but comments have been made at multiple conventions that, following the success of a new colorization technique to restore episode 3 of Planet of the Daleks to color, the entire Pertwee story The Mind of Evil has been successfully recolorized for DVD release.

I have yet to own a Pertwee story on DVD, but if this turns out to be true then this may well be the first

And Invasion of the Dinosaurs will be the second

[Docteur Qui 1,544]

Well, we have another

for "Waters of Mars". It's shaping up to be a real corker. I'm really very excited to finally get some new Who happening on telly!! A bit over a week now! Den of Geek have also briefly commented on the episode which they've seen, calling it one of the best since the show's revival in 2005. Well then, isn't that encouraging!

[John Crichton 4]

Maybe the long delay is helping, but I've been managing not to watch any of the trailers or clips that have surfaced. I'll be going into this fresh, which is more than I can say about the finale considering all the set reports I've read!

[Naïve Old Fart 9,533]

Well, Gold's music is usually loud and bombastic.

Is he doing season 5?

I bloody hope not! By the way, it's season 31!

[Wycket 36]

Well, Gold's music is usually loud and bombastic.

Is he doing season 5?

I bloody hope not! By the way, it's season 31!

No, its Season 5, as the new series is a break from the old one. Technically, they were saying that this was going to be called Season 1 again as if it were once again a new series, though I haven't heard anything about that in a while.

[John Crichton 4]

The clapperboards used during filming have actually said Series 1. I'll still call it Series 5 though.

Strangely enough, I never identify the classic series by season/series #, I always identify it by the number of seasons for whichever actor is playing the Doctor (ex. Troughton's second year, Tom Baker's fourth, etc.).

[Naïve Old Fart 9,533]

IT'S SEASON 31, AND DON'T LET ANYONE TELL YOU ANY DIFFERENT!

[pixie_twinkle 48]

It's season 34! I count each Cushing movie and McGann's episode as seasons in their own right

[John Crichton 4]

The Cushing movies aren't canon, and I'll have words with anyone who thinks otherwise!

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

How are these movies regarded? Despite them not being canon.

[John Crichton 4]

The Daleks come across very well, not surprising considering the movies were made at the height of "Dalekmania" and they were the real stars. The rest is pretty meh. Personally I think you're better off with the Hartnell stories they're based on, despite the great difference in production value.

[pixie_twinkle 48]

What John said.

[Charlie Brigden 7]

The double act of Cushing and Cribbins is a knock out.

Saw the trailer for Waters of Mars. It looks pretty good, but also pretty silly, which is how Doctor Who mostly has been to me, so I will tune in.

[Naïve Old Fart 9,533]

It's season 34! I count each Cushing movie and McGann's episode as seasons in their own right

Actually it is season 631, because I count all the Big Finish stuff, "D.I.T" "...Fatal Death" the books, the records, the board games, and the chocolate wrappers!!!

[John Crichton 4]

You forgot the comics.

[Naïve Old Fart 9,533]

You forgot the comics.

Smart arse.

[pixie_twinkle 48]

Actually I fondly remember some of the 3rd/4th Doctor comics from when I was a wee bairn. There was a wonderful 4th Doctor story called "Death Flower" in TV Comic, and a great 3rd Doctor story called "Labyrinth" or something like that. I'd love to see those again after all these years. Does anyone here have them? I remember Death Flower being frighteningly close to the story of Seeds of Doom, which didn't appear on TV until a few months later.

[John Crichton 4]

I know a lot of the recent DVDs have had features about the comics. "Stripped for Action" they're called.

[John Crichton 4]

I haven't seen enough evidence to say this is definite yet, but there are strong rumors from recent location shooting that we're going to see another classic series race return in the new series:

the Silurians

[Docteur Qui 1,544]

Anyone catch the lastest Sarah Jane? Another great, solid outing. These characters just keep getting stronger. There was another case of temp track-itis though, following the Giacchino/LOST rip off a few weeks ago. This time it was Williams himself, and the Skull theme from Indy 4.

[Greg1138 3]

My carefully considered review of Waters of Mars:

F**k Me!!!!!

[John Crichton 4]

Man, I can't wait. Gonna watch it when I get home from work tonight. Even found a site that shows you how to get past the iPlayer's UK-only limitation, or if that doesn't work it should be in the usual place.

[Greg1138 3]

It's a slow burner for the first half hour, but then fasten your seatbelts please ladies and gentlemen...and the closing 5 minutes are....superb.

[Wycket 36]

Well, I'm going to bid this thread adieu for a while as I keep hearing "Waters of Mars" was good and don't want to be spoiled until it airs in the US on December 19. Apparently though if the commercial I saw during Torchwood last night was accurate, we'll be getting all 3 specials in December along with the Brits.

All I have to say is it's about time.

[John Crichton 4]

Holy. Crap. Tennent wasn't kidding when he said that we'd see a side of the Doctor we'd never seen before. Great, great story all around. It didn't have quite as much lead in to the final story as I'd expected, but that's a very minor quibble. And thankfully now it's a much shorter wait to the end of the glorious Russell T. Davies/David Tennent era, Who's second Golden Age if I may say so.

And Murray Gold was on form too, great score as usual. I really hope there's a CD release.

[Greg1138 3]

Well - just saw the opening of The End Of Time on Children in Need.....it would be safe to say that it gives away - well - very little! Ood (no spoilers there), something amiss with aworld we have visited before, and a dream sequence around a fire where we see - ahem - "someone" laughing! And that was it....Russell and the gang keeping things very, very close to their chest.

[John Crichton 4]

Actually that clip is scene 3 or 4, RTD didn't want to put out the actual opening because it gave away too much. Or "was too plot heavy" in his words, but we know what that means.

The official title for Christmas is The End of Time, Part 1, making this the first story since the show's revival to actually have part 1 and part 2 in the title. Part 2 is still expected for New Year's Day or thereabouts. And Series 5 (or whatever ) is being rumored for a late January or February start, with a split season.

[Docteur Qui 1,544]

I don't know about you, but I read into what the Ood were chanting before the Doctor came in like this: (big, big spoiler warning if I'm anywhere close to the mark)

Returning, returning, it is slowly returning, through the dark and the fire and the blood, always returning, returning to this world. Gallifrey is returning, from beyond time, beyond the Time War.

He is returning. The Master

And they are returning.The Time Lords

Too late. Too Late. Far too late. He has come.The Master is already here.

[John Crichton 4]

I've been saying that for months!

[Docteur Qui 1,544]

Haha, I know, that's why I thought of it so quickly. If that is the case... This will be one epic finale!

[John Crichton 4]

I think in large part it's

RTD hitting the reset button a bit for Moffatt. The "last of the Time Lords" deal was always RTD's thing, Moffatt probably wants to do something different, and a bit more traditional.

[Docteur Qui 1,544]

Absolutely, i agree, and it's a great way to do it. I'm glad he's doing it now and not halfway through the current series as he created a truly interesting and unique story arc for the 9th and (particularly) 10th Doctors and would have cheapened the impact of their stories somewhat.

[John Crichton 4]

Well with the focus rightly still on the 10th Doctor/RTD finale, we're finally getting some concrete news about the structure of the first 11th Doctor/Moffatt series. Intrepid reporter Scooty has compiled a rumored episode list, with titles, writers, and basic descriptions. Everything fits with what we've been hearing during location filming:

Episode 01: The Eleventh Hour. Writer Steven Moffat.

Episode 02: Title TBC. Writer Steven Moffat.

Episode 03: Title TBC. Writer Mark Gatiss (Daleks & Churchill).

Episode 04: Time of Angels. Writer Steven Moffat (Weeping Angels, River Song, part 1/2).

Episode 05: Flesh & Stone. Writer Steven Moffat (Weeping Angels, River Song, part 2/2).

Episode 06: Vampires of Venice. Writer Toby Whithouse.

Episode 07: Title & Writer TBC.

Episode 08: Title TBC. Writer Chris Chibnall (Silurians part 1/2).

Episode 09: Cold Blood. Writer Chris Chibnall (Silurians, part 2/2).

Episode 10: Vincent & The Doctor. Writer Richard Curtis (Van Gogh).

Episode 11: Title & Writer TBC.

Episode 12/13: Titles TBC. Writer Steven Moffat.

Episode 14: (Xmas 2010) Title & Writer TBC (Assuming there is a xmas episode).

That's a lot of familiar writers coming back. Mark Gatiss is the true Renaissance Man of Who: writer of The Unquiet Dead and The Idiot's Lantern, guest star villan in The Lazarus Experiment, and has dipped his hand into many, many Who related comedy bits over the years. Toby Whithouse was the writer of School Reuinion, and Chris Chibnall previously wrote 42.

[pixie_twinkle 48]

Great news that Mark Gatiss is contributing another episode. Idiot's Lantern may not be on any favourite episodes lists, but I think The Unquiet Dead is a real highlight of the new series. (sorry, not sure how to make spoiler text)

No one's said anything about the new K9 series yet. I believe the pilot episode has already aired somewhere in the world. Has anyone seen it? Any good?

[John Crichton 4]

Yeah, the K9 series is being made in Australia. Haven't heard too much about it, I'm not much interested in it honestly. I'm happy K9's been able to become a regular on Sarah Jane again.

The new series is currently filming in the new European hotbed of filmmaking: Croatia. The spy photos show this is a period piece, I'm thinking

Vampires of Venice

from the ep list.

Lots of confirmations on The End of Time too: both parts will air at 7:30, Christmas Day and New Year's Day respecively. Part one is just under 60 minutes, while part two is a whopping 72+ minutes long.

[Wycket 36]

Adding to the End of Time news, BBC America will be airing part 1 on December 26, so I'd imagine that part 2 will be on January 2.

At last, we don't have to wait to watch the Doctor.

[Docteur Qui 1,544]

So, it's only 4 more days until part one of The End of Time. I'm incredibly excited, especially after reading the spoiler-free review over at Den of Geek. Russell T Davies' stint as showrunner has been shaky, but generally the quality has been outstanding (if not awfully fan-wankish). And David Tennant's run has been... Nothing short of brilliant. So as we come to the end of the era, are there any thoughts, speculations or hopes about the finale that the other Who fans on this board have?

[John Crichton 4]

Shaky?

[Docteur Qui 1,544]

Oh look, it's the Daleks. Oh not to worry, they're all gone now. Except they're not. Yes they are. Yep. Oh no, there's Davros and another army of Dale.... They're all gone? All of them? Again?

Despite how exciting a lot of those episodes were, I got a bit tired of the constant "threat" of the Daleks when they really have become a lot less scary than they used to be. Maybe this is the Joss Whedon fan in me, but don't tell us how bad they are, SHOW us - kill off a main character (who doesn't then come back to life and go do his own spin-off). Doctor Who can still be scary - just look at "Blink" or "The Empty Child".

I loved "Journey's End", it was very epic. But it did seem that a lot was packed in too little time; the return of all the beloved characters since the revival didn't really resonate with me as there were too many of them and not enough screen time to share. Then there's the computer controls that happen to set off a chain reaction that destroys all of Davros' new Empire (or did it?) which are conveniently located in Davros' basement which doubles as a prison. It just seems at times (particularly in the finales) that when Russell writes an event episode the setup is far too big for a satisfying conclusion - like he puts all of his effort into a fantastic, intelligent premise/cliffhanger, only for some technobabble and questionable deus ex machina to come in and save the day.

There also seems to be an uncanny amount of incidents that plague Earth. I understand the Earth episodes rate better, but out of 58 episodes aired since the show came back, 37 are set on Earth; past, present or future. That's not even including the New Earth, Satellite 5 and parallel Earth eps or ones that are set in various locations with Earth a major focus ("Girl in the Fireplace", "Planet of the Dead", "Voyage of the Damned", "Waters of Mars" etc). I guess it becomes less of a family adventure show and more sci-fi when true alien worlds and species are involved, but really, the man can travel to any point in the space-time continuum of the current universe, and all we see is bloody Earth or humans!

Anyways, that's what I find "shaky". I'd need several pages more to go through why I love the current series however, and I simply don't have the time!

[Richard Penna 3,690]

I've definitely found several of RTD's finales a bit woolly. The 'turning back time' element at the end of season 3 was eye-rolling for me - was there no other way he could have resolved the already not too brilliant storyline?

I'll compare two episodes here - The Next Doctor and The Waters of Mars. The former had huge hype about whether David Morrissey was indeed the next doctor, and for me, that's what stole the show. Some crappy plot about a giant cyberman (with some really crap sfx IMO) just didn't do it for me - I felt very unsatisfied with that episode.

Whereas the latter had a very interesting psychological tool, a genuine plot and a fantastic dilemma for the doctor in the same vein as The Fires of Pompei.

Seems that Davies either gets lazy, or just gets himself into situations where things have gone so epically wrong with the world that there's no sensible and logical way to bring it back to normal. Answer? There's a big button somewhere that can be rewired to save the world.... zzzzZZZZ.

[Charlie Brigden 7]

I just think he's not that great a writer. The truly great episodes I've seen of the show have usually been written by someone else. And the finales were generally terrible, and almost seemed to be going for the big emotional Hollywood ending types (like the one with the master and everyone on Earth saves the Doctor - wretched stuff), which is the antithesis of Who for me.

Still, more Daleks please!

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

The biggest problem with RTD that he too often depends on his audience going along with a rather contrived plot element, or resolution.

He has a penchant for big, almost epic finales that dramatically leave something to be desire.

He does know how to write for characters though. Rose and Donna had very moving departures from the series. Much more interesting then his sudden plot twists, duex ex machina or slightly gay camp.

On the whole though one of the biggest problems with these 4 series he produced is that they sometimes make horrible use of the concept of time travel and temporal logic.

[John Crichton 4]

RTD writes big, and I don't see anything wrong with that. I haven't had the problems with the finales that you guys have, they've invariably been among my favorites. As Steef said he writes for character extrememly well, which always gives the show a strong heart and foundation that allows you to just go with everything else that's happening. Personally I thought Davros had a bit of a lost opportunity for more character moments (the reality bomb revelation for example was a perfect chance to reference his famous "break the vial" speech from Genesis), but that's a quibble.

As for all the Earth based episodes, two main reasons: budget and audience connection. Like the new Star Trek, I think RTD was really trying to bring in new Who viewers, and he succeeded.

And I agree with Rich about The Next Doctor, that was the weakest RTD written ep. Once the mystery of Morrisey's "Doctor" was unravled (not that I ever thought he WAS the Doctor), the rest is a bunch of weak runaround.