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Jay's Score Information Collection (John Williams Edition)

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6 hours ago, Display Name said:

Is there any spreadsheet of Harry Potter that indicates where the individual cues in combined tracks end and start?

 

I haven't made one, but I can't think of any tracks where it isn't obvious, I mean, the recording sessions leaked for 1 & 2

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As far as I understand from examples I know from way back, it's a form of insert/overlay. For example, in Last Crusade, Indy's Very First Adventure has a few its in the film where pipe organ has been overlaid on top of the orchestral music, and in the Venice chase, mandolin replaced or has been laid over a few bits - those are all sweeteners.

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47 minutes ago, Holko said:

As far as I understand from examples I know from way back, it's a form of insert/overlay. For example, in Last Crusade, Indy's Very First Adventure has a few its in the film where pipe organ has been overlaid on top of the orchestral music, and in the Venice chase, mandolin replaced or has been laid over a few bits - those are all sweeteners.

IIRC with the Venice chase, it is unknown if those Mandolins are sweeteners, or separately recorded and not included on the album mix.

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The term sweetener comes from adding sugar to coffee or tea. I recall using the term not only for music but sound effects as well.  It’s just something to enhance the flavor and call out some detail or moment. If it was in the original orchestration, then it is not a sweetener even if recorded separately. That would be just an overlay. However, the result is the same - the filmmakers wanted the sound to pop out for a story telling or emotional reason. 

 

Being recorded separately of course could be because someone wanted an addition later or just that the player was not available at the same time. 

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A sweetener is a piece of music recorded later intended to mix over an already-recorded cue, to , well, sweeten it up!  The examples posted above are, well, perfect examples!

 

And yes I know I have more scores to add to the main post and more edits to make to some existing ones posted.  I'll get to it soon.

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I haven't made one.  Hard to make them without sheet music or recording session leaks, and there isn't any yet for either SW sequel score.

 

Without that kind of resource, it's all just guesswork

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On 5/4/2019 at 3:45 AM, bollemanneke said:

Seconded. Every time someone bumps this thread, I get excited hoping for HP3. Not that I haven't worked 99% out myself, but it would be great to have your take and all the cue names.

Can I have your info on it? I have most of it figured out but I can't find "Aunt Marge Points the Finger" anywhere is the box set and I don't even know what the point of "More Grim and Boggarts" is.

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16 hours ago, Space Pineapple Prod. said:

I can't find "Aunt Marge Points the Finger" anywhere is the box set and I don't even know what the point of "More Grim and Boggarts" is.

 

Williams' original version of Aunt Marge Points the Finger is not on the LLL release; The Revised version however opens "Aunt Marge's Waltz (Alternate)" on Disc 2.

 

More Grim and Boggarts features an alternate version of "You Have the Grim", then an alternate version of "The Spider", then "Clown out the Cupboard" without the circus organ overlay.

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Clown without calliope... where? It goes into the dementor part instead, doesn't it? It certainly doesn't include those string stingers for the bobbing clown cleanly.

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Could you tell us whether the original finger cue was vetoed, not found or just deemed not important enough? At first I was rather disappointed it wasn't there, but then when I tried to think of a good place to put it in this set, I couldn't come up with anything either.

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7 hours ago, Jay said:

Williams' original version of Aunt Marge Points the Finger is not on the LLL release; The Revised version however opens "Aunt Marge's Waltz (Alternate)" on Disc 2.

 

More Grim and Boggarts features an alternate version of "You Have the Grim", an alternate version of "The Spider", then "Clown out the Cupboard" without the circus organ overlay.

Ohh. Is the film version of Aunt Marge Points the Finger in the Waltz alternate?

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15 hours ago, Holko said:

Clown without calliope... where? It goes into the dementor part instead, doesn't it? It certainly doesn't include those string stingers for the bobbing clown cleanly.

 

I don't understand your confusion.

 

Clown Out Of The Cupboard is available clean in "More Grim and Boggarts" from 0:50-end.

 

Later, a New Beginning was written and recorded, and that appears, combined/overlapped with Clown Out Of The Cupboard, in "The Boggarts" from 2:13-end.

 

 

 

15 hours ago, bollemanneke said:

Could you tell us whether the original finger cue was vetoed, not found or just deemed not important enough? 

 

I don't know.

 

 

9 hours ago, Space Pineapple Prod. said:

Ohh. Is the film version of Aunt Marge Points the Finger in the Waltz alternate?

 

Yes.... isn't that what I said?  Sorry if I worded something wrong.  The music you hear in the film when Marge points her finger is what opens the "Alternate" track on disc 2.

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Oh. The additional string stringers can still only be heard in the version with the calliope. A third separate element?

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I never said they were?  They are in the main Boggarts track, like I said.

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Oh, sorry, I understand what you are saying now.  The circus organ AND string stingers are all the same overlay, not two different overlays.

 

It's in the sheet music leak as "3M7X New Beginning"

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No one was confused.  Holko merely made the point that the string stingers must've been recorded separately, then he said it would've been cool if they had been included with the calliope-less version.  He didn't say you said they were.  I think you're the one who's confused, actually.

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From your comment it seemed like the calliope was the only difference while it obviously isn't, you haven't mentioned these stingers before.

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I mean, the sheet music leaked what, a decade ago?  It clearly shows the calliope and string parts right on it

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Sorry, that was so obvious, of course I should have known where to look and poured over sheet music I could naturally read with my perfect and not at all horribly lacking musical education.

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I can't read music either!  But you can see the instruments called for even without knowing what the notes are

 

image.png

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That's just unused source music right?  I don't think Williams titled any of the source pieces, they are just like "source 1", "source 2", "source 3" (just like The Phantom Menace).  And then Cuaron stuck them in the film where he wanted

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I have no idea what instructions Williams was given for writing the source pieces or if he was even writing them for specific locations or not *shrug*

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3 hours ago, Jay said:

Yes.... isn't that what I said?  Sorry if I worded something wrong.  The music you hear in the film when Marge points her finger is what opens the "Alternate" track on disc 2.

 

You said the revised version was there but not the original. I had no clue if the revised version or the original was what was used in the movie because sometimes the originals go in and the revised versions never get used.

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Right.  The original version is what he wrote first, what we can see in the sheet music leak, what turned up in some DVD menu, but isn't in the film nor on the LLL set.


The low rumbling version that came later is both in the film and on the LLL set.

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3 minutes ago, Jay said:

Right.  The original version is what he wrote first, what we can see in the sheet music leak, what turned up in some DVD menu, but isn't in the film nor on the LLL set.


The low rumbling version that came later is both in the film and on the LLL set.

 

Okay, that makes perfect sense. Thank you! 

Screw it, I'm making a spreadsheet. And it's gonna suck because I've never seen the sheet music and I've never made a spreadsheet before!

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On 5/9/2019 at 11:14 AM, Disco Stu said:

 

Wait, for anything??? They taught spreadsheet software in school when I was young.

 

It's been years since I learned anything about spreadsheets. I'm very bad at this.

 

EDIT: Here's the spreadsheet, terrible like I promised!

 

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1N3Vx_iwai4JvDFZIzG4U_MM0k2nKXzUJUcBlUOBBA_4/edit?usp=sharing

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@Jay, I have to admit, I don't find your Harry Potter spreadsheets particularly good. There are so many different and pointless tables and in the end they don't even include the information, where one cue ends and where another starts on the LLL set (if it's a track that combines several cues). The excellent spreadsheet that was made for the third Harry Potter film is much more complex and better structured.

Moreover you marked some OST versions as "incomplete" although they just overlapped with another cue (Moaning Myrte, The Spiders).

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8 hours ago, Display Name said:

The excellent spreadsheet that was made for the third Harry Potter film is much more complex and better structured.

Which one?

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