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SPOILER TALK - The Last Jedi (open spoilers allowed!!!)

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In this thread you can openly discuss The Last Jedi with no spoiler blocks at all, but here in the early days before wide release it's ok if you want to block certain things.

 

 

 

 

LAST WARNING!!!

 

 

SPOILERS ALLOWED BEYOND THIS POINT!!!

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5 minutes ago, El Jefe said:

 

 

Crap, that means the other rumor is probably true and it will ruin the film for me.

Yes 

Spoiler

Luke “dies” too and the bullshit transport projecting thing is true

 

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Spoiler

 

Snoke dies, though his death sets up an interesting moment for Kylo and Rey.

 

The force projection thing is a little weird, but yes Luke does die.  

 

Rey and Kylo end up being reaffirmed of their paths, there’s no flip flopping.

 

I do wonder if Kylo’s remarks on Rey’s parents were a manipulation or if they were true.  That being said, if it’s true that her parents are no one then I’m happy about it.  I’m good with having an outsider.

 

 

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3 minutes ago, Joe Brausam said:
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Alright, than. It sure delivers in terms of not being expected.

 

I wonder how it will all play out in retrospect after we see episode IX.

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Spoiler

 

Han

Luke (half-ish)

Leia (won't appear anymore)

Snoke

 

 

 

Who's next?  I mean if they are world building for the next 30 years... there's almost no ground left of any of the original 6 movies or even TFA.  

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8 minutes ago, ymenard said:
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Since the next movie will obviously be ahead in time and they have no material left of her, she will not appear on screen anymore. She's dead in terms of character building or future potential story-wise

 

 

Spoiler

Is her character given a fitting farewell in the film? Like a final inspiring speech, a heroic act in the midst of battle, something like that?

 

Also, about Snoke... how does he die?

 

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Spoiler

Leia is alive and well at the end of the film

But I get the feeling that episode 9 will feature a jump forward in the timeline, I wouldn't't be surprised to see a 5-10 year jump in the timeline honestly.  Just based on how the film ended it makes sense to me to see a lot of time pass.

Spoiler

 And the passage of time can cleanly solve the issue of her death.

 

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Why are people using spoiler tags in this thread?

 

Open spoilers allowed = no need for spoiler tags.

 

Anyway, the film is a resounding meh for me. Will post my thoughts later, but right now, I'll say this: the very end of the film is absolutely cringeworthy. Absolutely dreadful. Felt like one of those TV ads selling lightsaber toys for kids. Ugh.

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21 hours ago, Joe Brausam said:

But I get the feeling that episode 9 will feature a jump forward in the timeline, I wouldn't't be surprised to see a 5-10 year jump in the timeline honestly.  Just based on how the film ended it makes sense to me to see a lot of time pass.

 

I dunno about 5-10 years, but there was always going to be a time gap between those films. You can't make two films in a trilogy end in an unresolved manner. Its too much. The other one has to have at least a temporary sense of closure and the final one tends to get bogged down in trying to wrap everything up.

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i posted mine days ago elsewhere...

 

Here's my spoiler-filled bullet-pointed reviewed:

Luke dying is complete bullshit.  It's not explained.  You have no idea it's coming.  And he deserved far more, as a character.  

We didn't need the burp.

BB-H8 was pointless.

I don't get why DJ had that stutter. It wasn't necessary...nor consistent.

Not enough Chewie.

I don't remember anyone saying "I've got a really bad feeling about this."

We needed more BB8.

Holdo says "godspeed," I believe.  Who the Hell is God?

Not enough lightsaber battles.  The battle at the end of TFA was easily twice as long as the single one in this movie.

Not enough space battles.  

I still don't get why the republic ship was just sitting there forever.

Porgs are not nearly as annoying as you think they're going to be.  They're pretty irrelevant and, honestly, didn't need to be in the movie at all...and neither did the women who clean the temple.

The humor.   There's a lot of it.  It was far too campy for a SW movie.  Luke throwing the lightsaber behind him was funny...but i don't think it's going to hold up on multiple watches.

Again, don't think this movie will hold up like TFA does.  That one is very much a rocket-ship. I LOVED the pairings of Finn/Poe, Finn/Rey....etc.

Rose.  Dear God...Rose.  Go away.  No one cares about you.  The kiss is awkward and comes out of nowhere.  

I'd love to hear about how TFA haters love this one...with lines of dialogue lifted right out of Jedi and Empire.

Why was the Emperor's theme played during Snoke torturing Rey?  Just cuz he was saying almost the same dialogue?

I was going to be extremely pissed if the movie ended with the big Falcon party when Luke just died.  Fortunately it didn't and ended on something far more poignant. However....that's still sticking with me.  Zero emotional weight.  Luke deserves FAR, FAR better.

JW reused several pieces of music.  I was actually surprised at how much repetition there was.

Phasma dies like a chump.  She's the Darth Maul of this trilogy.  Deserved much, much better.  Looked VERY cool.  Did VERY little.

That's it for now.  I'll add more if I think of more.  I'll be seeing it again on Thursday and I'll add my thoughts.

That said, DO NOT expect massive spoilers.  There is no "I am your father" moment.  There are just some cool "ooh I need to see that" moments.  Nothing earth shattering is revealed.

That's why i said...temper your expectations.

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Overall it was very good, too long. and partly because of that length the film lacks a certain focus. Though it might also be inherent to the plot.

 

TFA was essentially a modern remake of Star Wars (1977), almost beat for beat at times. TLJ resembles TESB in that it's essentially a chase film, with the First Order trying to hunt down and destroy the resistance. Meanwhile the young Jedi hopeful meets an old Jedi Master to receive training.

 

And yes it's not quite that simple. The Last Jedi's greatest asset is that it manages to add depth to not only the characters, but the philosophy of the Jedi and the Force. It has things to say about rebellion, and hope. 

 

Mark Hamill returns as Luke, and he actually gives a very good performance. Ranging from guilt and regret, to fan service badass. (there's a lot of fan service and visual references to both the OT and the prequels in this film)

 

Fisher is better in this overall than she was in TFA. Though for the middle part she's more or less replaced by a far far better actress. (Laura Dern). Leia get's blown into space in this one, but uses the Force to survive. In retropect Dern's character's end might have worked for Leia. 

 

Daisey Ridley once again shines as Rey. Both in her interactions with Luke and with Kylo Ren. The film does lose her character at one point. There's a lot of balls that it ahs to keep in the air.

Finn basically got a sidequest, and a love interest. This part of the film is probably what should have got cut down. Though I think I understand what Johnson was trying to do here. 

Basically it concerns Finn's change from a former Stormtrooper on the run to a true rebel. It also shows that the decadence that existed during the days of the Old Republic continues, just without the politics.

 

Johnson does something similar with Poe Dameron, who shifts from being a gung-ho hero to a potential leader of the Resistance and the New New Republic. There's actual character development in this film for all the "new" leads. And it tries to go a bit deeper than simple good versus evil. Johnson is apparently a defender of the Prequels. Judging from this film, I believe that. His attempts to add shades of grey mirrors what Lucas did with those films, he just manages to make it more entertaining.

 

Because this film looks and feels huge and epic. From the opening attack to the scene of Luke Skywalker facing the First Order ground army all by himself. The special effects are stupendous, and Johnson has a far strong visual flair that JJ has. 

 

I wonder how much Johnson really liked TFA? It was his job to follow up on what JJ and Kasdan had written, but he doesnt seem to feel bound or restrained to that.

I like that Snoke is killed off here, and Phasma, and I loved that Rey's parents are in fact....nobodies. Who her parents were became a huge "internet hype" almost straight away. Was Luke her father, or Han? Was Leia her mother? 

 

Thankfully they didnt go that route. 

 

The score was awesome, and mixed quite loudly. There seems to be some tracking of music from TFA, especially in the first part of the film. Or Williams rather bluntly restated everyone's theme. I noticed a couple of nice new ones too. I need this CD! 

Lots of themes from the OT are stated too. The Rebel Fanfare once again, The Emperor's Theme, Yoda's theme (yes, Yoda is in this movie), The Imperial March, Luke & Leia, Han Solo & The Princess and of course Leia's Theme (which get's a moving piano rendition during Fisher's dedication credit)

 

Luke dies, btw.

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4 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

 

With the slowest, most boring ass chase sequence put on film!

 

Even though I agree with some of your points, you are too kind on the film!

 

 

Fuck you!

 

Can someone please explain to me why the First Order just let that one ship just sit there?  What was the point?  I feel like I missed something. 

 

Why didn't they board it?  Blow it up? 

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Just now, Stefancos said:

Because it has a Star Trek like shield protecting it. I think it might be the first time we have seen a bubble shield on a ship in Star Wars.

 

Like many things in this movie...my only reaction is..."oh."

 

So ships can fly out of it but not into it?  I'm not sure what the laws are about this type of thing.

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1 minute ago, BloodBoal said:

 

The whole concept of that subplot with the Resistance being chased from a distance by the First Order was really weak.

 

And it took forever for Holdo to decide to sacrifice herself (after more than half the ships trying to reach the planet had been destroyed). The whole sequence was drawn out to the extreme... It was one of the moments of the film where I thought: "Shit, there's still the battle of Crait after that? How long is this movie? 2 hours and 30 minutes long or 4 hours long?"

 

I'm really just trying to get a hold on it.  As someone who has a hard time concentrating, the first time through can be an overwhelming experience and I miss details.  I feel like I missed that this time through.  Like....WTF are we waiting around for?

 

And, again, not a single walker is taken down.  The show up...but do nothing. And the big cannon?  A threat that's never used.  The Crait battle is just....blue balls.  Nothing happens.  And then the ensuing battle with Kylo and Luke isn't even real.  It reminded me of Superman 2.  And then Luke dies with absolutely no explanation.

 

I just feel so incredibly manipulated for much of the film and that not only offends me but upsets me. 

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Yoda died with no explanation, what's your problem?

 

It's very obvious Luke would die here. It's basically what the film is about. Out with the old, in with the new.

 

Kylo Ren kills Snoke, a Sith style Emperor. Yoda destroys the old Jedi temple and the books.

 

 

38 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

 

Even though I agree with some of your points, you are too kind on the film.

 

I haven't give it any rating.

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5 minutes ago, Stefancos said:

Yoda died with no explanation, what's your problem?

 

It's very obvious Luke would die here. It's basically what the film is about. Out with the old, in with the new.

 

Kylo Ren kills Snoke, a Sith style Emperor. Yoda destroys the old Jedi temple and the books.

 

 

 

I haven't give it any rating.

Uhh..Yoda was 900.  There was absolutely NO reason for Luke to die.  what's YOUR problem?

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1 minute ago, Stefancos said:

Yoda dies in ROTJ without any reason or explanation given. He was 900 in TESB, why didn't he die in that film?

 

 

 

A good question.  But it was, at the very least, CLEAR that he was dying in Jedi.  That he was weak.

 

Luke dies out of nowhere.  You don't see it coming. 

 

Back off with the attitude, dude.  I don't know what your problem is but I don't appreciate your being a massive dick to me.

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7 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

 

Never said you did. My point still stands.

 

What is your point, actually?

 

I agree the whole First Order pursuit was slow and endless. That should have been done very differently.

 

Is it explained why the First Order is able to track the main Resistance ship while its at lightspeed?

 

1 minute ago, DigitalfreakNYC said:

 

Back off with the attitude, dude.  I don't know what your problem is but I don't appreciate your being a massive dick to me.

 

No offense intended at all actually. 

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4 minutes ago, Stefancos said:

Yoda dies in ROTJ without any reason or explanation given. He was 900 in TESB, why didn't he die in that film?

 

It makes sense for him to die in what is (well, was) a concluding film. This one isn't.

 

And Yoda's death is super rushed, as well. If you want to talk about a filler sequence, Jabba's palace is just that.

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Just now, Stefancos said:

What is your point, actually?

 

That you're being too kind on the film.

 

1 minute ago, Stefancos said:

Is it explained why the First Order is able to track the main Resistance ship while its at lightspeed?

 

Nope. It's just "don't ask, just accept it". Like how Maz got Luke's lightsaber somehow.

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I think reading about what's going to happen is very different from experiencing it for yourself. That being said, I can see certain things pissing a few people off.

 

As an aside, there is a track titled "The Rebellion Reborn" - does the title hold any plot significance?

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4 minutes ago, Gistech said:

I think reading about what's going to happen is very different from experiencing it for yourself. That being said, I can see certain things pissing a few people off.

 

As an aside, there is a track titled "The Rebellion Reborn" - does the title hold any plot significance?

I haven't listened yet.  I would assume that's when Luke "fights" Kylo and talks about the Rebellion beginning again.

2 minutes ago, BloodBoal said:

 

In a way, yes, I guess.

 

 

By the way, Stiff, did you notice the random Gareth Edwards cameo?

 

How could you not?  He was right in front of the camera. 

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