AOTC a reflection of time.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

It's the originality of AOTC - the film and the production - which keeps people interested in it, while movies like Pirates 3 or Men In Black II will not live beyond the Summers in which they were released.

It certainly helps that this film (and the other 2) is part of an already established and much loved franchise.

Battlefield Earth is as badly made as the prequels, yet is far less discussed today.

Also the fact that Lucas is keeping the franchise alive and well has something to do with it. (Star Wars in 3D anyone?)

[Sandor 797]

It's the originality of AOTC - the film and the production - which keeps people interested in it, while movies like Pirates 3 or Men In Black II will not live beyond the Summers in which they were released.

It certainly helps that this film (and the other 2) is part of an already established and much loved franchise.

Battlefield Earth is as badly made as the prequels, yet is far less discussed today.

Also the fact that Lucas is keeping the franchise alive and well has something to do with it. (Star Wars in 3D anyone?)

If you can't see the difference between Battlefield Earth and the Prequels, then you really don't understand (or want to understand) the one truly redeeming quality of AOTC.

[Ollie 1,059]

Yeah that $300 million was very disappointing when you consider how much TPM made, how quick it fell off at the box office and the fact that Spiderman destroyed Clones at the box office that summer.

Lucas made a bunch of poor decisions, I believe there was a scene that would have explained who Count Dooku was, which was cut, the scene where Anakin and Padme visit her parents would have been perfect for the film instead of that dumb meadow picnic scene.

[Trent B 337]

Ya I remember that about the AOTC discs too. Why bother making the discs if there's a chance they won't play on some computers?

I remember the first copy of the score I got had the hissing everyone heard. Then the second one with the "The Conveyor" bonus track didn't have any hiss to it.

I'm hoping though next year we get the intended edition of the Prequel scores and remastered OT scores to tie into the Blu-Ray release of the films.

The ROTJ pieces in TFU 2 sound better than before (the non Anthology stuff) and that leads me to believe there's a better sounding version out there. Even the material for Star Wars (ANH to you youngsters) sounded better than on the RCA discs.

[Quintus 5,399]

It's the originality of AOTC - the film and the production - which keeps people interested in it,

I strongly disagree. I believe the only reason some people are still interested in it is because it's Star Wars. I don't think it has anything to do with it's alleged originality or anything like that.

Interesting that you mentioned the infamous Empire review - the one they never did live down; even after they admitted later that they were wrong - it was revealed the reviewer in question was actually a bit of a fanboy and he actually confessed to getting a bit carried away, much to his humorous regret.

[Luke Skywalker 1,796]

Who the hell is Count Dooku?

A former Jedi master, that trained qui-gon jinn. He was disenchanted with the republic corruption and left the order. (i think this is the scene Mark was talking about - the one where they talk about the 'lost twenty'. Those busts on the library)

You meet him two hours in and it turns out he's more boring than algebra.

I dont know, i find christopher lee to be really cool as him.

Was he good or bad?

Superbad... he is a sith...

This is not clear for the jedi in the beggining of the film, but in the end they see what he has become.

It is rather clear for the audience too.

Why does he tell Obi-Wan about Palpatine?

He says the senate is controlled by one darth sidious, not that palpatine is the sith. That he could be some shadow character pulling the strings. If they cant sense Palpatine is force senstive they are not going to think he is a sith.

He was trying to lure obi wan to his cause by appealing to his duty sense. sometimes you tell the plain truth and nobody believes you.

Why the hell is his lightsaber curved?

Personal taste?

If you see this character has an aristocratic flair (and Title). The curved hilt (IMO) makes fell him more distinguised, as if is was XVIII swordmaster nobleman.

Why does everyone call him Count Dooku instead of Darth Tyranus?

'welcome back lord tyranus, you have done well'-Darth sidious

He is called tyrannus by the people who know his sith name (probably just palpatine and jango). He is officially a strong political leader with the name of Count dooku, but it is a sith undercover. And probably most of the sepparatists dont know he is a sith. If he had said openly he was a sith, he would have been hunted by the jedi, and had no oportunity to create a sepparatist political faction during 10 years.

Jango doesnt say 'darth' when he speaks to obi wan about him, and being a bounty hunter is not going to say more than he has to, hence he does not say i was contacted by a man called tyrannus who is count dooku.

so in the end, while the jedi learn dooku is a sith they dont know who 'Tyrannus', the one that ordered the clone army, is.

I have tried to make explanations without resorting to expanded universe material, just what one can say from the film and a little of reasonable imagination with that information.

[Sandor 797]

It's the originality of AOTC - the film and the production - which keeps people interested in it,

I strongly disagree. I believe the only reason some people are still interested in it is because it's Star Wars. I don't think it has anything to do with it's alleged originality or anything like that.

Interesting that you mentioned the infamous Empire review - the one they never did live down; even after they admitted later that they were wrong - the reviewer in question was actually a bit of a fanboy and he actually confessed to getting a bit carried away, much to his humorous regret.

Well, it was a ***** star review nonetheless. This pile of shit must have made a pretty damn good first impression on some people.

I think you really take this "because it's Star Wars" argument to an extreme where I can't follow.

In the end, all I'm saying is that despite all the ugly things about AOTC, there is something unique about it too. In a time when blockbuster movies are completely exchangeable and generic in nature, AOTC stands out as a one-of-a-kind experience. Again; take that as you will.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Ebert rates AOTC as a 2 star film, while TPM and ROTS have 3.5 or 4 stars.

What does that tell you roald?

[Ollie 1,059]

The reason Dooku's saber hilt is curved is because the character was originally going to be a female. However the design was appealing and if they had given the audience the info they should have it would have been mentioned that Dooku's specialty was swordsmanship. I believe that is why they left his saber hilt curved.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

I have tried to make explanations without resorting to expanded universe material, just what one can say from the film and a little of reasonable imagination with that information.

Nice analyses Manuel, but usually with the prequels, when Lucas gives it's viewers a piece of important information, he bludges it in with a sledgehammer.

[crocodile 8,020]

And because he's trained in much older Jedi fighting style when it was more about fencing. Or something like that. But I can't see that in the movie.

Anyway, I've seen the film multiple times in the cinema. And it deteriorated drastically over years.

AOTC has one of the worst lines in movie history. You know, the one about sand and the "wish away my feelings" one. Lucas apparently too his dialogue writer reputation very seriously.

But it marked the time when I started reading this forum regularly, something like 4.5 years before I decided to join. I rememer all the things that the older members talk about, albeit I was only an observer.

Karol

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

And because he's trained in much older Jedi fighting style when it was more about fencing. Or something like that. But I can't see that in the movie.

that is my point. Lucas generally does not leave anything up to the imagination of his audience. everything is S P E L L E D - U O T!

[Sandor 797]

Ebert rates AOTC as a 2 star film, while TPM and ROTS have 3.5 or 4 stars.

What does that tell you roald?

??? Still learning to read hey? I never said AOTC is worth more than 2 stars (whatever the fuck that means anyway).

My point remains that despite all that it bad with AOTC - which I acknowledge fully -, it's not as exchangeable or generic as most Hollywood blockbusters these days.

[Quintus 5,399]

Sure, because it's a Star Wars movie. Of course, the very fact that it manages to be even worse than much of the "generic" rubbish of today is rather amusing.

[#SnowyVernalSpringsEternal 10,265]

Roald, mijn vriend. Ik sta aan jou kant, en ik ben het compleet met je eens.

AOTC is a shit film, but unlike most shit-filmsm of this type of budget, it's worth watching just to see how badly it is made.

[Ollie 1,059]

And because he's trained in much older Jedi fighting style when it was more about fencing. Or something like that. But I can't see that in the movie.

Anyway, I've seen the film multiple times in the cinema. And it deteriorated drastically over years.

AOTC has one of the worst lines in movie history. You know, the one about sand and the "wish away my feelings" one. Lucas apparently too his dialogue writer reputation very seriously.

See my above post about Dooku.

But you also forget the cringing dialogue between Yoda and Dooku, yet Christopher Lee manages to make it sophisticated.

[crocodile 8,020]

I was actually responding to it.

Chris Lee and Ian McDiarmid saved what they could, that's true.

Karol

[Datameister 2,044]

I recently looked over something I wrote around the time I saw AOTC in theaters. A sort of journal entry. I was surprised at how complimentary of the film I was...I guess it wasn't till ROTS that I was old enough to be really aware of the prequels' flaws. I was able to overlook them more when I was younger...just get caught up in the fact that they were Star Wars movies.

[Quintus 5,399]

It happens. Especially were Star Wars is concerned.

[Charlie Brigden 7]

Lee makes Lucas' and Hales' dialogue sound like Mamet. His line readings in the scene where he stands before the captive Obi-Wan are nothing short of brilliant. Then again, I think McGregor is pretty good as well. He certainly seems to be enjoying himself and it makes his performance easier to watch.

[crocodile 8,020]

Yes, but McGregor started to enjoy himself in ROTS. But then again this film gave him at least anything to work with.

Karol

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

I remember all this geek raving over Yoda vs. Dooku. I thought that scene was terrible. Why were people so excited to see Yoda fight?

The fact that they used the scene prominently in advertising the movie is simply embarrassing.

[Quintus 5,399]

Yes, but McGregor started to enjoy himself in ROTS. But then again this film gave him at least anything to work with.

Karol

I've always thought McGregor looks uncomfortable in the films. I get the impression he did the second and third movie because his contract made it difficult for him not to.

[crocodile 8,020]

I think that's mostly because he's trying to imitate Alec Guinness' accent too much. It sounds fake.

Karol

[Datameister 2,044]

The fact that they used the scene prominently in advertising the movie is simply embarrassing.

I'm so glad I ran out of the room every time a Star Wars commercial started on TV. I literally had no idea Yoda was going to fight until I saw the film itself.

[Quintus 5,399]

Heh, I like the fight for the novelty it is.

[Charlie Brigden 7]

I always enjoyed it. I also laughed heartily when he picked up his cane and limped again after exerting all that energy.

[Datameister 2,044]

Same here. It's amusing for what it is.

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

I'm so glad I ran out of the room every time a Star Wars commercial started on TV. I literally had no idea Yoda was going to fight until I saw the film itself.

Well, a commercial I was thinking of was disguised as an ad for Spider-Man. It was stupid.

[Charlie Brigden 7]

But it probably got people to watch the movie.

[Datameister 2,044]

Well, a commercial I was thinking of was disguised as an ad for Spider-Man. It was stupid.

That's true...I remember that from the DVD now. No idea how I avoided seeing that one, since it didn't start with Williams music or any of the other usual "tells." I guess I just got lucky. Or maybe I swore off TV for a few months...can't really remember.

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

There was also an advance review on AICN that declared it the best Star Wars movie.

That was when I first read Yoda would fight and apparently John Williams' music from TPM had nothing on AOTC.

[Demondm810 399]

There was also an advance review on AICN that declared it the best Star Wars movie.

That was when I first read Yoda would fight and apparently John Williams' music from TPM had nothing on AOTC.

Oops. lol

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

Attack of the Clones keeps throwing stuff at the audience without explaining it. Most of it happens because THE PLOT DEMANDS IT.

Dooku is bad because he's a Sith (but everyone thinks he's a Jedi - except the audience), Anakin and Padmé fall in love because they have to do the nasty before the end of Episode III in order to spawn the incestuous twins and Anakin bitches incessantly about Obi-Wan because the two need to have a falling out before the end of Episode III.

None of it is really motivated by anything we see on the screen. We're just supposed to assume things happen the way they do because things happen the way they do.

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

The only prequel that came closest to having an okay story was Revenge of the Sith. It was more of the traditional good vs. evil that Star Wars rocks so well. There sort of were stormtroopers, fights with a purpose, motivation for the characters and the dark side/light side gray zone we all loved when Han, Lando, Vader and company were around. Also, the story didn't drag much. But it was still kind of awful.

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

Yes, Revenge of the Sith seemed to get most of the elements right. But I still don't understand why we needed a new villain - again. Dooku was dispensed with really quickly (although the way in which he died represented an interesting moment). The Grievous thing just went on and on and in the end, what was his purpose in that film again? I mean, other than being an excuse to keep Obi-Wan occupied and away from Anakin for half the movie?

[crocodile 8,020]

The way I understand this is that every single villain in the prequels is a foreshadowing of Darth Vader. You have Darth Maul's rage, Count Dooku's charisma and the last missing part was a cyborg thing. So they introduced Grievous. Yes, I know. It's still lame.

Karol

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

Grevious was the singular element that caused the movie to drag. One of the problems is that there were all these other characters and things that were more important and you likely wanted to see. Anakin/Vader, Palpatine, the Jedi, the Republic, Padme, the Rebellion. You may not have even liked what Lucas did with all that stuff, but this was the movie where everything would transform into the old movies and be explained. Who cares about this damned robot? Same thing with the Wookiee planet scenes, although that was at least very brief. Obi-Wan investigating shit: we had enough of that in the last movie. An hour of talking to aliens and walking through caves. Less of that, more Jedi and Sith.

[Trent B 337]

What I didn't like about Grievous in ROTS in how much of a pussy he was. In the animated Clone Wars after the film came out (the first one) Grievous was one mean tough mofo. Taking out several Jedi even taking out two Masters when he captured Palpatine. In the film it didn't even show him like that at all. The fight with Obi-Wan, not only the hand to hand combat but with sabers was pathetic at best.

[Gruesome Son of a Bitch 6,488]

Well that's another thing, as well as the character being completely ludicrous.

[Datameister 2,044]

I think Grievous's design and concept are amazing - far more interesting than Maul and Dooku. But he was totally declawed and then implemented in a rather pointless way. There should have been a single Sith apprentice for all three prequels, and there should have been a really compelling story built around him.

[gkgyver 1,646]

Yes, Revenge of the Sith seemed to get most of the elements right. But I still don't understand why we needed a new villain - again.

[Trent B 337]

I think Grievous's design and concept are amazing - far more interesting than Maul and Dooku. But he was totally declawed and then implemented in a rather pointless way. There should have been a single Sith apprentice for all three prequels, and there should have been a really compelling story built around him.

I agree.

[SF1_freeze 131]

The only reason it's talked about so much is because it's so monumentally bad. So bad that humans cannot fathom the shit on the screen. It's beyond our understanding. No one ever says anything good about it, because there is nothing good about it.

It didn't make $300 million because of some unknown genius buried beneath the shit, it's because STAR WARS is slapped on the title.

A true standard hater post, it gets old.

Well i can tell you the great things i like this movie for (i ignore the bad things more or less(love story, love story, love story), accept them cause it's Star Wars and there are also good things but i wont mention them here)

1) The truest greatness for me personally always were the first 30-35 minutes on Coruscant. I always wanted to see the City Planet's civil life, the people, the districts, the bars, the different types of skyscrapers, speeders (the epitome of Metropolis).

George Lucas delivered here on every level (!!!). The visual effects in these scenes were/are groundbreaking, the effort that went into the whole speeder chase is astonishing. Coruscant at night is a visual feast for the eyes.

We also finally see a civil district and a wonderful nightclub encounter (set design is pure gold there). Every moment is filled with details. For example as they enter the nightclub one girl in the bar elevates down an antigrav tub to get down to ground level

2) The whole mystery plot with Obi Wan was great, really great in my eyes. We got to see one of the most interesting planets ever Kamino, saw even more of Coruscants civil life (dinner), had the cute younglings scene...and you have the cool action scenes with Jango and Boba Fett

3) Groundbattle on Geonosis was done very well, Christopher Lee was priceless in every scene he was in.

4) Perfect moment in the end with the clone army marching, palpatine on the balcony and the best version of the imperial march in all six movies!

[Mr. Breathmask 555]

It didn't make $300 million because of some unknown genius buried beneath the shit, it's because STAR WARS is slapped on the title.

Well i can tell you the great things i like this movie for (i ignore the bad things more or less(love story, love story, love story), accept them cause it's Star Wars and there are also good things but i wont mention them here)

So basically, you agree with Koray.

[Luke Skywalker 1,796]

Yes, Revenge of the Sith seemed to get most of the elements right. But I still don't understand why we needed a new villain - again.

and that leads to 1.5 billon to charity.

next.

[SF1_freeze 131]

It didn't make $300 million because of some unknown genius buried beneath the shit, it's because STAR WARS is slapped on the title.

Well i can tell you the great things i like this movie for (i ignore the bad things more or less(love story, love story, love story), accept them cause it's Star Wars and there are also good things but i wont mention them here)

So basically, you agree with Koray.

Did you read my post ? I agree on the fact that being Star Wars let me accept hard flaws but i strongly disagree with the statement that there are no good things in the movie.

In my post i listed the great things/scenes of AOTC. Without the cheesy, bad bad love story this film would have been an A-

[Genius_Gone_Insane 5]

I really enjoyed Attack of the Clones the first time I saw it. It is one of my favorite movies.

Also, regarding the posts above -- it took me 5 years to figure out why Lucas added another new villain, Grevious.

[lordskylark 1]

I used to despise the relationship and corny dialogue between Padme and Anakin for several years. But, as strange as it sounds, I actually don't mind it at all anymore. After having observed many people and how couples enter relationships... The strange thing is, Anakin and Padme's dialogue and conversations and interactions are actually far more realistic than most movies. I actually don't mind that Lucas made realistic dialogue as opposed to fake unrealistic movie relationships. And in the defense of people getting married that quickly -- in many cultures, with an exception of the modern Westernized societies who have unfortunately taken the route of dating (especially before the onslaught of media), people get married very very quickly - many times within a week or a month after they decide that they want to be together.

But, that said, I would consider it the worst of all the Star Wars movies, although I did enjoy the final clone battle immensely (although some of the best footage of that battle were not included in the movie for some reason and instead found unfinished in a bonus documentary)

[Faleel 5,365]

the worst part of the movie was the tracking