The Hobbit Film Trilogy Thread

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Really? they are gonna go that direction?

Lame.

[KK 3,307]

The thing is, Azog actually feels like a cheap plot device, largely because he never really accomplishes anything in the big picture. My problem with him wasn't so much about being loyal to Tolkien as it was that.

In FotR, the Lurtz was used with a similar purpose for an identifiable villain in the first film and it was incredibly effective. We never lost sight of the main goal, and plot wise it worked quite well. Azog on the other end just rambled on gibberish for most of the film. The exposition required to explain the character slowed down the pace of the film and he simply wasn't nearly as frightening as Lurtz was (probably because of the CGI).

[Jay 37,372]

I assume you mean effective, not defective

[KK 3,307]

Yes. Thank autocorrect.

[Incanus 5,715]

The thing is, Azog actually feels like a cheap plot device, largely because he never really accomplishes anything in the big picture. My problem with him wasn't so much about being loyal to Tolkien as it was that.

In FotR, the Lurtz was used with a similar purpose for an identifiable villain in the first film and it was incredibly effective. We never lost sight of the main goal, and plot wise it worked quite well. Azog on the other end just rambled on gibberish for most of the film. The exposition required to explain the character slowed down the pace of the film and he simply wasn't nearly as frightening as Lurtz was (probably because of the CGI).

I agree that a certain threat or driving force was needed in the first film, which is like a road movie where the Dwarven company stumbles on to different dangers. It provides a tangible need to move on, suspence and an antagonist element. There were scenes where PJ failed with the use the enemy to good extent. The Warg chase is a good example: Thorin has a tantrum like a 5-year old about not wanting to enter Rivendell and after a wee bit of running in circles the Wargs drive them there none the less. Extremely contrived.

On the other hand the final scene in the burning forest works quite well as it obviates the need for the audience to believe that the Goblin warband and a pack of Wargs just happen to meet in the same clearing where the company ends up after their escape as they do in the novel. I believe this is why Azog's Warg riders were needed in the first place.

But I wait with abated breath what will be revealed about Azog in the next films. Is he a juju-zombie? Did he paint himself white to look cool or did an experiment with hair bleach go awfully awry?

I am just sorry Tolkien didn't have a mind to write a dramatic death scene of a hero for the burning forest scene to bolster the importance of the bad guy. Nothing says I AM A BADASS BAD GUY like killing a protagonist.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Incanus 5,715]

BECAUSE I AM A BAD ORC AND I CAN!

P.S. I actually like the Azog design (apart from the hook hand and his odd habit of not wearing any armor or clothing).

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Incanus 5,715]

lol

P.S. I actually like the Azog design (apart from the hook hand and his odd habit of not wearing any armor or clothing).

His face is OK. The rest of the design is just bland.

Well he is just a gigantic albino Orc. Slap more armor on him and he would do fine in colder climates and look cool on battlefield. Although if he is undead no climate is a problem.

[Brónach 1,302]

He doesn't look interesting to me.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Incanus 5,715]

The hook was one of the worst ideas in the entire film. They should have put a machine gun instead.

Ooh like the original Nazi antagonist in Raiders of the Lost Ark! That would have been cool!

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

lol

P.S. I actually like the Azog design (apart from the hook hand and his odd habit of not wearing any armor or clothing).

His face is OK. The rest of the design is just bland.

Of course... it's flesh

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[KK 3,307]

You can tell it was a pretty last minute design.

[Jay 37,372]

That's my problem with it. Well one of them. It's different in tone than everything else in the film.

I worry that PJ has the time and money to turn things more to that style now in Film 2 and Film 3....

[Smeltington 1,441]

Agreed, his design wasn't consistent with the style of the rest of the film or series. He didn't look like something designed by the same team so much as a generic stock CG model of an orc.

On top of that, throughout the film I missed the use of real people portraying the orcs. The battles in LotR had a visceral feel because you knew they were fighting something that was actually standing there in front of them.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

To be honest I think you guys are all talking rubbish. Azog worked fine for the function he had in the film. He was not any more of less believable to me then Lurtz was in FOTR.

[Incanus 5,715]

Agreed, his design wasn't consistent with the style of the rest of the film or series. He didn't look like something designed by the same team so much as a generic stock CG model of an orc.

On top of that, throughout the film I missed the use of real people portraying the orcs. The battles in LotR had a visceral feel because you knew they were fighting something that was actually standing there in front of them.

Yes the CG goblins did look just like that, CG. A huge pile of CG goblins.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Gollum was totally believable in The Hobbit, yet he was CGI.

For a rush job, Azog was incredibly well rendered.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Incanus 5,715]

Gollum was totally believable in The Hobbit, yet he was CGI.

Gollum is a different story, because you've got an actor like Serkis behind him.

For a baddie like Azog, who has very little to no personality, it's all about the physical presence of the character.

You kind of buy it more easily with Lurzt because he is just this killing machine and Saruman is doing all the thinking and commanding. Yet he still makes for a fearsome presence thanks to the actor Lawrence Makoare.

With Azog you would expect a bit more depth to the creature in his actions since he is the main antagonist than those extremely slow and terribly painful sounding sentences where he is chewing every word as though it was raw meat. But he seems to be a direct kind of guy, not one for words.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Geez, you guys can really over-whine!

I'm outta here bitches!

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[gkgyver 1,645]

Lurtz was more believable because he wasn't a major character, and didn't talk trash.

[Incanus 5,715]

Geez, you guys can really over-whine!

I'm outta here bitches!

It's awful when a grown man can't watch others bitch and moan like whipped cats. Just tragic really.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Jay 37,372]

Lurtz was basically just there to stand up and have someone for Saruman to give his history of the orcs speech to, and also to be the leader of the orc group at the end of the film. Having an orc kill Boromir that you had seen in a few scenes before and not just a random orc was a great idea.

Azog is COMPLETELY different. He's given many lines and scenes and has a strong personality, and is out for specific revenge and not just doing what his master tells him. Also, he was FUCKING RESURRECTED FROM THE DEAD BY SAURON which is what I think many of us have the biggest problem with.

As Inky has pointed out many times, having Bolg chasing the group in Film 1 would have make a lot more sense.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Jay 37,372]

True, I forget that in the film world, the Battle of Anilbazar (however you spell it) happened in a more recent history than Tolkien intended. He could just be old

[Brónach 1,302]

Lurtz was more believable because he wasn't a major character, and didn't talk trash.

Also... he looked cool.

[KK 3,307]

Lurtz looked awesome and real.

I miss real people with prosthetics for orcs.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[KK 3,307]

Well some of the broader shots in Goblintown made the goblins CGI kind of glaringly obvious. And then there's Azog...

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

True, I forget that in the film world, the Battle of Anilbazar (however you spell it) happened in a more recent history than Tolkien intended. He could just be old

We do not see him actually die. Only Thorin assumes that he died at Moria. And both Gandalf and Balin give each other a look when Thorin claims that, like they are not sure about that.

[Quintus 5,399]

Ok, so if they had the exact same character, but named him Bolg, it would have been fine with you?

No, he'd have just found something else to moan about.

[Incanus 5,715]

Ok, so if they had the exact same character, but named him Bolg, it would have been fine with you?

No, he'd have just found something else to moan about.

You got that right! Azog is just one thing on the long list of horribles from the Hobbit.

[Luke Skywalker 1,795]

probably it was mentioned already...

In the film's credits it says that the Necromancer is played by Cumberbach... will it have any relation to smaug? I dont like the resemblance between the eye of sauron and the eye of smaug...

Oh, BTW, in Radagast's hair lives a couple of gay male Sparrows...

[Brónach 1,302]

I'll see the next two as a sort of Middle-Earth fan wank but it's obvious the chance of this being THE Hobbit films is gone.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Rubbish!

[gkgyver 1,645]

So, today was European DVD release. Who got the DVD.

I had it in my hands, and, in a shocking turn, didn't buy it.

[BloodBoal 7,538]

[Jay 37,372]

Didn't buy it. We all know the EE is coming.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Same here.

I might get it one day if it drops below 10 euro, just to own it.

[Incanus 5,715]

Same here. I might get it one day if it drops below 10 euro, just to own it.

Yup. Waiting for the EE. Mostly for the gazillion hours of extras!

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Oh God, I'll have to plow through those again.

[Incanus 5,715]

I am expecting and enlightening and unabashed choir of apology in the From Book to Script section of the documentaries.

[Quintus 5,399]

I don't have the same adoration and fascination I had with LotR to be bothered to watch the slapdash making of AUJ.

The charming little title card for the "MUSIC" doc will be a sham anyway!

I'll probably buy the EE trilogy boxset in years to come after it's been heavily discounted.